Late 2008 MacBook - upgrade? replace? Please help!

[TricksyFox]

I have been using the same trusty late-2008 MacBook since, well, late-2008. We've had some challenges here and there, but it's still working pretty well. But now I'm constantly running into "your connection is not private" warnings. Some amount of sleuthing later and I find it's (most likely) because I'm running El Capitan, which is no longer supported by some ssl certificate... something or other.

No problem, I think. I'll update to a newer OS. Except as I'm sure you already know... El Capitan is the most recent OS that's compatible with a late-2008 MacBook.

So now I'm at a loss. Do I use a patch to upgrade to a newer OS? Do I stop resisting and get a new laptop? I'm feeling a little overwhelmed and at a loss, and would really appreciate any guidance. I'll try to put as much information as I can think of to be helpful below, but please don't hesitate to ask if I left something out!

Thanks in advance!!

Current MacBook info:
MacBook (13-inch, Aluminum, Late 2008)
Processor 2 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
Memory 8 GB 1067 MHz DDR3
Graphics NVIDIA GeForce 9400M 256 MB
Over the years I've replaced:
Battery
Charging cable
HD (replaced with a 1TB SATA SSD)
Memory (added 2 4gb memory cards)

Considerations:
1) I am on a budget (see: using the same laptop for 13 years), but have saved up enough that I could buy a new laptop if that's what makes the most sense in the long run. So I'm particularly looking for guidance on what is the most sensible option, rather than the easiest ("just buy a new one") or the cheapest ("slap some more duct tape on it!"), if that makes sense?

2) My concern with keeping the current one is that we're starting to reach the edge of my computer knowledge, in terms of what I can do on my own to keep it going. Who knows how much longer I'll be able to keep it up? There's definitely a point of diminishing returns, I just don't know if I've passed it yet or not.

3) My concern with getting a new one is that it just seems like I'm not going to be able to franken-computer a newer model, and I don't want to end up having to get a new model every 3 years or some nonsense like that due to planned obsolescence. I'm also a little overwhelmed by the options and price points and release schedule and... you know. The whole general Thing of buying a new laptop.

4) My primary uses are pretty typical - web browsing, zoom, netflix/hulu/etc, excel and powerpoint, and the occasional game (Myst or Catan moreso than Fortnite). Right now it handles most of these pretty well, although things get a little questionable if I try to do more than one at a time.

TL;DR:
I have a late-2008 MacBook. Do I update it to keep it going longer (if so, in what ways specifically), or do I get a new one (if so, what do I get)?

 

[Fishrrman]

A 2008 MBP is now 13 years old, going on 14.

I reckon that it's time for something new.
Or at least... Apple-refurbished.

What you buy depends on what you need and your financial situation.

If you "need Intel" -- I'd suggest an Apple-refurbished 2020 MacBook Pro 13" (Intel model released May 2020).

If you think you're ready to move to the "m-series" CPU,
Either
- A MacBook Pro 13" (with the m1)
or
- A MacBook Pro 14" (with the m1pro).

 

[TricksyFox]

A 2008 MBP is now 13 years old, going on 14.

I reckon that it's time for something new.
Or at least... Apple-refurbished.

What you buy depends on what you need and your financial situation.

If you "need Intel" -- I'd suggest an Apple-refurbished 2020 MacBook Pro 13" (Intel model released May 2020).

If you think you're ready to move to the "m-series" CPU,
Either
- A MacBook Pro 13" (with the m1)
or
- A MacBook Pro 14" (with the m1pro).

Is there a meaningful difference between the Intel or m-series? ...Does the fact that I'm asking imply that any difference would probably be irrelevant in my usage?

 

[theMarble]

I would stick with your 2008 MacBook. It's still an amazing computer.

Depending on what you want,
you can use the dosdude1 Catalina Patcher to get macOS Catalina running perfectly on your MacBook or if you really want El Capitan, you can install updated web certificates. I don't remember the link right now but I can send it to you once I find it again.

I see buying a new Mac for your use would be a waste. Your Mac is over 13 years old now (from release date), an M1 Mac can't be upgraded at all 13 years down the line.

 

[mmkerc]

To add my 2 pence, I would get a M1 Mac book Air 8Gb ram, and as much hard drive as the budget allows. Note that you will likely want/need to get a hub for extra peripherals, and maybe the 2021 single user version of MS 0ffice ($149 I think). For your stated uses it is more than sufficient, and should last at least 10 years. If you found a deal on an Intel (Mac 2018 or newer) that would also work for your needs and last as well.

 

[eyoungren]

I have been using the same trusty late-2008 MacBook since, well, late-2008. We've had some challenges here and there, but it's still working pretty well. But now I'm constantly running into "your connection is not private" warnings. Some amount of sleuthing later and I find it's (most likely) because I'm running El Capitan, which is no longer supported by some ssl certificate... something or other.

No problem, I think. I'll update to a newer OS. Except as I'm sure you already know... El Capitan is the most recent OS that's compatible with a late-2008 MacBook.

So now I'm at a loss. Do I use a patch to upgrade to a newer OS?

I have a 15" 2008 MBP. I'm running Catalina on it with a 500GB SSD. I just put Catalina on a 2010 MacBook Air last week as well. I have Mojave on my 2009 MacPro and Catalina on my Late 2009 Mac Mini. Just follow the patcher instructions and there shouldn't be any problems.

I'm using Vivaldi as a browser, which is a modern updated browser. You can still use Safari if that's your browser of choice. It'll be updated if you upgrade.

 

[eyoungren]

A 2008 MBP is now 13 years old, going on 14.

I reckon that it's time for something new.
Or at least... Apple-refurbished.

What you buy depends on what you need and your financial situation.

If you "need Intel" -- I'd suggest an Apple-refurbished 2020 MacBook Pro 13" (Intel model released May 2020).

If you think you're ready to move to the "m-series" CPU,
Either
- A MacBook Pro 13" (with the m1)
or
- A MacBook Pro 14" (with the m1pro).

To add my 2 pence, I would get a M1 Mac book Air 8Gb ram, and as much hard drive as the budget allows. Note that you will likely want/need to get a hub for extra peripherals, and maybe the 2021 single user version of MS 0ffice ($149 I think). For your stated uses it is more than sufficient, and should last at least 10 years. If you found a deal on an Intel (Mac 2018 or newer) that would also work for your needs and last as well.

Just want to make sure that you guys understand OP has posted this thread in the Early Intel Mac forums. If you're using the New Posts tab or coming from the front page of the forum it doesn't make that clear.

 

[Amethyst1]

To add my 2 pence, I would get a M1 Mac book Air 8Gb ram,

If the new machine is to be adequate for 10 years, rule number one is to max out the non-upgradable RAM to 16 GB — OP’s current machine already has 8 GB. There’s nothing more annoying than running out of RAM, not being able to do anything about it and wishing you had gone for more when buying the machine.

 

[mmkerc]

There’s nothing more annoying than running out of RAM, not being able to do anything about it and wishing you had gone for more when buying the machine.

Agree, but OP is on a budget, and given stated usage will not need additional RAM as much as storage, or hub.

 

[Amethyst1]

Agree, but OP is on a budget, and given stated usage will not need additional RAM as much as storage, or hub.

Maybe not today, but can you predict the RAM requirements in 10 years? No. Thus: don’t skimp on non-upgradable RAM when buying a machine supposed to last.

 

[Lars B.]

MacBook (13-inch, Aluminum, Late 2008)
Processor 2 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
Memory 8 GB 1067 MHz DDR3
Graphics NVIDIA GeForce 9400M 256 MB
Over the years I've replaced:
Battery
Charging cable
HD (replaced with a 1TB SATA SSD)
Memory (added 2 4gb memory cards)

Ok, so a new Mac with the same amount of memory (8GB, 1TB) would be at least 1400 dollars.

4) My primary uses are pretty typical - web browsing, zoom, netflix/hulu/etc, excel and powerpoint, and the occasional game (Myst or Catan moreso than Fortnite). Right now it handles most of these pretty well, although things get a little questionable if I try to do more than one at a time.

Definitely keep your old Mac. You said yourself that it is still fast enough for all its uses. If you buy a new computer now, you'll be annoyed at the latest when the next model comes out with even more cool features and you can't buy it because you've already spent your money.

If, on the other hand, you wait until your current MacBook is really no longer sufficient for your purposes, you will firstly have a better new MacBook for probably less money (especially the memory upgrades will certainly get cheaper over time), and secondly, when the successor model is released later, you can always say to yourself: I did everything right, I couldn't have waited any longer.

2) My concern with keeping the current one is that we're starting to reach the edge of my computer knowledge, in terms of what I can do on my own to keep it going. Who knows how much longer I'll be able to keep it up? There's definitely a point of diminishing returns, I just don't know if I've passed it yet or not.

The dosdude patchers are really easy to use. If you only use third-party browsers (Firefox, Chrome etc.), you might want to use the High Sierra patcher from

macOS High Sierra Patcher

because High Sierra is the last version of macOS that runs perfectly on your machine. Apple blocked it from installing, but there's no real technical reason, they just didn't want to support the older machines any longer. So there won't be any problems with High Sierra whatsoever. And High Sierra is at least a lot more secure than El Capitan, and while you won't get the latest version of Safari, you can still use the current version of Firefox or Chrome on it. Firefox uses its own certificate store and won't have any problems with secure connections, even if your system certificates are outdated.

If you want to be on an OS that's still supported with security updates, use the Catalina patcher. Catalina actually needs a Metal-compatible GPU which your laptop doesn't have (so in this case, there is a technical reason why it doesn't run out of the box), but the authors of the patch have found a way to change some system libraries in a way that Catalina will run on your Mac. There might be glitches here and there, because some apps assume that Metal must be available on Catalina, but on my 2008 MacBook, Catalina runs just fine. You can get the Catalina patcher here:

macOS Catalina Patcher

It's also possible to install Big Sur and Monterey on the 2008 MacBook using the OpenCore Legacy Patcher from

OpenCore Legacy Patcher

Experience macOS just like before

dortania.github.io

but I haven't tried that myself yet. In any case, if you want to try it, don't install Monterey, because that's a moving target and it might break with every new 12.x release. Use Big Sur now and upgrade to Monterey only after the next version of macOS has been released.

 

[bobesch]

As @theMarble, @eyoungren and @Lars B. said: keep the book and try one of @dosdude1 's patches.
I do prefer MojavePatch, since it's the last version of macOS that allows 32bit-Apps and the patched version also keeps system in HFS+ instead of APFS.

I've updated two 2,4GHz early-08 13" MB to Mojave and they do run fine.
Personally I'd recommend to use more than one partition on the 1TB SSD. A smaller one for the system and the other one for data. It's easier for system-upgrade/restore and more handy for clone-backups with CCC etc., especially, if there's a bunch of smaller drives around for backup-purpose (typically some of the backup-drives are previous system drives and smaller than the new internal drive ...)
So this update comes at no extra-costs, since you don't have to buy any extra-stuff, except ... except for any backup drive! Since you certainly have your old spinning-drive left, that might serve as the drive for clone-backups and the system-partition needs to have the same size. Better get an additional external 1TB drive (or bigger) for an extra clone-backup.

If You want to upgrade to a faster machine I'd recommend a mid-2012 13" or 15" pre-Retina MBP. Both sport USB3, can hold 16GB RAM and the 15" has a quad-i7-chip and a sturdy GPU (compared to previous past-c2duo-models from 2010/11). You might even swap Your current SSD into one of them and continue to work.
If You're lucky You may find a 13"/15" MBP at 250/350 bucks thanks to the M1-hype.
Reselling the late-2008 MB should get You about 100 bucks or more cash back (but I'd keep such a tough companion).

PS: Moving to AppleSilicon would mean to leave a lot of stuff behind, that You use on Your's 2008MB and there will be extra-cost for adapters and software upgrades etc.

 

[bobesch]

Is there a meaningful difference between the Intel or m-series? ...Does the fact that I'm asking imply that any difference would probably be irrelevant in my usage?

M1 allows only 64bit-Apps (no iPhoto/Aperture, no MS Office'08 etc.)
Intel-only Apps will only run emulated.
There's no virtual Windows (VMware-Fusion/VirtualBox) like it used to be on an intel-Mac.

 

[Amethyst1]

M1 allows only 64bit-Apps (no iPhoto/Aperture, no MS Office'08 etc.)

And the same applies to an Intel Mac running Catalina or a later version. Mojave is the end of the road for 32-bit. So, moving past Mojave should be given careful consideration if you have any 32-bit applications..

There's no virtual Windows (VMware-Fusion/VirtualBox) like it used to be on an intel-Mac.

You can virtualise the ARM version of Windows, including its emulator for 32- and 64-bit x86 applications, in Parallels Desktop. It's not nearly as useful as the x86 version though.

 

[bobesch]

You can virtualise the ARM version of Windows, including its emulator for 32- and 64-bit x86 applications, in Parallels Desktop. It's not nearly as useful as the x86 version though.

Soothing, feels like becoming a Guinea Pig ... 😄

 

[Amethyst1]

Soothing, feels like becoming a Guinea Pig ... 😄

Living on the bleeding edge comes with a price

 

[m1maverick]

To add my 2 pence, I would get a M1 Mac book Air 8Gb ram, and as much hard drive as the budget allows. Note that you will likely want/need to get a hub for extra peripherals, and maybe the 2021 single user version of MS 0ffice ($149 I think). For your stated uses it is more than sufficient, and should last at least 10 years. If you found a deal on an Intel (Mac 2018 or newer) that would also work for your needs and last as well.

FYI it's currently on sale at Microcenter for $99.00.

 

[davigarma]

I have been using the same trusty late-2008 MacBook since, well, late-2008. We've had some challenges here and there, but it's still working pretty well. But now I'm constantly running into "your connection is not private" warnings. Some amount of sleuthing later and I find it's (most likely) because I'm running El Capitan, which is no longer supported by some ssl certificate... something or other.

No problem, I think. I'll update to a newer OS. Except as I'm sure you already know... El Capitan is the most recent OS that's compatible with a late-2008 MacBook.

So now I'm at a loss. Do I use a patch to upgrade to a newer OS? Do I stop resisting and get a new laptop? I'm feeling a little overwhelmed and at a loss, and would really appreciate any guidance. I'll try to put as much information as I can think of to be helpful below, but please don't hesitate to ask if I left something out!

Thanks in advance!!

Current MacBook info:
MacBook (13-inch, Aluminum, Late 2008)
Processor 2 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
Memory 8 GB 1067 MHz DDR3
Graphics NVIDIA GeForce 9400M 256 MB
Over the years I've replaced:
Battery
Charging cable
HD (replaced with a 1TB SATA SSD)
Memory (added 2 4gb memory cards)

Considerations:
1) I am on a budget (see: using the same laptop for 13 years), but have saved up enough that I could buy a new laptop if that's what makes the most sense in the long run. So I'm particularly looking for guidance on what is the most sensible option, rather than the easiest ("just buy a new one") or the cheapest ("slap some more duct tape on it!"), if that makes sense?

2) My concern with keeping the current one is that we're starting to reach the edge of my computer knowledge, in terms of what I can do on my own to keep it going. Who knows how much longer I'll be able to keep it up? There's definitely a point of diminishing returns, I just don't know if I've passed it yet or not.

3) My concern with getting a new one is that it just seems like I'm not going to be able to franken-computer a newer model, and I don't want to end up having to get a new model every 3 years or some nonsense like that due to planned obsolescence. I'm also a little overwhelmed by the options and price points and release schedule and... you know. The whole general Thing of buying a new laptop.

4) My primary uses are pretty typical - web browsing, zoom, netflix/hulu/etc, excel and powerpoint, and the occasional game (Myst or Catan moreso than Fortnite). Right now it handles most of these pretty well, although things get a little questionable if I try to do more than one at a time.

TL;DR:
I have a late-2008 MacBook. Do I update it to keep it going longer (if so, in what ways specifically), or do I get a new one (if so, what do I get)?

I'm still using Imac 2008. El Capitan. I don't recommend the Mojave and Catalina patches, it gets slow. In El Capitan Chrome, the official version is still 96 that Google updates perfectly. The sign that you can't connect is given by Safari on some sites. Let's Encrypt SSL Certificates expired
Update the certificate and your problems will be over. If you are not very expert in installing it by hand, and want to automate, open terminal:
Download the updated certificate copy or type:
curl -L http://x1.i.lencr.org -o 'ISRG Root X1.der'
sudo security add-trusted-cert -d -r trustRoot -k /System/Library/Keychains/SystemRootCertificates.keychain 'ISRG Root X1.der'

And you have your mac book up and running again

I also recommend the installation of Ad Guard to eliminate advertising and feel safe

 

[Lars B.]

I'm still using Imac 2008. El Capitan. I don't recommend the Mojave and Catalina patches, it gets slow.

That's not my experience on the 2008 MacBook with 8GB RAM. However, if you (Tricksy Fox) don't want to upgrade to Catalina, you should really upgrade to High Sierra. Almost all the software that runs in El Capitan still runs in High Sierra (including 32-bit apps), and High Sierra really works perfectly on the 2008 MacBook with the patcher. You might still need the certificates, if so, they can be installed just like davigarma described for El Capitan.
On Catalina, you still get automatic upgrades including recent certificates.

If you stay on High Sierra (or even El Capitan), you really should not use Safari, because of the missing security updates. Use Chrome, Opera or Brave on El Capitan, or any browser except Safari on High Sierra (Firefox, Edge, Opera, Chrome, Brave all run fine).

 

[davigarma]

Esa no es mi experiencia con la MacBook 2008 con 8 GB de RAM.

Mine is yes with 6 Gigs of ram and 2'4 Ghz, not 2. Besides being slow (Apple's caps are usually accurate) you mount a patch for Hight Sierra that destroys the protection of the system. That's its inconsistent with their recommendation that you don't use Safari 11 for lack of security.

Take care

 

[Amethyst1]

you mount a patch for Hight Sierra that destroys the protection of the system.

Disabling System Integrity Protection isn’t the end of the world

 

[davigarma]

Disabling System Integrity Protection isn’t the end of the world

No. It is just as "safe" as surfing with Safari 11 😁

 

[Amethyst1]

No. It is just as "safe" as surfing with Safari 11 😁

I’d rather run a more modern macOS without SIP than El Capitan with SIP. El Capitan can’t even run the latest Firefox anymore.

 

[davigarma]

I’d rather run a more modern macOS without SIP than El Capitan with SIP. El Capitan can’t even run the latest Firefox anymore.

I do not doubt it. If you feel safe like this, congratulations! . That's what it's about 😉

 

[Lars B.]

No. It is just as "safe" as surfing with Safari 11 😁

Sorry, but that is totally ridiculous. These two things are absolutely not comparable. System Integrity Protection is useful in this scenario:

1. Your Mac has already been hacked or you have downloaded and executed a trojan.
2. That hacker or trojan has already gotten administrator privileges. That may be because they could exploit another security issue or they tricked you into entering your admin credentials.
3. This means the hacker or trojan already has the power to download all your data, or delete or encrypt all your data. Essentially, you have already lost. (By the way, they wouldn't even need the admin privileges to do this.)
4. Now the hacker or trojan wants to modify the system software, so that you can't remove it even if you delete your user account and create a new one. Now they need the admin privileges, but it still won't work, because SIP will prevent that.

That's the only thing SIP on High Sierra protects against. You have already lost all your user data to the attacker, but you don't need to reinstall macOS. There's absolutely no way an attacker could get into your computer in the first place just because you disabled SIP. They need to already be on your Mac (and have administrator privileges) for SIP to make any difference.

Surfing with an old version of Safari (or using Apple Mail) is totally different. An attacker only needs you to visit their site or a site they compromised, and they are on your Mac. If you use Apple Mail which uses WebKit under the hood, it's enough if you click on an e-mail they sent you. You don't have to open attachments, just looking at the e-mail is enough.
(After they got into your Mac and are able to download or delete all your data, SIP kicks in and protects the macOS installation, not your data.)

So the question is: Would you rather have a secure computer where noone will be able to hack you, at least as long as you don't do very stupid things like downloading a trojan and manually bypassing Gatekeeper, but if you really get hacked, you don't only lose your data, but have to reinstall macOS as well, or would you rather have a computer where every 15-year-old script kiddie can hack you and get access to all your data, but then you can simply create a new user account instead of reinstalling everything.

It really isn't comparable in any way.