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It not just about that, its about hypocrisy - that the attacks are already being shaped like Obama started this whole thing (he didn't) or that he expanded it (we don't know that). As usual, when it comes to Obama critics, when he does the same things others have done, somehow its a million times worse.

And when it comes to statists, he is infallible.
 
And when it comes to statists, he is infallible.

You know, that may not have been the case if the wall of ridiculousness about Obama (birth certificates, college transcripts, secret Muslim, communist/socialist and all the other nonsense accusations that has been stuck on Obama by the right) hadn't been built up to such ridiculous heights, many people would be more critical of Obama's actual faults, not made-up ones.

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First, ever? Where is the proof of that? I was just trying to show that the Obama administration is not innocent. Sometime, it has to take responsibility for its actions too.

The Washington Post revealed a list of Prism contributors, starting with Microsoft in 2007.
 
I didn't read all pages here but the only thing that comes to my mind is a quote from Benjamin Franklin.

" Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

This sums it up quite nicely and is something our politicians should give some real time and thought to.
 
i think ill be okay

'I have nothing to hide.'

This is such a selfish way of thinking. You don't mind being fundamentally stripped of the freedoms and rights that make you who you are as an American citizen one bit? Good for you.

If Obama has nothing to hide, why are even his college records classified? Why is nothing about his administration transparent? We have nothing to hide, he has everything to hide. The scrutiny should lie with the government, not its people.

So the government claims its doing this to protect us from imminent, classified threats and thwart us from terrorist activities that cannot be brought the public's attention? How convenient. How about the idea that government is the imminent, classified threat?
 
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You know, that may not have been the case if the wall of ridiculousness about Obama (birth certificates, college transcripts, secret Muslim, communist/socialist and all the other nonsense accusations that has been stuck on Obama by the right) hadn't been built up to such ridiculous heights, many people would be more critical of Obama's actual faults, not made-up ones.

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The Washington Post revealed a list of Prism contributors, starting with Microsoft in 2007.

I don't care if it started in 2007. That was one year of Bush's administration, it has continued for many more in the Obama administration. They are both at fault. Stop blaming someone who can't do anything about it, take responsibility.
 
I don't care if it started in 2007. That was one year of Bush's administration, it has continued for many more in the Obama administration. They are both at fault. Stop blaming someone who can't do anything about it, take responsibility.

He's more outraged by that one year of overlap under Bush than the five under Obama.

2007 was the hardest year ever for him, man. Let his irrationality slide.
 
You know those rewards cards that you swipe at the drug stores and grocery stores? Every time you swipe the card the government knows you were there.

So the government cares about me? Wow i have such a fascinating life to them, buying milk and eggs every week ;)
 
Not the "if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear mantra"..? Please... :rolleyes:

Just because you have nothing to hide within your private affairs, does not mean that anybody should have access to it without your knowledge or consent.

Well the internet is designed to be open, not private... So if people are worried about their privacy they should go live on a farm with no internet and phone.
The world we live in privacy is no longer really existent. We live in a interconnected society so if you are up to no good, be prepared to get caught. Simple.
 
Well the internet is designed to be open, not private... So if people are worried about their privacy they should go live on a farm with no internet and phone.
The world we live in privacy is no longer really existent. We live in a interconnected society so if you are up to no good, be prepared to get caught.

Being up to no good is not my concern...
 
So if nobody has anything to hide, nobody will mind if government officials start going to everyone's house, peeking in everyone's bedroom window late at night when strange noises start leaking out through the walls (as having blinds will be made illegal at late hours, since it's not needed to block out the sun), with a video recorder in hand, ready to upload the findings to the Internet immediately and make them readily available?

Nah, no way.
 
So if nobody has anything to hide, nobody will mind if government officials start going to everyone's house, peeking in everyone's bedroom window late at night when strange noises start leaking out through the walls, with a video recorder in hand, ready to upload the findings to the Internet immediately and make them readily available?

Nah, no way.

Nobody'll also mind I'd imagine if government officials start going through everybody's mailboxes and rifling through bank statements to see how everyone's finances are doing. You can still have the statement, and they'll put it back in the mailbox all ripped open, but they just wanna have a look. For your safety, you know.
So what is the motive again?
 
So what is the motive again?

Make anything up and that's what it is.

"To ensure the safety of our children, against sex offenders"

"To ensure your finances are in order at all times, for the prosperity of your family and your nation."

These sound good on paper, don't they? But the implications of the way they are implemented are menacing.

I also removed the second example in my edit, about rifling through bank statements, because IRS already does essentially with tax season every year. Except it's to make revenue, in addition to having a peak, as opposed to just taking a peak. And I'm not defending IRS, it just seemed like a weaker comparison.
 
Does this mean that the NSA are harvesting pictures of my cat out of photostream? :mad:
 
Make anything up and that's what it is.

"To ensure the safety of our children, against sex offenders"

"To ensure your finances are in order at all times, for the prosperity of your family and your nation."

These sound good on paper, don't they? But the implications of the way they are implemented are menacing.

I also removed the second example in my edit, about rifling through bank statements, because IRS already does essentially with tax season every year. Except it's to make revenue, in addition to having a peak, as opposed to just taking a peak. And I'm not defending IRS, it just seemed like a weaker comparison.


No but what is the "real" motive? The ultimate goal of having access to all your data?

I really think a lot of people think they stand out in the "system" and have such interesting lives that the government is just snooping around looking at our lives. I think that is unrealistic. Just saying.
 
Does this mean that the NSA are harvesting pictures of my cat out of photostream? :mad:

And well they should!

Your cat was observed carrying secret papers clearly intended to be sold to some Pekinese dogs...

Your cat will be questioned by the FBI momentarily!

:rolleyes: ;)
 
So i always kinda knew this sort of system existed but it was in the ether kinda thing. I knew there was a massive dark data center out there collecting data but i just assumed it was all data they could steal with vampire taps so data out of context not fully formed data with out having to reconstructed it. I do not buy the whole just foreign bit that is a cover i do not care what there charter is if your logged into facebook and the NSA wants to know what you ate for dinner last night (cause we all check in) they now know in Baghdad or Nashville the servers hold it all how do you enforce such a grey policy heres a hint you dont.
 
Well the internet is designed to be open, not private... So if people are worried about their privacy they should go live on a farm with no internet and phone.
The world we live in privacy is no longer really existent. We live in a interconnected society so if you are up to no good, be prepared to get caught. Simple.

So are you saying that internet services like iCloud storage are open and anything on it should not be private and accessible to anybody who wants a peak? You really believe this...?

Prepared to get caught doing what?

Who defines what is "up to no good"? Helicopter gunship machine gunners "lighting-up" unarmed civilians, or the Bradley Manning's of this world..? Oh... when has the US government scheduled BM's execution for...?
 
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