I do not want macOS on iPad. Ever.

[SanderEvers]

Wait. Before you start commenting that I'm stupid. Just read on...

I agree that iPadOS (in its current form) is a massive limiting factor for the iPad. But I don't think that 'just release macOS on iPad' will be the answer. MacOS is entirely designed for trackpad and keyboard use. Icons, fonts and UI elements are too small to use with touch alone. And the iPad is still a primary touch device, and it should be. An iPad is not a MacBook without keyboard. Even if you add the keyboard stand an iPad will never become a MacBook.

Trying to force macOS onto iPad is just beyond stupid. And in the end it will hurt both iPad and mac users. Because Apple would either just have to change the UI of macOS to fit with touch input or just stick the terrible touch controls onto iPad. And these scenarios basically copy what Microsoft did with Windows 8 and Windows 10.

With Windows 8 they, Microsoft, tried to force an iPad-like (tablet friendly) UI upon everyone who used it. By making the start menu full screen only, removing the start button entirely and opening most apps in full screen. Also they made all UI elements 3-4x the size they were in Windows 7. This UI was very popular with Surface (Pro) users and basically allowed them "full Windows on an iPad-like device". But alienating everyone who did not use a tablet. Windows 8 quickly became the most hated Windows version since Vista for most PC users.

This forced Microsoft to do a 180 and drastically change things with Windows 10. Which almost entirely ditched the Metro/tablet UI and brought back the Start menu. Also UI elements were reduced in size again and Apps didn't force a full screen anymore. Which made it a very compelling OS for desktop / laptop users. But it made it a lot worse for tablet users, and here we also saw a steady decline in Surface (tablet) users. But it did also have some lingering issues from Windows 8 like the new Settings screen and the less than useable 'metro' styled Apps. Stuff most power users still disable these days with Windows 11.

So in the end, forcing desktop Windows upon a tablet was worse for both the tablet AND the desktop users. And sure Apple could port the UI of iPadOS to only an iPad version of macOS. But that is basically already what iPadOS is. And it would require all mac-only software to be redesigned before it would work on iPad.

My solution: improve iPadOS. With stuff like Stage manager and pro apps. Allow JIT compilation. And release XCode on iPad Pro. And sure, fully allow pro users to install any app from any source. But keep the primary focus on touch controls with the current optional keyboard and trackpad support.

Edit: later in the topic I also talk about the possibility to run mac apps on iPad like you can run iOS/iPadOS apps on Apple Silicon Macs. Which would also be a useful solution.

 

[dumastudetto]

Totally agree. It’s the Mac users who seem to think shoving macOS onto our iPads that will suddenly make them love iPad. iPad is perfect for the people using it. Power users have lots of mobile laptop options. It makes no sense shoehorning a pointer interface OS onto a touch-first device. Windows 8 demonstrated why perfectly.

 

[H_D]

Why not both? Improving iPadOS should be a given and the goal should be to unite the two systems more and more where sensible. The perfect thing one day will be an open, professional system with touch features that is not degraded like iPadOS is now, sure. But at the same time, with Magic Keyboard and maybe a BT mouse attached, let it boot into MacOS. It’s good to have options and it should be simple enough to implement on systems of more than 1TB

 

[SanderEvers]

Why not both? Improving iPadOS should be a given and the goal should be to unite the two systems more and more where sensible. The perfect thing one day will be an open, professional system with touch features that is not degraded like iPadOS is now, sure. But at the same time, with Magic Keyboard and maybe a BT mouse attached, let it boot into MacOS. It’s good to have options and it should be simple enough to implement on systems of more than 1TB

How would you see this being usable? I don't feel like installing every app twice, or having 2 full operating systems on my iPad. Or that it forces a reboot on me when I de-/attach it to the keyboard.
This will end in a "tablet mode" forced upon a "desktop" os. Which basically is Windows 10. Which would switch into a tablet mode when removing the keyboard from a Surface pro. Only most apps aren't designed for a tablet, which in the end hurt the sales of the Surface tablets.

Allowing to replace iPadOS entirely with MacOS (by the user) will hurt Pro iPad users who want to stay on iPadOS as well. Since developers wouldn't bother optimizing their pro apps for iPadOS anymore.

I could see something like "virtual macOS" on iPad, where you could run macOS apps in a macOS like container on iPad. Like you can install iPad / iOS apps on macOS with Apple Silicon.

 

[apostolosdt]

I am ready to agree, except that Apple already mixed up the two OS systems before but the other way round. I’m talking about the “System Preferences. In my humble opinion, it produces a “monster”, functionality-wise.

 

[SanderEvers]

I am ready to agree, except that Apple already mixed up the two OS systems before but the other way round. I’m talking about the “System Preferences. In my humble opinion, it produces a “monster”, functionality-wise.

Yes. Apple is trying to unify the experience. Which basically is what Microsoft also ended up doing. (Windows 11) And no I'm not happy about that either. But it would be worse if they'd just put macOS on iPad.

 

[apostolosdt]

[...] But it would be worse if they'd just put macOS on iPad.

Well, I can't agree more with that.

 

[Regulus67]

I would like to see better file management on the iPad. And eject for external disks, so one knows it is safe to unplug it.
And I agree absolutely with SanderEvers, the iPads should never use macOS

 

[drrich2]

I don't want Mac OS on the iPad. I would like the iPad to be able to run Mac app.s in a pinch. Since Quicken went to subscription (which I despise other than anti-virus products), I switched to Splasm's Checkbook Pro on my old 2017 iMac. Nice. But there's no iOS version. Finding a good 'checkbook register' type app. with both Mac (not exclusive to M series processors) and iOS that has the same look and syncs across devices has been...a vain search so far.

It'd be nice if my 11" M2 iPad Pro could run Checkbook Pro. Even if it required me to use a mouse. That way, when I travel, I wouldn't need to take my old MacBook along to enter expenses 'on the go.'

So no, I don't want the iPad to turn into a MacBook with no attached keyboard. I would like the option to run Mac apps on it as needed.

This isn't unlike the use case for running Windows in virtual machines (e.g.: Parallels, VMware Fusion). No, people don't usually buy a Mac to run Windows, but some people who mostly operate on a Mac need to run a Windows app. or app.s occasionally. Nice to have the option.

 

[jb310]

I think Apple is moving towards a single "hybrid" OS.

Ever since Apple Silicon was introduced, it's now possible to run iPad apps on the Mac, and now the iPad Pro has a desktop-class chip that's newer than what the iMac has. And as the years pass, iPad OS looks more like Mac OS than ever, with some of the same features being shared between the two (like Stage Manager).

Maybe Apple will continue to keep the two operating systems separate, but it really does feel like they're working towards a single OS that just looks a little different depending on what device you use it on.

 

[sledgehammer89]

I'm sure no one will be forced to use macOS if there is an option, if a keyboard and trackpad is connected. But it's big plus for developers and admins.
I really miss long running tasks in the background, custom keyboard shortcuts, something like BetterTouchTool, real Terminal with Unix tools, Browsers with common developer mode, Visual Studio Code, real Firefox and Chrome, more control of the network traffic (like Little Snitch), Mail app where I can view mailheaders and so on... when I use my iPad (98% with a keyboard and trackpad). Handling is much better on an iPad. I can pick it on the display and lift it up. Never want to do this with my MacBook and his heavy body.

 

[winxmac]

Some iOS apps have been ported to macOS since 2018 and they may not need to put macOS on the iPad but just some of its features...

Had Microsoft used the Start menu they used in the final set of updates to Windows RT 8.1 on the initial release of Windows 8, then Microsoft could have shown Apple what they are missing out [by not using macOS and stuck with iOS, now called iPadOS] but then again, Apple is a late adopter...

 

[SanderEvers]

I think Apple is moving towards a single "hybrid" OS.

Ever since Apple Silicon was introduced, it's now possible to run iPad apps on the Mac, and now the iPad Pro has a desktop-class chip that's newer than what the iMac has. And as the years pass, iPad OS looks more like Mac OS than ever, with some of the same features being shared between the two (like Stage Manager).

Maybe Apple will continue to keep the two operating systems separate, but it really does feel like they're working towards a single OS that just looks a little different depending on what device you use it on.

It's basically already there. MacOS can run iPad & iOS apps. If they'd allow that in the other direction (mac apps on iPad, or even on iPhone with an external monitor) they'd be done.

Some iOS apps have been ported to macOS since 2018 and they may not need to put macOS on the iPad but just some of its features...

Had Microsoft used the Start menu they used in the final set of updates to Windows RT 8.1 on the initial release of Windows 8, then Microsoft could have shown Apple what they are missing out [by not using macOS and stuck with iOS, now called iPadOS] but then again, Apple is a late adopter...

Nah they didn't port the apps, they made apps either 'universal' (run on iOS and MacOS natively) or with Apple Silicon in an virtual iOS / iPad mode on Mac. And yes Windows 8.1 fixed a lot of it's issues for tablets, but not so much for PC.

I'm sure no one will be forced to use macOS if there is an option, if a keyboard and trackpad is connected. But it's big plus for developers and admins.
I really miss long running tasks in the background, custom keyboard shortcuts, something like BetterTouchTool, real Terminal with Unix tools, Browsers with common developer mode, Visual Studio Code, real Firefox and Chrome, more control of the network traffic (like Little Snitch), Mail app where I can view mailheaders and so on... when I use my iPad (98% with a keyboard and trackpad). Handling is much better on an iPad. I can pick it on the display and lift it up. Never want to do this with my MacBook and his heavy body.

True, the iPad should allow more system access or even root access. And those apps should absolutely be either ported or run 'virtual' on iPad. But that doesn't mean it should run MacOS.

 

[Arctic Moose]

Power users have lots of mobile laptop options.

Really? Which <11" laptop with a detachable keyboard can I run macOS on?

Trying to force macOS onto iPad is just beyond stupid. And in the end it will hurt both iPad and mac users.

Why? Those that are happy with iPadOS now wouldn't even need to know the option exists.

Those of us that want a truly mobile macOS experience could have it, without the need for any new hardware.

(I'd be fully content with macOS virtualized on top of iPadOS though.)

 

[dumastudetto]

Really? Which <11" laptop with a detachable keyboard can I run macOS on?

Why would you want to detach a keyboard from a laptop when you need a keyboard to use the operating system effectively?

 

[redheeler]

The iPad isn’t a useful device to me. It’s not able to run the apps I need to run for development work like a Mac, and it’s not able to be put in my pocket and taken anywhere like an iPhone.

It’s a product for some use cases like a Chromebook replacement for note taking / document editing, drawing with Apple Pencil, kids, POS and other embedded devices; and because of this Apple will keep it around for the foreseeable future.

Apple isn’t interested in making it useful to people who need Macs because it will compete too much with the Macs and that’s not a desired outcome for Apple. So I think you’re safe that MacOS will never find its way to iPad.

 

[Ranjuro]

Years ago Apple ran an iPad ad in which they claimed that your next computer wouldn't be a computer. That seemed to telegraph pretty strongly that Apple was hoping to see people transition from using MacBooks to using iPads with keyboards attached. Why would they want this? Three words: App Store revenue. The Mac still lets you install software willy nilly from wherever you want and Apple doesn't get their 30% chunk of that revenue, so, the iPad is a much better platform from Apple's perspective. At the core, iPadOS and MacOS are the same operating system but one is optimized for a touch UI and the other is optimized for a keyboard and mouse. Had Apple created a touchscreen capable Mac they would cannibalize iPad sales so, of course, they would never do such a thing. Why sell somebody a MacBook that can do everything when you can sell the MacBook and then also sell an iPad to the same user? Good for Apple, bad for us. To people who say that the Windows 8/10 frankenstein UI approach proves that a dual purpose device will suck at both things, I will say this: why does iPadOS work just fine with a keyboard and mouse? Why sell the Magic Keyboard if it would suck as a laptop? An iPad with a Magic Keyboard IS a touchscreen Mac in every meaningful way with one key exception: no third party apps. I have an M2 iPad Pro and I have an M1 MacBook Pro. The difference is apps. That's the ONLY difference. You can even run the iPad apps on the Mac but not the other way around. If that isn't proof staring you in the face I don't know what is.

So yeah, they could have built the iPadOS UI into macOS, made the MacBook into a touch machine, and it would have been one HELLUVA machine but it would have cut into their App Store revenue and iPad market so instead they are innovating on iPad first, Mac second, with the best display, the best (M4) processor, and the rest going to iPad, along with the pricey Magic Keyboard so you can pretend it's a Mac, and the MacBook Pro is the afterthought. This is to be expected. The MacBook will continue to be treated as the second class platform as long as it allows freedom of application installation. This has been true for over a decade, Apple has essentially said so in every event and advertisement since 2012. Why would anybody expect anything different?

I've said it before and I will say it again: Apple's long term strategy with the iPad is to mostly kill off the Mac and it's pesky third-party app problem.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

Hello.

Let's make a deal.

You iPad people can keep iPadOS on your iPads if us Mac people can keep macOS on our Macs.

Unfortunately, we can't. Over the past decade, our beloved macOS has been turned into a weird iOS/iPadOS knockoff.

Which I guess means the deal if off. By this time tomorrow, every iPad will boot into NeXTSTEP 3.2. Sorry, but it's only fair.

 

[PsykX]

I want macOS on my iPhone.

Wait...

WAIT...

That would actually be freaking amazing.

Not to use it with the phone screen, of course this would remain iOS.
But to plug an external screen to it and then it would morph into macOS. I always thought this was going to be the future.

 

[JCCL]

It is an iPad with iPadOS when it’s in a tablet. Just the same limited OS it always back. But it turns into full macOS when connected to a keyboard or monitor. Why is that so hard to understand? Literally that would give the Surface and any other convertible a run for its money 100%. An OS, with an optimal UI, no matter which form factor or input method you’re using. It just adapts to your needs at any moment.

For me the iPad is nothing more than a big iPhone for consumption. Nothing more, nothing less. I use my Surface Pro 8 when need to do any real work. And on businesss travel, Surface comes with me. iPad stays home. That would change easily if iPad had an OS that allowed me to be fully productive.

 

[Arctic Moose]

Why would you want to detach a keyboard from a laptop when you need a keyboard to use the operating system effectively?

Just because it is detached doesn’t mean you can’t use it.

I can already use my Apple Magic Keyboard and my Apple Magic Mouse with my Apple iPad.

The only part missing is Apple macOS.

The primary reason is ergonomics. The screen should be much higher than the keyboard. Also, I have on more than one occasion struggled to find a workable position in a cramped airline seat, only to have the screen crushed when the person in front reclines their seat.

I practically always take an iPad with me because I can do most of what I need to do on it, and I prefer it for many tasks. However, I always bring a Mac because there are some things I can only do on a Mac, and many things I much prefer to do on a Mac.

If the iPad could be an iPad most of the time and be a Mac (virtualized or otherwise) when I need it, I would only need to carry one device, plus keyboard and mouse.

This would be a huge win for me, especially now that Apple does not currently offer a modern equivalent to the MacBook Air 11” or the MacBook 12”.

 

[stinksroundhere]

It's not going to happen anyway so why panic?

Any Xcode dev and anyone with a memory and two eyes will tell you Apple has been trying to make macOS more like iPadOS, not vice versa.

The frameworks have slowly been introduced for application saved states, real time document saving and helping to port iPad apps to macOS.

What's holding it back is legacy apps and drivers.

When Apple no longer needs to support universal binaries and Rosetta then macOS will get the next major revamp in about 4 years from now.

macOS, which can only ever be on a machine called a Mac, will become much leaner and smoother and launch apps immediately. It will be much more stylus and touch friendly.

But iPadOS on the iPad will remain a different OS for a device that is used primarily in the hands.

 

[yabeweb]

I would like to see better file management on the iPad. And eject for external disks, so one knows it is safe to unplug it.
And I agree absolutely with SanderEvers, the iPads should never use macOS

Safe unplug is unneeded and has been for the past decades unless you are actively writing on the device.

I rarely do that on desktop either, never lost a thing.

 

[SanderEvers]

Safe removal is indeed really only needed on spinning harddrives. Because "safe removal" would 'park' the drive heads. If you don't do that your heads might crash into the platters.

On solid state storage you don't really need it, except when writing to it. This might have an issue with cache though. But then just wait until the activity led stops blinking.

 

[The Clark]

I too want them to remain different, however I still require more flexibility in regards to multitasking, file management, terminal etc for iPad. It’s so gimped right now.