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Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
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4,549
Texas
This would be easily solved with a pop up window that asks if you want to stay in current mode. Apple’s good at this.
But enabling/disabling Stage Manager is a two step process (swipe down on Control Center and tapping the icon).

I don’t see a huge need for a feature that will automatically enable Stage Manager when docking a keyboard to it (imo).

Those stands look interesting. But a missed opportunity that they didn't add power though a smart connector, like the Magic Keyboards can do.
Tbh, that’s entirely up to Apple. If I’m not mistaken, they control who has access to the Smart Connector… I‘m sure manufactures would want to create what you mention.
 
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Rafterman

Contributor
Apr 23, 2010
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But enabling/disabling Stage Manager is a two step process (swipe down on Control Center and tapping the icon).

I don’t see a huge need for a feature that will automatically enable Stage Manager when docking a keyboard to it (imo).


Tbh, that’s entirely up to Apple. If I’m not mistaken, they control who has access to the Smart Connector… I‘m sure manufactures would want to create what you mention.

It's probably a licensing fee.
 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
5,533
4,549
Texas
It's probably a licensing fee.
Perhaps! There’s no articles discussing it… but I’d imagine it’s expensive.

And I think it’s more on Apple choosing who to work with… I remember seeing an article detailing Brydge failure and how Apple reached out to them and later decided to stop partnering with them. At this point, Logitech is the only competitor that can compete with Apple in terms of Smart Connector access.
 
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sarcasticgamer

macrumors newbie
Jan 17, 2023
21
27
Some downsides are they keyboard is heavy, you lose a charging port that the Magic Keyboard gives you, have to charge the keyboard, and there were issues with the trackpad software (though maybe fixed now).
Never had these issues for the past decade of using them.
 

bcortens

macrumors 65816
Aug 16, 2007
1,274
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Ontario Canada
This would be easily solved with a pop up window that asks if you want to stay in current mode. Apple’s good at this.
I would say in the last 10 years they have fallen from good at this to just barely acceptable… Stage manager is still bad at windowing because of the stupid way they stack windows from the same app in the multitasking app switcher but only show you the top three. Window stacking was bad when they tried it on macOS and it hasn’t gotten any better when tried in iPadOS.

Edit: Updated to say Stage Manager is bad at windowing instead of calling it unusable bceause it isn’t actually unusable.

As @Ludatyk said above, Stage Manager is already ridiculously easy to toggle on and off
 

prospervic

macrumors 65816
Aug 2, 2007
1,072
1,250
NYC
…….I think it would be cool to have the iPad evolve into its own thing that can become as productive and intuitive to use as the Mac. Maybe apple could refine the iPad OS to be as good at mouse/keyboard input friendly as MacOS while still retaining the touch interface friendliness……….

If and when the iPad becomes that useful it will cannibalize Mac sales yes, but it will also cannibalize the entire PC/laptop/mobile industry and paradigm as well and could potentially reinvent the computer if it achieves that god like status. The potential sales and impact can be way higher than the lost Mac sales……
Yes, adding macOS capabilities to iPadOS is a more creative and challenging solution to iPad’s limitations than the lazy-minded “just slap macOS on the thing already“ fix demanded by certain geeks. (They should try using Sidecar to discover just how kludgy and inelegant this looks and feels.)

I agree that, although Apple seems to be moving as a glacial pace on this, when they eventually reach the pinnacle of iPadOS development it will create a new computing paradigm that will change what it means to operate a computer (with our hands, that is — Vision Pro not withstanding). I would welcome cannibalization in this case.
 
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transpo1

macrumors 65816
Jul 15, 2010
1,011
1,673
I would say in the last 10 years they have fallen from good at this to just barely acceptable… Stage manager is still bad at windowing because of the stupid way they stack windows from the same app in the multitasking app switcher but only show you the top three. Window stacking was bad when they tried it on macOS and it hasn’t gotten any better when tried in iPadOS.

Edit: Updated to say Stage Manager is bad at windowing instead of calling it unusable bceause it isn’t actually unusable.

As @Ludatyk said above, Stage Manager is already ridiculously easy to toggle on and off
I find Stage Manager gimmicky and not useful and therefore keep it turned off. IMHO they made too big a deal out of this feature when it debuted.
 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
5,533
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I find Stage Manager gimmicky and not useful and therefore keep it turned off. IMHO they made too big a deal out of this feature when it debuted.
I think the birth of Stage Manager came out of external display support... so, the two goes hand and hand. Without Stage Manager, iPad users wouldn't have received external display support.

Maybe you weren't apart of the group criticizing the iPad for not having external display support, but I believe it was a big deal when it debuted.
 
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bcortens

macrumors 65816
Aug 16, 2007
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Ontario Canada
I think the birth of Stage Manager came out of external display support... so, the two goes hand and hand. Without Stage Manager, iPad users wouldn't have received external display support.

Maybe you weren't apart of the group criticizing the iPad for not having external display support, but I believe it was a big deal when it debuted.
I actually wish we had gotten split-view and slide-over external display support alongside stage manager external display support.
 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
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I actually wish we had gotten split-view and slide-over external display support alongside stage manager external display support.
Umm... I don't think pre-existing multitasking is a good idea on a much larger display, it would be too limited versus the ability to resize and move windows around freely under Stage Manager. Heck, that was one the biggest criticism of Stage Manager when it was introduced... the lack of window/app movement.

Now, Apple has fixed it. And I understand it would be nice to have it as an option similar to Apple have done it on the iPad itself, but I personally wouldn't use pre-existing multitasking on an external monitor.
 
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Unregistered 4U

macrumors G4
Jul 22, 2002
10,159
8,104
Yep, Gurman seems more and more confident on M4. He stated M4 in his newsletter and on Bloomberg. The processor codes match his predictions.
“And the power of the M4 will be coming to other products for you macOS folks, later this year! Probably. If we don’t forget. ‘Hey Siri, remind me to have them put the M4 in a Mac.’ ”
 

kc9hzn

macrumors 68000
Jun 18, 2020
1,603
1,909
I think most people want the file management capabilities of MacOS with an iPad, and not MacOS per se.
Perhaps, but I think most of the same people don’t realize that the iPad’s file management capabilities have been getting better and better over the years. It may be more that they want to have the Finder on iPads so they don’t have to spend time learning how to make Files work for them than Files not being powerful enough for them. Or maybe they’re THOSE people, the people who keep every single file ever on their desktops.
 
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Unregistered 4U

macrumors G4
Jul 22, 2002
10,159
8,104
If and when the iPad becomes that useful it will cannibalize Mac sales yes, but it will also cannibalize the entire PC/laptop/mobile industry and paradigm as well and could potentially reinvent the computer if it achieves that god like status. The potential sales and impact can be way higher than the lost Mac sales. Similar to how the iPhone initially cannibalized the iPod and then become so much more than that. Steve Jobs also supported the idea himself.
Steve Jobs was never bothered with cannibalization. If, instead of buying a Mac, a customer is buying something else that has an Apple logo on it, that’s the intent. Especially if the device they’re getting is tied into services those users are likely to make use of. By the end of the year, Apple will have made up the profit margin difference on a MacBook from the user getting music, videos, subscriptions, games, etc. And, continue to make money in the coming years.

Apple has a product range that actually feels like it has cannibalizing built into it. Like Intel has to cripple their low end processors so folks still pay top dollar for the expensive ones, where Apple is giving users similar single threaded performance (for an Apple Silicon generation) across the entire line.
 

transpo1

macrumors 65816
Jul 15, 2010
1,011
1,673
I think the birth of Stage Manager came out of external display support... so, the two goes hand and hand. Without Stage Manager, iPad users wouldn't have received external display support.

Maybe you weren't apart of the group criticizing the iPad for not having external display support, but I believe it was a big deal when it debuted.
You’re probably right, and that’s how it came about, but still my criticism stands. If it works for you, that’s great 👍
 

bcortens

macrumors 65816
Aug 16, 2007
1,274
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Ontario Canada
Perhaps, but I think most of the same people don’t realize that the iPad’s file management capabilities have been getting better and better over the years. It may be more that they want to have the Finder on iPads so they don’t have to spend time learning how to make Files work for them than Files not being powerful enough for them. Or maybe they’re THOSE people, the people who keep every single file ever on their desktops.

I’ll stop complaining about files when the following are true:
  1. It doesn’t crash or freeze apps by trying to sync with iCloud while I’m in the middle of doing something
  2. It keeps a local cache of all iCloud files and folder metadata (not the files themselves just icons and names) on device so that I never have to wait for it to sync just to see the files and folders
  3. I can choose to keep just some folders or my entire iCloud Drive cached locally on device.
Until Apple can manage these then I will continue to call out File management on iPad OS
 
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bcortens

macrumors 65816
Aug 16, 2007
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Umm... I don't think pre-existing multitasking is a good idea on a much larger display, it would be too limited versus the ability to resize and move windows around freely under Stage Manager. Heck, that was one the biggest criticism of Stage Manager when it was introduced... the lack of window/app movement.

Now, Apple has fixed it. And I understand it would be nice to have it as an option similar to Apple have done it on the iPad itself, but I personally wouldn't use pre-existing multitasking on an external monitor.
When I actually bother to use stage manager it is with two apps side by side each set to 2/3 width mode and I just tap between them. Being able to see both at full width each on half of a 27” 5K screen would be an excellent experience.

When doing my job on my Mac I only have one or two windows visible at once on said 27” display at any given moment, usually Xcode with multiple vertical splits (2 or 3 files open usually)

Not everyone actually wants to see multiple things on screen at once and sometimes it just isn’t productive to do so.
 

scottrichardson

macrumors 6502a
Jul 10, 2007
701
275
Ulladulla, NSW Australia
Introducing… MacPad Pro with the all-new M4 chip from Apple.

It’s an iPad, and a Mac. Now you can enjoy the best of both worlds in one, portable device.

Just connect the keyboard and you have a Mac.

Detach the keyboard and MacPad automatically becomes an iPad.

Of course you can also detach the keyboard and wirelessly connect any Mac keyboard, mouse or trackpad and place the iPad anywhere you wish and stay in Mac mode.

Starting today. MacPad Pro comes standard with 16GB of RAM and a M4 chip!
 
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Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
5,533
4,549
Texas
When I actually bother to use stage manager it is with two apps side by side each set to 2/3 width mode and I just tap between them. Being able to see both at full width each on half of a 27” 5K screen would be an excellent experience.

When doing my job on my Mac I only have one or two windows visible at once on said 27” display at any given moment, usually Xcode with multiple vertical splits (2 or 3 files open usually)

Not everyone actually wants to see multiple things on screen at once and sometimes it just isn’t productive to do so.
But it's the freedom to do it. That's the point I'm trying to make... especially on a larger display (users demand that freedom).

And I think maybe you are more concern with the grid or locking element that comes with Split View, because I'm still able to have windows/apps side by side when using Stage Manager on an external display.
 

bcortens

macrumors 65816
Aug 16, 2007
1,274
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Ontario Canada
But it's the freedom to do it. That's the point I'm trying to make... especially on a larger display (users demand that freedom).

And I think maybe you are more concern with the grid or locking element that comes with Split View, because I'm still able to have windows/apps side by side when using Stage Manager on an external display.

It doesn’t matter if stage manager is more flexible. Sometimes I just want the nice easy way that Split View works.

The spit view multitasking switcher is still easier to use. I know I can work around the issues with stage manager I just shouldn’t have to.

Stage manager is nice for those who like it but that doesn’t really mean they shouldn’t also give us who actually like Split View the option to use it on external displays.
 
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bcortens

macrumors 65816
Aug 16, 2007
1,274
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Introducing… MacPad Pro with the all-new M4 chip from Apple.

It’s an iPad, and a Mac. Now you can enjoy the best of both worlds in one, portable device.

Just connect the keyboard and you have a Mac.

Detach the keyboard and MacPad automatically becomes an iPad.

Of course you can also detach the keyboard and wirelessly connect any Mac keyboard, mouse or trackpad and place the iPad anywhere you wish and stay in Mac mode.

Starting today. MacPad Pro comes standard with 16GB of RAM and a M4 chip!
And instantly the level of incentive to make a dedicated iPad app drops away as they can now just punt people towards the Mac version.
Torpedoing a decade of quality UX improvement to satisfy a fringe minority of a minority…

Honestly, the people who propose this “solution” don’t actually seem interested in making the iPad better but rather seem to just be intent on giving up on the iPad platform and retreating to familiar territory.
 
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Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
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It doesn’t matter if stage manager is more flexible. Sometimes I just want the nice easy way that Split View works.

The spit view multitasking switcher is still easier to use. I know I can work around the issues with stage manager I just shouldn’t have to.

Stage manager is nice for those who like it but that doesn’t really mean they shouldn’t also give us who actually like Split View the option to use it on external displays.
I understand you are not pleased with the whole idea of Stage Manager. But I just said… I’m still able to have side-by-side apps when using Stage Manager, I don’t understand the problem.

It’s one of those things where I think Apple decided this was the best method for external display due to its flexibility. There’s a group of folks that want overlapping windows, maybe a group of folks that want a grid of 3 or 4 apps.. then there’s a group (like you) who wants side-by-side apps like they are accustomed of doing.

Basically, this method covers all bases.
 

Rafterman

Contributor
Apr 23, 2010
7,034
8,409
And instantly the level of incentive to make a dedicated iPad app drops away as they can now just punt people towards the Mac version.
Torpedoing a decade of quality UX improvement to satisfy a fringe minority of a minority…

Honestly, the people who propose this “solution” don’t actually seem interested in making the iPad better but rather seem to just be intent on giving up on the iPad platform and retreating to familiar territory.

They are charging Enterprise desktop prices for iPad Pros, running a phone operating system. Regular iPads and Airs can keep their lower level OS, but Pro pricing should indicate a higher level of OS performance.

IMO, the Pros need to broken off from the iPad line and developed into a desktop OS experience. Airs can handle the higher end iPad experience already via iPadOS, like AAA games and 4K video editing. iPad Pros running the current iPadOS though is hardware overkill. The name "iPad Pro" should mean more than just better specs.
 
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bcortens

macrumors 65816
Aug 16, 2007
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They are charging Enterprise desktop prices for iPad Pros, running a phone operating system. Regular iPads and Airs can keep their lower level OS, but Pro pricing should indicate a higher level of OS performance.

IMO, the Pros need to broken off from the iPad line and developed into a desktop OS experience. Airs can handle the higher end iPad experience already via iPadOS, like AAA games and 4K video editing. iPad Pros running the current iPadOS though is hardware overkill. The name "iPad Pro" should mean more than just better specs.

None of that is an argument for not fixing iPadOS. That’s just a more elaborate version of, let’s give up on iPadOS.
 

Rafterman

Contributor
Apr 23, 2010
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None of that is an argument for not fixing iPadOS. That’s just a more elaborate version of, let’s give up on iPadOS.

How much do you "fix" iPadOS, before it morphs into MacOS? Fixing iPadOS is basically saying "make it more like MacOS." Don't do it half-arsed. Have iPadOS and have MacOS, the later on laptops, desktops and tablets. A third OS that sits between iOS and MacOS is not necessary.
 
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