Mac Pro Release

[kfscoll]

Because there is an unresolved problem somewhere. It may be at Apple or it may be with a supplier. In any case Apple does not have a reliable estimate of when that problem will be resolved. If they did have a good estimate they could set and announce a date with a reasonable expectation of meeting it. I can not imagine a reason why failing to set a date would be to Apple's advantage so I must assume this condition is imposed on them.

You come to these conclusions based on the fact that Apple hasn't said anything more about the nMP's release? Wow. The fact that Apple announced as much as they have about the nMP is virtually unprecedented. The fact they haven't said more isn't indicative of anything. Many, if not all, of their new product releases go like this. We won't hear any more from them about it until the nMP can be ordered.

Their website still says "Coming in December." There's no reason to think that's changed. I could see certain configurations being delayed if there's a CPU shortage, but I think it's also just as likely that Apple's is first in line to get the chips -- which has happened before. I bet at a minimum the quad- and hex-core configurations will ship this month.

 

[Rich.Cohen]

You come to these conclusions based on the fact that Apple hasn't said anything more about the nMP's release?

Their website still says "Coming in December." ... I bet at a minimum the quad- and hex-core configurations will ship this month.

I drew that conclusion when they announced December in October. I can think of no business reason to release it in December if it was at all possible to release it in November. That says production problem to me. I don't believe there original intent was to release it this late in the year.

I don't have any inside knowledge, but I've been working with computers for about 50 years. I remember when IBM used to play FUD games with prerelease announcements, but I don't think Apple is doing that here. I think we are seeing the result of some unexpected problems.

I hope you win your bet. I'd like to buy one with out of this year's profit. On the other hand, I may decide to wait for a 8-core model.

 

[deconstruct60]

Apple really blew it by announcing nMP in June with "Coming This Fall". Then…"coming in December"….then…TBD.

Not sure why you can't see the progression that is consistent.

It is coming in 2013
It is coming in the Fall (and by the way we're cancelling this current form factor)
It is coming in December.

None of those are in conflict (the bulk of December is still Fall). It is just incrementally more precise. About 5-7 days before the launch they'll put a date on it.

It is different from their usual approach but a year and a half countdown is a bit of a counterbalance to putting out a very limited 2012 update, withdrawing from EU markets early 2013, and then waiting for technology that wasn't going to go into volume production until very close to the beginning of 2014. For various reasons they backed themselves into a corner on this product with choices made and not made in 2010-2011.

 

[kfscoll]

I drew that conclusion when they announced December in October. I can think of no business reason to release it in December if it was at all possible to release it in November. That says production problem to me. I don't believe there original intent was to release it this late in the year.

I don't have any inside knowledge, but I've been working with computers for about 50 years. I remember when IBM used to play FUD games with prerelease announcements, but I don't think Apple is doing that here. I think we are seeing the result of some unexpected problems.

I hope you win your bet. I'd like to buy one with out of this year's profit. On the other hand, I may decide to wait for a 8-core model.

Gotcha. I interpreted your posts as saying it'd be delayed past December. You're saying it was delayed until December. I agree -- it seems like if Apple could've released it in November (or sooner), they would've.

 

[deconstruct60]

I don't believe there original intent was to release it this late in the year.

If that was an intent they shouldn't have coupled it to Thunderbolt v2. Intel has said for a long while that TB v2 was a 2014 era technology. They are doing limited roll out in end of 2013 but limited supply inhibiting manufacturing was a very real possibility for all of 2012 and most of 2013.

Very similar issue with trying to couple to E5 v2. In 2012 E5 v1 released in early March but didn't hit volume distribution for a broad set of system vendors till late May.

Apple not giving premature exact date is normal Apple procedure. There is nothing indicative one way or the other about that. Once they bet on the above two horses though it had to be a date range that was the objective, not some specific month or week.

 

[Tanax]

im calling dec 24th or dec 25th....

That'd be a major loss for Apple since most people are busy celebrating Christmas then, being with their families and stuff making them not able to check their computer so often.

Either they'll announce it just before Christmas or just after it.

 

[AidenShaw]

That'd be a major loss for Apple since most people are busy celebrating Christmas then, being with their families and stuff making them not able to check their computer so often.

Either they'll announce it just before Christmas or just after it.

*Anything* about the Mac Mini Pro will have an inconsequential effect on the financials of Apple. Raging success or dismal failure won't change the bottom line.

It's all about IOS now, Apple OSX is a footnote.

 

[spaz8]

I think the Quad and Hex will ship this month maybe even 2 weeks from now. The 8 and 12 core will be able to be ordered at that time, but will ship in January or Feb 2014. Based on the fact I have only seen other vendors with the 1620,1650 and 1660 chips. I see the 2697 out there, but have a personal hunch that the nMP version will not be off the shelf.

Which is fine with me, I'd rather have the 2014 tax write off.

TB2 I've seen on a recent boxx workstation with an i7 in it , I think TB2 and 8 and 12 core (perhaps custom E5 1697 v2, not 2697) are in short supply. Has anyone seen the E5 1680 v2 in a PC system?

 

[iBug2]

*Anything* about the Mac Mini Pro will have an inconsequential effect on the financials of Apple. Raging success or dismal failure won't change the bottom line.

It's all about IOS now, Apple OSX is a footnote.

This is of course false. Macs still make up for 20% of Apple's revenue. 20% is not a footnote. 1% might be a footnote.

But Mac Pro is a footnote indeed.

 

[JavaTheHut]

20% = BIG footnote

 

[Lesser Evets]

This is of course false. Macs still make up for 20% of Apple's revenue. 20% is not a footnote. 1% might be a footnote.

But Mac Pro is a footnote indeed.

20%, even 5%, is a HUGE slice of revenue for any company.

If a person is a neophyte to business, he assumes a consumerist stance and believes 5% can be lost quite happily. The true motive of any business that intends to last is that it must grow across the board (or accrue losses temporarily in order to foster future profits), unless some segment of it has become a burden of loss. 20% is not a loss. 5% is not a loss. 1% is not a loss. The Macs are not losses--only busidiots would let go of any earnings because they have a larger revenue in one sector they value more. And, yeah, there are a lot of idiot businesses that have done that.

Macs aren't dead--mini to pro. In future they will be, but that's a decade or more away.

 

[Cubemmal]

It's all about IOS now, Apple OSX is a footnote.

iOS as an ecosystem only exists because of OS X - how do you think all those apps are developed? I can see it now, Xcode for Windows! Except that you can't develop .NET apps with it, win-win!

OS X is an important development environment, when I go to hackathons by far the most common computer is a MBP.

 

[iBug2]

20%, even 5%, is a HUGE slice of revenue for any company.

If a person is a neophyte to business, he assumes a consumerist stance and believes 5% can be lost quite happily. The true motive of any business that intends to last is that it must grow across the board (or accrue losses temporarily in order to foster future profits), unless some segment of it has become a burden of loss. 20% is not a loss. 5% is not a loss. 1% is not a loss. The Macs are not losses--only busidiots would let go of any earnings because they have a larger revenue in one sector they value more. And, yeah, there are a lot of idiot businesses that have done that.

Macs aren't dead--mini to pro. In future they will be, but that's a decade or more away.

Couldn't have said it better.

 

[hudson1]

Many companies use fiscal years that don't coincide with the calendar year - so their "end of year" purchasing doesn't happen in December. Often they'll have quarterly budgets as well, however, so there's some pressure to deplete the quarterly budget in March, June, September and December. (HP's fiscal year isn't aligned with the quarters - their year is August-July.)

Companies also differ in when expenses are booked. My big company does not book expenses when the *order* is made, but instead when the *delivery* is made. If they don't arrive by 31 December, they aren't booked this quarter. (Maybe you realize this, since you said "invoices" and usually the "invoice" comes after the product is shipped.)

Most companies will capitalize computer hardware expenses (I think that's US tax law) so order/invoice/delivery dates aren't all that critical anyway.

 

[iBug2]

Actually, Dell has

    T3610
         E5-1607v2 quad, 3.0GHz 4 Dec 2013
         E5-1620v2 quad, 3.7GHz 4 Dec 2013
    T5610
         E5-2620v2 hex, 2.1GHz 12 Dec 2013
         E5-2609v2 quad, 2.5GHz 12 Dec 2013
    T7610
         E5-2620v2 hex, 2.1GHz 12 Dec 2013
         E5-2630v2 hex, 2.6GHz 12 Dec 2013

No sign of octo, deca or dodeca in the workstations, although servers list a lot more

4 - 6 Core 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2640 2.50GHz, 15M Cache, 7.2GT/s QPI, Turbo, 6C, 95W, Max Mem 1333MHz [Included in Price] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2637 3.00GHz, 5M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, 2C, 80W, Max Mem 1600MHz add $0.00 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2643 3.30GHz, 10M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, 4C, 130W, Max Mem 1600MHz add $0.00 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2667 2.90GHz, 15M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, 6C, 130W, Max Mem 1600MHz [add $628.64] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2637 v2 3.50GHz, 15M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 4C, 130W, Max Mem 1866MHz [add $164.65] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2643 v2 3.50GHz, 25M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 6C, 130W, Max Mem 1866MHz [add $718.45] 
 
8 core 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2650 2.00GHz, 20M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, 8C, 95W, Max Mem 1600MHz [add $194.58]
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2660 2.20GHz, 20M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, 8C, 95W, Max Mem 1600MHz [add $404.13] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2665 2.40GHz, 20M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, 8C, 115W, Max Mem 1600MHz [add $538.84] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2670 2.60GHz, 20M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, 8C, 115W, Max Mem 1600MHz [add $628.64] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2680 2.70GHz, 20M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, 8C, 130W, Max Mem 1600MHz [add $800.77] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2690 2.90GHz, 20M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, 8C, 135W, Max Mem 1600MHz [add $1,130.06] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2667 v2 3.30GHz, 25M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 8C, 130W, Max Mem 1866MHz [add $1,145.03] 
 
10+ core 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2650L v2 1.70GHz, 25M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 10C, 70W, Max Mem 1600MHz [add $291.87] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2660 v2 2.20GHz, 25M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 10C, 95W, Max Mem 1866MHz [add $404.13] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2670 v2 2.50GHz, 25M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 10C, 115W, Max Mem 1866MHz [add $628.64] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2680 v2 2.80GHz, 25M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 10C, 115W, Max Mem 1866MHz [add $823.22] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2690 v2 3.00GHz, 25M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 10C, 130W, Max Mem 1866MHz [add $1,152.51] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2695 v2 2.40GHz, 30M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 12C, 115W, Max Mem 1866MHz [add $1,451.87] 
   Intel® Xeon® E5-2697 v2 2.70GHz, 30M Cache, 8.0GT/s QPI, Turbo, HT, 12C, 130W, Max Mem 1866MHz [add $1,788.64]

I meant one processor among Apple's offerings. Anyway, seems like the octo and the dodeca are missing from Dell as well hence the delay doesn't seem to be about Apple.

----------

Most companies will capitalize computer hardware expenses (I think that's US tax law) so order/invoice/delivery dates aren't all that critical anyway.

In my country it's simple. You write up an expense and you get the tax back in 3 years. If I write it off before december 31st I'll get it in 3 equal pieces in 2014, 15 and 16. If I write it off on January 1st, I'll get it in 15 16 and 17.

And it's the same money I'm getting, so getting it a year before is really important due to currency devaluation here. If they actually paid the dollar value back it wouldn't matter that much. December is the purchase month for everyone here due to that. People are buying all sorts of stuff for their office even if they don't need it right away. We are buying chairs even.

 

[AidenShaw]

Most companies will capitalize computer hardware expenses (I think that's US tax law) so order/invoice/delivery dates aren't all that critical anyway.

My company (+20k employees) expenses personal systems (laptops, desktops, workstations) and capitalizes servers, big storage and big network.