iOS 10 is such a disappointment, why?

[agentsmithone]

I think iOS 10 is a beautiful, evolutionary refinement to iOS. I'm not entirely sold on the changes to the lock screen, but that's muscle memory and I'm relearning everyday.
It's my opinion that the people disappointed in iOS 10 are expecting it to be completely rebooted into something different like some type of macOS-Android hybrid nonsense. iOS 10 when finished will impress and overwhelm the expectations of new users and Android switchers and will be a familiar outgrowth for current users. As iOS 10 has matured I keep wanting more customization options, like letting us choose between a Dark mode or to switch back to the old lock screen.

 

[agentsmithone]

I use a Galaxy S7 Edge and iPhone 6S +, I swap regularly. Email and calendar is so far and away better on the S7E (and most Android devices for that matter). It's not just the robust interfaces but they seem to *work* better.

Personally, I do not like Apple's Mail or Google's GMail apps, I'm strictly a Google Inbox user, it's smarter and intuitive (not as robust as GMail or Outlook) but so much easier and even fun to use and keep track of messages, events, reservations, etc. I'm disappointed that Apple hasn't taken a hint from Inbox and other clones to innovate in the smart email client space—wouldn't it be bold and fresh if an Inbox clone version of Apple Mail were the default in iOS (and macOS for that matter)? That's something even Google isn't brave enough to do, even though it's clearly the superior email client.

 

[widgeteer]

Personally, I do not like Apple's Mail or Google's GMail apps, I'm strictly a Google Inbox user, it's smarter and intuitive (not as robust as GMail or Outlook) but so much easier and even fun to use and keep track of messages, events, reservations, etc. I'm disappointed that Apple hasn't taken a hint from Inbox and other clones to innovate in the smart email client space—wouldn't it be bold and fresh if an Inbox clone version of Apple Mail were the default in iOS (and macOS for that matter)? That's something even Google isn't brave enough to do, even though it's clearly the superior email client.

Yup! That's what I'm talking about. It's as though Apple has simply abandoned their own native apps save for iMessage and Maps. It's weird to me too considering how hard they worked to get the iPhone in as an Enterprise standard for a lot of companies.

 

[Beastmaster]

I think iOS 10 is a decent update. I *love* the new lockscreen, iMessage is an even better platform now. However I wish they would improve some of the native apps. I use a Galaxy S7 Edge and iPhone 6S +, I swap regularly. Email and calendar is so far and away better on the S7E (and most Android devices for that matter). It's not just the robust interfaces but they seem to *work* better. When I need to set a meeting in the calendar from Exchange, names/email populate lightening quick with Android. The iPhone Cal takes FOR-EFFING-EVER to populate a name. I've been with 2-3 different companies over the span of time the iPhone has been available, so this isn't a company-specific issue. This is just one example. iOS email is wonky at times too.

See? I'm not asking for anything flashy or "exciting". I just wish they would pay a little attention to their native apps.

Get Email by EasilyDo and Fantastical. They rock.

 

[Feenician]

Yup! That's what I'm talking about. It's as though Apple has simply abandoned their own native apps save for iMessage and Maps. It's weird to me too considering how hard they worked to get the iPhone in as an Enterprise standard for a lot of companies.

Being an enterprise standard is exactly why they don't throw in a flavour of the month "features" into their email client. It's not something a C level wants, needs or is asking for.

 

[KmanOz]

For me personally, I don't care if it's a rip off from android. If it works, it works for me

I do care. iOS feels polished compared to Android. Android is counter intuitive, cluncky and has way to many options to do a simple task that doesn't really increase productivity, but just gives you options for the sake of options. A good example is the top status bar or whatever it's called. Sometimes in screen grabs of Android I see 15 icons in that status bar. Often their duplicated. What the hell do they all mean and more so, who cares. How does using that phone become easier if you have 15 status's of services running in that status bar. How can you keep track of 15 icons and what exactly their purpose is and if one dropped off what that means. If anything it's more confusing. That's what Windows was and I don't want iOS to become the Windows of mobile phones like Android is. Keep it simple yet highly functional. Now I'm not saying it can't improve, but lets hope the improvements stay in line with the simplicity and functionality that iOS is built around. Believe it or not, it's much harder to design functional simplicity than it is to just add feature upon feature.
[doublepost=1471262309][/doublepost]

Wow, you completely missed the point: iOS did not have cut & paste (even though it existed). Good argument that if Android didn't have it, iOS still might not. My point is that the competition with Android has been great for users of both OSes.

Dude you are so far off the mark. You're saying iOS may not have Cut & Paste in 2016 if it wasn't for Android. Again I implore you, think about what you are saying. A better example would be that Eye Tracking feature that Samsung had where if you stopped looking at the screen it would turn off. Errrmmmm scratch that, that was just a stupid feature, Apple would never copy that.

 

[widgeteer]

Being an enterprise standard is exactly why they don't throw in a flavour of the month "features" into their email client. It's not something a C level wants, needs or is asking for.

So true. Being able to set reminders on email, calendar invitations that make it easy to contact attendees, etc are all silly gimmicks no true working professional needs.

Great point.
[doublepost=1471269519][/doublepost]

I do care. iOS feels polished compared to Android. Android is counter intuitive, cluncky and has way to many options to do a simple task that doesn't really increase productivity, but just gives you options for the sake of options. A good example is the top status bar or whatever it's called. Sometimes in screen grabs of Android I see 15 icons in that status bar. Often their duplicated. What the hell do they all mean and more so, who cares. How does using that phone become easier if you have 15 status's of services running in that status bar. How can you keep track of 15 icons and what exactly their purpose is and if one dropped off what that means. If anything it's more confusing. That's what Windows was and I don't want iOS to become the Windows of mobile phones like Android is. Keep it simple yet highly functional. Now I'm not saying it can't improve, but lets hope the improvements stay in line with the simplicity and functionality that iOS is built around. Believe it or not, it's much harder to design functional simplicity than it is to just add feature upon feature.
[doublepost=1471262309][/doublepost]

Dude you are so far off the mark. You're saying iOS may not have Cut & Paste in 2016 if it wasn't for Android. Again I implore you, think about what you are saying. A better example would be that Eye Tracking feature that Samsung had where if you stopped looking at the screen it would turn off. Errrmmmm scratch that, that was just a stupid feature, Apple would never copy that.

So this is the part that iOS users often get wrong. The person whose phone you saw a screen grab of probably knows exactly what those icons mean. It's great that they have the option to set up their phone in that manner, or if you prefer a cleaner look can set it up without those icons/notifications. Choice is an *advantage*. I agree that depending on the OEM, Android settings can be a bit of a mess to sort through. Having options though is tremendous, and I do wish iOS at this point would allow its users more choices in how their phone notifies them of messages, events, etc.

The "unpolished" bit doesn't fly anymore either. It's an old argument that doesn't work. You want to know what looks unpolished? The still huge number of iOS apps where developers never bothered to alter the screen ratio to reflect the larger iPhone Plus models. Looking at stretched out/blown up graphics on an interface is ugly as sin.

 

[Feenician]

So true. Being able to set reminders on email, calendar invitations that make it easy to contact attendees, etc are all silly gimmicks no true working professional needs.

Great point.

Firstly, I did not say that Mail.app could not be improved, merely that the corporate customers you point out (that now make up 50% or so of the iPad user base iirc) do not want their email client changing under their feet constantly. If you've worked in a corporate environment, and it sounds like you have, you'll know how averse to change they generally are. Apple merely provide a sane (and, yes, somewhat staid) default, which brings me to my second point...

Apps. There's nothing stopping people not locked to a corporate standard using the funky client de jour.

Third, I go back to the gimmickry, or worse, of some of these apps. The Gmail inbox one above as a prime example. Go to their website (google.com/inbox) and scroll down a little and what is the key feature they mention above all others? "Promotions are now organised". Thanks, Google, just what Johnny CFO needs

Tl;dr Apple's email is a fairly old school email client that implements the basic feature set of mail. It could probably stand to be improved a bit but radical change is highly unlikely. If you don't like it, use another app you do.

 

[widgeteer]

Firstly, I did not say that Mail.app could not be improved, merely that the corporate customers you point out (that now make up 50% or so of the iPad user base iirc) do not want their email client changing under their feet constantly. If you've worked in a corporate environment, and it sounds like you have, you'll know how averse to change they generally are. Apple merely provide a sane (and, yes, somewhat staid) default, which brings me to my second point...

They're averse to changing platforms, not more robust feature integration in the one they're currently using. There's a HUGE difference. Apple's staid default isn't sane, it's actually cumbersome in 2016.

Apps. There's nothing stopping people not locked to a corporate standard using the funky client de jour.

Third, I go back to the gimmickry, or worse, of some of these apps. The Gmail inbox one above as a prime example. Go to their website (google.com/inbox) and scroll down a little and what is the key feature they mention above all others? "Promotions are now organised". Thanks, Google, just what Johnny CFO needs

Tl;dr Apple's email is a fairly old school email client that implements the basic feature set of mail. It could probably stand to be improved a bit but radical change is highly unlikely. If you don't like it, use another app you do.

Apple's email is very old school. And the idea that any real change is unlikely is going to lead to a stall eventually in purchasing. Apple should take heed of what Blackberry experienced when that company and fanbase kept insisting the Earth could keep on rotating, they just needed to stand still.

 

[IndianBird]

I'm curious and I know we do this every time there is an update, but why is it labeled a success or a failure a month before it actually drops an official release?

 

[Feenician]

They're averse to changing platforms, not more robust feature integration in the one they're currently using. There's a HUGE difference. Apple's staid default isn't sane, it's actually cumbersome in 2016.



Apple's email is very old school. And the idea that any real change is unlikely is going to lead to a stall eventually in purchasing. Apple should take heed of what Blackberry experienced when that company and fanbase kept insisting the Earth could keep on rotating, they just needed to stand still.

I use mail.app to manage my personal gmail (so no real calendars, invites/meetings etc. to manage) and Outlook to manage my corporate email (where such things work as expected). Mail.app works fine for simple management of email and Outlook gives me the features I need on an exchange account. I use the client that has the features I want/need. No problem.

I highly doubt that most people are going to stores and rejecting iphones because they don't group promotions or have reminders in the default email client, and I doubt that even more in a corporate purchasing context.

 

[widgeteer]

I use mail.app to manage my personal gmail (so no real calendars, invites/meetings etc. to manage) and Outlook to manage my corporate email (where such things work as expected). Mail.app works fine for simple management of email and Outlook gives me the features I need on an exchange account. I use the client that has the features I want/need. No problem.

I highly doubt that most people are going to stores and rejecting iphones because they don't group promotions or have reminders in the default email client, and I doubt that even more in a corporate purchasing context.

You're making a leap no one is arguing. No, *right now* this isn't a big deal. However as Android becomes more robust in terms of usability (it always offered more features, but stability was a problem with the platform for a long time), there will be an effect. Especially from industries such as tech. Apple needs to be seen as competitive in those offices.

Also, the entire point of this conversation was that Apple's native apps are underpowered. You basically agree otherwise you wouldn't be suggesting people use other apps to fill in the gap. Just works...?

 

[KmanOz]

I'm curious and I know we do this every time there is an update, but why is it labeled a success or a failure a month before it actually drops an official release?

Because people love to sensationalise and create a conversation point. It will be success because Android has proved many times over that you can actually have a crappy OS and still be successful

 

[lagwagon]

So true. Being able to set reminders on email, calendar invitations that make it easy to contact attendees, etc are all silly gimmicks no true working professional needs.

Great point.
[doublepost=1471269519][/doublepost]

So this is the part that iOS users often get wrong. The person whose phone you saw a screen grab of probably knows exactly what those icons mean. It's great that they have the option to set up their phone in that manner, or if you prefer a cleaner look can set it up without those icons/notifications. Choice is an *advantage*. I agree that depending on the OEM, Android settings can be a bit of a mess to sort through. Having options though is tremendous, and I do wish iOS at this point would allow its users more choices in how their phone notifies them of messages, events, etc.

The "unpolished" bit doesn't fly anymore either. It's an old argument that doesn't work. You want to know what looks unpolished? The still huge number of iOS apps where developers never bothered to alter the screen ratio to reflect the larger iPhone Plus models. Looking at stretched out/blown up graphics on an interface is ugly as sin.

Choices aren't always a good thing. Too many choices or options adds too many variables that then lead to more bugs and issues. Choices add clutter (like the Android status bar example, and also in the phone settings themselves)

 

[C DM]

Choices aren't always a good thing. Too many choices or options adds too many variables that then lead to more bugs and issues. Choices add clutter (like the Android status bar example, and also in the phone settings themselves)

I think clutter and the like are more subjective as what's useful to some might not be to someone else, and vice versa. I do at least somewhat agree about more things introducing more variations and thus potentially more issues or at least complexities. There's some range that offers some balance, I'm not quite sure if iOS is really in that range, or if it is if it's much closer to one edge of it (rather than being around the middle).

 

[lagwagon]

I think clutter and the like are more subjective as what's useful to some might not be to someone else, and vice versa. I do at least somewhat agree about more things introducing more variations and thus potentially more issues or at least complexities. There's some range that offers some balance, I'm not quite sure if iOS is really in that range, or if it is if it's much closer to one edge of it (rather than being around the middle).

People complain about having to make one swipe from time to time (like with Music now has it's own CC card.) I can only imagine what it would be like if people had 1000 options in settings, having to sift through them all to find anything.

This is only personal opinion but I feel iOS hits the spot of being complex and a good set of features (and growing) all while being simple, clean and organized.

 

[C DM]

People complain about having to make one swipe from time to time (like with Music now has it's own CC card.) I can only imagine what it would be like if people had 1000 options in settings, having to sift through them all to find anything.

This is only personal opinion but I feel iOS hits the spot of being complex and a good set of features (and growing) all while being simple, clean and organized.

Realistically speaking, all kinds of people will complain about just about anything and everything essentially no matter what, be it too much, or too little, or even just enough/right. Ultimately I'd be happier with what would make things better for me, which would be some additional options for control some additional things. But as things are right now I'm certainly not disappointed or even unhappy about it all.

 

[duffman9000]

Personally, I do not like Apple's Mail or Google's GMail apps, I'm strictly a Google Inbox user, it's smarter and intuitive (not as robust as GMail or Outlook) but so much easier and even fun to use and keep track of messages, events, reservations, etc. I'm disappointed that Apple hasn't taken a hint from Inbox and other clones to innovate in the smart email client space—wouldn't it be bold and fresh if an Inbox clone version of Apple Mail were the default in iOS (and macOS for that matter)? That's something even Google isn't brave enough to do, even though it's clearly the superior email client.

I don't know how Apple decides what apps are critical and require substantial investment. We know Apple is deeply devoted to iMessage, Music, Safari, and Maps (to be brief). Should Mail be included in that group? I don't know. Maybe, since it's a very important app. But if Apple is in, it has to be committed. I wish I could change the default Mail client even more than wanting to change the default Maps provider.

 

[LovingTeddy]

Choices aren't always a good thing. Too many choices or options adds too many variables that then lead to more bugs and issues. Choices add clutter (like the Android status bar example, and also in the phone settings themselves)

I feel exactly the different way. The Android status bar gives me exactly what I want and I can extract informations from icon without really do anything.

For example: I know I have a mail message, I know I have WeChat message, I know if app are updating in the background. I don't need go back to home screen to know I have message waiting, I have unanswered call, I don't need go App Store to know I have app updating.

I love choice. I dislike Applw force stuff to my throat.

 

[lagwagon]

I feel exactly the different way. The Android status bar gives me exactly what I want and I can extract informations from icon without really do anything.

For example: I know I have a mail message, I know I have WeChat message, I know if app are updating in the background. I don't need go back to home screen to know I have message waiting, I have unanswered call, I don't need go App Store to know I have app updating.

I love choice. I dislike Applw force stuff to my throat.

Funny. I can know all that stuff too without going to the home screen. It's called notifications. I don't need to go to the App Store either, automatic downloads and notifications when an app updates. And the status bar isn't completely filled with icons, its clean and void of redundant info and icons.

 

[C DM]

Funny. I can know all that stuff too without going to the home screen. It's called notifications. I don't need to go to the App Store either, automatic downloads and notifications when an app updates. And the status bar isn't completely filled with icons, its clean and void of redundant info and icons.

Well, that would be if you catch those notifications or pull down the notification center and go through the notifications there, assuming you didn't dismiss them already (while the new messages/etc. are still there waiting). Again, nothing wrong with an approach like that at all, similarly to nothing really being wrong with the status bar approach for those what would like to use that because it works better for them.

 

[lagwagon]

Well, that would be if you catch those notifications or pull down the notification center and go through the notifications there, assuming you didn't dismiss them already (while the new messages/etc. are still there waiting). Again, nothing wrong with an approach like that at all, similarly to nothing really being wrong with the status bar approach for those what would like to use that because it works better for them.

And then we circle back to one simple swipe people seem to find the worst thing ever. (if you miss a notification) If the phone is in use it's fairly hard to miss a notification and if the phone is not in use while one comes in, well...that's what the lock screen is for and the first thing you'd see anyways.

 

[C DM]

And then we circle back to one simple swipe people seem to find the worst thing ever. (if you miss a notification) If the phone is in use it's fairly hard to miss a notification and if the phone is not in use while one comes in, well...that's what the lock screen is for and the first thing you'd see anyways.

Well, you have to catch them and perhaps more importantly remember them if you didn't act on them when you saw them (and perhaps dismissed them). Checking notification center is one way, looking for badges is another way, something like having at least certain ones that you might care about (like missed calls, or new messages, or emails or something like that) being present in the status bar is certainly a fairly straightforward and potentially simpler way as well. For some it might be more cluttered perhaps, for others it might not be, just like for some it's simple to check notification center at different times or look for badges, while for others it would be simpler to just see something in the status bar that's present more often without any additional actions.

 

[Jimrod]

Exactly. If Apple is at a point right now where they're running low on new ideas, there is no better way to move the platform forward than to give developers more tools and features to do great things.

Nice in principal but Apple have a habit of taking things from developers, making them their own and removing the developer's app... I'd imagine it makes some reluctant.

 

[akash.nu]

Choices aren't always a good thing. Too many choices or options adds too many variables that then lead to more bugs and issues. Choices add clutter (like the Android status bar example, and also in the phone settings themselves)

Couldn't agree more.