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is Steve turning the mac into a PC

Macmadant said:
apple say powerpc will be continued to be supported, but that doesn't mean other companys will, would people like aspyr make and sell two versions of there, i don't think so, or what about adobe or macsoft:confused: totally random point btw
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Universal Binaries. Why would a company make a product that a majority of it's users couldn't use? May be optimised for Intel, but it'll probably still run on G3s.
 
aristobrat said:
If someone looks at a box running OS X and a box running XP and says "oh, they're the same" because they have the same internal processors or two-button mice, then I'd really not worry about anything else that person has to say on the matter. :eek: :D
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Erm, they ARE the same, it is just that on one it incorporates DRM with imposes limitations on MY rights on what I can do with my machine.

At the very least Apple really should still strive to build high quality machines, although good god.. it seems like even when you are burning cash you can't buy quality nowadays anymore.
 
dmetzcher said:
I don't think Apple has to drop prices at all. Remember, you are paying for the great OS (at least I am). I don't care what it's running on, so long as each computer that I buy is significantly more powerful than the one before. So, Apple has to release an iBook that beats the pants off my current iBook. I don't think that Apple is competing with the other PC/Windows vendors on hardware so much as they are competing on the OS. The average user does not care what hardware is inside the box, so long as it performs for them the way that they need it to.
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Sure, I will pay for the great OS. All $129 of it. Where is the rest of the money going?
 
generik said:
Sure, I will pay for the great OS. All $129 of it. Where is the rest of the money going?
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The OS is a selling point for the entire hardware system. Apple has stated many times that they are a hardware company. Whether you like it or not, they are not going to make it easy for you to separate their software from their hardware, as the former is meant to be a feature of the latter. On a side note, isn't there anything more constructive to do than constant bashing of Apple?
 
Macmadant said:
i mean two button mouses, intel processors, i was happy being different, i don't like being the same as everyone else.:confused:
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ide hard drives, rectuangular laptops, universal motherboard architecture, intel usb, microsoft office for mac? ;)

i have my clamshell ibook and liked being way different from the masses...man, that thing turned a lot of heads in its day
 
Josh said:
The difference is IBM "said" that about their roadmap. Intel has actually provided their roadmap.

Showing > Saying
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>> I have to disagree. Intel's roadmap is vaporware. HYPE. Yonah is not here yet. Merom/Conroe, etc...not here yet...and word on the street is... Intel *is* indeed having trouble with these chips. Every year Intel has promised the moon...and right now, AMD is kicking their a$$ on every level. Intel's roadmap the last few years has not remotely lived up to their hype. I believe Intel is about to rebound..late 2006...but that is merely a belief/hope...based on nothing solid.

Personally, I would love to see Apple become more like the x86 world. I would love to have apps actually optimized for my platform for a change like windows users enjoy. I would love to have graphic cards' drivers optimized for the graphic card in my machine...again, like windows users enjoy. I would love to have all the choices in hardware and software x86 users have enjoyed for years and years. Bring it on!

peace
 
the multi-button mouses do have their benefits, try playing unreal tournament, warcraft 3, or any game with one button.

i use my computer, and i prefer to only have one hand at the computer, while another flips the pages, holds a cup of juice, etc. and usually i have to hold the mouse instead of the keyboard, so, i would need a multibutton mouse to be more productive. imagine a person that has one hand occupied with reading a book or drinking while the other hand has one buttoned mouse. if he wants to access the menus, he has to go up the the menubar, and select something, then go back to where he was.

the mouses go from multibutton and one buttoned mouses being the same at productivity to having multibutton mouses better to use. there isn't much I can sacrafice when migrating from single button mouses to multibutton mouses (especially logitech's), and they are generally more versatile.


now, intel does not equal PC (windows computers), and switching to them will change macs only to better machines. there is nothing sacrificed.

now, that is different from runing windows on intel macs and macosx on traditional PC boxes. i hate that idea. ew...

people that say that intel macs and PCs are the same is like saying that rulers and a pens are the same just because they use plastic. it's also like saying that both ppc macs and intel pcs are the same just because it uses electricity and has silicone and metal.
 
decksnap said:
A one-button mouse user would say 'double-click, Apple+C, Apple+Tab, Apple+V.' Seems a lot faster than your method. Pay up.
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So multi-button mice disable keyboard shortcuts. I get it. Wait, no, I don't. I use keyboard shortcuts, and a few months got an 8 button logitech mouse. It's a thing of beauty. Just try a few weeks with expose on your mouse. One of my buttons acts as a double click, coincidentally. Saves me a click everytime I use it, but I guess that saving clicks reduces productivity. Wait, that also does not make sense. I appreciate the elegance of the single button mouse, and on my Mac Classic II the single button mouse is literally perfect. But these days the ergonomics and convenience just aren't there. I don't do a lot of graphics editing, but when you consider the fact that the left click has the exact same functionality as an entire one button mouse, there's just no possibility that it can REDUCE productivity. You can still do all the shortcuts with a multibutton mouse you can with a single button mouse. If a multi-button mouse disabled keyboard shortcuts I wouldn't buy one because keyboard shortcuts make things faster. Just like multibutton mice do. I'm curious to hear your rebuttal.
 
What's easy and intuitive about Apple+C, Apple+Tab, Apple+V etc
A right click context menu tells you what commands you can do. It's almost like an interactive bubble help balloon and I think is generally a superior tool to a menu bar or keyboard combination. It's easier and powerful.
 
Morn said:
What's easy and intuitive about Apple+C, Apple+Tab, Apple+V etc
A right click context menu tells you what commands you can do. It's almost like an interactive bubble help balloon and I think is generally a superior tool to a menu bar or keyboard combination. It's easier and powerful.
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So do I. That's why I use keyboard shortcuts alongside my multi-button mouse...
 
Macmadant said:
i mean two button mouses, intel processors, i was happy being different, i don't like being the same as everyone else.:confused:
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Different isn't good all the time. The one button mouse was a stupid idea that never caught on... Now it's revolutionary with Apple! Wow a two button mouse. Look we reinvented the mouse!
 
jefhatfield said:
ide hard drives, rectuangular laptops, universal motherboard architecture, intel usb, microsoft office for mac? ;)

i have my clamshell ibook and liked being way different from the masses...man, that thing turned a lot of heads in its day
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my point exactly, people say WOW! about my g4 imac but when i show them
the G5 imac they go whats that a thick display? :confused:
 
decksnap said:
i mean two button mouses, intel processors, i was happy being different, i don't like being the same as everyone else.
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What if I am holding on to something else with my other hand? Like a mug of coffee or a sandwich?

Hey, you are the one who should pay up.
 
generik said:
Sure, I will pay for the great OS. All $129 of it. Where is the rest of the money going?
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Apple will say that it's going into the hardware, which you need to run their OS. It's all marketing.
 
Standard issue

Standards and compatible parts are one of the greatest achievements of mankind. Apple is a great company IMO, but the computer world is a place where it pays to conform to standards. Apple suffers somewhat because their hardware just doesn't fit into our daily lives as easily as PCs. I'm all for being different, but you have to consider the consequences.

Imagine a firearm maker deciding to make a 14 gauge shotgun or a car maker producing a vehicle thats 15 feet wide. It just doesn't work, and consumers would not accept it.

It's only natural that Apple products shifts closer to the PC realm. The vast majority of consumers have made a choice, and that is a PC running Windows. Now whether they made this choice because its a better product or more user friendly or less expensive is a different discussion and is irrelevant anyway. My point is, Apple will still be Apple regardless of what processor is in the boxes they make or whether their OS can be utilized on other hardware.

Stop fighting, resistance is futile. :D
 
damax452 said:
Stop fighting, resistance is futile. :D
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i liked apple when woz and jobs ran it, when scully ran it, and when sj returned to the company

as long as they make unique products with a quality level and industrial design above the rest, along with a better operating system, i will remain a fan of apple inc

even if bill gates or michael dell became ceo i wouldn't care as long as apple led the way like they have been from the very start of home based computers
 
jefhatfield said:
even if bill gates or michael dell became ceo i wouldn't care as long as apple led the way like they have been from the very start of home based computers
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Yes, but if Gates or Dell ran it, they wouldn't. Look at what started happening before Jobs came back. But I guess if someone like Ive took over, I'd feel pretty good about that.
 
When I read about the switch the Intel processors, I was worried about it. It bothered me to think that the Mac was changing from the PPC processor. However, I now see this is a good move for Apple. Steve is making sure that Apple sticks around, that is what he has to do, and I don't see any problems with it.
 
solvs said:
Since it's a private forum, it's not protected under free speech. If the mods wanted, they could ban you for looking at them funny. Though I don't think they can break your fingers.

I don't think.
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Is this true? Even if it is, the back lash that the site would receive if they did start to censor unfairly would be swift and harsh.....or at least I'd like to think so.
 
Rocksaurus said:
So multi-button mice disable keyboard shortcuts. I get it. Wait, no, I don't. I use keyboard shortcuts, and a few months got an 8 button logitech mouse. It's a thing of beauty. Just try a few weeks with expose on your mouse. One of my buttons acts as a double click, coincidentally. Saves me a click everytime I use it, but I guess that saving clicks reduces productivity. Wait, that also does not make sense. I appreciate the elegance of the single button mouse, and on my Mac Classic II the single button mouse is literally perfect. But these days the ergonomics and convenience just aren't there. I don't do a lot of graphics editing, but when you consider the fact that the left click has the exact same functionality as an entire one button mouse, there's just no possibility that it can REDUCE productivity. You can still do all the shortcuts with a multibutton mouse you can with a single button mouse. If a multi-button mouse disabled keyboard shortcuts I wouldn't buy one because keyboard shortcuts make things faster. Just like multibutton mice do. I'm curious to hear your rebuttal.
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If you DO use two hands and key commands, then my difference of opinion isn't with you. It's with people who think users of a one button mouse CAN'T be as productive/fast as those with more. I just don't like hearing things like:

"I guarantee a person with a multi-button mouse could type a word, select it, control-click it, copy the text, use expose to see all windows, click a window, and control-click to paste the text in the new window MUCH faster than a person with a one-button mouse."

The example I gave clearly showed a faster method than that specific multi-button mouse user's method... but that's just one example.

For me a double-click takes exactly the same amount of time as a single click, don't know about you...And as for expose, I don't use it because Apple+tab and Apple+` are so much faster.
 
Clicking on the dock and right clicking on text to copy is pretty fast too, and I can do it with one hand.
 
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