Mac mini: 4k @ 120hz?

[giggles]

The proof lies within the extensive amount of testing within this thread. Many of us have confirmed that our adapters work with thunderbolt ports on different computers. I even tested personally within windows on my intel iMac, yet macOS doesn't work on the same machine. Also, I think its confirmed that if you have a monitor with display port input, you can get 120hz to work.

Of course 120Hz or even 144Hz works via native DP.

And what do “different computers with thunderbolt” have to do with this.

You’re conflating a lot of different things.

On M1 Macs we cannot bootcamp to Windows and hence we have no proof that same hardware chain (GPU + video switcher + port controller) would allow those adapters to work, we have no definitive proof it’s being deliberately disabled via sw.

 

[kasakka]

Of course 120Hz or even 144Hz works via native DP.

Tell that to my 2019 16" Intel MBP. https://tonsky.me/blog/monitors-mac/ exists because support for high refresh rate 4K is a pile of crap on Macs.

Literally the same USB-C DP adapter will give me 4K 144 Hz with my PC but the same LCD display won't work at more than 4K 60 from my MBP. Meanwhile the LG OLEDs with any of the DP+DSC -> HDMI 2.1 adapters won't put out more than 4K 60 Hz.

On M1 Macs we cannot bootcamp to Windows and hence we have no proof that same hardware chain (GPU + video switcher + port controller) would allow those adapters to work, we have no definitive proof it’s being deliberately disabled via sw.

But on Intel MBPs we can and people have tested that the hardware itself is capable, MacOS isn't because of Apple's problems with software implementation. There's oh, 24 pages on this.

With Apple now having HDMI 2.1 ports on their Macs, we are hoping that this also as a side effect allows those DP adapters to work as the OS support for HDMI 2.1 should be there. I would not be surprised if they don't though.

 

[Mizouse]

I’m hoping my 2018 i7 Mini will somehow support this. I picked up a 42” LG C2 OLED and would love to be able to run it at 4K 120hz.

That’s one thing I miss when I replaced my 1440pp 144hz monitor. Animations and 24fps content look better to my eyes at 120hz.

My 2018 Mini does everything else I need and would hate to upgrade just to get an HDMI 2.1 port.

 

[centracore]

Has anyone had a chance to test 13.2 RC to see if it now works?

 

[PatricioooAG]

Hi, I want 1080 hidpi 100hz, with 13.2 RC usb-c to hdmi 2.1 cable, I can with Swichresx 1080p hidpi 100hz 4.4.4 10b but scaled, before 13.2 RC it was impossible. But 4k 120hz with MacMini M1 and a oled C2 and other LG TV 2019 isn't possible.

 

[zamzam1235]

Hi, I want 1080 hidpi 100hz, with 13.2 RC usb-c to hdmi 2.1 cable, I can with Swichresx 1080p hidpi 100hz 4.4.4 10b but scaled, before 13.2 RC it was impossible. But 4k 120hz with MacMini M1 and a oled C2 and other LG TV 2019 isn't possible.

Wait!! So 1080p HiDpi is 4k normal resolution . That means you are able to do 4k/100Hz/444/10bit. HDR? What about HDR?

if you can do 4k/100Hz , then why not 4k/120Hz.

May be try with EDID override using better display tool.

 

[Toss4]

Has anyone had a chance to test 13.2 RC to see if it now works?

Installing it now! Will report back.

EDIT: No luck. Not seeing 1920x1080@120Hz either.

 

[PatricioooAG]

Wait!! So 1080p HiDpi is 4k normal resolution . That means you are able to do 4k/100Hz/444/10bit. HDR? What about HDR?

if you can do 4k/100Hz , then why not 4k/120Hz.

May be try with EDID override using better display tool.

Yes 120hz hidpi its possible. I don't understand Better display too much. Im to ask google.

 

[jwahaus]

Looks like the new M2 Pro Mini will be able to drive a 4K monitor up to 240Hz. The max refresh rate slows down, however, if you're using more than one monitor.

 

[Toss4]

Yes 120hz hidpi its possible. I don't understand Better display too much. Im to ask google.

View attachment 2144570

If you pick that option though it doesn't work. The result is the same as "1920x1080" without HiDPI.

 

[N0ne1eft]

Just upgraded to macOS 13.2 RC, M1 Pro + LG C2 42" here, still doesn't do 3840x2160@120 but a new HiDPI 2k@120 just been added which is not present in 13.1 with club3d USB-C DP1.4 DSC to HDMI 2.1 adapter

mode 237: res:2560x1440 hz:120 color_depth:7 scalingn <-- current mode

weirdly it doesn't look like crisp native 4K but slightly better than 2K without HiDPI enabled, can't figure out what the actual resolution it is pushing. Anyone knows how to see actual resolution on macOS?

==========================
UPDATE: It looks like it is still 2K, because the new 2K HiDPI can be enabled with built in HDMI port and an HDMi2.0 cable, it's just that text rendering changed a little bit.

 

[zamzam1235]

@N0ne1eft​

What does the LG OLED TV says when you press the green button 4 times.

Are you getting 4k/120hz/ycbcr444?

 

[Zorast]

Yes also 4k HiDPI is possible on a native 4k Screen. But only over BetterDisplay

 

[N0ne1eft]

@N0ne1eft​

What does the LG OLED TV says when you press the green button 4 times.

Are you getting 4k/120hz/ycbcr444?

No, the best I can get is 3840x2160P@60 YCBCR422 8b 4L6 over club3d DP1.4 to HDMI2.1. Still seems like Apple software limited it

 

[PatricioooAG]

If you pick that option though it doesn't work. The result is the same as "1920x1080" without HiDPI.

It isn't the same, now are 10b 4.4.4 SDR and how say N0ne1eft the text and pictures are most clear, and its true is working in HDMI and USB.C same time. The thing is what are Hidpi scaled, I don't understand the Swichresx help. For me now is perfect, maybe 4k are the way, but for now enough.

 

[N0ne1eft]

My observation is the new 2k HiDPI@120 option renders graphics at HiDPI (potentially 5120*2880 at 2x) but still output downsampled 2K actual resolution to LG TV. Therefore although the text rendering is slightly different than 2K NoHiDPI@120 it is still 2K blurred. Only the 2K HiDPI@60 output real 4K resolution.

I guess I will just use 2K HiDPI@60 + LG TruMotion frame interpolation for some fake smooth scrolling and clear visuals. Given that they added hardware HDMI2.1 to new M2P/M MBPs I don't think it's likely Apple is gonna update M1s.

 

[kasakka]

My observation is the new 2k HiDPI@120 option renders graphics at HiDPI (potentially 5120*2880 at 2x) but still output downsampled 2K actual resolution to LG TV. Therefore although the text rendering is slightly different than 2K NoHiDPI@120 it is still 2K blurred. Only the 2K HiDPI@60 output real 4K resolution.

I guess I will just use 2K HiDPI@60 + LG TruMotion frame interpolation for some fake smooth scrolling and clear visuals. Given that they added hardware HDMI2.1 to new M2P/M MBPs I don't think it's likely Apple is gonna update M1s.

Please do not use the term 2K. Just say 1080p and 1440p because otherwise it's confusing. 2K = 1080p. I guess you mean 2560x1440 here since you talk about 5120x2880.

Frame interpolation adds so much input lag that it would feel awful to use.

 

[Malus120]

So as we approach the release of the new M2 Pro/Max Macs, could someone who is getting an M2 Pro Mac Mini or M2 Pro/Max MBP please share their macOS build number?
(Click on the Apple in the Menu Bar -> About this Mac -> Click on macOS Ventura 13.2 to get the actual build number -> for example mine is 13.1 (22C65) )
I'd like to see if it's running/will run the same build as the RC/release version of 13.2.
This wouldn't be the first time a new Mac is running a slightly different build than other Macs nominally on the same OS version and could be relevant to the discussion.

 

[zamzam1235]

Shipping starts from jan 24th. So i doubt anyone got the new M2 minis/MBPs.

In any case , we have to wait till 13.3 Beta/RC atleast to see on which devices hdmi 2.1 is enabled and will it work with adapters.

 

[Malus120]

Shipping starts from jan 24th. So i doubt anyone got the new M2 minis/MBPs.

In any case , we have to wait till 13.3 Beta/RC atleast to see on which devices hdmi 2.1 is enabled and will it work with adapters.

Right, I was just putting this here in advance as the new machines should be available in ~32 hours for those in Australia/New Zealand/East Asia.
I imagine the new machines will ship with a different build of (the upcoming) 13.2 that properly supports HDMI 2.1 (vs the current builds in which it doesn't appear to work.)

 

[Pressure]

So as we approach the release of the new M2 Pro/Max Macs, could someone who is getting an M2 Pro Mac Mini or M2 Pro/Max MBP please share their macOS build number?
(Click on the Apple in the Menu Bar -> About this Mac -> Click on macOS Ventura 13.2 to get the actual build number -> for example mine is 13.1 (22C65) )
I'd like to see if it's running/will run the same build as the RC/release version of 13.2.
This wouldn't be the first time a new Mac is running a slightly different build than other Macs nominally on the same OS version and could be relevant to the discussion.

All uploaded benchmarks show macOS 13.2 (Build 22D49).

 

[zamzam1235]

So the actual reviews are out and people have tested the hdmi 2.1 with their TV and monitors.

You can check out youtube. tons of videos on the M2 macbooks.

Now macOS 13.2 should have support for hdmi 2.1 and if the adapters are not working on the older M1 models , that means apple deliberately is limiting that port. Why? i have no idea. even though M1 is capable of hdm2.1. Prolly something else in the hardware is the limiting factor.

However , if anyone has any success with 13.2 do post.

I think hdmi 2.1 ONLY works on the high end M2 mac mini and M2 macbooks pros. I hope someone proves me wrong.

Also , 13.2 final public release is out.

if 13.2 don't support hdmi 2.1 for adapters and e-gpu users , we are ****ed.

 

[yukkerz]

So the actual reviews are out and people have tested the hdmi 2.1 with their TV and monitors.

You can check out youtube. tons of videos on the M2 macbooks.

Now macOS 13.2 should have support for hdmi 2.1 and if the adapters are not working on the older M1 models , that means apple deliberately is limiting that port. Why? i have no idea. even though M1 is capable of hdm2.1. Prolly something else in the hardware is the limiting factor.

However , if anyone has any success with 13.2 do post.

I think hdmi 2.1 ONLY works on the high end M2 mac mini and M2 macbooks pros. I hope someone proves me wrong.

Also , 13.2 final public release is out.

if 13.2 don't support hdmi 2.1 for adapters and e-gpu users , we are ****ed.

I just updated my macbook air m2 to 13.2 and tried with no luck. I am using a thunderbolt 4 dock with hdmi 2.1 to my lg c1 and still only see 60hz on 4k.

HyperDrive Thunderbolt 4 Docking Station (2 Downstream Ports) | Hypershop

The Thunderbolt 4 Dock is perfect for enterprises, gamers, and video editors, offering two 40Gbps Thunderbolt 4 ports and one 96W Power Delivery port for top-tier connectivity.

www.hypershop.com

The dock I use.

 

[zamzam1235]

I just updated my macbook air m2 to 13.2 and tried with no luck. I am using a thunderbolt 4 dock with hdmi 2.1 to my lg c1 and still only see 60hz on 4k.

HyperDrive Thunderbolt 4 Docking Station (2 Downstream Ports) | Hypershop

The Thunderbolt 4 Dock is perfect for enterprises, gamers, and video editors, offering two 40Gbps Thunderbolt 4 ports and one 96W Power Delivery port for top-tier connectivity.

www.hypershop.com

The dock I use.

Yep, looks like adapters wont work on older m1s.

if you want 4k/120/444/hdr , only 2 options - m2 mac mini and m2 macbook pro.

I don't think adapters are going to work as we expected.

I believe this is because on older models the signal is going via the DP 1.4 which cannot do 4k/120/444.

But atleast two apple products support hdmi 2.1. which is a good start.

if you want 4k/120/444 , you will have to upgrade to the M2.

 

[yukkerz]

Yep, looks like adapters wont work on older m1s.

if you want 4k/120/444/hdr , only 2 options - m2 mac mini and m2 macbook pro.

I don't think adapters are going to work as we expected.

I believe this is because on older models the signal is going via the DP 1.4 which cannot do 4k/120/444.

But atleast two apple products support hdmi 2.1. which is a good start.

if you want 4k/120/444 , you will have to upgrade to the M2.

But I have an M2. I am guessing you mean only the pro and the max m2?