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Mac Pro vs. Hackintosh
- Thread starter adddictedtomac
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I built a 2.8ghz Core 2 Duo tower for my younger brother three or four years ago for a measly $350 and it runs like a champ to this day. It's running Lion quite well and he recently put a Radeon 6850 in it. He plays WoW, Diablo III, Starcraft II, and several other games on it all the time and gets great framerates running at 1920x1080.
My next desktop "Mac" will almost certainly be a hackintosh tower. My 2009 27" quad i5 iMac has been great, but I need expandability - I currently have four HDs in USB enclosures hooked up and my Radeon 4850 is feeling rather ancient pushing 2560x1440 - and I just can't justify dropping $2500 on a Mac Pro when the top-end iMac provides better value.
I tried speccing out my hypothetical hackintosh tower on Newegg, basing the machine around an i5 2500k. The result? I had to try really, really hard to push the build's cost over $1200, and that's even when using nicer, more expensive parts like an Intel SSD, a Corsair/SeaSonic 600W modular PSU, a great graphics card, and a $100+ case. It'd perform just as well or better than the Mac Pro in all the tasks I'll use it for, too (Photoshop/Illustrator, Obj-C programming, 3D rendering, and more).
Considering it's less than half the cost, the invested time is completely worth it.
My next desktop "Mac" will almost certainly be a hackintosh tower. My 2009 27" quad i5 iMac has been great, but I need expandability - I currently have four HDs in USB enclosures hooked up and my Radeon 4850 is feeling rather ancient pushing 2560x1440 - and I just can't justify dropping $2500 on a Mac Pro when the top-end iMac provides better value.
I tried speccing out my hypothetical hackintosh tower on Newegg, basing the machine around an i5 2500k. The result? I had to try really, really hard to push the build's cost over $1200, and that's even when using nicer, more expensive parts like an Intel SSD, a Corsair/SeaSonic 600W modular PSU, a great graphics card, and a $100+ case. It'd perform just as well or better than the Mac Pro in all the tasks I'll use it for, too (Photoshop/Illustrator, Obj-C programming, 3D rendering, and more).
Considering it's less than half the cost, the invested time is completely worth it.
Hi Cindori,
Very Clean build !!! I like it. you ought to enter it here for MacMod of the Month:
http://www.insanelymac.com/forum/index.php?showforum=295
I think you would win... Anyway, I hope you'll enter it, later...
I'm going to create a thread zombie..
I have a $1900 budget I have/had every intent on buying a a baseline MP then I prices the equivalent (as in $1900) Hackintosh. I'm back no not being firmly decided. Here is the Hack spec's
Keep in mind I have a tower, fans, PS, and H100 still..
the MOBO has WiFi and BT Built in and takes 64GB RAM which I have included in the price
Wisdom of the MP forum?
I have a $1900 budget I have/had every intent on buying a a baseline MP then I prices the equivalent (as in $1900) Hackintosh. I'm back no not being firmly decided. Here is the Hack spec's
Keep in mind I have a tower, fans, PS, and H100 still..
the MOBO has WiFi and BT Built in and takes 64GB RAM which I have included in the price
Wisdom of the MP forum?
Attachments
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I don't think sleep or SpeedStep works on x79 motherboards yet. Might be wrong, last time I looked into it was a few months ago. Also the WiFi card may not work with OSX which is somewhat picky (usually require Broadcom based). Unless you really need the power you should consider a Ivy Bridge setup with a Z77 motherboard instead.
SS doesn't work but supposedly the WiFi does...
I'm more interested in socket 2011 than 1155 or 1150 at Haswell.
I really don't know why I do this to myself that little 'puter could probably get near 30k on geekbench and there is something appealing to that
Mac Pro 2012 is not worth it
This is a silly statement... I have seen firsthand how terrible Alienware can be, and I have furthermore never had a better PC than the one I custom built for under 700 dollars years ago.
I now own a Mac Pro 12 core, and I can tell you compared to that custom PC it has had a WEALTH of problems. It never wakes up from sleep mode if you attempt to wake it while it is "panting" (this "panting" takes place often in sleep mode for no reason as far as I can tell.)
Furthermore, it freezes (not completely like Windows 95, but enough to delay your task for a good 30 seconds to 2 minutes) often without much reason - No, I do not have time machine on. I say this knowing it's not my hard drive or ram as my work computer happens to be the EXACT same computer with entirely different internal hard drives and ram (mine has a brand new seagate hybrid - 16 gigs of ram @ 2gb each, and the one at work has 32 gigs of ram @ 16gb each with a stock boot drive from Apple.)
It's interesting that someone stated that it's illegal to Hackintosh a computer as I have heard firmly that this is a gray area under much debate. Does anyone have proof that this has been altered and clarified by Apple? I ask because I truly do not have ANY interest in buying another over-priced Apple tower. The laptops (non-retina matte - glossy screens are terrible) are still the best out there (well, I love the 2012 Razor Blade, but it's 17 inch and I want 15 inch for portability) but the towers are not a practical or intelligent purchase at this time (especially since they don't have eSATA, USB 3.0 or Thunderbolt - you can add on eSATA or USB3.0, mind you, but they only work for specific devices.)
This is a silly statement... I have seen firsthand how terrible Alienware can be, and I have furthermore never had a better PC than the one I custom built for under 700 dollars years ago.
I now own a Mac Pro 12 core, and I can tell you compared to that custom PC it has had a WEALTH of problems. It never wakes up from sleep mode if you attempt to wake it while it is "panting" (this "panting" takes place often in sleep mode for no reason as far as I can tell.)
Furthermore, it freezes (not completely like Windows 95, but enough to delay your task for a good 30 seconds to 2 minutes) often without much reason - No, I do not have time machine on. I say this knowing it's not my hard drive or ram as my work computer happens to be the EXACT same computer with entirely different internal hard drives and ram (mine has a brand new seagate hybrid - 16 gigs of ram @ 2gb each, and the one at work has 32 gigs of ram @ 16gb each with a stock boot drive from Apple.)
It's interesting that someone stated that it's illegal to Hackintosh a computer as I have heard firmly that this is a gray area under much debate. Does anyone have proof that this has been altered and clarified by Apple? I ask because I truly do not have ANY interest in buying another over-priced Apple tower. The laptops (non-retina matte - glossy screens are terrible) are still the best out there (well, I love the 2012 Razor Blade, but it's 17 inch and I want 15 inch for portability) but the towers are not a practical or intelligent purchase at this time (especially since they don't have eSATA, USB 3.0 or Thunderbolt - you can add on eSATA or USB3.0, mind you, but they only work for specific devices.)
Well the ONLY time that I've seen anyone get busted was this company:
http://www.insanelymac.com/_/osx86/apple-fails-to-keep-trade-secrets-fro-r942
Now that I can totally see being just wrong; mass producing a system to sell for profit. But so far (that I know of) no one has been busted for individually installing and using Mac OS X on a PC built system for their own personal use. Especially the ones that publicly show you how to do it here on youtube:
(Even a product review show, explains how to do it)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmJ2vPILxKw&feature=related
(Mike at Insanely Great Mac put out a nice vid)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGL-fZWq8h0
(Graphically, this was a nicely produced vid)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiAw0esxc_o&feature=rellist&playnext=1&list=PL535AAA16E82A5812
(This one too, was nicely done)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jc0viyfsRqU
(Sound quality was weak, but again, you get the point)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkQXD-U9rqE&feature=related
or you can go here to see the myriad of other youtube vids that show you how they did it:
http://www.youtube.com/results?sear...0.127.768.11j1.12.0...0.0...1ac.1._Lh_IEp1bkQ
We can go back and forth with all the debates of how "wrong" it is and how we're breaking the EULA laws and whatnot, but when it comes right down to it, you purchased it and as long as you're using it for your own personal use and you're not selling these PC built machines with Mac OS X installed in it to make profit from it, they haven't made an issue about it. Why? Because I believe their main focus isn't the Mac Pro community anymore, as it's getting harder to afford these $6,000 - $10,000 Mac Pro machines. Personally, Hackintoshes (if they're done correctly) perform better anyway. Plus, Apple's real market is the iPhone, iPad and MacBook community, and has been over the last couple of years, as that hits your wallet far less than a Mac Pro and they know this. That's my take on it...
On a side note, the thing that bugs me out about this is that from what I can remember (and I could be wrong about this), a few years ago we never had this "law" that you couldn't install Mac OS X on a non Apple product, because nobody was doing this kind of stuff before, but since Apple dumped the Power PC chip and married into Intel's product line (when it comes to their CPUs), well I believe that opened up Pandora's box to making it easier to having programmers step in and toying with making PC parts work with Mac OS X. What kicks me even more about this is, what is an Apple Mac Pro anyway?... P... C... parts... mmmmm... and they don't want you to do what they're doing for less money???... mmmmm... seems a bit controlling to me... I think you (and anyone else that's interested) should watch this clip to see for yourself what Steve Jobs said himself on video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=J0UjU0rtavE
and you can watch the full movie: Pirates of Silicon Valley:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=440334862070787846
After watching what Steve Jobs said and watching this movie, I think the point has been made. BTW, I know that no movie is totally on point with everything when it comes to being completely accurate, but the essence of what it's communicating is still there; both these guys were stealing from each other and bragging about it and we (personal hackintosh owners) can't build our own personal PC systems for our own use that (Intel and Apple) are still making profit on anyway? Seems a bit strange and hypocritical doesn't it?... Anyway, enjoy all the vid links... Later...
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Hey guys,
I have a question.
Someone gave me his G5 for free. So I thought of building me my own Hackintosh Tower with its case.
There is a great parts list on TonyMacx86, so far no problem.
I have never build any computer, the only thing I have done was switching the GPU in my Mac Pro 4.1...
Do you think I will be able to handle this? I am not bad in handling with screwdrivers and stuff, but I'm not experienced at all with electronics.
I do have time, that's not the matter.
Thanks!
I have a question.
Someone gave me his G5 for free. So I thought of building me my own Hackintosh Tower with its case.
There is a great parts list on TonyMacx86, so far no problem.
I have never build any computer, the only thing I have done was switching the GPU in my Mac Pro 4.1...
Do you think I will be able to handle this? I am not bad in handling with screwdrivers and stuff, but I'm not experienced at all with electronics.
I do have time, that's not the matter.
Thanks!
Depending on your personal expectations toward the result of your work.
Sticking together some components that are already matched dimensionwise (i.e. being standardized) is just a question of being careful (don't wear cheap plastic clothing or work on certain carpets - ideally have a wrist-strap - to avoid static charge that could destroy the components and handle them with care and preferably only by the edges).
The G5 case however is particularly difficult to mod for non-Apple components (if you want it to look good).
So with no experience on your side i'd suggest to first try it with a cheap standard tower housing and once you are familiar with the process you can start to prepare the G5 case to eventually move it all over.
That way you can already run the hackintosh while modding the G5 case and have no pressure to get it going, which almost 100% surely would lead to being neglectful on the mod, leading to mediocre or even disappointing results.
The G5 case would take a couple of weeks even for an very experienced PC guy. It requires sawing holes in the case since the backplate does not align, precise measurements etc. Really just a pain in the ass. Definately alot more skill required then "handling a screwdriver".
I agree Cindori. Even with the custom build I did with my Silverstone TJ11. That was a complete custom build. I had to order a custom mobo plate from MountainMods.com. I even had to cut that to fit as well as a bunch of other stuff that I have to custom cut and fit. Go here to see what I'm talking about:
http://www.osx86.net/dream-machine-...a-sr-2-w-2-x-x5690s-geekbench-36-583-a-2.html
Like the TJ11 any case (like the G5 that you're thinking about modding) is going to take quite a bit of work to make things fit. That's why most people just purchase PC cases. You want a nice G5 looking case that is actually BETTER than the G5 (because of airflow)? Well, go here and read up on this award winning case:
http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=242&area=en
Get the Aluminum case. I have the Black one because I used in a build that I called the Black Sheep of the Family:
http://www.tonymacx86.com/case-mods/18983-mac-hak-pro-silverstone-ft02-black-sheep-family-3.html
Now, to me this case is amazing; pulls in cool air from the bottom (with 3 x 180 mm fans) and pushes the warm air to the top (with 1 x 120 mm fan) to keep positive pressure flowing, and it's how air works naturally anyway; hot air rises to the top...
At the end of the day El Awesome, it's your choice, and I wish you the best if you do decide to go for it and use the G5 tower... Time to break out those tools and Ibuprofen for those headaches that you'll be facing!!!
- Just messin'... Later...
If you're going to do that, what current MP do you have and what series model CPU do you have? Because if you have the low end CPUs and decide get 2 x Xeon X5690's ($1,500 each) if they work with your mobo, you might want to google who's done that and what kind of performance boost they've received from that. Since you can't OC your mobo, you're really not going to see the kind of boost you want.
Why don't you keep it simple and do this setup:
- Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD7 ver.1 mobo
- Xeon W3680 (same as i7 980X)
- 12GB of RAM
- 1000W PSU
- Corsair H80 (CPU all in one water cooled setup)
This has been a tried and true setup and at least you'll get a GeekBench of 18,000+ (when you OC it to 4.2GHz) and that'll be good enough for a rendering powerhouse for all your apps. Heck even the new 3930K X79 setups aren't getting more than 20,000 - 22,000+ anyway. So you'll save some money getting the setup I just mentioned and you'll be up and running in no time and won't have to spend more than $1,000 to $1,200 tops...
Then go to www.kakewalk.se and download the new 4.5 for Mountain Lion and follow the easy step by step process to get it done. I have two those machines and they work great...
PS - you'll save more money in the end doing the way I mentioned than getting 2 new processors for your current setup. Just sayin'... In the end it is your decision. Later...
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if you're going to do that, what current mp do you have and what series model cpu do you have? Because if you have the low end cpus and decide get 2 x xeon x5690's ($1,500 each) if they work with your mobo, you might want to google who's done that and what kind of performance boost they've received from that. Since you can't oc your mobo, you're really not going to see the kind of boost you want.
Why don't you keep it simple and do this setup:
- gigabyte ga-x58a-ud7 ver.1 mobo
- xeon w3680 (same as i7 980x)
- 12gb of ram
- 1000w psu
- corsair h80 (cpu all in one water cooled setup)
this has been a tried and true setup and at least you'll get a geekbench of 18,000+ (when you oc it to 4.2ghz) and that'll be good enough for a rendering powerhouse for all your apps. Heck even the new 3930k x79 setups aren't getting more than 20,000 - 22,000+ anyway. So you'll save some money getting the setup i just mentioned and you'll be up and running in no time and won't have to spend more than $1,000 to $1,200 tops...
Then go to www.kakewalk.se and download the new 4.5 for mountain lion and follow the easy step by step process to get it done. I have two those machines and they work great...
Ps - you'll save more money in the end doing the way i mentioned than getting 2 new processors for your current setup. Just sayin'... In the end it is your decision. Later...
+1
If you're going to do that, what current MP do you have and what series model CPU do you have? Because if you have the low end CPUs and decide get 2 x Xeon X5690's ($1,500 each) if they work with your mobo, you might want to google who's done that and what kind of performance boost they've received from that. Since you can't OC your mobo, you're really not going to see the kind of boost you want.
Why don't you keep it simple and do this setup:
- Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD7 ver.1 mobo
- Xeon W3680 (same as i7 980X)
- 12GB of RAM
- 1000W PSU
- Corsair H80 (CPU all in one water cooled setup)
This has been a tried and true setup and at least you'll get a GeekBench of 18,000+ (when you OC it to 4.2GHz) and that'll be good enough for a rendering powerhouse for all your apps. Heck even the new 3930K X79 setups aren't getting more than 20,000 - 22,000+ anyway. So you'll save some money getting the setup I just mentioned and you'll be up and running in no time and won't have to spend more than $1,000 to $1,200 tops...
Then go to www.kakewalk.se and download the new 4.5 for Mountain Lion and follow the easy step by step process to get it done. I have two those machines and they work great...
PS - you'll save more money in the end doing the way I mentioned than getting 2 new processors for your current setup. Just sayin'... In the end it is your decision. Later...
Thanks!
I have a 2009 2.66 Quad and was planning to do the firmware upgrade and get a W3680.
Is watercooling difficult to set up fot a noob like me? I'm still thinking about getting a hackintosh.
What I am also wondering is how stable hackintoshes run - especially the system you just mentioned.
I'll use the hackintosh as a working machine, simply because I can't afford 2 machines, so if I'm going to build a hackintosh I'll sell my MP.
This means I just don't want to have random crashes and KPs.
I'll use the hackintosh as a working machine, simply because I can't afford 2 machines, so if I'm going to build a hackintosh I'll sell my MP.
This means I just don't want to have random crashes and KPs.
Sorry, couldn't back to you fast enough. I had both my water heaters in my house go out on me and I'm hustling to get a plumber to put in one of those tankless water heaters in. So I'm very busy today. So if I don't get back to you fast enough, sorry...
Anyhoo, the machine I just gave you specs on just works. Now if you want you can get the Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3 (or UD5), but I'd just prefer getting the best one they made (the UD7 ver. 1 model). You can find it on ebay used. Get and then get the rest of the parts that I said and when it comes to PSUs get any Enermax or Silverstone 1000W PSU - YES, get that high wattage PSU. Don't pay attention to any nay-sayers out there saying that you don't need it. YOU NEED IT - Trust me... I'll explain more of the reason why later... I have to get going but for now just do what I said and I'll help you in a few hours.
If you're penny conscience then go with the UD3r model found here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SLI-Gigabyt...001618179?pt=Motherboards&hash=item4abd2ffb03
or google the UD7 and/or UD3r:
http://www.serverpartswarehouse.com...X58ICH10R-DDR3-24G-GA-X58A-UD3R-P1862854.aspx
http://pcplanetsystems.com/pcp/mage...0-a-gbe-atx-motherboard.html?___store=default
Some are new and some are refurbs. CONTACT THESE VENDORS FIRST TO MAKE SURE. Now that's for the UD3r
For the UD7 mobo, go here:
http://www.upgradebay.com/Products/..._content=pla&gclid=CNPC1vXhiLMCFRQcnAodG0oAFw
or you could go with the UD5. Again, all of these mobo's work. It's just that I have the UD7 ver.1 (not ver.2 - not that it matters, but it's just what I know that works).
I don't want to overwhelm you but if you're not in a hurry and want to wait until ebay has a good used UD7 ver.1 mobo for $200 to $250, then you can do that too. That's what I did and I have no regrets. Who know you might find a brand new one...
Let me know what you find... Later...
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Sorry, couldn't back to you fast enough. I had both my water heaters in my house go out on me and I'm hustling to get a plumber to put in one of those tankless water heaters in. So I'm very busy today. So if I don't get back to you fast enough, sorry...
Anyhoo, the machine I just gave you specs on just works. Now if you want you can get the Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3 (or UD5), but I'd just prefer getting the best one they made (the UD7 ver. 1 model). You can find it on ebay used. Get and then get the rest of the parts that I said and when it comes to PSUs get any Enermax or Silverstone 1000W PSU - YES, get that high wattage PSU. Don't pay attention to any nay-sayers out there saying that you don't need it. YOU NEED IT - Trust me... I'll explain more of the reason why later... I have to get going but for now just do what I said and I'll help you in a few hours. Later...
If you're penny conscience then go with the UD3r model found here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SLI-Gigabyt...001618179?pt=Motherboards&hash=item4abd2ffb03
or google the UD7 and/or UD3r:
http://www.serverpartswarehouse.com...X58ICH10R-DDR3-24G-GA-X58A-UD3R-P1862854.aspx
http://pcplanetsystems.com/pcp/mage...0-a-gbe-atx-motherboard.html?___store=default
Some are new and some are refurbs. CONTACT THESE VENDORS FIRST TO MAKE SURE. Now that's for the UD3r
Haha thanks man
I`m not paying you for anything, so I don´t have expectations
Again, thanks for helping.
I built hacks in 2008 but none of them could ever do
1) mirrored monitors -
2) Air Display (on iPad)
3) Ethernet control surfaces for audio (avid artist series never recognized though internet was fine)
Does any one have direct experience of mirrored monitors working 100% on their current hack?? How about Air Display? Avid artist series?
Thanks
-Lee
1) mirrored monitors -
2) Air Display (on iPad)
3) Ethernet control surfaces for audio (avid artist series never recognized though internet was fine)
Does any one have direct experience of mirrored monitors working 100% on their current hack?? How about Air Display? Avid artist series?
Thanks
-Lee
Haha thanks man
I`m not paying you for anything, so I don´t have expectations
Again, thanks for helping.
I hope you're kidding, because I NEVER ask for payment. I do this out of the goodness of my heart and time...
----------
Yes, mirrored monitors work, don't know about Air Display...
Okay,
so I though about the following parts to build a hackintosh:
Intel i7-2600k (I want Sandy or Ivy Bridge, and the Sandy Bridge gvies better overclocking results)
GA-Z77X-UD5H
24GB Corsair Dominator RAM
EVGA GTX570 2560MB (the one I already use in my MB) - maybe I'll add another one in SLI
Watercooling setup for GPU,CPU and Motherboard (I put a big setup together for 1000$, including some fans and light effects and stuff like that. I really want to get a super-silent rig)
Some 1000W PSU - maybe two 700W?
I'll use the SSD/HDD of my Mac Pro.
I'll choose the case later on. I'll probably go visit a big electronics store.
Ihave something in mind there.
Does that look good?
so I though about the following parts to build a hackintosh:
Intel i7-2600k (I want Sandy or Ivy Bridge, and the Sandy Bridge gvies better overclocking results)
GA-Z77X-UD5H
24GB Corsair Dominator RAM
EVGA GTX570 2560MB (the one I already use in my MB) - maybe I'll add another one in SLI
Watercooling setup for GPU,CPU and Motherboard (I put a big setup together for 1000$, including some fans and light effects and stuff like that. I really want to get a super-silent rig)
Some 1000W PSU - maybe two 700W?
I'll use the SSD/HDD of my Mac Pro.
I'll choose the case later on. I'll probably go visit a big electronics store.
Ihave something in mind there.
Does that look good?
I use that same motherboard in my hackintosh, with a 3570K. Good choice. It's really easy to get working with a hackintosh. I didn't have any issues with it at all.
I use an EVGA GTX560ti video card. I'm not sure if you'll have the same issue as I had but I had to follow what this post said to do: http://www.tonymacx86.com/mountain-...dual-monitor-audio-problems-5.html#post432133
Without that, I couldn't get dual-monitors to work.
I also couldn't boot with the 'darkwake' kernel flag set, a flag that multibeast might automatically add in for you. I removed it from the kernel flags entirely.
Thanks. The one I have is EFI-flashed and works perfectly fine in my MP, so I guess that shouldn't be any problem in a hackintosh.