Theft is not the correct term.
Here is a helpful picture to show why it is not theft:
It would be more "thefty" if the pirate would have decided to buy a copy if he/she could not pirate a copy. How do you work that into the picture?
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iPod Just bought 80gb ipod classic from somebody with 8000 plus songs..need help
- Thread starter Raris
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It would be more "thefty" if the pirate would have decided to buy a copy if he/she could not pirate a copy. How do you work that into the picture?
That's actually a very short-sighted view. In the case of software piracy, having more illegal copies out there increases strain on servers. I know this from personal experience - I released a piece of software that synchronised with my webhosting server and downloaded updates. The payments from legit customers fed the bandwidth and capacity fees. So when a slew of people pirated it I paid the fees out of my own pocket until I couldn't, so legitimate customers ended up with broken software exactly because of people who believe piracy isn't stealing.
It's a different case with music and video though. After all giving a CD to someone or buying a second hand CD doesn't give any money to the original artist.
A. It's doubtful that the original owner of the iPod bought all 8000 songs.
B. It's even more doubtful that the current owner (the OP) would buy all of these songs should he be unable to copy them to his or her computer. Whether the data is destroyed or listened to makes no difference; the artists won't be getting their money. Morality is the only issue.
If the iPod was advertised as coming with the 8000 songs then I would keep them. It is the responsibility of the seller to delete his copies of the songs, if he advertised the songs with the iPod. But if he didn't say they came with the iPod then you should delete them.
Now if this was about software...
I've seen numerous threads which have stopped short after only a few replies where the original question was, essentially:
"How do I pirate this iPhone app which I don't want to pay for?".
These usually end with a "You'll get banned if you talk about pirating software - we don't do that here" comment.
So why is this any different? Is it because people here believe that iPhone developers are more in need than artists? Or because music is essentially off-topic for a Mac rumours site so they don't mind helping people 'steal' it?
Surely the end-game is exactly the same:
I buy an app/track
I break registration details/DRM
I give a copy of the app/track to someone else to use/listen to
Original developer/artist doesn't get paid for this additional copy
Bad news for everyone, except the person who got it for free (unless you believe in karma!).
So while I think that some people are over-doing the 'criminal/thief' card, I also think that artists should be treated with the same respect as software developers.
TT
I've seen numerous threads which have stopped short after only a few replies where the original question was, essentially:
"How do I pirate this iPhone app which I don't want to pay for?".
These usually end with a "You'll get banned if you talk about pirating software - we don't do that here" comment.
So why is this any different? Is it because people here believe that iPhone developers are more in need than artists? Or because music is essentially off-topic for a Mac rumours site so they don't mind helping people 'steal' it?
Surely the end-game is exactly the same:
I buy an app/track
I break registration details/DRM
I give a copy of the app/track to someone else to use/listen to
Original developer/artist doesn't get paid for this additional copy
Bad news for everyone, except the person who got it for free (unless you believe in karma!).
So while I think that some people are over-doing the 'criminal/thief' card, I also think that artists should be treated with the same respect as software developers.
TT
If the guy who sold the iPod bought the songs, why couldn't he resell them once? Maybe he meant to see them to the guy who bought the iPod?
Let's do this slow. If the guy who sold the iPod filled it with 8,000 songs that he owned legally and deleted all the originals and backup copies then the new owner can most likely legally copy these songs onto his Mac. If the guy who sold the iPod filled it with 8,000 songs but didn't own them, or kept the originals or backup copies, then copying the songs onto the new owner's Mac is a severe case of copyright infringement.
Now it is undeniably _possible_ that copying the songs is legal. However, it is also undeniably _possible_ that copying the songs is highly illegal (and may I say so, about 10,000 times more likely). The onus is on the new iPod owner to establish whether it is legal or not. Copyright infringement is still copyright infringement if you believed there is a _possibility_ that your copying is legal. It may be downgraded to "innocent infringement" (which is still infringement but with lower penalties) if the new iPod owner had a _good faith_ believe that the songs were legal. For example, if the old owner signed a written contract about the sale of the songs and an appropriate amount of money was paid, but the old owner lied. This is obviously not the case here.
Three cases: Case 1. I steal 800 CDs from a shop and sell them to you. You are buying stolen goods which is illegal if you know it, and you don't get any ownership of the CDs if you don't know it. Case 2. I sell 800 CDs to you that I purchased completely legally, but I made copies of all of them and kept them. Most likely my problem, not yours. Case 3. I put the music from 800 CDs onto my iPod and sell it to you, you copy the songs onto your Mac. Note: _you copy_. The songs are not yours. When you copy them, that is copyright infringement.
Use any of the aforementioned techniques, whether that be keep the songs or delete.
If you choose to keep them, do me a favor... if any of the songs pique your interest and you like the band, buy something directly from their website, go see them in concert, or go buy the CD's. That is how bands truly make money. Otherwise, the music label takes most of it (around the 92% range).
I read somewhere that a typical artist will profit like $.72 from each CD sold, but will make in the range of $300-25,000 dollars an hour at a concert depending on venue size and how full it is.
Don't feel bad if you keep the songs. Feel bad if you like the music and don't support the bands.
If you choose to keep them, do me a favor... if any of the songs pique your interest and you like the band, buy something directly from their website, go see them in concert, or go buy the CD's. That is how bands truly make money. Otherwise, the music label takes most of it (around the 92% range).
I read somewhere that a typical artist will profit like $.72 from each CD sold, but will make in the range of $300-25,000 dollars an hour at a concert depending on venue size and how full it is.
Don't feel bad if you keep the songs. Feel bad if you like the music and don't support the bands.
It's doubtful because the seller sold his iPod with 8000 songs still on it. Anyone that dumped that kind of money into their music collection (roughly $8000US), would be much more careful managing their music collection, and would no doubt make sure they restored the iPod before handing it over to someone else.
Use your heads people.
Man shut up with your stupid talk. Sitting behind a computer screen acting as if you are god. Come say it to my face that you never did anything similar to that before ever in your life? You act as if you never did anything wrong.
Save us all your crap and just go play with yourself, PLEASE!
I hate when people do that crap.
Later
AE
lol shut up. Yeah use Senuti.
if you want to be upset, blame the guy for leaving the songs on there, unless he said that was apart of the price. then it's all good.