iPhone 16e iPhone launched in 2007 for $499. How is $599 a budget phone?

[webkit]

Yes but that contract gave you unlimited text, calling, and data which was rare back then.

Incorrect. There were multiple AT&T iPhone plans available in 2007 starting at $59.99/month (around $92/month in today's dollars) but none of them offered unlimited voice and text.

despite requiring a contract, the original iPhone wasn't subsidized. That came with the 3G.

It was subsidized in the sense that in 2007, AT&T gave discounts on phones purchased with a 2 year contract. In the case of the iPhone, which required a contract, that savings/discount was baked into the price.

 

[ParAd09]

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this is great example of the inflation aspect when compared to the iPhone, however you need to look through the many lenses to see what and where the iPhone 16e sits and why it may or may not be over priced for the market.

first it is the budget or "value" phone, you don't need all the bells and whistles, this model is usually targeted at kids or fist adopters to the apple eco-system, the SE was perfect for this, some $200 cheaper than the 16e and was a great way to get people to use an iOS device for the first time. even better as they go through school they buy a Mac book air, watch etc...

however, the SE phone always has low adoption figures because it is basic, but that should be fine as you can upgrade to the regular iPhone next time around, the hook so to speak to get you in. but because of these lower figures it has a lower return for apple, it will cost almost as much to develop as any other device in the line, but with the lower sales volumes ends up costing apple more. two options, make them closer to the regular iPhone to get cost benefits for greater volumes of common components and charge more because you have made it that much better than the predecessor.

so challenge for Apple, make it better with a lower cost to manufacture and feature rich to justify the price hike compared to the previous version, or stick to the market needs for a cheap low cost phone and have a potential loss-leader to bring in the newbies, who next time round will be buying the regular phones, then the watch and Mac books etc... most companies need the loss-leaders to bring in the customer for the first time. this current move is a risky move no doubt, you lose the iPhone SE customer you may never win them as they will buy into another platforms eco-system. one study suggested a first time apple user will expand their collection of apple products within their first year of being a customer.

so in this case it looks like Apple went for the former, and added to the mix is the marketing messaging that its a cheaper alternative, when in reality for the market position where it resides its just had a price hike of $200 per unit, and consumers don't like being gaslit.

so in summary, it is a cheaper iPhone, but its a more expensive entry level phone compared to it predecessor, how expensive for apple it will end up being... well we will have to wait and see when they start to publish the sales volumes.

 

[darngooddesign]

Incorrect. There were multiple AT&T iPhone plans available in 2007 starting at $59.99/month (around $92/month in today's dollars) but none of them offered unlimited voice and text.

We are both partially correct. The plans had SMS restrictions, but they did come with unlimited calling and data.

It was subsidized in the sense that in 2007, AT&T gave discounts on phones purchased with a 2 year contract. In the case of the iPhone, which required a contract, that savings/discount was baked into the price.

While it's impossible to say since there was no unlocked price to compare against, but the fact that one year later the subsidized price was $199 indicates that $499/599 was not discounted. That no one mentioned iPhone and Subsidized in the same sentence until the second generation also indicates the original phone wasn't subsidized.

 

[webkit]

We are both partially correct. The plans had SMS restrictions, but they did come with unlimited calling and data.

No. They all came with unlimited data but none of them had unlimited voice and text. Even the most expensive "Individual" plan, which was $219.99/month or around $336/month in today's dollars) and most expensive "Family" plan, which was $339.99/month or around $520/month in today’s dollars) didn’t have unlimited voice and text.

You could, however, get unlimited text as a separate add-on to an iPhone plan for an additional $20/month or so but not unlimited talk.

While it's impossible to say since there was no unlocked price to compare against, but the fact that one year later the subsidized price was $199 indicates that $499/599 was not discounted. That no one mentioned iPhone and Subsidized in the same sentence until the second generation also indicates the original phone wasn't subsidized.

Even prices for the original iPhone were reduced less than three months after launch e.g., the 8GB price went from $599 to $399. That still doesn't mean the original $499 (4GB) and $599 (8GB) launch prices didn't also reflect "discounts" tied to the 2 year contract commitment.

 

[darngooddesign]

No. They all came with unlimited data but none of them had unlimited voice and text. Even the most expensive "Individual" plan, which was $219.99/month or around $336/month in today's dollars) and most expensive "Family" plan, which was $339.99/month or around $520/month in today’s dollars) didn’t have unlimited voice and text.

You could, however, get unlimited text as a separate add-on to an iPhone plan for an additional $20/month or so but not unlimited talk.

"...unlimited mobile to mobile"

If you want to split hairs we are both correct.

AT&T and Apple Announce Simple, Affordable Service Plans for iPhone

www.apple.com

Even prices for the original iPhone were reduced less than three months after launch e.g., the 8GB price went from $599 to $399. That still doesn't mean the original $499 (4GB) and $599 (8GB) launch prices didn't also reflect "discounts" tied to the 2 year contract commitment.

Subsidized phones were common back then, but they never mentioned subsidized iPhones until the3G.

 

[webkit]

"...unlimited mobile to mobile"

If you want to split hairs we are both correct.

Ok. I was referring to "unlimited" more in today's terms and none of the 2007 AT&T iPhone plans offered truly unlimited voice. Some offered unlimited voice weekends but none offered unlimited 7 days a week like unlimited plans do today.

Subsidized phones were common back then, but they never mentioned subsidized iPhones until the3G.

Which is why I was focusing on AT&T 2 year contract phone discounts i.e., "It was subsidized in the sense that in 2007, AT&T gave discounts on phones purchased with a 2 year contract. In the case of the iPhone, which required a contract, that savings/discount was baked into the price."

 

[darngooddesign]

Which is why I was focusing on AT&T 2 year contract phone discounts i.e., "It was subsidized in the sense that in 2007, AT&T gave discounts on phones purchased with a 2 year contract. In the case of the iPhone, which required a contract, that savings/discount was baked into the price."

I think it was more a case of the contract gave you unlimited data.

 

[webkit]

I think it was more a case of the contract gave you unlimited data.

All of the AT&T iPhone plans provided unlimited data. The voice minutes were the primary variable (as well as the separate text add-on options) that determined whether you paid $59.99/month (1 line) or potentially a lot more.

 

[barkmonster]

There's no excuse for it costing any more than the 128GB SE it replaced. None whatsoever. Any attempt at an excuse is corporate bootlicking. I'm glad I got an SE when I could last December and don't see it as an upgrade, but rather a price-gouge opportunity in much the same way they started charging 15" prices for 13" MacBook Pros when they added the touch-bar.

 

[webkit]

There's no excuse for it costing any more than the 128GB SE it replaced. None whatsoever.

No excuse? None whatsoever?? The way Apple prices phones in general, the much larger size and increased base storage alone could justify much of the increase. On top of that, the 16e has over the archaic SE quite a few new or upgraded features including increased RAM, better camera setup, better chip, better modem, better battery, increased max brightness, super retina XDR display, Apple Intelligence, emergency SOS via satellite, roadside assistance via satellite, Messages via satellite, crash detection, Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos, ceramic shield, greater water resistance, etc. Close to 20 "excuses" right there.

 

[TgeekB]

There's no excuse for it costing any more than the 128GB SE it replaced. None whatsoever. Any attempt at an excuse is corporate bootlicking. I'm glad I got an SE when I could last December and don't see it as an upgrade, but rather a price-gouge opportunity in much the same way they started charging 15" prices for 13" MacBook Pros when they added the touch-bar.

Justification is not, and should not, be based on internet sentiment. It’s based on data analysis and strategy to bring the most sales. Thats what corporations do. If we don’t like it we don’t buy it but it’s not an excuse.

 

[throAU]

It’s not a budget phone. It’s the budget iPhone.

 

[ILoveCalvinCool]

At the very least, these two should cancel each other.

In the 1920s one of the wealthy few could purchase a home refrigerator for the low price of $200.

 

[RRC]

There's no excuse for it costing any more than the 128GB SE it replaced. None whatsoever. Any attempt at an excuse is corporate bootlicking. I'm glad I got an SE when I could last December and don't see it as an upgrade, but rather a price-gouge opportunity in much the same way they started charging 15" prices for 13" MacBook Pros when they added the touch-bar.

Literally everything on the 16e is an upgrade over the SE it replaces... battery life, screen, modem, camera, glass and finish of the back glass being matte, face ID, more RAM as well as Apple Intelligence for people who are interested and people don't think you've got an iPhone 6.

 

[ZiBart]

Literally everything on the 16e is an upgrade over the SE it replaces... battery life, screen, modem, camera, glass and finish of the back glass being matte, face ID, more RAM as well as Apple Intelligence for people who are interested and people don't think you've got an iPhone 6.

No doubt a massive spec bump but at the same time, the 1-3rd gen SE was also stuck in time and such a low bar to jump from. It was much below industry spec baselines and design for the price at launch (except cpu). And in its last gen, comical how old some specs (except cpu) and design were. I think the 16e is a nice phone. More up to date in its time vs previous iterations. Maybe 10-15% over priced for now (due to tarrifs) and bad x rates in other regions but hopefully it will settle down eventually. The one thing i dont get at all, is why no mag safe. I mean that has become an Apple thing with many apple accessories. And a couple magnets is not a huge cost savings. I guess you can get cheap mag stickers to change that but still.

 

[RRC]

No doubt a massive spec bump but at the same time, the 1-3rd gen SE was also stuck in time and such a low bar to jump from. It was much below industry spec baselines and design for the price at launch (except cpu). And in its last gen, comical how old some specs (except cpu) and design were. I think the 16e is a nice phone. More up to date in its time vs previous iterations. Maybe 10-15% over priced for now (due to tarrifs) and bad x rates in other regions but hopefully it will settle down eventually. The one thing i dont get at all, is why no mag safe. I mean that has become an Apple thing with many apple accessories. And a couple magnets is not a huge cost savings. I guess you can get cheap mag stickers to change that but still.

MagSafe is more than a sticker inside the phone it’s a completely different charging coil to the basic wireless version, so takes up space.

Plus realistically, the e line is going to need upgrades each year over a simple chip upgrade so they’re likely keeping it back to add in future versions much like the promotion display that is rumoured to finally come to the regular 17 models later this year.

 

[ZiBart]

MagSafe is more than a sticker inside the phone it’s a completely different charging coil to the basic wireless version, so takes up space.

Plus realistically, the e line is going to need upgrades each year over a simple chip upgrade so they’re likely keeping it back to add in future versions much like the promotion display that is rumoured to finally come to the regular 17 models later this year.

The sticker does just fine for the non charging accessories like a wallet, car stands etc. You are right, next year - MagSafe. Year after, Dynamic Island. Year after, ProMotion. All things that easily could have been done now but held back for future marketing headlines.

 

[baconcat_8964]

You could buy it without the contract at 499. I bought one which I jailbroke and unlocked to use in Mexico.

Doesn't change the fact that $499 price is for a carrier-locked version. Unlocked version costs $200 more from Apple directly.

 

[Tunster]

Didn't you previously complain that you and other SE 3 users were "unloved" for your passion for smaller phones? You then turn around and buy the largest iPhone possible to replace your SE 3? Why didn't you get the 16 Pro instead of the Pro Max? If you wanted such a large phone, the 6.1" display 16e wouldn't have made sense regardless of its specs which were never going to be "Pro" level anyway.

I did. It's still my main complaint. But there's no other non-Apple phone I could go to. As much as I'd love an eInk phone, they examples out there are terrible. So there was no point in going mid-tier or go for the plain Pro. Battery life is important and I have started using my iPhone to watch more video. So why not the biggest screen? I don't like not being able to use one hand but it's all about trade-offs. 16e is a massive trade-off.

Apple are still doing disservice to people who want smaller phones. My SE3 will continue as a business phone.

Unfortunately, you cannot see people can still carry a point of view whilst doing something else that goes against it. I don't trust anyone else apart from Apple to secure my data (although I'm in UK and can't use the 1:1 encryption feature).

 

[1rottenapple]

A budget phone is a used iPhone. There’s plenty of them around and Amazon has good deals with excellent return policy (sometimes 1 yr).