Sidebar Sidebar
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

Other In-Display Touch-ID is all but confirmed - Coming to future iOS devices soon

S

serialiphoneuser

macrumors regular
Original poster
Sep 21, 2016
215
397
UPDATE: Aug 14th: http://www.patentlyapple.com/patent...e-display-to-capture-3d-fingerprint-data.html

I have a glimmer of hope that they'll offer in-display Touch ID with iPhone 6.1. From the stories you may have read Tim Cook pushed the engineers hard to embed Touch ID into the display of iPhone X even delaying the product release by several months till the last minute but it did not yield good results because the inclusion of 3D Touch increases the screen opaqueness and the fingerprints did not quite get through the screen using ultrasonic or optical sensors with the results they were expecting.
The "budget" iPhone 6.1 omits 3D Touch.. this would be a great opportunity for Apple to embed in-display touch id to sway over a majority of the Touch-ID device hold outs. If it does end up including touch-ID, it will have a huge impact
 
Last edited:
Not a chance... Touchid in any form on new iPhones from the X forward won’t happen(except a SE update). Not sure what stories you’ve read but, FaceId was always the plan for Apple’s future. Craig Federighi explained that at the iPhone X launch
 
  • Like
Reactions: Newtons Apple
You’re in for disappointment.
[doublepost=1532486824][/doublepost]
BugeyeSTI said:
Not sure what stories you’ve read but, FaceId was always the plan for Apple’s future. Craig Federighi explained that at the iPhone X launch
Click to expand...
Of course they’re gonna say that. They’re not going to say “we couldn’t embed it into the display so we just put Face ID.”
 
  • Like
Reactions: navier, 826317, YaBoiD and 2 others
It won’t have in-display Touch ID because it’s not technically possible with LCD.

The current in-display sensors only work on OLED panels because it can sit under the panel, which is self-emissive.

On an LCD, it would not work because it relies on a backlight layer. The fingerprint sensor is opaque which would block the backlight.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Givmeabrek, goobot and BugeyeSTI
serialiphoneuser said:
I have a glimmer of hope that they'll offer in-display Touch ID with iPhone 6.1. From the stories you may have read Tim Cook pushed the engineers hard to embed Touch ID into the display of iPhone X
Click to expand...

Any Sources for what you’re posting? Because it’s complete opposite of what Dan Riccio (VP of Hardware Engineering) stated in a direct article that Apple had no plans for Face ID on the back of the iPhone or under the display, as Face ID was always ‘Plan A.’ So how could Tim Cook ‘push’ the engineers if it was never there goal to do so in the first place with touch ID under the display?

http://www.idownloadblog.com/2017/10/31/apple-never-worked-on-rear-inscreen-touch-id/

Also, John Gruber for Daring Fireball stated based off what multiple iPhone engineers Face ID was always ‘Plan A’, and touch ID under the display was ‘Plan B’, when Apple was able to execute Face ID in terms of how they envisioned it, it was always their primary goal. It was _Never_ concluded that Touch ID under the display wasn’t feasible, it’s just they abandoned the project.

https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_and_observations

serialiphoneuser said:
The "budget" iPhone 6.1 omits 3D Touch.. this would be a great opportunity for Apple to embed in-display touch id to sway over a majority of the Touch-ID device hold outs. If it does end up including touch-ID, it will have a huge impact
Click to expand...

The end result is this, during the fall 2017 keynote, Tim Cook said moving forward Face ID is Apples biometric future of security. If that’s what he said, what makes you think they would resort to using touch ID under the display? That would be completely counterproductive of this new 3-D facial mapping technology that they had invested millions of dollars into for a completely different type of security. Think if Apple did offer a touch ID sensor under the display, it would indicate complete opposite not what Cook stated in their new security with Face ID.
 
Last edited:
Relentless Power said:
The end result is this, during the fall 2017 keynote, Tim Cook said moving forward Face ID is Apples biometric future of security. If that’s what he said, what makes you think they would resort to using touch ID under the display? That would be completely counterproductive of this new 3-D facial mapping technology that they had invested millions of dollars into for a completely different type of security. Think if Apple did offer a touch ID sensor under the display, it would indicate complete opposite not what Cook stated in their new security with Face ID.
Click to expand...

I don’t know if under display Touch ID is ever happening, but regarding Face ID completely replacing Touch ID,
there was one thing Craig Federighi said—that no one seemed to notice—that casts doubt on whether it’s as final as that:

Craig Federighi “confirmed that Apple believes Face ID is the future of biometric authentication, with the caveat that there are settings where different biometric techniques or combinations of biometrics could make sense.”

https://www.macrumors.com/2017/09/15/craig-federighi-addresses-face-id-concerns/

I didn’t read the entire original source, so maybe there is missing important context, but to me that sounds like it’s possible Apple will keep Touch ID around in some form or another, maybe even under display, who knows.
 
subjonas said:
I don’t know if under display Touch ID is ever happening, but regarding Face ID completely replacing Touch ID,
there was one thing Craig Federighi said—that no one seemed to notice—that casts doubt on whether it’s as final as that:

Craig Federighi “confirmed that Apple believes Face ID is the future of biometric authentication, with the caveat that there are settings where different biometric techniques or combinations of biometrics could make sense.”

https://www.macrumors.com/2017/09/15/craig-federighi-addresses-face-id-concerns/

I didn’t read the entire original source, so maybe there is missing important context, but to me that sounds like it’s possible Apple will keep Touch ID around in some form or another, maybe even under display, who knows.
Click to expand...

Wow, I thought I was the only one who picked up on that! I couldn't believe that I wasn't seeing that tossed around in all the FaceID vs. TouchID discussions. I firmly believe that FaceID isn't going anywhere. But in my opinion, that highlighted quote does leave the door open down the line for both to exist. I don't think we'll ever see a phone that has both FaceID and TouchID, but I wouldn't bet against it at this point either. My guess is he's referring to FaceID + AsYetUnknownID, but he may well have had TouchID in mind.
 
  • Like
Reactions: subjonas
I greatly doubt Apple will use Touch-ID for any of their products anymore aside from the ones that already have it and are still being sold.

Face-ID is the future and it’s here to stay, it’s time to face it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kram Sacul and The-Rift
I’m speculating Apple wont invest in under finger sensor display when FaceID is the new norm and using fingers is sort of outdated to the new UI experience.

Personally I look at a home button with nostalgia, kind a like I look at an iPhone 3.
 
I just love it how some people actually think that Apple were working until the last minute trying to implement touch ID, only to give up at the last moment. Never mind the years of planning and development and the absolutely enormous logistical operation required to manufacture the device and bring them to sale.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kram Sacul, MEJHarrison and eyoungren
BugeyeSTI said:
....... FaceId was always the plan for Apple’s future. Craig Federighi explained that at the iPhone X launch
Click to expand...
I agree that apple chose FaceID as the future. But in regards to Federighi saying FaceID was always the plan, I don't buy it. There were way too many credible rumors claiming apple was hard at work trying to embed TouchID into the display, (not to mention the filed patents), but could not yield good results. That is not to say that FaceID was the last resort. Obviously FaceID was in development for a long time. I don't expect apple or in this case Federighi to come out and say we tried to do an in display touchID but could not get it to work.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Peter K., JPack and EM2013
Raist3001 said:
I agree that apple chose FaceID as the future. But in regards to Federighi saying FaceID was always the plan, I don't buy it. There were way too many credible rumors claiming apple was hard at work trying to embed TouchID into the display, (not to mention the filed patents), but could not yield good results. That is not to say that FaceID was the last resort. Obviously FaceID was in development for a long time. I don't expect apple or in this case Federighi to come out and say we tried to do an in display touchID but could not get it to work.
Click to expand...
Can you please list the sources that work for Apple that have reinforced your “credible rumors” theory? Considering top Apple executives have gone on the record contradicting your claim, I give little credence to rumors or hearsay especially from tech sites that think they know what’s going on behind the scenes..
 
  • Like
Reactions: 44267547, Kram Sacul, eyoungren and 2 others
Raist3001 said:
I agree that apple chose FaceID as the future. But in regards to Federighi saying FaceID was always the plan, I don't buy it. There were way too many credible rumors claiming apple was hard at work trying to embed TouchID into the display, (not to mention the filed patents), but could not yield good results. That is not to say that FaceID was the last resort. Obviously FaceID was in development for a long time. I don't expect apple or in this case Federighi to come out and say we tried to do an in display touchID but could not get it to work.
Click to expand...

I think it always was. But I think they thought they could have under the screen Touch ID two years ago or more and it took so long they had Face ID ready to go by then.

I suspect we may see some sort or door locks from them that can use this tech in the newest patent.

I don’t see them ever bothering with it for phones or iPads. It’d be a waste.
 
inkahauts said:
I doubt it and it’d be a waste anyway imho. Face ID is much better than any Touch ID ever was because it works consistently from all those that I know that have had both face and Touch ID at different points. Touch ID failed way to often and was not consistent at all for many people.
Click to expand...

I’ve owned four TouchID devices dating back to the 5s. I must be very lucky because I think it’s worked perfectly for me at least 99% of the time with every finger I’ve scanned on every one of those devices. I’m not holding my breath on Apple bringing it back, but I favour it over FaceID. If Apple offered a phone with the X form factor and TouchID in the screen, I just might replace my 8 Plus after all.
 
  • Like
Reactions: navier and Brandonjr36
joeblow7777 said:
I’ve owned four TouchID devices dating back to the 5s. I must be very lucky because I think it’s worked perfectly for me at least 99% of the time with every finger I’ve scanned on every one of those devices. I’m not holding my breath on Apple bringing it back, but I favour it over FaceID. If Apple offered a phone with the X form factor and TouchID in the screen, I just might replace my 8 Plus after all.
Click to expand...

I never had to much trouble with Touch ID unless my fingers wet or had done a lot of work with my hands that day. Or had on gloves. Face id has never had issues for me in any of those situations. Ever. And I know several people who had to redo their finger prints weekly because they’d always stop working. They’ve not had to redo their face even once. It’s just worked perfectly since the first time. Face ID is just better at working for more people all the time in my experience.
 
inkahauts said:
I never had to much trouble with Touch ID unless my fingers wet or had done a lot of work with my hands that day. Or had on gloves. Face id has never had issues for me in any of those situations. Ever. And I know several people who had to redo their finger prints weekly because they’d always stop working. They’ve not had to redo their face even once. It’s just worked perfectly since the first time. Face ID is just better at working for more people all the time in my experience.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. But I still like being able to have my phone unlocked and on the home screen before I even look at it. With TouchID I can do it as I take my phone from my pocket. I also find it to be more convenient for Apple Pay. As I said, I must be lucky because I’ve also heard of people having issues with TouchID but I never do. Other phones allow for multiple biometric identification features and let the user decide which works best for them, but that has never been the Apple way.
 
  • Like
Reactions: einmusiker
It's true, and there are a number of other ways to implement it. Apple also did try to get it done for the iPhone X but didn't, but that doesn't mean they are not interested in it. People seem to think that's the case just because Apple didn't include it and because Apple will of course not confirm the fact that they did pursue under display fingerprint scanners.

So basically, we will see it in future products, but it will not be in the 6.1-inch iPhone (iPhone 9). That will solely use FaceID. It's not something we'll see for a while and due to the work behind FaceID, they have in fact put it on the shelf until the technology improves since while it's possible today, the accuracy, yield, and price aren't currently sufficient.
 
serialiphoneuser said:
UPDATE: Aug 14th: http://www.patentlyapple.com/patent...e-display-to-capture-3d-fingerprint-data.html

I have a glimmer of hope that they'll offer in-display Touch ID with iPhone 6.1. From the stories you may have read Tim Cook pushed the engineers hard to embed Touch ID into the display of iPhone X even delaying the product release by several months till the last minute but it did not yield good results because the inclusion of 3D Touch increases the screen opaqueness and the fingerprints did not quite get through the screen using ultrasonic or optical sensors with the results they were expecting.
The "budget" iPhone 6.1 omits 3D Touch.. this would be a great opportunity for Apple to embed in-display touch id to sway over a majority of the Touch-ID device hold outs. If it does end up including touch-ID, it will have a huge impact
Click to expand...

there are no cameras under the display in any of the leaks. so no.
Touch ID in some cases was slightly cooler and it'd be nicer to have both but Im okay with just Face ID.
I understand some use cases touch is slightly more efficient. also more likely we get Face ID to improve a bit more too both this year software wise and next year hardware wise.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.
Top Bottom
Back