M1 (pro/max) parallels + visual studio

[Kimcha]

In the meantime, @matram as an option can be a virtual machine on Azure (e.g. https://jan-v.nl/post/2020/developing-in-an-azure-virtualmachine/ ) I did some calculations and 32GB ram 8 cores machine costs $60 for 8hx20 days, which is not that bad at all

You can also check out hetzner.com cloud VM. I’m using a CX41 with 4 vCPUs and 16gb of ram for powerbi and it’s working fairly well.

Remote Desktop is a little laggy when scrolling or moving windows, but for productivity apps it works quite well.

I still need to try to find a way to make it work with parsec, which has amazing performance. It’s almost like working locally.

 

[ultrakyo]

Honestly the windows bit is maybe slower, as I said still need to do tests with a stopwatch, but as I wrote you can use your laptop no issues at all while parallels runs. I unplugged my Mac on Friday afternoon, watched a few hours of Apple TV, came to work this morning and plugged in at 2pm. From Friday afternoon parallels was on )

That is a big improvement, my i9 MPB 16 would last a day in standby mode with full charge if parallel is not suspended.

 

[x600]

That is a big improvement, my i9 MPB 16 would last a day in standby mode with full charge if parallel is not suspended.

Try enable auto-pausing and disabling power nap on batteries

 

[alien3dx]

I'm running VS 2022 on my Parallels VM on my 2.4Ghz i9 Macbook Pro 16 inch. With ReSharper it's very laggy. Trying to decide if an upgrade to the new M1 Max will hurt or help. It sounds like performance can be good on the new M1 Max for this scenario...but anyone know if it's better/worse than with an i9?

we now trying to make sample .net core asp.net on 2022(spa startup apps)

1. ram usage is beyond crazy . this afternoon 4 gb ram usage upon searching.(imac 2017 16 gb )
2. hot reload - not suitable for old need to migrate even so lots not supported yet
3. Usage either using vs 2022 in mac much lower ram then vs 2022 windows.( both okay no lag on 2017)
4. Future we try on our m1 either performance good or not.

 

[throAU]

If you want to run X86 windows (i.e., Windows on Mac, legally) you're better off with an intel machine. End of story.

Alternatively, if you're set on getting an M1 Mac, consider Microsoft's Windows 365 service (I think that's its name) which basically gives you a cloud windows desktop. Or get a NUC pc to Remote Desktop to for those things.

trying to run x86 windows on ARM/Apple Silicon is just asking for heart-ache, in terms of reliability, performance, etc.

If Visual Studio on Windows is a major usage of your PC, by buying an M1 pro to do it, you're just spending a heap of money to run Windows apps really badly/not legally - Windows 10/11 ARM is not for redistribution to non-Windows on ARM machines; there's no legal way to buy it outright as I understand it (same situation as Hackintosh).

 

[alien3dx]

If you want to run X86 windows (i.e., Windows on Mac, legally) you're better off with an intel machine. End of story.

Alternatively, if you're set on getting an M1 Mac, consider Microsoft's Windows 365 service (I think that's its name) which basically gives you a cloud windows desktop. Or get a NUC pc to Remote Desktop to for those things.

trying to run x86 windows on ARM/Apple Silicon is just asking for heart-ache, in terms of reliability, performance, etc.

If Visual Studio on Windows is a major usage of your PC, by buying an M1 pro to do it, you're just spending a heap of money to run Windows apps really badly/not legally.

visual studio for mac existed dear , but more .net core platform. If still stuck on webform nothing can do.
visual studio 2022 for m1 official next year but still existed in beta

 

[RDelgado]

Honestly the windows bit is maybe slower, as I said still need to do tests with a stopwatch, but as I wrote you can use your laptop no issues at all while parallels runs. I unplugged my Mac on Friday afternoon, watched a few hours of Apple TV, came to work this morning and plugged in at 2pm. From Friday afternoon parallels was on )

I am a little late to this discussion, my apologies. I too am hoping to go with a new macbook pro max, but am hoping to use it as both my mobile solution and desktop. I also spend a lot of time in Visual studio and must be able to develop in Windows as some of our legacy apps are still WinForms and WPF.

Can you give me an update on how using VS in Windows through Parallels is going? Looks like you are using Windows 11 and VS 2019. Are you able to publish your ClickOnce apps directly or are you having to use Proxy or some other method? lastly, would you do it again?

Thanks for any and all help/information

 

[alien3dx]

I am a little late to this discussion, my apologies. JamesPet

I am a little late to this discussion, my apologies. I too am hoping to go with a new macbook pro max, but am hoping to use it as both my mobile solution and desktop. I also spend a lot of time in Visual studio and must be able to develop in Windows as some of our legacy apps are still WinForms and WPF.

Can you give me an update on how using VS in Windows through Parallels is going? Looks like you are using Windows 11 and VS 2019. Are you able to publish your ClickOnce apps directly or are you having to use Proxy or some other method? lastly, would you do it again?

Thanks for any and all help/information

i yet try to migrate and test my old wpf application to .net core. My advise kinda hard to said , you need x86 for old platform . Movin to .net core from webform , winform maybe a bit hard to test em all. Wait official release vs studio 2022 for mac. 2022 still yet polish and hot reload is cool but only new platform

 

[RDelgado]

i yet try to migrate and test my old wpf application to .net core. My advise kinda hard to said , you need x86 for old platform . Movin to .net core from webform , winform maybe a bit hard to test em all. Wait official release vs studio 2022 for mac. 2022 still yet polish and hot reload is cool but only new platform

Appreciate the response. Unfortunately the one mixed WinForms/WPF application has several hundred projects in it will not be that easy to convert. I acquired my first MacBook years ago for Xamarin development and fell in love with it. Was hoping to completely dive in this time and replace my Windows desktop. Appears this M1 issue is throwing a hitch in those plans and not only is not easy to acquire a new intel based MacBook, I am not sure I have cared for the heat issues they had.

 

[x600]

Okay, got my 16'' M1 Max. Top spec, 4TB SSD.

Windows 11, latest. Visual Studio 2022, .net core 6 web project, fairly small (nothing crazy i'd say).

VERY SLUGGISH. Comparing side-by-side with 16'' top spec, i9... every action is approximately 20-30% slower. I mean they both launch Egde in debug mode in pretty much the same time, but then M1 Max turns into a slide show really.

It feels as if you are working on a (very) remote machine with a huge latency. F10 -> 0.5s delay -> F10 -> 0.5s delay etc. i9 is instant in comparison.

SQL server: installed docker (under macos). Didn't start. Not sure why.
Azure Data Studio: works pretty well, although a bit laggy.

Noticeably heavier and bulkier. Nice screen, nice keyboard. Very good battery life. But huge pain if you are debugging.

I don't recommend it for serious dev. Sorry folks.


NEXT STEPS: VS2022 on MacOS side. Last hope, although i think i'm staying with i9 for now.

 

[alien3dx]

Okay, got my 16'' M1 Max. Top spec, 4TB SSD.

Windows 11, latest. Visual Studio 2022, .net core 6 web project, fairly small (nothing crazy i'd say).

VERY SLUGGISH. Comparing side-by-side with 16'' top spec, i9... every action is approximately 20-30% slower. I mean they both launch Egde in debug mode in pretty much the same time, but then M1 Max turns into a slide show really.

It feels as if you are working on a (very) remote machine with a huge latency. F10 -> 0.5s delay -> F10 -> 0.5s delay etc. i9 is instant in comparison.

SQL server: installed docker (under macos). Didn't start. Not sure why.
Azure Data Studio: works pretty well, although a bit laggy.

Noticeably heavier and bulkier. Nice screen, nice keyboard. Very good battery life. But huge pain if you are debugging.

I don't recommend it for serious dev. Sorry folks.


NEXT STEPS: VS2022 on MacOS side. Last hope, although i think i'm staying with i9 for now.

i'm staying on imac 2017 for development visual studio .net core 6.

Azure data studio - a bit annoy for me. i prefer sql server management studio if existed in Mac.
** sql server in macos normal can start but i don't want to test in my m1 . default 8 gb ram .
You can used visual studio code and run manually dotnet core watch or using rider .
** my windows in intel.using 4 GB ram lol .

 

[RDelgado]

Glad I held off. Thanks for the feedback, it really did help me.

 

[x600]

I think when vs 2022 is out (for mac with full arm support) it will be easier to move over as I really hope vs 2022 for windows 11arm will be released as well

 

[Conutz]

I’m waiting for my 14” to arrive and I have a Parallels license ready (on Intel I use Fusion). I don’t use VS, rather Delphi, plus SQL Server, Keil, some ST-Micro, Digi and Microchip tools. Looking forward to seeing how things will work…

 

[uratic]

Are the performance issues due to the x86 emulation of Windows ARM? Also did somebody try UTM (QEMU) yet?

 

[poorcody]

I used Visual Studio under Parallels daily on my Intel MacBook Pro. In anticipation of switching to the M1, I decided to take a different route: I set up a desktop Windows PC, and remote into it. I have been very pleased with it -- to such an extent I stopped using Parallels even though I'm still on Intel.

I use Microsoft Remote Desktop client, and when I'm in the office it feels native. Remotely on a high-speed connection I might detect a slight lag if I'm looking for it. I tried cellular-hot-spotting with a 5 Megabit/1 Megabit connection, and while that shows lag, it is still quite useable.

Remote Desktop works great too: multiple screens, folder sharing, clipboard sharing, retina screen support. I also get the advantage of native computer speed, much longer battery life, more RAM availability on both the desktop and laptop, no fans running, Windows-updates don't require Parallels to be open, and finally get to use a Nvidia GPU again. I can even remotely turn it on with Wake On Lan through my router.

Obviously you spend more money on a second computer, but you could also repurpose your Intel Mac with Windows when upgrading to M1.

 

[bobcomer]

I use Microsoft Remote Desktop client, and when I'm in the office it feels native. Remotely on a high-speed connection I might detect a slight lag if I'm looking for it. I tried cellular-hot-spotting with a 5 Megabit/1 Megabit connection, and while that shows lag, it is still quite useable.

You might want to try "Jump Desktop". It's a paid for app, but it's a more versatile. I like it better anyway.

 

[poorcody]

You might want to try "Jump Desktop". It's a paid for app, but it's a more versatile. I like it better anyway.

Yeah, thanks, I did look at a couple of similar apps. Do you notice much difference between an RDP connection and the "fluid" protocol? So far I'm happy with MS-RDP so I think I will keep things simple, but I may try one of those at some point...

 

[bobcomer]

Yeah, thanks, I did look at a couple of similar apps. Do you notice much difference between an RDP connection and the "fluid" protocol? So far I'm happy with RDP so I think I will keep things simple, but I may try one of those at some point...

I just use RDP and VNC with Jump.

 

[haralds]

Yes, I'm aware of VS for Mac but unfortunately, I still have some .net 4x apps

Has anyone successfully run VS2019 on m1

Yes and I have targeted X86 without issues.

 

[x600]

A week on a new machine. Well...

I feel it is a huge compromise at this point of time.

- Parallels + Windows ARM: still quite limited. Visual Studio is pretty slow. Not usable for serious work.
- Visual Studio Preview 4 native. Feeling like I got 2 fingers cut off. Performance is good, but every next important feature is "coming soon". Useless for now. Plus if you develop for windows servers, quite a lot of hassle to develop on Non-Windows platform for windows (paths, libraries etc). No, no, no.
- Remote Desktop: that's what i'm currently using now. It works really well, but I had to keep my old (well it is 6 months old) mac as my main machine which i'm remote desktopping from the new machine.

Is it worth it?

Don't know really. Except that i do not have to carry my laptop anymore (Intel sits permanently at the office, M1 - at home + Remote Desktop).

The good:

- Battery life is amazing (considering it is now just a terminal - no doubts it should be)
- Keyboard is amazing (yes, f&&k touch bar. Always hated it!)
- Screen is amazing. Blacks do make difference.
- Temperature/noise levels - huge win on the M1. Cool and silent. Nothing to add really.
- Adobe Photoshop, Lightroom, Video rendering is super fast.

The bad:

- Now i have to look after 2 laptops. One was meant to be sold, originally.
- M1 is heavy and ugly. Sorry Tim. It is.
- If i go on holidays and want to code (I often do so. I will have to carry my 2nd laptop with me). I really hope it will change soon and VS for Windows ARM will become as good as for x86 now. I don't believe VS for Mac will catch up any soon.
- 2nd copy of Parallels to buy as i still have hopes for Windows ARM.
- Lost Solidworks at home.

Check the latest video from Alex:

I think I mostly agree with him. This machine is not there yet for serious development. Intel MBP 16'' is still a winner for me.

 

[poorcody]

- If i go on holidays and want to code (I often do so. I will have to carry my 2nd laptop with me). I really hope it will change soon and VS for Windows ARM will become as good as for x86 now. I don't believe VS for Mac will catch up any soon.
- 2nd copy of Parallels to buy as i still have hopes for Windows ARM.

I may be misreading your setup, but it sounds like on the Intel Mac you are still running Windows under Parallels. If you instead install Windows ala Bootcamp, you will have better performance and only one OS to maintain and one less copy of Parallels to buy.

Also, why would you need to carry the 2nd laptop? You could remote into the main machine from anywhere, given a good Internet connection. I find even a cellular connection works for that.

 

[Internaut]

Deleted (realised I contributed way too late to add anything meaningful).

 

[bobcomer]

Also, why would you need to carry the 2nd laptop? You could remote into the main machine from anywhere, given a good Internet connection. I find even a cellular connection works for that.

Might I suggest you don't expose RDP to the internet, but instead put it behind a VPN or SSH connection. RDP is not one of the most secure protocols and is under constant attack by script kiddies, so it's slower than it should be. But given that constraint, it does indeed work well -- as long as your home internet stays up and you have a cellular data connection available where you are at. It's one of my redundant ways of getting things done.

There's also something like Splashtop that doesn't require a VPN, as the connection is hosted...

 

[poorcody]

Might I suggest you don't expose RDP to the internet, but instead put it behind a VPN or SSH connection. RDP is not one of the most secure protocols and is under constant attack by script kiddies, so it's slower than it should be.

Oh definitely. I found the simplest way to do that for my home network was to get an Asus router: it has a built in OpenVPN server that I RDP through. Performance is great. The router firmware also auto-updates and they seem to keep security updates for OpenVPN flowing.

The router also has integrated Wake On Lan support, so you can wake any PC on the network once you attach to the VPN. I can even wake my Windows PC from total shutdown.