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Digitalguy

macrumors 601
Apr 15, 2019
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The i5 and lower models were fanless from SP7 and prior, so maybe for them they were throttled. But the i7s in all previous models had fans, so I don't think they would have had a reason to throttle.
they did throttle too although less than the fanless models. The SP8 is the first Surface pro that can sustain the full performance.
 

bondr006

macrumors 68030
Jun 8, 2010
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Cary, NC - My Name is Rob Bond
Indeed. Since the 2018 iPad Pro 11 form factor came out, it has been my most used Apple device period. My consumption of the written word has gone up exponentially among moving a LOT of my computing to the iPad. I use it with a 4K external monitor when I want to, or right now, in a lab with an external mouse and keyboard as if it was a laptop. Reading on this thing is unparalleled - with an iCarez matte screen protector. I have tried to replace this iPad with a MBP, a mini, and no iPad - I keep coming back to my iPad - it is my most used device. Does it do everything? No. Does it do almost everything I need? Yep.

Like you - I have a mini, a MBP, and my much loved iPad Pro 11. It’s going to be this way for some time. Everyone’s needs are different so what works for me may not work well for others - that’s fine. Keeps life interesting. Would I love a 1 device fits all scenario? Absolutely. But life isn’t perfect. But as a techie (someone who knows how to program - I use Parallels with Windows 11 (visual studio 2022)) - I absolutely love my iPad - it is my most used device (not counting work).
I concur. I have replaced my MBP with my M1 iPad Pro 11. I wish everyone had the tolerance to realize that not everyone's use case is the same, and that it can be done. It seems that the question of whether the iPad Pro can replace a laptop is as polarizing as religion and politics. For some yes, for others no. It all depends on the person and their needs. It certainly can for a large minority of people.

My story...

Love my M1 iPad Pro 11. I am a Realtor and Property Manager, and my iPad Pro has completely replaced my MacBook Pro as my business device. The iPad Pro is literally the perfect computer for what I do.

It was an easy decision for me to get rid of my 2019 MacBook Pro(hated the dang ribbon bar). I got the new M1 Mac Mini with 16gb ram for desktop, and a new M1 iPad Pro 11 for my mobile needs. I chose the 11” because the screen is big enough for doing work on, but still super portable. Paid less for the two of them together than I did for just my MBP. It's the perfect setup for me. I create and work with contracts, pdf's, and documents on a daily basis. It is so much easier, convenient, and more intuitive to use the iPad for the work I do. In fact, I would go so far as to say, in my opinion the laptop is limiting and cumbersome compared to the iPad Pro for the type of work I do. Jeeze, even the camera on it is good enough to use for most of the photos I need for a property listing. It streamlined my workflow, and has definitely made my work more fun.

Cloud storage is cheap nowadays, as is fast external storage. I got the M1 iPad Pro 11 with 256gb, but have 2TB iCloud+ for $10 month, 1TB of cloud storage with MS Office 365 and OneDrive. I also have 2TB of Google Drive storage for $10 a month. On top of that, I have a couple of external 1TB USB C SSD's, and a few USB 3.1 512GB flash drives. So, storage is not a problem. It easily runs any of the realty apps I need to use, so only 8gb ram is no problem. And, it has the same M1 processor the 1TB and up models have, so power is also not a problem.

Don't have the magic keyboard but bought the Logitech Combo Touch and I love it. It fully protects my iPad front, back, and edges. I can take the keyboard off, and it is still protected, and has a fully adjustable stand. The typing experience is excellent, and the keyboard has a large, very responsive, click anywhere trackpad. And, one of the things I love the most about it is, it has a full row of shortcut keys. I also bought a Logitech MX Anywhere 2s mouse, and an Apple Pencil 2, both of which are the best. I have a few choices for carry. First, is a small traditional laptop case with many zippered compartments. Second is a nice REI sling bag with lots of pockets and storage. Last is a small REI backpack with even more pockets and storage than the sling. I can carry all the accessories I need with any of my carry choices.

Working with a product that you like to use is an important key in business. No need for a dedicated camera or scanner anymore. I also use it for handwritten and typed notes, daily planning, task management, to-do's, email, web browsing, phone calls, messages, entertainment, reading books, play an occasional game, and the list goes on. I use a bunch of realty specific web apps and services but have a few others that I really like.

For note management I use Notes, OneNote, GoodNotes, and Noteful. I also use a Paperlike screen protector and my Apple Pencil 2 for a natural writing experience. For document management I use MS Office, and PDF Expert. For file management I use Files, iCloud+, FileBrowser, Tonido, OneDrive, and Google.

Now that I have used the iPad Pro for work, there is no going back to a laptop. The Apple ecosystem is the best. Everything just talks and works with each other seamlessly. As of right now, I have the Apple TV 4K/AirPod Pros/Apple Watch Series 6 44mm/iPhone 12 Pro Max 512GB/M1 iPad Pro 11 256GB/M1 Mac Mini 16GB RAM, 256GB SSD/2019 intel i9 2.3ghz 16gb 512gb 16" MacBook Pro(sold).

Really cool having an all in one that’s easy to use and light to carry for your business and personal needs. I will admit that iPad OS still has a way to go but has certainly come a long way from its humble beginnings. Been using Apple products since the mid 90’s. My first Apple computer was a Macintosh Color Classic in Jan. 1994. In the almost 30 years I have been using Apple products, I have had to take only one one thing to the Genius Bar. My iPhone 5 had a bad battery in it, and they replaced the phone with no problem. My avatar picture is what is left of my collection of the Apple stickers I haven't given away. Still have about half of them. Not bad for 30 years and dozens of Apple products.

An evolving list of what can be done with the iPad.
 
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Rafterman

Contributor
Apr 23, 2010
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Indeed. Since the 2018 iPad Pro 11 form factor came out, it has been my most used Apple device period. My consumption of the written word has gone up exponentially among moving a LOT of my computing to the iPad. I use it with a 4K external monitor when I want to, or right now, in a lab with an external mouse and keyboard as if it was a laptop. Reading on this thing is unparalleled - with an iCarez matte screen protector. I have tried to replace this iPad with a MBP, a mini, and no iPad - I keep coming back to my iPad - it is my most used device. Does it do everything? No. Does it do almost everything I need? Yep.

Like you - I have a mini, a MBP, and my much loved iPad Pro 11. It’s going to be this way for some time. Everyone’s needs are different so what works for me may not work well for others - that’s fine. Keeps life interesting. Would I love a 1 device fits all scenario? Absolutely. But life isn’t perfect. But as a techie (someone who knows how to program - I use Parallels with Windows 11 (visual studio 2022)) - I absolutely love my iPad - it is my most used device (not counting work).

The 11 is the sweet spot iPad - almost as small and light as a Mini, but you can really spec it up if you want. A lot of people went for the 12.9 in 2021 due to mini LED, but now (allegedly) the two Pro models will spec equally. So the 11 should get a lot more popular for 2022.
 

DeepSix

macrumors 6502a
Feb 4, 2022
855
937
I'm not sure how they are throttling Surfaces.

MS has always throttled Surfaces but it was the worse with 6 and 7. It heavily trottled just from idling in windows. When people found out there has been a huge backlash in the media upon owners. The machines would crawl down to celeron speed….600hz, sometimes even as low as 200hz. This is why I’ve always bought the base level Surfaces. Unacceptable for what you pay for a decently powered device but MS has it running at celeron speed most of the time. To get a device in the Surface form factor, you have to make some big compromises and proper and adequate thermals is one of them. You just can't put proper thermals into such a thin device. And Microsoft is the last company in the world that I would count on coming up with something. They're a software company, not a hardware company.
 
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DeepSix

macrumors 6502a
Feb 4, 2022
855
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they did throttle too although less than the fanless models. The SP8 is the first Surface pro that can sustain the full performance.

I bet the only reason why the SP8 actually maintains it's power is because MS took serious backlash on the 6 and 7 for heavily throttling. It only took MS 9 generations to get it right, good lord. But there will be issues, don't get me wrong. Each gen has a different hardware issue that MS does not address. Pen jitter has carried over from each generation of the Surface Pro and even though owners of SP8 are saying that the Slim Pen 2 is much improved, it's too early to tell if MS has finally overcome the pen jitter. This is one big reason why I gave up on the Surface, the pen jitter drove me nuts. Literally made the device unusable for me as a writing device.
 
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Digitalguy

macrumors 601
Apr 15, 2019
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MS has always throttled Surfaces but it was the worse with 6 and 7. It heavily trottled just from idling in windows. When people found out there has been a huge backlash in the media upon owners. The machines would crawl down to celeron speed….600hz, sometimes even as low as 200hz. This is why I’ve always bought the base level Surfaces. Unacceptable for what you pay for a decently powered device but MS has it running at celeron speed most of the time. To get a device in the Surface form factor, you have to make some big compromises and proper and adequate thermals is one of them. You just can't put proper thermals into such a thin device. And Microsoft is the last company in the world that I would count on coming up with something. They're a software company, not a hardware company.
The 600hz issue may be a different thing, not thermal throttling but power limit throttling. I have had it with my HP clone and the solution was to set the turbo boost limit much higher than the 3.5 watt (in my case) it had for some reason via Intel XTU. I set it to 15watts. I never understood while this happened. A friend had a similar issue but in her case it happened after idling for a certain number of minutes. XTU did not help and the solution was to set an automatic stand-by after 3-5 minutes of idling. Not ideal in both cases (with my HP it has to be set every time I restart, but I only restart once or twice a month), but at least it avoid the issue. Again this a nothing to do with cooling or thermals.
 

igauravarora

macrumors regular
Original poster
Feb 16, 2017
112
161
Yeah, but the quoted poster's comment stands. We know what we get if one is a previous iPad user. So why the shock and anger when it is exactly like the last iPad? Don't buy an iPad until they up the OS game on it.
So angry, shocked, upset and at fault I am and ofcourse the quoted comment stands as you're the judge and the jury. Maybe add a one or two syllables more like abashed? as people here in macrumors are apparently in touch with what I feel these days.

Anyways, if it works for you, great. It didn't work for me and I have only shared by experience. The first line I wrote in the first page is that it depends of individual's use case and I want to share my experience only.

And it's not exactly like my iPad Air 2, I didn't say that. Thank you for your advice in my purchasing decision, it's of immense value to me and would surely ask you first before buying anything :)

Lastly, my gripes are and were about the software that I used or the lack thereof and it wasn't up to the par and I stand by those as many others do as well. My comments about the software are my personal experiences with it and if someone else's experience is different than mine then I am happy for them but my bad experience or their good experience or vice-versa doesn't diminish each other's comments where one stands and other doesn't?
 

bondr006

macrumors 68030
Jun 8, 2010
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Cary, NC - My Name is Rob Bond
So angry, shocked, upset and at fault I am and ofcourse the quoted comment stands as you're the judge and the jury. Maybe add a one or two syllables more like abashed? as people here in macrumors are apparently in touch with what I feel these days.

Anyways, if it works for you, great. It didn't work for me and I have only shared by experience. The first line I wrote in the first page is that it depends of individual's use case and I want to share my experience only.

And it's not exactly like my iPad Air 2, I didn't say that. Thank you for your advice in my purchasing decision, it's of immense value to me and would surely ask you first before buying anything :)

Lastly, my gripes are and were about the software that I used or the lack thereof and it wasn't up to the par and I stand by those as many others do as well. My comments about the software are my personal experiences with it and if someone else's experience is different than mine then I am happy for them but my bad experience or their good experience or vice-versa doesn't diminish each other's comments where one stands and other doesn't?
Not trying to single you out, you are just the op. My iPad Pro works really well for me. It easily replaced my MBP for work, not only easily, but in a way that makes my work fun, productive, efficient, cost effective, and convenient. In fact, it is one of my favorite, if not the favorite of my Apple devices....as the majority of folk here and I have in common. Been 30 years using Apple products and only one bad device that btw, was replaced without question. All brands have detractors, shills, defective products, and are certainly imperfect, but Apple rocks better than Samsung and Microsoft combined. People here have a right and a reason to love their products and be loyal to Apple. Sincerely sorry that you either don't like Apple, and/or have had a bad experience with their products.

During the fourth quarter of 2021, Apple shipped around 17.5 million tablets worldwide.

In the fourth quarter of 2021, Samsung's tablet shipments worldwide amounted to 7.3 million units.

How many MS Surface tablets sold Q4 2021? I won't embarrass Microsoft.;)

Samsung vs iPhone sales.png


Kind of like comparing the
Apple logo invert.png
Yankees 27 World Series Pennants to the
MS logo2in.png
png-transparent-samsung-logo-samsung-galaxy-a8-2018-logo-samsung-electronics-arrow-sketch-comp-png.1968924
Boston Red Sox 13 World Series Pennants. I have no doubt whatsoever that Apple would handily beat Samsung sales revenues in major appliances and TV's if they manufactured them also.

NY Yankees emblem2.png
Apple logo invert.png
 

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igauravarora

macrumors regular
Original poster
Feb 16, 2017
112
161
Not trying to single you out, you are just the op. My iPad Pro works really well for me. It easily replaced my MBP for work, not only easily, but in a way that makes my work fun, productive, efficient, cost effective, and convenient. In fact, it is one of my favorite, if not the favorite of my Apple devices....as the majority of folk here and I have in common. Been 30 years using Apple products and only one bad device that btw, was replaced without question. All brands have detractors, shills, defective products, and are certainly imperfect, but Apple rocks better than Samsung and Microsoft combined. People here have a right and a reason to love their products and be loyal to Apple. Sincerely sorry that you either don't like Apple, and/or have had a bad experience with their products.

During the fourth quarter of 2021, Apple shipped around 17.5 million tablets worldwide.

In the fourth quarter of 2021, Samsung's tablet shipments worldwide amounted to 7.3 million units.

How many MS Surface tablets sold Q4 2021? I won't embarrass Microsoft.;)

View attachment 1968920

Kind of like comparing the View attachment 1968938 Yankees 27 World Series Pennants to the View attachment 1968930
png-transparent-samsung-logo-samsung-galaxy-a8-2018-logo-samsung-electronics-arrow-sketch-comp-png.1968924
Boston Red Sox 13 World Series Pennants. I have no doubt whatsoever that Apple would handily beat Samsung sales revenues if they manufactured major appliances and TV's also.

View attachment 1968922 View attachment 1968938
Do understand that I actually am happy for all the people who have made good use of their ipads and enjoy using it. You're right in all the figures you represented and I couldn't be more glad that you and many others enjoy using it. I have been an apple fanboy (for a lack of the better word) for quite sometime and I use their products exclusively. If they made a new product for example an e-reader made by apple then I would happily sell my current kindle to switch brands. My gripes are with the software that I experienced and I have detailed most of it in this thread to my capacity.

My problem starts when people start telling me (not you) that I am upset or angry or other words that they use when they know nothing about me. I just shared my experience just like everyone else is sharing theirs however, I don't go telling them that they are angry, upset, shocked or at fault etc. At the end of the day, it's my point of view at the thoughts/words I wrote in the first page and I didn't write them down to demean anyone or to downplay their opinions.

and my hope is that apple will actually add something to the software experience which will enhance the software capabilities even further but the current state of iPadOS is not up to the par in my opinion.
 

bondr006

macrumors 68030
Jun 8, 2010
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Cary, NC - My Name is Rob Bond
Do understand that I actually am happy for all the people who have made good use of their ipads and enjoy using it. You're right in all the figures you represented and I couldn't be more glad that you and many others enjoy using it. I have been an apple fanboy (for a lack of the better word) for quite sometime and I use their products exclusively. If they made a new product for example an e-reader made by apple then I would happily sell my current kindle to switch brands. My gripes are with the software that I experienced and I have detailed most of it in this thread to my capacity.

My problem starts when people start telling me (not you) that I am upset or angry or other words that they use when they know nothing about me. I just shared my experience just like everyone else is sharing theirs however, I don't go telling them that they are angry, upset, shocked or at fault etc. At the end of the day, it's my point of view at the thoughts/words I wrote in the first page and I didn't write them down to demean anyone or to downplay their opinions.

and my hope is that apple will actually add something to the software experience which will enhance the software capabilities even further but the current state of iPadOS is not up to the par in my opinion.
Yeah, what I didn't clarify when I said that my iPad Pro easily replaced my MBP for my business and the work I do, was that I was talking about iPad OS as opposed to MacOS or Windows. iPad OS is more streamlined and intuitive which simplifies and even reduces steps, or condenses if you will, the work I do (Contracts, pdf's, notes, property listings and photos, scanning, sharing) and other realty/property management related tasks. I am a realtor. To me, it's also the whole package between the hardware and software that works so well for me. iPad Pro does iPad OS really well. Does iPad OS need to keep evolving into something more people can use seriously? Hell yeah, but for now there is still a very large minority that can use it for more than just fun, and yes, even replace their "traditional" computer too.?I predict that that number just keeps on growing.;)
 
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igauravarora

macrumors regular
Original poster
Feb 16, 2017
112
161
Yeah, what I didn't clarify when I said that my iPad Pro easily replaced my MBP for my business and the work I do, was that I was talking about iPad OS as opposed to MacOS or Windows. iPad OS is more streamlined and intuitive which simplifies and even reduces steps, or condenses if you will, the work I do (Contracts, pdf's, notes, property listings and photos, scanning, sharing) and other realty/property management related tasks. I am a realtor. To me, it's also the whole package between the hardware and software that works so well for me. iPad does iPad OS really well. Does iPad OS need to keep evolving into something more people can use seriously? Hell yeah, but for now there is still a very large minority that can use it for more than just fun, and yes even replace their "traditional" computer too. I predict that that number just keeps on growing.;)
It largely depends on the individual use case. I bet most of the people wouldn't be able to replace their mbp for an iPad as simply the Pro apps doesn't exist on the iPadOS. Maybe there are alternatives for it but they are hardly on par with their macOS equivalent. Still, again, it depends. Many music software exists on the iPad which arguably could be better than Macbook just because of the touch input. Your use case fits perfectly with the iPadOS which is good if it's working for you.

I don't know about who is in majority or minority as it's simply hard to know about it. I have talked about this in one of my previous posts as well.

Moving back a bit, I don't even think it's about replacing MacBook for an iPad or putting macOS on the iPad, at least I sure don't want that to happen. It's the hardware capability of the iPad Pro which makes the software look really bad imo.
 

bondr006

macrumors 68030
Jun 8, 2010
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Cary, NC - My Name is Rob Bond
@igauravarora

"It largely depends on the individual use case."

I agree 100%

"I bet most of the people wouldn't be able to replace their mbp for an iPad as simply the Pro apps doesn't exist on the iPadOS."

That's why I said, a large minority, not majority could replace their "Traditional Computer" with an iPad Pro.

"Moving back a bit, I don't even think it's about replacing MacBook for an iPad or putting macOS on the iPad, at least I sure don't want that to happen."

I don't necessarily want MacOS on the iPad either, unless they could modify it to be primarily "touch first" for tablet/touch use, and keyboard/mouse input secondarily like iPad OS. I actually like iPad OS and would really just like to see Apple make iPad OS an OS that can run pro level applications. Don't know if it is Apple holding developers back, or if developers just need to catch their existing apps up to the M1's capabilities, or a combination of both. M1 iPad Pros certainly have power, ram, and storage capacity now, so somebody needs to get with the program for Pete's sake. Apple needs to keep adding OS capabilities and pro features, and updating its native apps to the desktop level experience too.

"It's the hardware capability of the iPad Pro which makes the software look really bad imo."

I disagree with this statement. In my experience, use and observation, it is the iPad OS that makes the hardware/M1 iPad Pro look bad. Yes, the iPad Pro hardware surpasses the capabilities of the OS that operates it, but the fact still remains it is the OS that is keeping the M1 iPad Pros from living up to the "Pro" moniker it has been titled with.

My M1 iPad Pro 11 was truly a game changer for me. It is currently my favorite Apple product. I believe that Apple and its developers will keep improving the the OS and software to provide this experience to many more people.
 
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igauravarora

macrumors regular
Original poster
Feb 16, 2017
112
161
"It's the hardware capability of the iPad Pro which makes the software look really bad imo."

I disagree with this statement. In my experience, use and observation, it is the iPad OS that makes the hardware/M1 iPad Pro look bad. Yes, the iPad Pro hardware surpasses the capabilities of the OS that operates it, but the fact still remains it is the OS that is keeping the M1 iPad Pros from living up to the "Pro" moniker they has been titled with.
I think from what I understood, you actually agree with me except for that first line of your disagreement? I have read your comment like 10 times but I don't know if I understand it correctly. Apologies if I didn't.

You think iPadOS is making the M1 hardware look bad? that's exactly what I meant when I said the software is bad for the hardware capabilities. The software is hampering the iPad Pro to reach its full potential and I have talked about it previously, several times. In my view to simply put, hardware is much more capable but the software is severely limited for what it can possible achieve.

On other things that you wrote, I agree, more or less.

Dunno though, I think we have different experiences with regards to the iPad Pro and I am sure we cannot change that, however, I agree to disagree with you in regards to our experiences/differences with due respect.
 

bondr006

macrumors 68030
Jun 8, 2010
2,904
16,823
Cary, NC - My Name is Rob Bond
@igauravarora

"Dunno though, I think we have different experiences with regards to the iPad Pro and I am sure we cannot change that, however, I agree to disagree with you in regards to our experiences/differences with due respect."

We do, and I agree to disagree on any differences
thumbsup.gif


Just one more thing though.? The way you worded this statement clearly points to the hardware being the blame. My statement is just the opposite, pointing clearly and directly to the software being the blame.

Yours...

"It's the hardware capability of the iPad Pro which makes the software look really bad imo."

I can somewhat see that your statement could possibly be interpreted to say the software is to blame though.

Mine...

"In my experience, use and observation, it is the iPad OS that makes the hardware/M1 iPad Pro look bad."

cheers.gif
 
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Luis Ortega

macrumors 65816
May 10, 2007
1,185
362
Summary: didnt research what an iPad was, didn’t really want one. An iPad is an excellent tablet and an excellent tablet experience. It is not a laptop and is not a good laptop experience
Maybe if apple wasn’t hell bent on telling everyone that iPads are computers, people wouldn’t waste their money buying a product not fit for purpose.
 

bondr006

macrumors 68030
Jun 8, 2010
2,904
16,823
Cary, NC - My Name is Rob Bond
Maybe if apple wasn’t hell bent on telling everyone that iPads are computers, people wouldn’t waste their money buying a product not fit for purpose.
But, iPads are computers. Just not a "traditional" desktop/laptop computer, but a very capable tablet computer that can do a majority of the things a "traditional" computer can. Even able to replace a "traditional" laptop for many people.;)

Things the iPad can do...
 

BigMcGuire

Cancelled
Jan 10, 2012
9,832
14,032
But, iPads are computers. Just not a "traditional" desktop/laptop computer, but a very capable tablet computer that can do a majority of the things a "traditional" computer can. Even able to replace a "traditional" laptop for many people.;)

Things the iPad can do...
I have to agree with you here. It will fulfill the needs of a "computer" for a (in my opinion) vast array of the population. I know quite a few people who use their phone as their primary computer. Heck, the last computer science class I took, over half the class tried to take the quiz (online despite the class being in person and having a college provided desktop at every desk) on their cellphone.

Outside of work and gaming, 98.9% of my time is spent on my iPad 11 Pro. When I want a bit more of a desktop experience, I plug it into my 4k monitor. Sure, when I'm doing heavy excel spreadsheet work, VS 2022 programming in Windows 11 - I'll go to my MBP but outside of work/gaming - I don't do that too often.

During work - my iPad is relegated to note taking via Notability and the pencil. So when I say it is my most used device by miles - .... it has been since 2018.
 

UBS28

macrumors 68030
Oct 2, 2012
2,893
2,340
But, iPads are computers. Just not a "traditional" desktop/laptop computer, but a very capable tablet computer that can do a majority of the things a "traditional" computer can. Even able to replace a "traditional" laptop for many people.;)

Things the iPad can do...

iPads are big iPhones. The good news about it that is if the iPhone gets something, so will the iPad. The bad thing about it, it just a big iPhone with a pencil.

So the iPad Pro will get World of Warcraft for sure for example, because it requires no effort from Blizzard to port it from iPhone to iPad when they release that game for iOS in the near future (and you will probably want the M1 chip for that).
 

maflynn

macrumors Haswell
May 3, 2009
73,682
43,740
But, iPads are computers.
Technically yes, i.e., they contain a cpu, but in actuality, no, not really. Its a great device for content consumption, and there's some content creation that is possible, but overall a traditional laptop or a desktop does more better.

I was trying to edit a pdf on my iPad, it could do it, but truth be told, doing it on a laptop was so much easier. Do I want to write code on an iPad or a laptop?

I have used an iPad to remote into a server to resolve a problem - its not something I'd want to do long term. It was not a fun experience but it got the job done in an emergency. Now I just bring a laptop with me because its the better tool for those sort of things
 

bondr006

macrumors 68030
Jun 8, 2010
2,904
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Cary, NC - My Name is Rob Bond
iPads are big iPhones. The good news about it that is if the iPhone gets something, so will the iPad. The bad thing about it, it just a big iPhone with a pencil.

So the iPad Pro will get World of Warcraft for sure for example, because it requires no effort from Blizzard to port it from iPhone to iPad when they release that game for iOS in the near future (and you will probably want the M1 chip for that).
Some people are like talking to "Flat Earthers". The uncontested proof is there that the Earth is a sphere, but they still deny it. The iPad may be able to do what the iPhone does, but that doesn't make it a big phone, nor does it change the fact that it is undeniably, beyond the shadow of a doubt.....100% a computer. It may not be a laptop computer or a desktop computer, but it is definitely a tablet computer. It has all the same electronic parts(processor, ram, gpu, hd or ssd, circuits and capacitors), can perform the same functions(in some cases better than the traditional Win or Mac computer), hook up to a mouse, touchpad, and monitor. The only difference is the OS that runs it. If the OS is your hang up, then Linux computers shouldn't be classified as computers. Chrome books shouldn't be classified as computers. Heck, the Raspberry pi should not be classified as a computer. Windows computers can run software Mac computers can't and Mac computers can run software Windows computers can't. Linux does things differently than either Mac or Windows. But the fact is that they are all computers, only differentiated by the operating systems that run them.

My M1 iPad Pro 11 replaced my MBP for use in my real estate and property management business and totally streamlined my workflow, reduced steps I had to take, makes the work easier, and a lot more fun. I work with contracts, forms, docs, pdf's, take a huge amount of notes, sketch house dimensions, take pictures, communicate(messages and email), do research, figure out taxes and mortgage payments, and do a bunch of scanning. Working with documents, pdf's, contracts, and forms is so much easier for me. Editing, marking up, and then sending to clients is all done within the app, and reduces the amount of steps it takes to communicate. The iPad also reduced the amount of hardware devices I needed, and condensed them all into one really portable device that actually makes my work more easy and convenient. You can deny it's a computer all you want but when I head out the door, it is my main go to computer that does more, does it easier, does it faster, and does it in less steps. I really look forward to grabbing my iPad computer when I go to work, and feel great relief that I don't have to deal with a clunky and cumbersome laptop computer any more.

Dictionary.com - Computer Definition

"A programmable electronic device designed to accept data, perform prescribed mathematical and logical operations at high speed, and display the results of these operations. Mainframes, desktop and laptop computers, tablets, and smartphones are some of the different types of computers."

By any definition or description of "Computer", the iPad safely, and firmly qualifies. The burden of proof is on you to prove that the iPad is not a computer.
 
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bondr006

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Jun 8, 2010
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Cary, NC - My Name is Rob Bond
Technically yes, i.e., they contain a cpu, but in actuality, no, not really. Its a great device for content consumption, and there's some content creation that is possible, but overall a traditional laptop or a desktop does more better.

I was trying to edit a pdf on my iPad, it could do it, but truth be told, doing it on a laptop was so much easier. Do I want to write code on an iPad or a laptop?

I have used an iPad to remote into a server to resolve a problem - its not something I'd want to do long term. It was not a fun experience but it got the job done in an emergency. Now I just bring a laptop with me because its the better tool for those sort of things
You might want to try PDF Expert by Readdle. Been using it for years and it is imo the best pdf app for iPad. Really streamlines my workflow when I am working with pdf's.
 
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Rafterman

Contributor
Apr 23, 2010
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MS has always throttled Surfaces but it was the worse with 6 and 7. It heavily trottled just from idling in windows. When people found out there has been a huge backlash in the media upon owners. The machines would crawl down to celeron speed….600hz, sometimes even as low as 200hz. This is why I’ve always bought the base level Surfaces. Unacceptable for what you pay for a decently powered device but MS has it running at celeron speed most of the time. To get a device in the Surface form factor, you have to make some big compromises and proper and adequate thermals is one of them. You just can't put proper thermals into such a thin device. And Microsoft is the last company in the world that I would count on coming up with something. They're a software company, not a hardware company.

Actually, that 200hz thing sounds familiar now.
 
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DeepSix

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Feb 4, 2022
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The 600hz issue may be a different thing, not thermal throttling but power limit throttling. I have had it with my HP clone and the solution was to set the turbo boost limit much higher than the 3.5 watt (in my case) it had for some reason via Intel XTU. I set it to 15watts. I never understood while this happened. A friend had a similar issue but in her case it happened after idling for a certain number of minutes. XTU did not help and the solution was to set an automatic stand-by after 3-5 minutes of idling. Not ideal in both cases (with my HP it has to be set every time I restart, but I only restart once or twice a month), but at least it avoid the issue. Again this a nothing to do with cooling or thermals.

The Surfaces were heavily throttled all round that it was misleading what you were getting out of the box. You pay an arm and a leg for the form factor while sacrificing power in exchange of it. I think for the Android (like the Ultra) OS, you can throttle the CPU and not notice the drawbacks in performance as much as a windows device because I believe Android is just much lighter and better in handling memory.

Either way, the first 48 hours without a Surface Pro in over 9 years and it sure feels great taking out the trash.
 
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Rafterman

Contributor
Apr 23, 2010
7,267
8,809
Technically yes, i.e., they contain a cpu, but in actuality, no, not really. Its a great device for content consumption, and there's some content creation that is possible, but overall a traditional laptop or a desktop does more better.

I was trying to edit a pdf on my iPad, it could do it, but truth be told, doing it on a laptop was so much easier. Do I want to write code on an iPad or a laptop?

I have used an iPad to remote into a server to resolve a problem - its not something I'd want to do long term. It was not a fun experience but it got the job done in an emergency. Now I just bring a laptop with me because its the better tool for those sort of things

The apps themselves are fine on iPad. But with complex tasks, the biggest advantage of laptops and desktops is windowing. A lot of things are better when you can open multiple windows at once and have a file system that is easily shared among apps, with no limitations. iPads have come a long way in the sharing department, but it is still limited, compared to a laptop.
 

Rafterman

Contributor
Apr 23, 2010
7,267
8,809
The Surfaces were heavily throttled all round that it was misleading what you were getting out of the box. You pay an arm and a leg for the form factor while sacrificing power in exchange of it. I think for the Android (like the Ultra) OS, you can throttle the CPU and not notice the drawbacks in performance as much as a windows device because I believe Android is just much lighter and better in handling memory.

Either way, the first 48 hours without a Surface Pro in over 9 years and it sure feels great taking out the trash.

Well, I've had the Surface Pro 8 for a week now, and it has performed great.

Side note, Microsoft...its called a Surface PRO, yet you ship it with Windows Home on it? Weak. I had to upgrade it to Windows Pro with an MSDN key.
 
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