iPad Pro M1 on 2021 iPad Pros?

[rui no onna]

I could see the iPad Pro getting the m1 or a chip more specialised to the iPad Pro. I still stand behind a previous comment I made in these forums that the m1 was being designed for the iPad Pro and Intel buggered up. Apple having this chip in the works let them ditch Intel.

Intel buggered up a long time ago. Apple was just waiting for all the pieces to fall into place before they released the first Apple Silicon Macs and they used the iPad Pros as test bed for the chipsets.

A9/A9X is when they matched Core 2 Duo (2008) performance. By A10X, Apple already jumped around 4 years worth into Ivy Bridge (2012) and all of that at a fraction of the power consumption. By the time A12X rolled out and they were matching current i5/i7s, the only question in my head is "How much performance overhead is required for emulating x86-based Mac apps?". They've seriously surpassed my expectations with M1 and Rosetta 2.

What you say makes sense IF AND ONLY IF Apple decides they want to wind down their Mac lines and I am not sure I see the logic in why they would want to do that.

Not really. Even in the PC world, there's room for both 2-in-1s and traditional clamshell laptops. I know automotive analogies are overused but the comparison is quite apt. There's a place for motorbikes, compacts, sedans, crossovers, SUVs, pickup trucks and ten-wheelers.

One thing I do expect regardless of whether Apple adds Dex-like mode and Rosetta to the iPad Pro or even release a brand new hybrid entirely is that the experience will be good. It won't be like the mess that is iOS apps running on M1 Macs.

 

[kristalsoldier]

Not really. Even in the PC world, there's room for both 2-in-1s and traditional clamshell laptops. I know automotive analogies are overused but the comparison is quite apt. There's a place for motorbikes, compacts, sedans, crossovers, SUVs, pickup trucks and ten-wheelers.

One thing I do expect regardless of whether Apple adds Dex-like mode and Rosetta to the iPad Pro or even release a brand new hybrid entirely is that the experience will be good. It won't be like the mess that is iOS apps running on M1 Macs.

As you already know, in the Windows world, particularly where 2-in1’s are concerned, the emphasis is always on the non touch version of the OS, which is a spin off from the standard Windows OS. But where the iPad is concerned, iPadOS is a markedly different animal as compared to MacOS and it’s a polished experience despite its obvious limitations unlike the touch-friendly version available on the Surface.

Considered in Windows terms, it is like having Windows Phone OS (ver 8 and after) or Windows RT powering something like the Surface (not the Surface book). I have spent quite a bit of time with a Windows RT Surface, and the experience was...not very good, I’m afraid. That aside, it makes sense for Apple to promote a “light computing” platform with the iPad. This allows them to maintain both iPad and Mac lines. But, of course, YMMV.

 

[rui no onna]

As you already know, in the Windows world, particularly where 2-in1’s are concerned, the emphasis is always on the non touch version of the OS, which is a spin off from the standard Windows OS. But where the iPad is concerned, iPadOS is a markedly different animal as compared to MacOS and it’s a polished experience despite its obvious limitations unlike the touch-friendly version available on the Surface.

Considered in Windows terms, it is like having Windows Phone OS (ver 8 and after) or Windows RT powering something like the Surface (not the Surface book). I have spent quite a bit of time with a Windows RT Surface, and the experience was...not very good, I’m afraid. That aside, it makes sense for Apple to promote a “light computing” platform with the iPad. This allows them to maintain both iPad and Mac lines. But, of course, YMMV.

That's kinda what I'm getting at. Windows has shown us how not to do it. I expect if/when Apple eventually goes there, the implementation would be markedly improved.

The Mac line up can remain as it is even as Apple adds support for Mac apps on the iPad Pro or to a new hybrid line.

 

[Serban55]

As well as Apple never give any iphone an Ax chip from the iapds....i dont see Apple also gives any M chips to the ipads or iphone
iPhones and also some ipads has the clock speeds at around 2.5ghz...the M1 can reach, thanks to its inside room/or to an active cooling, around 3.1 3.2ghz

 

[Seanm87]

Given the leaks that the new iPad Pro will only be 12.9 inches and now we have the M1 i think its a good chance the new pro models will have the M1 or some variant of it. Running MacOS.

It feels like that would be the last missing piece of the iPad becoming a full laptop replacement.

 

[Serban55]

why making any mac with M1 if the ipad would be running MacOS and have M1 also ?
Don't have hopes for that....MacOS still needs a lot of RAM...and for now ipads with 6gb ram is way too low
No wonder the dev kit mac mini had 16 gb ram...and any mac starts with 8 gb Ram at minimum

 

[Seanm87]

why making any mac with M1 if the ipad would be running MacOS and have M1 also ?
Don't have hopes for that....MacOS still needs a lot of RAM...and for now ipads with 6gb ram is way too low
No wonder the dev kit mac mini had 16 gb ram...and any mac starts with 8 gb Ram at minimum

I think the new ipad Pro will have 8gb ram. It’s at 6 already so its not that big a leap.

 

[Digitalguy]

Intel buggered up a long time ago. Apple was just waiting for all the pieces to fall into place before they released the first Apple Silicon Macs and they used the iPad Pros as test bed for the chipsets.

A9/A9X is when they matched Core 2 Duo (2008) performance. By A10X, Apple already jumped around 4 years worth into Ivy Bridge (2012) and all of that at a fraction of the power consumption. By the time A12X rolled out and they were matching current i5/i7s, the only question in my head is "How much performance overhead is required for emulating x86-based Mac apps?". They've seriously surpassed my expectations with M1 and Rosetta 2.




Not really. Even in the PC world, there's room for both 2-in-1s and traditional clamshell laptops. I know automotive analogies are overused but the comparison is quite apt. There's a place for motorbikes, compacts, sedans, crossovers, SUVs, pickup trucks and ten-wheelers.

One thing I do expect regardless of whether Apple adds Dex-like mode and Rosetta to the iPad Pro or even release a brand new hybrid entirely is that the experience will be good. It won't be like the mess that is iOS apps running on M1 Macs.

A9X was way more powerful than core 2 duo. I have a Word document with a chart comparing benchmark across my 40-50 devices, including laptops of virtually any generation since 2002. A9X is on Sandy bridge level of performance (talking about dual core laptops of course, not about quad core cores in 15in to 17in laptops or desktops....). A9 is a different story, but still beats core 2 duo laptops. A10X is close to the 8th gen (quad core). As for Ivy brydge, it even slightly beats the big quad core laptops (maybe you were referring to those...)

 

[Digitalguy]

I think the new ipad Pro will have 8gb ram. It’s at 6 already so its not that big a leap.

Likely. However, as I have said it countless times, Apple will keep Macs and iPads clearly separate. MacOS will not come to iPads, nor touch will come to Macs....

 

[rui no onna]

A9X was way more powerful than core 2 duo. I have a Word document with a chart comparing benchmark across my 40-50 devices, including laptops of virtually any generation since 2002. A9X is on Sandy bridge level of performance (talking about dual core laptops of course, not about quad core cores in 15in to 17in laptops or desktops....). A9 is a different story, but still beats core 2 duo laptops. A10X is close to the 8th gen (quad core). As for Ivy brydge, it even slightly beats the big quad core laptops (maybe you were referring to those...)

Yes, you're right. A9X is more powerful than Core 2. It's A9 that's Intel Core 2 Duo E8500 level. That's my baseline for minimum performance on desktop. Paired with a discrete GPU to handle AVC/HEVC hardware acceleration, 8GB RAM and SSD, it's actually not awful on Windows 7/10. For years, Intel's Atom and ultra low voltage CPUs couldn't even match that level.

The comparisons made were to 65W desktop chips.

 

[ericwn]

Given the leaks that the new iPad Pro will only be 12.9 inches and now we have the M1 i think its a good chance the new pro models will have the M1 or some variant of it. Running MacOS.

It feels like that would be the last missing piece of the iPad becoming a full laptop replacement.

There is zero leak here but plenty of rumors.

 

[Tsepz]

I think the new ipad Pro will have 8gb ram. It’s at 6 already so its not that big a leap.

Looking at Apples track record with iOS as well as iPad OS devices and RAM I highly doubt we will see a RAM upgrade in the next iPad Pro. Apple kept iPad Pro at 4GB RAM maximum from 2015 all the way to 2018 and even then they only gave the 1TB iPad Pro 2018 the 6GB RAM while the rest got 4GB RAM and only now in 2020 did they finally upgrade the full range to 6GB RAM in the 2020 iPad Pros.

Maybe the 2022 iPad Pro 1TB will have 8GB RAM if we are lucky, but I think 6GB RAM is here to say for a few years in the Pros especially now that they have ARM based Macs, they no longer have to push iPads as some sort of laptop replacement, they can now push iPads as a nice go between device, giving them more incentive to keep the RAM at 6GB and maybe upgrading the Display technology to OLED or MiniLED with 120hz ProMotion and slightly higher brightness and a beefed up A14 (A14X with more GPU power)m while the Macs get to push the limits much further.

I honestly would appeal to people not to put their expectations too high for the next iPad Pro now that Apple are focused on ARM chips for their laptops. The biggest play Apple can have with iPad is display technology as that’s where it can shine over the Mac, the iPad OS touch experience.

 

[rui no onna]

Looking at Apples track record with iOS as well as iPad OS devices and RAM I highly doubt we will see a RAM upgrade in the next iPad Pro. Apple kept iPad Pro at 4GB RAM maximum from 2015 all the way to 2018 and even then they only gave the 1TB iPad Pro 2018 the 6GB RAM while the rest got 4GB RAM and only now in 2020 did they finally upgrade the full range to 6GB RAM in the 2020 iPad Pros.

Maybe the 2022 iPad Pro 1TB will have 8GB RAM if we are lucky, but I think 6GB RAM is here to say for a few years in the Pros especially now that they have ARM based Macs, they no longer have to push iPads as some sort of laptop replacement, they can now push iPads as a nice go between device, giving them more incentive to keep the RAM at 6GB and maybe upgrading the Display technology to OLED or MiniLED with 120hz ProMotion and slightly higher brightness and a beefed up A14 (A14X with more GPU power)m while the Macs get to push the limits much further.

I honestly would appeal to people not to put their expectations too high for the next iPad Pro now that Apple are focused on ARM chips for their laptops. The biggest play Apple can have with iPad is display technology as that’s where it can shine over the Mac, the iPad OS touch experience.

I don't think it's an impossibility.

The iPads had:

1GB 2012-2013

2GB 2014

4GB 2015-2018

There's 50/50 chance we get 8GB on the new Pros. If the A14X/Z are close enough to M1 (or perhaps are M1s that didn't pass binning for Mac-level), it may be more expedient or cheaper for Apple to just go 8GB on all of them.

 

[rowspaxe]

iPad: Great hardware, lacking severely in what you can do with its operating system.

It’s frustrating that they have pretty much everything they need if they would just merge, but they won’t. So will have to wait until they decide to improve/change one of the product lines

Does anyone still think full Photoshop is coming to the iPad? Logic? Final Cut?

 

[rui no onna]

Does anyone still think full Photoshop is coming to the iPad? Logic? Final Cut?

Not yet and quite possibly not the current versions. Future iPad Pro models? Yeah, it's a possibility.

 

[KittyKatta]

Does anyone still think full Photoshop is coming to the iPad? Logic? Final Cut?

Personally, I no longer have faith in Apple delivering Pro apps to this CURRENT generation of iPads.

I love the iPad Pro but after 5 years of ignored and missing Pro Apple apps then it's pretty clear where Apple's priorities are (most evident in the amount of Apple programs optimized for M1 Macs on Day1).

Maybe next gen they'll actually put effort into Apple iPad software but IF they do then I wouldnt be surprised if Apples "Pro" iPad apps will run on any of the current iPad Pros.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

I just want to know what happens when we get to M7, given previous M-series co-processors.

It’s obvious, really. The very next one becomes your friend...

 

[rowspaxe]

Personally, I no longer have faith in Apple delivering Pro apps to this CURRENT generation of iPads.

I don't think it full pro apps will ever come to the iPad. I don't know if that it makes sense. My hope is
that ios art apps supplant their gesture workflows with keyboard commands. Procreate has clearly
outgrown its UI and gesture commands. There are enough keyboard commands to get by, but it
could be better. Two finger tap undo? No thanks!

 

[ouimetnick]

The M1, A14, A12X/Z all have more in common than you might think. The name is just what the marketing department decides it should be called. They can make 1 or 2 actual chips and just disable certain features that would be used in an iPhone or iPad and vice versa. Imagine making 1 chip for the MacBook Pro, MacBook Air, Mac Mini and iPad Pro and just disabling non Mac specific features for use in the iPad Pro, and disabling iPad specific features for chips used in the Mac. Slap on a different heat spreader that says A14 or M1, and call it a day. It’s called binning, think of it as what GM is famous for doing with a single vehicle and selling it as a Saab, Buick and a Cadillac. Same engine, transmission, same suspension, ECU, etc, just a different skin.

 

[ericwn]

Looking at Apples track record with iOS as well as iPad OS devices and RAM I highly doubt we will see a RAM upgrade in the next iPad Pro. Apple kept iPad Pro at 4GB RAM maximum from 2015 all the way to 2018 and even then they only gave the 1TB iPad Pro 2018 the 6GB RAM while the rest got 4GB RAM and only now in 2020 did they finally upgrade the full range to 6GB RAM in the 2020 iPad Pros.

Maybe the 2022 iPad Pro 1TB will have 8GB RAM if we are lucky, but I think 6GB RAM is here to say for a few years in the Pros especially now that they have ARM based Macs, they no longer have to push iPads as some sort of laptop replacement, they can now push iPads as a nice go between device, giving them more incentive to keep the RAM at 6GB and maybe upgrading the Display technology to OLED or MiniLED with 120hz ProMotion and slightly higher brightness and a beefed up A14 (A14X with more GPU power)m while the Macs get to push the limits much further.

I honestly would appeal to people not to put their expectations too high for the next iPad Pro now that Apple are focused on ARM chips for their laptops. The biggest play Apple can have with iPad is display technology as that’s where it can shine over the Mac, the iPad OS touch experience.

Apple wants to shine in each product category but I’d guess they sell significantly more iPads than Macs.

Apple isn’t focussed on one chip only, they make multiple different hardware products for different audiences at the same time.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Apple wants to shine in each product category but I’d guess they sell significantly more iPads than Macs.

That is a darn fine guess!

 

[AxiomaticRubric]

Not arguing, but im not sure about that product breakdown. Every iPad has the EXACT same core functionality/accessories and no software exists that are exclusive to a specific model or spec. So a Pro isn't any more a "laptop" as an iPad/Air and the only real differentiators between models are “luxuries” and nothing more. The iPad clearly can (and should) do more but I dont think Apple wants it to.

With the ARM transition and so much excess power in even the most basic iPads then maybe it shouldn’t be a platform choice anymore, it should be a choice of form factor.

Eventually iPhones (for example) will have such powerful ARM processors that macOS can be included alongside iOS. Simply connect a monitor, a wireless keyboard, and a wireless mouse or trackpad. There's your Mac.

 

[rui no onna]

Not arguing, but im not sure about that product breakdown. Every iPad has the EXACT same core functionality/accessories and no software exists that are exclusive to a specific model or spec. So a Pro isn't any more a "laptop" as an iPad/Air and the only real differentiators between models are “luxuries” and nothing more. The iPad clearly can (and should) do more but I dont think Apple wants it to.

With the ARM transition and so much excess power in even the most basic iPads then maybe it shouldn’t be a platform choice anymore, it should be a choice of form factor.

Same chipset, the Pros, yeah. The branding's different but I expect they're almost identical. The iPhone chipsets have fewer cores (both CPU and GPU).

The base 2-3GB RAM and 32-64GB storage also wouldn't really allow for full desktop experience.

 

[blkjedi954]

Do we know the full A14X specs yet? The M1 comes with even more transistors than the A14,are we sure the A14X won’t be just a A14 with a few more GPU cores but maybe not a many as the M1? Seems to be a lot of variables at play.

A14 with more GPU cores makes it an A14X. As for the A14X and M1 being essentially the same? I would argue that the M1 is a scaled up version of the A14X in which the thermal envelope of the M1 is better suited for a Mac and additional circuitry is added for PC level functionality such as x86 translation, virtualization acceleration, Thunderbolt controllers etc. I think these differentiating factors require a new chip name.

 

[rui no onna]

A14 with more GPU cores makes it an A14X. As for the A14X and M1 being essentially the same? I would argue that the M1 is a scaled up version of the A14X in which the thermal envelope of the M1 is better suited for a Mac and additional circuitry is added for PC level functionality such as x86 translation, virtualization acceleration, Thunderbolt controllers etc. I think these differentiating factors require a new chip name.

We haven't seen A14X/Z yet. It would be interesting to see if it's actually a different chip or just a re-bin of M1 with certain parts disabled. Die size of the M1 is certainly within the ballpark for AX chipsets.

Comparing Geekbench 5 scores, the difference between A14 and M1 could be easily attributed to the slightly higher clock and extra big cores. If the next iPad Pros get A14X, I do expect them to be within a couple hundred points of the M1 scores.

GB5
M1 MBA 1700/7300
A14 iPad Air 4 1600/4200
A14 iPhone 12 650/3000 (low power mode)
A12Z iPad Pro 1100/4700
A12 iPhone Xr 1100/2400


A14 3.0 GHz
process 5nm
die size 88mm2
cpu cores 2 big/4 small
gpu cores 4

M1 3.2 GHz
process 5nm
die size 119mm2
cpu cores 4 big/4 small
gpu cores 7/8

A12X/A12Z
process 7nm
die size 122mm2
cpu cores 4 big/4 small
gpu cores 7/8

A10X
process 10nm
die size 96.4mm2
cpu cores 3 big/3 small
gpu cores 12

A9X
process 16nm
die size 147mm2
cpu cores 2
gpu cores 12