If Apple thought the future of ports is USB-C, why is Apple bringing back more types of ports?

[leman]

User expectations are the main problem with USB-C. As long as people expect that USB-C ports are fast, computers will only have bandwidth for a handful of them, and USB-A will remain necessary.

The way I see it, the problem was the the USB consortium just released the spec but did absolutely nothing to help the adoption. In fact, many things (like cable abundance) were blatantly mismanaged. There was no infrastructure, no chips, no transition roadmap. PC peripheral market is extremely reactionary, they it is not going to jump onto the bandwagon. If the entire thing were managed better, we'd have 100% USB-C adoption two years ago.

I once heard an idea that established technologies tend to die in reverse order. The longer something has been around, the longer it will probably remain. I would not be surprised if USB-C died out before USB-A.

If USB dies as a standard within next ten years, that's a remote possibility, yes. For now, USB-C is the USB connector going forward. USB-A has been officially discontinued in 2017.

 

[JouniS]

This is really thickly veiled sarcasm right?

USB 2 speeds are certainly enough for peripherals such as keyboards, mouses, controllers, and headsets.

30 MB/s is also enough for small data transfers – otherwise people would not be willing to use cloud storage. If you want to transfer a few gigabytes once in a while, even USB 2 gets the transfer done in a couple of minutes. In such situations, people may prefer an easily reachable slow port over a fast port that is more difficult to reach.

 

[Stephen.R]

USB 2 speeds are certainly enough for peripherals such as keyboards, mouses, controllers, and headsets.

So the stuff most people use Bluetooth for now?

otherwise people would not be willing to use cloud storage

The use case for a local ssd vs remote mass storage aren’t necessarily the same.

 

[Tozovac]

So by definition, it has the ability to do so.

Sure, with extra effort and hassle (at times) that could be avoided by outfitting a Pro device with the variety of commonly-used ports a Pro device deserves.

 

[JouniS]

So the stuff most people use Bluetooth for now?

A wireless keyboard was a nice party trick 20 years ago. Today it's yet another device to charge and yet another wireless connection that could fail. Wired peripherals are still common, because they just work.

The use case for a local ssd vs remote mass storage aren’t necessarily the same.

I was thinking more about things such as copying a few documents from a USB stick or some photos from a phone or a camera.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Sure, with extra effort and hassle (at times) that could be avoided by outfitting a Pro device with the variety of commonly-used ports a Pro device deserves.

Surely usbc/tv has that covered though? Fast as feck, can be anything.. it doesn’t actually get any more pro than that, so long as you’re really a professional using your computer, that is. Otherwise it’s just diehards whinging.

 

[Lord of the Pies]

A wireless keyboard was a nice party trick 20 years ago. Today it's yet another device to charge and yet another wireless connection that could fail. Wired peripherals are still common, because they just work.

The battery life of my Magic Keyboard 2, Magic Trackpad 2 and Magic Mouse 2 are all incredibly long. Not actually sure when I last charged any of them.

 

[JouniS]

The battery life of my Magic Keyboard 2, Magic Trackpad 2 and Magic Mouse 2 are all incredibly long. Not actually sure when I last charged any of them.

The keyboard has long enough battery life, and you can also use it while charging. The mouse has much worse battery life, and the charging is one of the most embarrassing design failures Apple has ever made.

My old iMac frequently had Bluetooth issues where it needed 10-15 seconds (or more) to find the keyboard an/or mouse after waking up from sleep. The Mac Mini I had before that was even worse, and I sometimes needed to connect a USB keyboard before I was able to log in. My current iMac does not have these issues, but it's still quite new, so it may be only a matter of time.

 

[jdb8167]

The keyboard has long enough battery life, and you can also use it while charging. The mouse has much worse battery life, and the charging is one of the most embarrassing design failures Apple has ever made.

Ever hear of Chesterton's Fence? You should look it up sometime.

The likely reason that Apple doesn't want you to use the mouse plugged into the lightning cable is that the cable won't take the strain and probably neither will the port. These can probably be solved but Apple maybe decided that given that you normally charge overnight, charging the mouse from the bottom is the least problematic solution.

 

[Stephen.R]

The mouse has much worse battery life,

A Magic Mouse lasts for a month on a charge. What are you talking about?

 

[JouniS]

The likely reason that Apple doesn't want you to use the mouse plugged into the lightning cable is that the cable won't take the strain and probably neither will the port. These can probably be solved but Apple maybe decided that given that you normally charge overnight, charging the mouse from the bottom is the least problematic solution.

I've never heard of such cable issues with any other mouse. If that was the real reason, Apple could have used a higher quality cable or a more suitable connector.

A part of the problem is that the low charge warning usually comes in the morning when I start using the computer. The warning also comes very late, and the mouse usually doesn't have enough battery left for the rest of the day. There are no further reminders about charging the mouse when I'm about to have a break, so I'll eventually have to stop working (or switch to another mouse or computer).

I kind of like the mouse otherwise, so it's a shame that Apple hasn't bothered to fix the obvious flaw.

A Magic Mouse lasts for a month on a charge. What are you talking about?

I have to charge the mouse often enough that it keeps annoying me. The keyboard lasts for months, which is more reasonable.

 

[jdb8167]

I've never heard of such cable issues with any other mouse. If that was the real reason, Apple could have used a higher quality cable or a more suitable connector.

What other mouse uses a Lightning cable to charge? I don't know of any. Apple isn't filled with fools. There is a reason for the bottom charging design even if we don't know exactly what it is.

 

[mazz0]

What other mouse uses a Lightning cable to charge? I don't know of any. Apple isn't filled with fools. There is a reason for the bottom charging design even if we don't know exactly what it is.

Yeah, cos Apple would never ship a terribly badly designed mouse…

 

[mazz0]

imagine being a professional with your USB-C only laptop ready to give a presentation but don’t have the necessary dongles as well? If you’re a professional, you will have the necessary equipment to do your job.

Yeah, I don’t get it either. If you occasionally need a USB-C to HDMI adapter then just leave it in your laptop bag. It’s not even something you have to remember - it can live in the bag when you’re not using it, and it will always be there when you do. The amount of space such an adapter takes up is negligible.

 

[cmaier]

What other mouse uses a Lightning cable to charge? I don't know of any. Apple isn't filled with fools. There is a reason for the bottom charging design even if we don't know exactly what it is.

The only reason is aesthetics. If you open up the mouse, you can see that the connector could have gone anywhere, so long as there was a flat surface to stick it to. It’s a dumb design for sure.

 

[JouniS]

What other mouse uses a Lightning cable to charge? I don't know of any. Apple isn't filled with fools. There is a reason for the bottom charging design even if we don't know exactly what it is.

Wired mouses are not exactly a new thing. If Lightning is not a suitable connector for charging a mouse, you can always choose something else.

Apple is not filled with fools, but it is filled with designers with strong opinions. And for a long time, those designers were apparently not kept in check by equally strong voices in engineering and usability.

 

[cupcakes2000]

delete

 

[cupcakes2000]

Wired mouses are not exactly a new thing. If Lightning is not a suitable connector for charging a mouse, you can always choose something else.

Apple is not filled with fools, but it is filled with designers with strong opinions. And for a long time, those designers were apparently not kept in check by equally strong voices in engineering and usability.

I don’t have a Magic Mouse. But I have a Logitech mouse. It charges at the front. I have never ever used it whilst charging. It’s not necessary to do. It lasts for ages on a charge. Actually it’s never even ram out - once every so often I just plug it over night. This point about the location of the charging port was, is and always will be a ridiculous non issue.

 

[JouniS]

I don’t have a Magic Mouse. But I have a Logitech mouse. It charges at the front. I have never ever used it whilst charging. It’s not necessary to do. It lasts for ages on a charge. Actually it’s never even ram out - once every so often I just plug it over night. This point about the location of the charging port was, is and always will be a ridiculous non issue.

With the Magic Mouse, the battery life is long enough that I have never developed a routine of charging it just in case. At the same time, the battery life is short enough that the sudden need to charge it annoys me once or twice a month.

I haven't tried Logitech mouses with a rechargeable battery. The ones with replacable AA batteries have an almost impossibly long battery life. I've had a Logitech travel mouse for a while, and the batteries easily last for a year or two.

 

[cupcakes2000]

I have never developed a routine of charging it just in case

I suggest you do then, if it runs out and annoys you.

I just tested something. My Logitech mouse doesn’t work as a mouse when attached and charging via usb. So the charging port can be in the front, on the bottom, or in a different room, and it makes no difference at all.

 

[theluggage]

I just tested something. My Logitech mouse doesn’t work as a mouse when attached and charging via usb. So the charging port can be in the front, on the bottom, or in a different room, and it makes no difference at all.

Certainly not the case with the Logitech MX Master 1 or 2 - I've frequently charged both while in use.

What other mouse uses a Lightning cable to charge?

If Lightning can't withstand being used as a mouse cable for an hour every month or so, it is completely unfit for use several times a day by teenagers to charge their iPhones and needs fixing. If the answer to why the MM charges from the bottom is "they gimped the design of their $80 mouse because of the deficiencies in their $20 cable" then that doesn't really let them off the hook.

There's is a very simple explanation for the design of the Magic Mouse 2 which satisfies both Chesterton and Occam: The Magic Mouse 2 is virtually identical to the removable-battery Magic Mouse 1. The easiest place to put the socket is on what was the battery hatch. Putting the socket anywhere else would have meant a slightly more significant re-design, which would have taken more time and money, as well as risking the delicate eyes of Apple users being besmirched by the horrific glimpse of a visible port on an Apple product. The very thought...

 

[Abazigal]

DID you guys know the Mac Pro has 2 USB-A ports? oh the horror.

So does the Mac Mini.

My take is that because these are standalone desktop units, Apple has to be realistic in their assumptions about what peripherals the user has. Hence the inclusion of 2 USB-A ports and a HDMI port on the Mac Pro and M1 Mac Mini to allow the user to connect to an external monitor and plug in their wired keyboard and mouse.

It’s a different ball game with the new M1 imac, because it comes with a wireless keyboard and mouse / trackpad, and has its own display, so Apple can safely remove the HDMI and USB-A ports because they know most people are not going to need those ports for the aforementioned purposes. You don’t even need to set aside a USB-C port for charging, and Ethernet goes into the power brick, so 4 ports is actually a luxury for the imac.

 

[Octopuss]

"Pro" in more, "Air" is less.
If this is not clear, get Air.

 

[Gudi]

You know electric cars exist, right?

The first ever Porsche P1 from 1898 was an electric four wheel drive. Electric cars have always been the future, never the present. USB was always supposed to be the one port for everything, but then USB became many different ports.

 

[Stephen.R]

The first ever Porsche P1 from 1898 was an electric four wheel drive.

Well ok then.

Electric cars have always been the future, never the present.

You just said one existed in 1898. That's literally the opposite of the future. It's the past.

USB was always supposed to be the one port for everything

I mean.. it wasn't intended to replace everything. It was intended to replace peripheral connections like PS2, Serial, Parallel.

In the original specification, the full speed mode (12Mbps) was intended for stuff like printers and floppy disk drives.

Nobody was sitting around working on USB 1.0 or 1.1 and going "I bet we can replace VGA with this".



Anyway. If you're bothered by the multitude of USB ports, you'll be glad to know that in 4.0 there's just one connector. Type C.