Mac mini (2018) Intel UHD Graphics 630 :: Pros and Cons

[D.T.]

I had kind of hoped we'd get either: a mid-to-upper-range dGPU as an option (even if only BTO/direct) or an Apple designed eGPU.

Heck, for me, the eGPU wouldn't even need to be internally modular, i.e., just a Mini sized box with a fixed 580 or Vega 56 chipset, some nicely designed active cooling - looks great stacked, even looks decent next to a MBP (I could see some accessory makers designing a neat MBP + eGPU stand).

Don't get me wrong, I don't mind like the direction they went, with a roll-you-own GPU, I prefer that over some very mediocre dGPU, that introduced heat issues and where people wanting serious GPU performance still want external.
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Sonnet has an eGPU in a relatively compact chassis, which makes me think they are using MXM GPU cards within...

https://www.sonnettech.com/product/egfx-breakaway-puck.html

Neat, wow, the box + 8GB 580 is $429 (developers edition, I guess it's right at the power requirement for that card, so less options moving forward).

Just need that, and like two Mini cases, a dremel, some JB Weld ...

Oh, sorry, I was posting, reading and trying to review some code, that's the larger, full sized card option, which is great for a eGPU to just stick on your desk, but in the context of the "small footprint" options that are nearly Mini sized, it's the MXM based units (more money, less GPU), so I guess one of those is the 2 Mini case stacker project starting place ...

 

[Sustainerplayer]

Huh? I thought T2 is a "security chip" that handles encryption/decryptions? I doubt it will do any video encoding for you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple-designed_processors#Apple_T2

There is hvec-encoding on the T2 chip.

 

[pallymore]

There is hvec-encoding on the T2 chip.

But that has nothing to do with the T2 chip.
If it does I don't see why Apple is not slapping their badges on it.

HEVC is supported on various apple devices without the T2 chip.
Here's a helpful list: https://techidaily.com/which-macs-support-hevc/

This is what T2 does:

https://www.apple.com/mac/docs/Apple_T2_Security_Chip_Overview.pdf

And if you actually read their T2 chip whitepaper, it has zero mentioning about video decoding/encoding.

 

[Sustainerplayer]

But that has nothing to do with the T2 chip.
If it does I don't see why Apple is not slapping their badges on it.

HEVC is supported on various apple devices without the T2 chip.
Here's a helpful list: https://techidaily.com/which-macs-support-hevc/

This is what T2 does:

View attachment 800573

https://www.apple.com/mac/docs/Apple_T2_Security_Chip_Overview.pdf

And if you actually read their T2 chip whitepaper, it has zero mentioning about video decoding/encoding.

Maybe. It’s been mentioned in a lot of articles. But wouldn’t be the first time media got something wrong.

https://www.thestreet.com/opinion/apple-launches-new-ipad-pros-and-macs-14762648

https://www.ubergizmo.com/2018/10/mac-mini-2018-official/

 

[pallymore]

Maybe. It’s been mentioned in a lot of articles. But wouldn’t be the first time media got something wrong.

https://www.thestreet.com/opinion/apple-launches-new-ipad-pros-and-macs-14762648

https://www.ubergizmo.com/2018/10/mac-mini-2018-official/

I see.
https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2018/10/new-mac-mini-packs-huge-punch/

It seems Apple's own media release says the same thing. My mistake.

It's odd though it is not mentioned clearly in their product page :/

 

[MRrainer]

Most people buying a Mini don't give a hoot on the GPU.
They'd not have sold any of the 2014 models at all, because that iGPU was outdated already in late 2014.

The current one can apparently do 3x4K, which is really all I (and presumably a lot of others) care about.

 

[strawbale]

Most people buying a Mini don't give a hoot on the GPU.
They'd not have sold any of the 2014 models at all, because that iGPU was outdated already in late 2014.

The current one can apparently do 3x4K, which is really all I (and presumably a lot of others) care about.

True, but the weak iGPU means most likely you can only smoothly use native and default resolutions and therfore have to carefully choose your monitor size (24" for default, 32-40" for native?).

 

[ChrisChaval]

True, but the weak iGPU means most likely you can only smoothly use native and default resolutions and therfore have to carefully choose your monitor size (24" for default, 32-40" for native?).

screen size does not equal resolution

 

[strawbale]

screen size does not equal resolution

Wasn't what I was saying:
* 24" 4k without scaling (= native) => 183ppi which is way too tiny for icons etc => set at default (1:2) so that icons etc are four times as big (like 91ppi) but much crispier than a normal 1920x1080 screen
* 32-40" 4k without scaling is 138-110ppi which is fine (depending on your eyesight)

Any scaling setting other than 1:1 or 1:2 will be too demanding for this weak iGPU.

 

[ChrisChaval]

Wasn't what I was saying:
* 24" 4k without scaling (= native) => 183ppi which is way too tiny for icons etc => set at default (1:2) so that icons etc are four times as big (like 91ppi) but much crispier than a normal 1920x1080 screen
* 32-40" 4k without scaling is 138-110ppi which is fine (depending on your eyesight)

ah ok, sorry, did not read that

the ideal combination of resolution and screen size depends on your viewing distance.

so it really makes a difference if you wish to use the mini as a media server connected to a TV in your living room or as desktop replacement

In both scenarios your viewing distance would differ and, in consequence, so would your need for screen size and resolution

 

[strawbale]

ah ok, sorry, did not read that

the ideal combination of resolution and screen size depends on your viewing distance.

so it really makes a difference if you wish to use the mini as a media server connected to a TV in your living room or as desktop replacement

In both scenarios your viewing distance would differ and, in consequence, so would your need for screen size and resolution

I'm talking desktop use, as any resolution used in/for the living room (TV) is retina by default, i.e. too far away so see individual pixels.

 

[archer75]

There is hvec-encoding on the T2 chip.

I'd like to know if other programs can use this to speed up their encoding? Such as handbrake. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[Appleaker]

This is irrelevant due to eGPUs, which is Apples vision for high end graphics on the Mac mini.
Some people seem to be ignoring or dismissing eGPUs, however they enable desktop cards and upgradeability, so it actually becomes good value (obviously excluding the Blackmagic and other non-upgradeable eGPUs).

In reality, many of the users that need a good GPU would be doing this anyway as the graphics options they would be able to offer are sub-par and GPU technology advances quickly.

So this wasn't unexpected and isn't unjustified, however offering a variation with a dGPU would be good for customers that want everything contained within the Mac mini casing.

 

[Zarniwoop]

Huh? I thought T2 is a "security chip" that handles encryption/decryptions? I doubt it will do any video encoding for you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple-designed_processors#Apple_T2

Someone didn't watch the Apple event I see. Well, here's a fast-track for you:
https://www.apple.com/apple-events/october-2018/

Start at 29:20 and watch the following 20 seconds.

T2 is a multipurpose co-processor. It is a GPU for TouchBar in MBP, a DSP for Siri and an ISP for the webcam and some other things.

 

[th0masp]

So is this T2 chip something you might see commonly supported in thirdparty apps? Like - some multi-platform video editor, compositor or paint program where they add that functionality for the mac version (in most cases a lazy port from the main windows - or in the case of open source: linux - builds, I imagine).

 

[Chocomonsters]

This is irrelevant due to eGPUs, which is Apples vision for high end graphics on the Mac mini.
Some people seem to be ignoring or dismissing eGPUs, however they enable desktop cards and upgradeability, so it actually becomes good value (obviously excluding the Blackmagic and other non-upgradeable eGPUs).

In reality, many of the users that need a good GPU would be doing this anyway as the graphics options they would be able to offer are sub-par and GPU technology advances quickly.

So this wasn't unexpected and isn't unjustified, however offering a variation with a dGPU would be good for customers that want everything contained within the Mac mini casing.

Great thing about eGPU is that it can be near silent. PSU fan can be noisy but PSU can be easily upgraded. 80 Plus Platinum PSU fan will rarely ever kick in. eGPU case usually have an 80 or 120 mm fan. Silent fans like Noctua are very quiet. I have changed out PSU and fan in Akitio Node eGPU and it is nearly silent.

Any demanding video applications will run Mac Mini (with dGPU) fan to max speed/noise.

 

[sergioarista]

I'm looking at the 6 core model with 512 GB RAM. It all seems a very decent spec but I know nothing about the Intel UHD 630 graphics card and I'm wondering if it's too underpowered for my needs. I'm not editing big files but simple 4k videos of 5 - 15 minutes.. I know it can output to a 4k monitor but does anyone know if will be able to edit 4k video in Final Cut or Adobe Premiere Pro?

Also, if Apple are making a computer with a reasonable processor than why put a crap graphics card in it?

Yes, simply think of it as a 4/core MBP from 2107. I recomend you edit in FCPX since it really takes advantage of mac´s hardware, not that it is better, it just is more optimized so it renders much faster than Premiere.

 

[Neodym]

Yes, simply think of it as a 4/core MBP from 2107.

Hopefully Apple has a bit more oomph in their MBP by then! SCNR ;-D

 

[scrunchy]

Look at this comparison.

The perfomance of the UHD 630 will be comparable to that of the discrete GPU of the mid 2012 retina Macbook Pro.
I've used that for 6 years now. I've run Tomb Raider 2013, Pillars of Eternity decently.
iMovie encoding also was okay.

 

[StellarVixen]

I've run Tomb Raider 2013, Pillars of Eternity decently.
iMovie encoding also was okay.

Decently = ~ 20FPS@720p, amirite?

 

[scrunchy]

Decently = ~ 20FPS@720p, amirite?

Notrite

Pillars of Eternity played totally fine with maxed out settings.
Tomb Raider 2013 was 1080p and pretty smooth, certainly around 30 FPS.
Here's some evidence.

Would be ridiculous if a 2012 Macbook pro couldn't play games published less than a year later decently.
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There is hvec-encoding on the T2 chip.

Apparently the T2 Chip does make a difference for HEVC encoding http://austinmann.com/trek/macbook-pro-2018-review):

The test was simple: convert a 4K Mavic Pro video file to 1080p H.265 (HEVC) using QuickTime Player (File > Export As > 1080p > Check “Use HEVC”).
I have three different MacBook Pros, all on macOS 10.13.6, all running QuickTime 10.4, all with the original file on the internal drive and exporting to the internal drive. Here are the results:

• My daily MBP until I discovered these results: 2.3 GHz i7 MacBook Pro (15", Late 2013, 16 GB RAM, 1 TB SSD) = 1980 seconds (33 minutes)
• Top-of-line 2016 MBP: 2.9 GHz i7 MacBook Pro (15", 16 GB RAM, 1 TB SSD) = 99 seconds
• This top-of-line 2018 MBP: 2.9 GHz i9 MacBook Pro (15", 32 GB RAM, 4 TB SSD) = 24 seconds

 

[LancesUK]

I think lack of a discrete GPU in the Mac mini helps Apple achieve a price point and also has to do with the space and thermal limitations of the small case. The upcoming MacBook Pro with Vega graphics is going to have a much higher base price than the Mac mini and Apple considered what the most common uses for the Mac mini are when designing it. For music and server usage a discrete GPU makes no sense. With the addition of TB3, it also makes no sense to put a powerful GPU in the Mac mini since an eGPU can be easily added.

Exactly. For MUSIC (hey, we audio folks do exist), the dedicated graphics are an extra expense we can live without gladly. And, as stated several times before, an eGPU is always a possibility later on for those who can’t live without one.

I’m glad Apple chose desktop chips. Will make a difference for plugins and track count in large projects or higher sample rates.

 

[Chancha]

I agree that only having an iGPU sufficient for pushing basic external displays is an ideal choice. The mini has been used for numerous purposes with no need to anything graphically intense, or GPU accelerated compute. A dGPU is totally useless for a headless server for instance. Not having it saves cost for the buyer as well, and potentially a cooler machine with more TDP budget reserved for CPU.

 

[Bonte]

There should be a difference depending on the amount of RAM the Mini has, the more RAM the more the GPU will use.

Are there any benchmarks on that yet?

I'm looking to complement a late 2015 iMac but at it stands now the Mini would hardly get the same performance except for the faster SSD. I do mainly Photoshop work on a dual 4K monitor setup.

 

[xylitol]

I'm looking to complement a late 2015 iMac but at it stands now the Mini would hardly get the same performance except for the faster SSD. I do mainly Photoshop work on a dual 4K monitor setup.

Here's an interesting test that corroborates what some people in this thread already said:

https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Photoshop-CC-2018-NVIDIA-GeForce-vs-AMD-Radeon-Vega-1197/

(UHD 630 is the Coffee Lake version of HD 630, which is used in comparisons)