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What the hell kind of businesses are you talking about? Real, private businesses use their hardware AS LONG AS THEY CAN make more money with it. Or more to the point, for as long as they can avoid spending money to keep doing the same thing they have always done with the machine. Computers do nothing fundamentally different now, in comparison to 2003. Go to any corporation, any organization, any hospital. 10-15 year old machines are NORMAL.

Maybe not if you're a Silicon Valley tech graphics startup. That is not the real world.
I am discussing most medium to large company IT device policies. Broad industry wide. They recoup partially paid price after 3 or 4 years by using a 3rd party to sell them for refurbishment before they become too old to be bought by 3rd parties.

Just because someone running their private business hangs onto to these devices too long just means they have a higher chance of failure, having to sell them with no trade in value, become somewhat slower/less useful then most current devices is not the view of lets hang onto them as long as we can. Like everything running a business carries risk, if you need someone to be dependable you don't let him/her use devices for many years, thats when something serious could occur and the all the money you save is consumed trying to recover, help, ship to urgently events.

If your technology adverse I might see this view more predominately, but it's a very old view if you think technology doesn't change much in a few years IMHO. ;)
 
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So... now there's rumors that the 2nd Gen iPad Pro won't be dropped and according to these rumors it will be dropped. I wonder which ones are true.
This rumor only states 1st Gen will be dropped. 2017 is 2nd gen.
 
I am discussing most medium to large company IT device policies. Broad industry wide. They recoup partially paid price after 3 or 4 years by using a 3rd party to sell them for refurbishment before they become too old to be bought by 3rd parties.

Just because someone running their private business hangs onto to these devices too long just means they have a higher chance of failure, having to sell them with no trade in value, become somewhat slower/less useful then most current devices is not the view of lets hang onto them as long as we can. Like everything running a business carries risk, if you need someone to be dependable you don't let him/her use devices for many years, thats when something serious could occur and the all the money you save is consumed trying to recover, help, ship to urgently events.

If your technology adverse I might see this view more predominately, but it's a very old view if you think technology doesn't change much in a few years IMHO. ;)
Maybe you're on one of the coasts. I grant you that the above is a logical approach to hardware, but here in middle America, pre-2010 machines that started out on XP, and are currently on 10, are the norm.
 
Maybe you're on one of the coasts. I grant you that the above is a logical approach to hardware, but here in middle America, pre-2010 machines that started out on XP, and are currently on 10, are the norm.
ETA, that's not right. Not the "norm" I'd say 5-10 year old machines are normal. But 12 year old machines that just had some more RAM stuffed in them and now run 10 are commonplace.
 
I almost wish Apple would drop support SOONER, all the devices I have that are on newer OS' run awful. iPad Air 3, iPad Mini 4, and Macbook 2017 just run abysmally on the newest software and I regret updating them all. At least the Macbook I can revert backwards, can't say that for the iOS devices.
 
I almost wish Apple would drop support SOONER, all the devices I have that are on newer OS' run awful. iPad Air 3, iPad Mini 4, and Macbook 2017 just run abysmally on the newest software and I regret updating them all. At least the Macbook I can revert backwards, can't say that for the iOS devices.
If it were up to me, I’d have no support, ever. Don’t give me a single major iOS update. You won’t allow downgrading? Fine, don’t support anything, ever, so that the only signed version for any of my devices is the first one. I’d love that. Can you imagine?! Guaranteed perfection forever!
 
If it were up to me, I’d have no support, ever. Don’t give me a single major iOS update. You won’t allow downgrading? Fine, don’t support anything, ever, so that the only signed version for any of my devices is the first one. I’d love that. Can you imagine?! Guaranteed perfection forever!

That's why I never understood why you can't downgrade. You can downgrade on macOS, why not iOS/ipadOS? I understand that security is an issue, but then don't be cheap and provide security updates for longer even though you don't provide feature updates. Heck Microsoft still provided security updates to Win 7 until just a few months ago, an almost 15 year old OS.
 
That's why I never understood why you can't downgrade. You can downgrade on macOS, why not iOS/ipadOS? I understand that security is an issue, but then don't be cheap and provide security updates for longer even though you don't provide feature updates. Heck Microsoft still provided security updates to Win 7 until just a few months ago, an almost 15 year old OS.
It’s funny because you can’t even install security updates. Make them full OS independent if you want to give security to everyone. I’m on iOS 12 on my 9.7-inch iPad Pro. If I wanted to install a security update, I’d have to update to the latest version of iPadOS 16. Give me an iOS 12 update. You don’t want to do that because you cannot support every iOS version forever? Don’t obliterate devices with iOS updates. I’m sorry, but I don’t buy a new device every year. I keep devices for a long time. If they don’t work properly, why would I even want them, with security or otherwise? The only way I have for my devices to be useful is to stay behind.
 
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I'd really like to see Apple (or others) do more with older iPads. Was disappointed to find out they no longer can work as a HomeKit Hub. Make them able to be a HomePod display, or just a simple Siri device that works like the Amazon Echo displays with just simple functions like displaying the weather, news, be a rotating picture frame and so on... I had previously looked at other apps but found them lacking, but haven't looked in a while.
The Hub thing is BS, everyone has an old ipad they can use for a hub, guess I have a buy a homepod
 
One is true and one isn't...

Schrödinger's iPadOS...
Noooo. Saying one is true and one isn’t does not constitute a Schrödinger's iPadOS.

Both MacRumour states have merged into a new, third MacRumour state which is simultaneously half-true and half-false.

Put even simpler, Schrödinger's cat is a zombie….who likes to hedge his bets.
 
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On that note most business's keep their devices 3 or 4 years depending on categories. Phones and iPads would be 3 years I think then swap them out. Computers are 4 years typically. So nothing Apple is doing would interfere with deployments/usage for enterprise community.

Outside of tech is that really true? That hasn't been my experience working in academia at all, nor my partner's in law. They've got Thinkbooks meant to last a generation. And to address other comments, I work at a R1 institution and partner is at a bay street firm, so I don't think that's just a middle america issue.
 
5 years from an iPad is pretty good going!
Outside of tech is that really true? That hasn't been my experience working in academia at all, nor my partner's in law. They've got Thinkbooks meant to last a generation.
Academia is an industry where money is thrown at them - a lot of tech waste. Law, there’s money in that. I’ve seen law firms all use iMacs for nothing other than they look good at reception and on the tables of their fancy millennial / eye Candy Ikea-haus offices
 
Not fussed about widgets, would simply like the option of the same layout of icons horizontal and vertical like previous iPadOS versions (can’t remember when the Home Screen icon arrangement got silly).

Equally, sort out the icon disaster that happens every time you move/install an app. Going from vertical to horizontal (or vice versa) after moving/installing an app is a complete mess and actually makes me reluctant to change anything sometimes.
 
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I have mixed feelings about this. My iPad Mini 4 will probably lose support, but for a 128GB model that I bought for $250 nearly five years ago I can't complain much. My OG mini was used more over the same length of time (2013-2018), though the 4 is nearly always on as a Homekit camera monitor (nothing else). My 2020 iPad Pro 11" has been my most-used iPad (with Magic Keyboard) but I still feel like I've never really made the most of the iPad ever since my first one, the iPad 3 retina in 2012.

Apple is playing a nickel and dime game with iPads to squeeze people to upgrade when they really don't need to. A 2018 iPad Pro is more than most people even need in an iPad (and no different than the latest 2022 iPads in day-to-day use in most respects), but I could see them dropping support for those by next year. I'm increasingly thinking that just my MacBook and iPhone Pro Max are more than enough for my computing needs, besides an older iPad as a Homekit hub. iPadOS is stale and boring, always lagging 1-2 years behind iOS and intentionally hobbled as far as a true, windowed, desktop experience. If I upgrade my iPad Pro it will be to a 2021 or 2022 M1/M2 model at a steep discount no sooner than next year. I see no need to buy the latest iPads anymore, the 2022 Pros were arguably the weakest update to date.
 
100% Agree regarding the iPad Pro 9.7. My only complaint is the Apple Keyboard (folio, I think.). I am on my second one, and this one hasn’t worked in over a year. I want to buy another one, but prices and limited availability have made it too difficult. But the iPad itself… still awesome. And I’ll use it as long as I possible can!
I dunno. The problem with the 9.7” Pro is the tiny amount of RAM (note though this issue does not affect the first-gen 12.9” Pro which has twice the amount of RAM).
 
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