iPad Pro iPad Pro M4 vs. Microsoft's New Surface Pro 11: Sound Off!

[klasma]

I had some Surfaces in my household.... I can only say that ditching Intel so suddenly really feels like a careless move from Microsoft's part.

They aren’t. From the blog:

“We look forward to expanding through deep partnerships with Intel and AMD, starting with Lunar Lake and Strix. We will bring new Copilot+ PC experiences at a later date. In the future we expect to see devices with this silicon paired with powerful graphics cards like NVIDIA GeForce RTX and AMD Radeon, bringing Copilot+ PC experiences to reach even broader audiences like advanced gamers and creators.”

 

[Digitalguy]

The PCs announced today are consumer PCs. Microsoft claims that their translation layer is at least as efficient as Rosetta 2. They also have commitments from key software vendors to produce native-ARM versions.

Based on the rumors, one of the reasons they have waited so long for these devices is precisely for the new Prism emulation to be ready. The chips were ready almost a year ago. And in the meantime more software makers are porting to Windows on Arm. Adoble will make all their suite native, DaVinci resolve will be native too. And recently Chrome was made native. Dropbox was made native last year. And of course all the Microsoft software is native. But if the emulation is really good, for a lot of apps it won't make much difference.
This is also a good thing for Macs running Parallels.

 

[ProbablyDylan]

Intel and AMD are expected to launch their own CPU's with NPU's later this year so I'd expect to see them start to filter into desktops

Not quite what I meant. I meant more as an accelerator add-in card, like we see AMD and Nvidia have for enterprise. Or an Afterburner for AI.

 

[KPOM]

This is also a good thing for Macs running Parallels.

Provided that Microsoft makes available the version of Windows 11 that includes Prism. They might restrict it to Copilot-branded PCs.

 

[ZombiePete]

I hope it’s a good device and that the people who want it are happy with it. Me personally, I have had Windows tablets in the past and I don’t care for them one bit. In fact my work has issued me a Dell Latitude tablet that is based on the Surface Pro design and I do not like it at all; has nothing to do with the terrible battery life. Hate the design of the thing too.

 

[klasma]

This kind of ignores the regular people. Students, teachers, office drones, writers, developers, I could go on and on. You know, the kind of people that would otherwise buy a MacBook Air. These laptops are for those people.

They are still kind of expensive for regular people. The base Surface Pro is $1350 with keyboard (without pen, else $1450). The Surface Laptop is a bit more affordable starting at $1000.

 

[klasma]

#1. No Tandem OLED = dealbreaker
#2. No VRR or 120hz Promotion
#3. No Apple Pencil ✏️

it’s shocking how bad that device is.

It also doesn’t run iPadOS, totally unusable.

 

[ProbablyDylan]

They are still kind of expensive for regular people. The base Surface Pro is $1350 with keyboard (without pen, else $1450). The Surface Laptop is a bit more affordable starting at $1000.

They're also Windows PCs, Best Buy is going to run them at $100-$200 off after the 3 month mark.

 

[Digitalguy]

Provided that Microsoft makes available the version of Windows 11 that includes Prism. They might restrict it to Copilot-branded PCs.

At the moment it's not very clear. My guess is that AI features will be restricted to Copilot+ PCs (with a minimum of 40 TOPs). But I think that Prism will come to all Windows 11 on Arm devices, including older ones.

 

[Digitalguy]

They are still kind of expensive for regular people. The base Surface Pro is $1350 with keyboard (without pen, else $1450). The Surface Laptop is a bit more affordable starting at $1000.

The new wireless keyboard is as overpriced as the Magic Keyboard (Microsoft probably stupidly copied the price, as Samsung did for its ultra tablet). What is not clear so far is if the old wired keyboard will still work with the new Surface. I don't see and reason for it not to work, unless Microsoft changed the wired connection.

 

[klasma]

They're also Windows PCs, Best Buy is going to run them at $100-$200 off after the 3 month mark.

Right, but you can also get something like this for under $500: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1772712-REG/lenovo_82xf0065us_16_ideapad_slim_5i.html

 

[ProbablyDylan]

Right, but you can also get something like this for under $500: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1772712-REG/lenovo_82xf0065us_16_ideapad_slim_5i.html

Yeah, but how's the battery on that compared to these ARM laptops? Screen quality, etc? If you ask me, that's a different market segment altogether.

 

[klasma]

Yeah, but how's the battery on that compared to these ARM laptops? Screen quality, etc? If you ask me, that's a different market segment altogether.

It being a different (up-level) market segment was exactly my point.

 

[DeepSix]

I'm tempted by the Surface Pro 10. I purposely waited out on the 9 just because the 10 has the new chips. What's the release date and pricing for it?

 

[KPOM]

I'm tempted by the Surface Pro 10. I purposely waited out on the 9 just because the 10 has the new chips. What's the release date and pricing for it?

It’s just called the Surface Pro now. You can preorder it today for release June 17. It’s $999 for the X Plus version and $1499 for the X Elite version, which also includes an OLED screen. Plus $450 for the keyboard and pen combo.

 

[KPOM]

At the moment it's not very clear. My guess is that AI features will be restricted to Copilot+ PCs (with a minimum of 40 TOPs). But I think that Prism will come to all Windows 11 on Arm devices, including older ones.

Likely, unless there is something specific to the new Qualcomm chips that Prism depends on.

 

[rui no onna]

While I’m a Windows user, Windows is not a suitable OS for touch use, so for me this doesn’t compete with an iPad. And even as a laptop, Intel is still preferable for Windows, generally speaking.

While I'm not interested in Windows as a tablet, I do find ARM Windows laptops intriguing. For Office work, it might do the trick for me depending on how MS delivers on the x86 translation layer.

I'd love to get a lighter (under 3 lbs), cooler and fanless version of the following for example:

ThinkPad T16 Gen 2 | High-performing AMD-powered 16 inch corporate laptop

The Lenovo ThinkPad T16 Gen 2 (16″ AMD) powerhouse is highly configurable & boasts a massive display, WWAN connectivity options, & epic battery life.

www.lenovo.com

Mind, I do think Lenovo's smoking with their MSRP for the Snapdragon T14s. I expect to see 60+% discount soon after release.

ThinkPad T14s Gen 6 Laptop | Hi-Performance Next-Gen AI PC for Business

Meet the hi-performance powerhouse, the Lenovo ThinkPad T14s Gen 6 laptop, fueled by Snapdragon X Elite with generative AI onboard.

www.lenovo.com

 

[Digitalguy]

While I'm not interested in Windows as a tablet, I do find ARM Windows laptops intriguing. For Office work, it might do the trick for me depending on how MS delivers on the x86 translation layer.

I'd love to get a lighter (under 3 lbs), cooler and fanless version of the following for example:

ThinkPad T16 Gen 2 | High-performing AMD-powered 16 inch corporate laptop

The Lenovo ThinkPad T16 Gen 2 (16″ AMD) powerhouse is highly configurable & boasts a massive display, WWAN connectivity options, & epic battery life.

www.lenovo.com

Mind, I do think Lenovo's smoking with their MSRP for the Snapdragon T14s. I expect to see 60+% discount soon after release.

ThinkPad T14s Gen 6 Laptop | Hi-Performance Next-Gen AI PC for Business

Meet the hi-performance powerhouse, the Lenovo ThinkPad T14s Gen 6 laptop, fueled by Snapdragon X Elite with generative AI onboard.

www.lenovo.com

I am not interested in a surface pro as a tablet (way too bulky). But I may be interested in a Surface GO (I have the go 2 M3) with a Snapdragon X chip for use on the go (at home it's iPads mainly).
Also a light clamshell with Macbook air like battery life would be interesting.
I just bought a Macbook air M1 with 16GB RAM for $500 because at this price I wanted to test an Apple Silicon laptop (I only have had a M1 Mini and an M1 iPad pro and my only Macs are Intel retina MacBooks).
A 5G Windows laptop similar to a Macbook would be great to compare with. Based on reviews I might pull the trigger on one.

 

[canadianpj]

It runs Windows so everything is does is completely irrelevant to me.

 

[Rafterman]

if this is like surface pro x 2

Its not.

 

[dalestrauss]

They are still kind of expensive for regular people. The base Surface Pro is $1350 with keyboard (without pen, else $1450). The Surface Laptop is a bit more affordable starting at $1000.

Base 13" M4 iPad Pro with 512gb ssd (not to mention only 8gb ram - but I'm sure Apple will scream 8gb iPadOS > 16gb Windows) is $1499 + Magic Keyboard is $349 + Pencil Pro $129 - so who is expensive. Look. I've wanted that M4 since release, BUT I need desktop class software on my 2-in-1, not iPadOS apps and creative only professional apps. Dince the M1 iPad Pro I've been shouting into a gale force wind from Apple and users who want their "pure iPaddy" experience, and I've come to believe it is a losing cause.

 

[Rafterman]

#1. No Tandem OLED = dealbreaker
#2. No VRR or 120hz Promotion
#3. No Apple Pencil ✏️

it’s shocking how bad that device is.

Tandem OLED? Oh, you mean the thing you just found out about two weeks ago and now are judging other devices on it?

A shockingly bad device that hasn't even been released yet. Got it.

 

[KPOM]

Base 13" M4 iPad Pro with 512gb ssd (not to mention only 8gb ram - but I'm sure Apple will scream 8gb iPadOS > 16gb Windows) is $1499 + Magic Keyboard is $349 + Pencil Pro $129 - so who is expensive. Look. I've wanted that M4 since release, BUT I need desktop class software on my 2-in-1, not iPadOS apps and creative only professional apps. Dince the M1 iPad Pro I've been shouting into a gale force wind from Apple and users who want their "pure iPaddy" experience, and I've come to believe it is a losing cause.

The Surface Pro with the Snapdragon X Elite is $1499 + $450 for the keyboard and pen. It is also 2 lbs just for the tablet itself.

Don’t get me wrong. The Surface Pro with the X Elite is a nice PC and what I would recommend to my Windows fan friends. But it isn’t great as a tablet. It’s a notebook with a heavy detachable screen. It’s useless to me as a work device since my employer supports only iOS and Android for our “managed mobile devices.” I would love to have a new Surface Pro as my main work device, though (we short-sightedly see Windows as suitable as our only ”enterprise” OS and only as our “enterprise” OS). I’d still keep my managed iPad, though.

 

[Rafterman]

An intriguing device, especially once the 5G version comes out. Plus, a wireless detachable keyboard look cool. But if I were to buy one, I'd still lean towards the Intel Surface Pro 10 version, as it's still more mainstream. But the new one is tempting.

But for my mobile needs, I'm still fired up about my 13 M4. That new keyboard really completes it.

 

[JCCL]

Surface Pro for me all the way. I spend 8-10 hours daily on my Surface Pro 8. My iPad Pro M2 is only used to consume media or browse on the web/social media/quick email or IM/ light Microsoft Office during off time. For me to consider upgrading my iPad Pro, it would need to be able to replace my Surface by having a real productivity OS when connected to a keyboard and trackpad (MacOS or a really productive version of iPadOS). I can live without my iPad, but I could not get by without my Surface.

Another nice thing about the Surface is that I can keep using my existing pen and type cover, so I just would just have to spend on the device itself.

I’m excited about the new Surface devices, but not really sure about this iteration. Will have to see some reviews on Windows on ARM to see how it performs.