Is the Apple TV dead ????

[priitv8]

Which makes one wonder why even get an Internet streaming device in the first place.

But it is not just that. Besides internet streaming there are other sources to stream from.

 

[Homeyjay]

It’s not ‘bizzare’. We just prefer physical media. It’s more versatile for us and it allows us to shop around from different retailers instead of being tied to just one. We can play physical media wherever we want and lend it to friends etc. Suits us just fine.
Our 3.5mb connection allows us to stream Amazon and Netflix mostly ok but it’s just not sensible to try and download/stream a 4K movie with it!
The real reason that we bought the Fire TV is that it allowed us to replace our Home Theatre PC with a £70 box with Plex, that did the same thing and was ultimately more reliable.
For us, the ATV has not been an improvement. There is no quality difference when streaming Amazon or Netflix. Mirroring from our iOS devices is far from perfect. The range of games and apps are woeful when compared to the iPad and this is unlikely to improve quickly as there’s no incentive for developers to write an ATV version. This may improve but then again, it may not. ATV is hardly new and many feel that if it was going to be fully supported by many developers, it would have been by now.
I’m not on an anti Apple bash folks - we have around 14 Apple devices at home and love them all. Just don’t think this one’s good value, for me.

 

[andrewstirling]

It’s not ‘bizzare’. We just prefer physical media. It’s more versatile for us and it allows us to shop around from different retailers instead of being tied to just one. We can play physical media wherever we want and lend it to friends etc. Suits us just fine.
Our 3.5mb connection allows us to stream Amazon and Netflix mostly ok but it’s just not sensible to try and download/stream a 4K movie with it!
The real reason that we bought the Fire TV is that it allowed us to replace our Home Theatre PC with a £70 box with Plex, that did the same thing and was ultimately more reliable.
For us, the ATV has not been an improvement. There is no quality difference when streaming Amazon or Netflix. Mirroring from our iOS devices is far from perfect. The range of games and apps are woeful when compared to the iPad and this is unlikely to improve quickly as there’s no incentive for developers to write an ATV version. This may improve but then again, it may not. ATV is hardly new and many feel that if it was going to be fully supported by many developers, it would have been by now.
I’m not on an anti Apple bash folks - we have around 14 Apple devices at home and love them all. Just don’t think this one’s good value, for me.

There will be no difference in quality because your quality is limited by your internet speed. It’s kind of like saying that you see no difference in speed between a Ferrari and a Toyota and then admitting that you haven’t put any fuel in either of them.

I’m not knocking physical media in any way. It has a number of advantages over streaming services. But it genuinely sounds like a cheap kodi box will do everything you need it to do. That doesn’t make the Apple TV bad....it just means that your internet speed prevents it from functioning as it should.

 

[Homeyjay]

I think you’re missing the point here. The internet speed is the same regardless of whatever device we use. Given that’s the one thing we can’t change, the quality of output is exactly the same on ATV or Fire TV.
1080p is 1080p, 4K is 4K.

 

[andrewstirling]

I think you’re missing the point here. The internet speed is the same regardless of whatever device we use. Given that’s the one thing we can’t change, the quality of output is exactly the same on ATV or Fire TV.
1080p is 1080p, 4K is 4K.

3.5Mbps will absolutely cripple the bitrate of your streamed video. 4k Netflix streams at around 15Mbps and 4k iTunes streams at around 25Mbps. So if you had faster internet you would see how much better iTunes streamed movies look when compared to Netflix or anything on your fire tv. However with 3.5Mbps you will be getting extremely low bitrate, low quality media on both devices. Not much point in displaying 4k resolution if the image is compressed to hell. I also seriously doubt you’re getting 4k Netflix at these speeds as it ramps the resolution up based on internet speed.

 

[Homeyjay]

I never said I was watching 4K streamed..

 

[Shanghaichica]

Overpriced, when was the last you you looked in the iTunes Store Lol?
There’s always bargains to be had, it wasn’t that long ago Predator & Die Hard we’re available in 4K for £1.99 each.
You could’ve also had The Maze Runner Films in 4K for £2.99 each.
Overpriced certainly isn’t a word I’d use.

And most of them are priced exactly the same as they are on amazon instant video.

 

[patseguin]

I have both an apple tv 4k and a shield TV. I switch back and forth when I feel like a UI change. Android TV looks better than tvos to me. Shield also has Atmos.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

3.5Mbps will absolutely cripple the bitrate of your streamed video. 4k Netflix streams at around 15Mbps and 4k iTunes streams at around 25Mbps. So if you had faster internet you would see how much better iTunes streamed movies look when compared to Netflix or anything on your fire tv. However with 3.5Mbps you will be getting extremely low bitrate, low quality media on both devices. Not much point in displaying 4k resolution if the image is compressed to hell. I also seriously doubt you’re getting 4k Netflix at these speeds as it ramps the resolution up based on internet speed.

Yes, it's going to be 480p tops at 3.5speed. 720p HD at least 4.5/5mbps is required with 6 for 1080p iTunes HD. Shocking how parts of the UK have that kind of speed - that's 2007! Crazy when you think your iPhone 4G does 60mbps Our fibre broadband is 150mbps on the basic package and 350mbps on the others - more like it I guess the beauty of living in the urban cities

 

[RecentlyConverted]

I don’t know why when we are being told how powerful the ATV 4K box is, that we don’t have Safari on it. Why do I have to still stream some content from an iOS device (causing further battery wear) when there is no technical reason not to have Safari?

 

[andrewstirling]

I have both an apple tv 4k and a shield TV. I switch back and forth when I feel like a UI change. Android TV looks better than tvos to me. Shield also has Atmos.

And the not so wonderful tendency to play media back in the wrong colour space. Not to mention that it has the worst upscaler known to man.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

I think you’re missing the point here. The internet speed is the same regardless of whatever device we use. Given that’s the one thing we can’t change, the quality of output is exactly the same on ATV or Fire TV.
1080p is 1080p, 4K is 4K.

I don't know what Universe some people live in, but the last time I checked, Amazon uses around 4x more bandwidth than Netflix for its movies and TV Shows. I had never even come close to using my cable provider's bandwidth cap before (didn't even realize there was one until I watched Downton Abbey on Prime in one month and I have 110Mbps down and 6Mbps up). More bandwidth = better picture with the same encoder as a general rule. Whether you can tell the difference is another matter. I'm not sure offhand how AppleTV's files compare to Netflix or Prime, but I do know their 1080p movies average perhaps 8GB while a Blu-Ray movie averages perhaps 20GB without lossless audio and 28GB with it. If you guys think there is NO quality difference between a Blu-Ray and streaming...... all I can say is you must be from another Universe where the laws of physics no longer apply or streaming services use much higher bandwidth rates because 20GB-30GB is 2-3x the amount of data as an 8GB streaming file. It's that size precisely because they use stronger compression, which means lower quality and more artifacts compared to uncompressed or BD's LESS compressed signals.

The great thing about buying newer Blu-Rays is you typically get the digital file included as well and with Movies Anywhere even studios that stopped directly supporting iTunes will now give you an iTunes copy PLUS you have the higher quality Blu-Ray in your possession as well that normally has uncompressed audio (many now use Dolby Atmos and DTS:X as well; Apple doesn't even support 7.1 channels for god's sake! You're better off watching your movies from VUDU that supports ATMOS and 7.1 for streaming over DD+).

What's really great is when you buy a 3D Blu-Ray that also comes with a 2D Blu-Ray and the digital copy can be redeemed directly from iTunes. You then get 3D & 2D Blu-Rays that are superior to streaming AND iTunes then throws in the 4K streaming version which then typically gets exported via Movies Anywhere to Vudu that (assuming they have that title in 4K now; many still aren't) then gives you a 4K version with Atmos, etc. when available when you never even bought a 4K anything! Great way to catch up on 4K titles even if you're still using only 1080p. My projector (Epson 3100) is 1080p and 3D only, but it doesn't hurt to stock up on 4K for a future projector or TV now when I can using Apple's auto-upgrades.

But what about price? Most older BDs are typically $4-8 (try and match that on iTunes). Many of those don't include digital copies, but with an external BD drive and MakeMKV + (optional) Handbrake (if you want smaller files or iTunes compatible ones) you can roll your own digital copies you can use anywhere, not just on Apple devices. I just got three Marvel 3D movies for $14 US from Britain (not available in the US) and they are region free and include 2D discs as well. I got the US newer Ghostbusters movie for $14 US that came with the Ultra 4K version, 3D version, 2D version and digital copies (as in two digital copies for regular and extended versions). $14!!! I've NEVER seen deals like that on iTunes. My point is that it's good to have the capability to handle multiple formats in order to get the best deals and/or best quality.

 

[Spankey]

That was a lot of text. Yes, physical media will give you an edge as far as sound and picture qualities go. Aside from Dolby Atmos (for now) iTunes movies are close enough in both picture and sound that for me it is not worth the investment in a physical disc.The decoder in the ATV 4k is great and there are frequent deals on iTunes and the web to pick up some great movies.

Right now the only time I buy a physical disc is if I want 3D for my one TV that even supports it. Hopefully projectors will continue to do so. Aside from my iPhone, the ATV might be my favorite Apple device.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

I don't know what Universe some people live in, but the last time I checked, Amazon uses around 4x more bandwidth than Netflix for its movies and TV Shows. I had never even come close to using my cable provider's bandwidth cap before (didn't even realize there was one until I watched Downton Abbey on Prime in one month and I have 110Mbps down and 6Mbps up). More bandwidth = better picture with the same encoder as a general rule. Whether you can tell the difference is another matter. I'm not sure offhand how AppleTV's files compare to Netflix or Prime, but I do know their 1080p movies average perhaps 8GB while a Blu-Ray movie averages perhaps 20GB without lossless audio and 28GB with it. If you guys think there is NO quality difference between a Blu-Ray and streaming...... all I can say is you must be from another Universe where the laws of physics no longer apply or streaming services use much higher bandwidth rates because 20GB-30GB is 2-3x the amount of data as an 8GB streaming file. It's that size precisely because they use stronger compression, which means lower quality and more artifacts compared to uncompressed or BD's LESS compressed signals.

The great thing about buying newer Blu-Rays is you typically get the digital file included as well and with Movies Anywhere even studios that stopped directly supporting iTunes will now give you an iTunes copy PLUS you have the higher quality Blu-Ray in your possession as well that normally has uncompressed audio (many now use Dolby Atmos and DTS:X as well; Apple doesn't even support 7.1 channels for god's sake! You're better off watching your movies from VUDU that supports ATMOS and 7.1 for streaming over DD+).

What's really great is when you buy a 3D Blu-Ray that also comes with a 2D Blu-Ray and the digital copy can be redeemed directly from iTunes. You then get 3D & 2D Blu-Rays that are superior to streaming AND iTunes then throws in the 4K streaming version which then typically gets exported via Movies Anywhere to Vudu that (assuming they have that title in 4K now; many still aren't) then gives you a 4K version with Atmos, etc. when available when you never even bought a 4K anything! Great way to catch up on 4K titles even if you're still using only 1080p. My projector (Epson 3100) is 1080p and 3D only, but it doesn't hurt to stock up on 4K for a future projector or TV now when I can using Apple's auto-upgrades.

But what about price? Most older BDs are typically $4-8 (try and match that on iTunes). Many of those don't include digital copies, but with an external BD drive and MakeMKV + (optional) Handbrake (if you want smaller files or iTunes compatible ones) you can roll your own digital copies you can use anywhere, not just on Apple devices. I just got three Marvel 3D movies for $14 US from Britain (not available in the US) and they are region free and include 2D discs as well. I got the US newer Ghostbusters movie for $14 US that came with the Ultra 4K version, 3D version, 2D version and digital copies (as in two digital copies for regular and extended versions). $14!!! I've NEVER seen deals like that on iTunes. My point is that it's good to have the capability to handle multiple formats in order to get the best deals and/or best quality.

A lot of what you have mentioned applies ONLY to the US market. Please be aware that many readers here come from outside of that country. VUDU is US only. Digital copies/Movies Anywhere - USA only. Very silly to argue about something that isn't available worldwide. PLUS you really cannot try and sell a disc copy to someone who likes downloading/streaming. It's the equivalent of trying to make someone like classical music!!!
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That was a lot of text. Yes, physical media will give you an edge as far as sound and picture qualities go. Aside from Dolby Atmos (for now) iTunes movies are close enough in both picture and sound that for me it is not worth the investment in a physical disc.The decoder in the ATV 4k is great and there are frequent deals on iTunes and the web to pick up some great movies.

Right now the only time I buy a physical disc is if I want 3D for my one TV that even supports it. Hopefully projectors will continue to do so. Aside from my iPhone, the ATV might be my favorite Apple device.

I'm with you 100% on that!

 

[Rigby]

But what about price? Most older BDs are typically $4-8 (try and match that on iTunes).

There are actually frequent sales on iTunes with prices like $4.99 or $7.99 for catalog titles. They also often have cheap bundles (e.g. some time ago I got the entire Godfather trilogy for $9.99). New releases are often available for $14.99 (even in 4K where available), while new Blu-ray releases are usually $20+.

And, should HD movies I buy they ever become available in 4K, my movies will be upgraded for free. Try that with Blu-rays.

My point is that it's good to have the capability to handle multiple formats in order to get the best deals and/or best quality.

Well, at least here in the US we can now take advantage of offers at Amazon, Vudu or Google as well thanks to Movies Anywhere.