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MBP 16" Compatible Docks with 96W/100W Power

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The first post of this thread is a WikiPost and can be edited by anyone with the appropiate permissions. Your edits will be public.
cool11

cool11

macrumors 68000
Sep 3, 2006
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So many opinions here, about what is happening when using pass-through/charging-docking stations, what uses less power than 96W.
I hope to be able to discover some conclusions.

I do not intend to charge my other devices with pass-through/charging-docking stations.
I would like to know, several other aspects though:

- will the battery be harmed?
- in heavy load situations, will mbp will be able to cope well?
- is it all about slower charging?
- a combination of power usage of pass-through/charging-docking station along with battery, will be a sufficient solution for achieving the top performance of mbp, if someone hardly pushes his mbp to the limits for most times of usage? (let's say, about 1hour of real pressure, in a 8hour time period).
 
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Krevnik

Krevnik

macrumors 601
Sep 8, 2003
4,101
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cool11 said:
So many opinions here, about what is happening when using pass-through/charging-docking stations, what uses less power than 96W.
I hope to be able to discover some conclusions.

I do not intend to charge my other devices with pass-through/charging-docking stations.
I would like to know, several other aspects though:

- will the battery be harmed?
- in heavy load situations, will mbp will be able to cope well?
- is it all about slower charging?
- a combination of power usage of pass-through/charging-docking station along with battery, will be a sufficient solution for achieving the top performance of mbp, if someone hardly pushes his mbp to the limits for most times of usage? (let's say, about 1hour of real pressure, in a 8hour time period).
Click to expand...

- No. Batteries only care about improper *fast* charging. Trickle charging is better, but manufacturers have to balance usability with long-term battery health. Nobody wants a laptop that requires overnight charging.
- Depends. Marco Armament commented he saw 80W spikes during compiling on one of these. I’d stick to 85W docks because of that.
- As long as peak draw never exceeds what the dock provides, yes.
- Generally, yes. *If* we saw power draw of 90W during that hour, let’s say, then 5W is coming from the battery. So over that hour, you draw 5Wh or ~5% off the battery. But that’s not terribly likely, see below.

The thing with that last question though is that the cooling can’t sustain 80W of power going through the CPU/GPU, let alone 90-96. It’s closer to 62W. So you will wind up seeing the CPU pull back from the boost speed to stay within its power envelope. Because of that, you won’t be able to create the hypothetical situation above for that long a period in time.

My advice is that you should avoid 60W docks with the 16” (advice I haven’t taken BTW), but 85W will be adequate. However, you will see slower charge times when on the dock, and I expect you will see brief periods of no charging depending on how you push the machine under load, and if the screen is on.
 
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B

bsbeamer

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Original poster
Sep 19, 2012
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If you’re not worried about sustained CPU/GPU load, the standard docks or hubs would likely be fine for your needs. You’ll have battery “reserve” if you’re out taxing what the PSU is providing (85W or less for most docks).

Video renders and people working on similar for good portions of their day should not ignore the 96W if they’re looking for longer term solutions.

Until CalDigit issues a firmware update, supplemental power MAY be required for heavy load users. For email, Word documents, etc it’ll be fine without.
 
cool11

cool11

macrumors 68000
Sep 3, 2006
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So what options are available today, for pass-through charging docks, especially for the needs of a laptop like the new mbp 16' ?
Something? Anything? (links please)

Should we expect to see more choices on the near future?
 
mcvaughan

mcvaughan

macrumors 65816
Aug 9, 2007
1,360
980
Houston, TX
mtnmac26 said:
It looks like even the UltraFine 5K Display won't be able to appropriately power the new 16" MBP. Apple recently updated the product description with "For optimal performance on the 16-inch MacBook Pro, connect to power using the MacBook Pro’s 96W adapter."

The 5K display supports "full-speed charging up to 94W" according to LG.

LG UltraFine 5K Display - Apple

Apple Store Search Results
www.apple.com
Click to expand...

sigh. I didn’t even think about this.
 
D

danwells

macrumors 6502a
Apr 4, 2015
783
617
I'm surprised at no MacOS! I thought docks were pretty much generic - my OWC doesn't use any software... I wonder if there's some controller in there that isn't supported?

Unusual port selection - no Thunderbolt pass through and only three USB-A (one's on the side), but two non-TB USB-C ports and no less than four display connectors (VGA, two DisplayPorts and one of the USB-C ports has extra DisplayPort functions according to the specs).
 
Krevnik

Krevnik

macrumors 601
Sep 8, 2003
4,101
1,312
danwells said:
I'm surprised at no MacOS! I thought docks were pretty much generic - my OWC doesn't use any software... I wonder if there's some controller in there that isn't supported?
Click to expand...

Folks have used macOS with it, but the dual DisplayPort outputs are mirrored because of how Apple doesn't fully support MST all that well.

I kinda wish the Razer Core X Chroma was more "officially" supported on the Mac. Having USB and Ethernet built in would make for a good little dock that supports 100W output.
 
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cool11

cool11

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Sep 3, 2006
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joelhinch said:
This hub will only pass through 49w. No matter what charger you stick on the other end.
Click to expand...

So it is dangerous and totally unsufficient for the new mbp 16'' ?
[automerge]1574154917[/automerge]
cool11 said:
So what options are available today, for pass-through charging docks, especially for the needs of a laptop like the new mbp 16' ?
Something? Anything? (links please)

Should we expect to see more choices on the near future?
Click to expand...

Nothing at all? At least for now?
 
joelhinch

joelhinch

macrumors 6502
Oct 2, 2012
382
764
cool11 said:
So it is dangerous and totally unsufficient for the new mbp 16'' ?
Click to expand...

it would probably charge it fine when the laptop is turned off. And MAY provide enough power to run the MacBook Pro without discharging under idle load. Anything else and you’ll see discharge.
 
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Silverjerk

Silverjerk

macrumors member
May 7, 2015
91
141
I own the Caldigit TS3+ as well as the new 16" MacBook Pro. It's a mid to high-end spec'd machine as I am throwing a lot at it daily (2.4 i9/32gb ram/8gb 5500M/2TB SSD). With Caldigit's lower PD and the higher, more power-hungry components of the MBP, I indeed need to keep it connected to the Apple power adapter. And there are other issues as well, which may be related to incompatibility between the dock and the new 16" configuration. Here are some observations from a few days of use:

  • Power drain was significant enough with my config that I needed to plug the adapter in within a couple of hours of using the single cable solution.
  • I'm using a 34" Samsung CJ791 (connected through the dock via TB3); when running the display at 100hz, the display often reverts to a black screen for the first few minutes after plugging in the TB3 cable.
  • The ethernet connection is not working/not being recognized (the cable has been tested thoroughly, with both my older 2015 MBP, and my 2018 model through the same dock; it appears to be an issue when connected to the 16" MBP).
  • I've had to plug-in/unplug external devices (like external drives) a few times in order to get them to work; in my case, several of my thumb drives had to be disconnected/reconnected 3-4 times before being recognized.
Obviously I bought the TS3+ for use on my 2018 15" model, and so I'm not that disappointed as I can't expect a product like this to be future proof. And I'm happy to hear Caldigit is working on a solution. That said, even when connected through the power adapter there are several OTHER issues that seem to be related to use with the 16" MBP and I'd like to see those get taken care of as quickly as possible, as I use the machine docked 90% of the time.
 
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cool11

cool11

macrumors 68000
Sep 3, 2006
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Someone to check the specs of this one, to tell me that it seems suitable for the new mbp 16'?
www.aukey.com

AUKEY Official Website

AUKEY® combines the latest technologies with over a decade of hardware expertise to design and build solid, reliable consumer electronics and mobile tech accessories.
www.aukey.com www.aukey.com
 
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Rafterman

Rafterman

Contributor
Apr 23, 2010
7,267
8,809
zhenya said:
CalDigit has to say that because they have to protect themselves from claims like yours that it’s ‘not totally compatible’ and whatnot if they say otherwise. This thread, and this forum in general, is filled with real-world examples of people using these slightly under-powered docks with their existing MBP’s with no problem. Heck, I’ve been charging my 12” MacBook from a 10W usb-c integrated wall outlet for years. Works fine if I accept that the battery will just charge slower.
Click to expand...

I doubt its to "protect" themselves. It may be that the 180 watts of power is capable of going up to 96 watts, and the firmware update will redistubute some of that 180w from the dock's ports to the Macbook power.
 
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joelhinch

joelhinch

macrumors 6502
Oct 2, 2012
382
764
Silverjerk said:
I own the Caldigit TS3+ as well as the new 16" MacBook Pro. It's a mid to high-end spec'd machine as I am throwing a lot at it daily (2.4 i9/32gb ram/8gb 5500M/2TB SSD). With Caldigit's lower PD and the higher, more power-hungry components of the MBP, I indeed need to keep it connected to the Apple power adapter. And there are other issues as well, which may be related to incompatibility between the dock and the new 16" configuration. Here are some observations from a few days of use:

  • Power drain was significant enough with my config that I needed to plug the adapter in within a couple of hours of using the single cable solution.
  • I'm using a 34" Samsung CJ791 (connected through the dock via TB3); when running the display at 100hz, the display often reverts to a black screen for the first few minutes after plugging in the TB3 cable.
  • The ethernet connection is not working/not being recognized (the cable has been tested thoroughly, with both my older 2015 MBP, and my 2018 model through the same dock; it appears to be an issue when connected to the 16" MBP).
  • I've had to plug-in/unplug external devices (like external drives) a few times in order to get them to work; in my case, several of my thumb drives had to be disconnected/reconnected 3-4 times before being recognized.
Obviously I bought the TS3+ for use on my 2018 15" model, and so I'm not that disappointed as I can't expect a product like this to be future proof. And I'm happy to hear Caldigit is working on a solution. That said, even when connected through the power adapter there are several OTHER issues that seem to be related to use with the 16" MBP and I'd like to see those get taken care of as quickly as possible, as I use the machine docked 90% of the time.
Click to expand...

The fact that you are seeing drain is a worry. Caldigit is saying they're going to bump it to 87 watts with Firmware (from 85 watts) - so you may even still see drain.
 
B

bsbeamer

macrumors 601
Original poster
Sep 19, 2012
4,313
2,713
CalDigit is saying they should be supporting full 96W/100W passthrough PD through firmware updates. Where are you finding 85W>87W only?
 
H

hajime

macrumors 604
Jul 23, 2007
7,927
1,312
bsbeamer said:
Thanks for your opinion. As it stands currently, CalDigit support says supplemental power is required with the TS3 Plus for MBP 16" until a firmware update is made available. I'll trust they know the power limitations of their product.
Click to expand...

Is it better to hold off the purchase and see how the TS3 Plus behaves after the firmware update?
[automerge]1574222984[/automerge]
Silverjerk said:
I own the Caldigit TS3+ as well as the new 16" MacBook Pro. It's a mid to high-end spec'd machine as I am throwing a lot at it daily (2.4 i9/32gb ram/8gb 5500M/2TB SSD). With Caldigit's lower PD and the higher, more power-hungry components of the MBP, I indeed need to keep it connected to the Apple power adapter. And there are other issues as well, which may be related to incompatibility between the dock and the new 16" configuration. Here are some observations from a few days of use:

  • Power drain was significant enough with my config that I needed to plug the adapter in within a couple of hours of using the single cable solution.
  • I'm using a 34" Samsung CJ791 (connected through the dock via TB3); when running the display at 100hz, the display often reverts to a black screen for the first few minutes after plugging in the TB3 cable.
  • The ethernet connection is not working/not being recognized (the cable has been tested thoroughly, with both my older 2015 MBP, and my 2018 model through the same dock; it appears to be an issue when connected to the 16" MBP).
  • I've had to plug-in/unplug external devices (like external drives) a few times in order to get them to work; in my case, several of my thumb drives had to be disconnected/reconnected 3-4 times before being recognized.
Obviously I bought the TS3+ for use on my 2018 15" model, and so I'm not that disappointed as I can't expect a product like this to be future proof. And I'm happy to hear Caldigit is working on a solution. That said, even when connected through the power adapter there are several OTHER issues that seem to be related to use with the 16" MBP and I'd like to see those get taken care of as quickly as possible, as I use the machine docked 90% of the time.
Click to expand...

They mentioned that there is no plan to have a newer version of the dock but they are working on firmware update. Is it better to hold off the purchase and see how it behaves under the new firmware?
 
J

jd00

macrumors newbie
Nov 19, 2019
9
1
HI guys, what about this Dell thunderbolt 3 dock (WD19TB) which claims a 130 W power delivery:

www.dell.com

Computer Accessories and Peripherals

Shop Dell's wide selection of high-quality computer accessories like keyboards, mice, webcams, batteries and more, tailored for your home or business needs.
www.dell.com
 
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