[Merged] Has Outsourced Assembly in China Contributed to Declines in Apple Quality?

[UltraNEO*]

geeeez....someone from Japan is certainly not too fond of their neighbors across the pond

I seem to remember from my history class about how some nasty, cheap, crappy country by the name of Nippon bombed our battleships in Pearl Harbor, Hawaii.....do you guys still learn that in your history books, or has the gov't banned that too...

If you care to read my blog, you might learn I'm not form Japan. Thanks.

 

[UltraNEO*]

If that's the case, you might consider editing the title of the thread.

I tried... but it seems I can't edit the title once someone comments to it.

 

[leekohler]

I wonder what's the ratio of Apple's return rate is.. I get this odd feeling that the current Penryn series of Macs ar some what more troublesome that it's previous generation, cause just about every single thread on here has been people reporting faults with their NEW Systems.

Are there any people here, who's actually been satisfied with their original purchase? By this I mean, you've not had to return to the Store for tech support due to something misbehaving, lose, missing etc.. i.e. absolutely PERFECT item.

So, is it me, or have the quality of our Macs been declining ever since Apple moved it's assembly's plant to nasty, cheap, crappy China? And what on earth is Apple doing about this? Anyone wanna share their view on this?

I recently got a new BlackBook, and yeah- it's perfect. My last rev PM G5 has also been perfect.

 

[aristobrat]

And from your blog, they can hop over to your flickr and see that you just might have a few more feelings about things made in China than you alluded to a few posts ago.

 

[ucfgrad93]

Well lets see in the past year my family has purchased the following items:

iPhone - June 2007
iMac - August 2007
MBP - January 2008
iPhone - January 2008

And not a problem with any of them. But I never owned a Apple computer before I bought my iMac so I can't compare past quality.

 

[arkitect]

If you care to read my blog, you might learn I'm not form Japan. Thanks.

True, but wow. You really do not like China, do you?

I have no idea how old you are, but your comments on your blog are — to be kind —*very immature…

now it's full of mainland Commie Chinese students, stealing our technology and know-how. Filling the stores with cheap, nasty goods and often toxic waste!! God damn it!! At least this site ain't Made in China! That'll be a ****ing sin!

 

[UltraNEO*]

And from your blog, they can hop over to your flickr and see that you just might have a few more feelings about things made in China than you alluded to a few posts ago.

Ahh.. there seems to be a mass misunderstand about regarding "Assembled in China" and "Made in China" amongst many many people on those forums and throghout the world - there is a subtle difference - mostly regard the source of parts.

It's true i have my thoughts about Chinese goods, though everyone of them are more related to edible goods, good we orally consume and digest... I dunno about you, but I'd like to think my food is healthy for me and not full of toxins from tainted water ways.

 

[Queso]

It's true i have my thoughs about Chinese goods though everyone of them are more related to edible goods and good we orally consume. For people who know me in person it's hardly racist cause I'm too are a yellow fellow - but you folks would never expect this - therefore only see colour and possibly race?

Your comments about China are as racist as if I were to say the Scots are all miserly drunkards. It doesn't matter that I come from a similar racial grouping as the Scots, one that people the other side of the planet may find it difficult to distinguish between. The comment is still racist.

 

[UltraNEO*]

Your comments about China are as racist as if I were to say the Scots are all miserly drunkards. It doesn't matter that I come from a similar racial grouping as the Scots, one that people the other side of the planet may find it difficult to distinguish between. The comment is still racist.

Er... "similar racial grouping" ≠ same. This is where we differ.
Don't you wish you have more freedom of expression?

 

[stevegmu]

I wonder what's the ratio of Apple's return rate is.. I get this odd feeling that the current Penryn series of Macs ar some what more troublesome that it's previous generation, cause just about every single thread on here has been people reporting faults with their NEW Systems.

Are there any people here, who's actually been satisfied with their original purchase? By this I mean, you've not had to return to the Store for tech support due to something misbehaving, lose, missing etc.. i.e. absolutely PERFECT item.

So, is it me, or have the quality of our Macs been declining ever since Apple moved it's assembly's plant to nasty, cheap, crappy China? And what on earth is Apple doing about this? Anyone wanna share their view on this?

If you look at the customer reviews at Best Buy and Circuit City, it seems the vast majority of people who bought Macs are not experiencing any problems.

 

[solvs]

I work mostly with Macs at my job, and rarely have a problem with them, but it does happen. As with anything. Haven't noticed anything unusual with the latest couple of batches. You're always going to hear more issues on sites like this, that have areas entirely dedicated to helping you with problems. Which we have to say every time threads like these come up, which they do quite often when someone has or sees a problem.

 

[carbonmotion]

Apple has only been manufacturing their computers in China (PRC) since a few years back and the last generation of the powerbook G4 aluminum. Before that, they were manufactured in Taiwan where workers are paid much better, working conditions are significantly better, and overall manufacturing quality is higher. I think most would agree that since the transition to the mainland, quality has deteriorated. Unfortunately, Taiwanese companies operating on the mainland are just as likely to abuse their workers as mainland companies.

By no means is the working conditions in the PRC comparable to blue collar workers in United States or Germany. However, I am not convinced that Apple suppliers abuse it's workers. Do you have any evidence of this abuse? I am assuming you toured the Hon Hai plant in Shenzhen and found evidence of this illegal activity. I did't see anything wrong when I was there.

It's not about blaming the Chinese. It's just stating an observation and drawing conclusions. Apple is ultimately responsible, not the assembly worker. It's not in any way about nationality, but rather about socio-economic conditions that exist in different places and the exploitation of those conditions by large companies like Apple.

I agree with you. You can build great things in China, you just have to shell out more cash to your supplier. It's as simple as quality vs. price.

 

[carbonmotion]

It's true i have my thoughs about Chinese goods though everyone of them are more related to edible goods and good we orally consume. For people who know me in person it's hardly racist cause I'm too are a yellow fellow - but you folks would never expect this - therefore only see colour and possibly race?

Even if you are Chinese, it does not exempt you from being criticized for your comments should others find them unfair. Being of a race does not automatically give you a fair opinion of that race, esp. if you did not grow up in the region. In that case, it will take a lot of education (i.e. language, politics, history, sociology) and environmental submersion before one gains a fuller understanding. Plus, growing up in the U.S. I knew plenty of self loathing Asians who were all too willing to bash their own race in order to seem more assimilated. This is what I like to call the Uncle Tom syndrome.

 

[yoyo5280]

Apple quality going down?

I am apple loyal. I love my mac.

But I am afraid the Apple quality has gone down. Not design and innovation but more the way it is manufactured. (Software was great up to iPhone 2.)

Has apple changed factories or something to make quality, not as good?

 

[SixStringAddict]

Well i think as their rate of production goes up, quality goes down.

And i still haven't had any problem with my iPhone software. Lucky me i guess

 

[mcarnes]

I've noticed a steady decline in software more than hardware, relatively speaking. But it is still *miles* ahead of windows and the only real option, imo.

 

[GoCubsGo]

Software quality: Mediocre. I had read about more issues with Leopard than I did with Tiger. Never have I been weary of being an early-adopter of an OS until Leopard (and windows but that isn't the point here). iPhone, it was great, until 2.0. I couldn't agree more.

Hardware quality: Tanked after they moved to Intel. In no way do I associate this with Intel. I associate it with the number of units they're pushing out.

Overall, there have been too many reports of software bugs and hardware issues for me to think they haven't somehow sacrificed quality for quantity.

 

[eddieiseddie]

yeah i've totally been thinking the same thing; i heard though that they started manufacturing in China--of course for cheap labor. That's why the iPhone price fell bigtime, and also the reason people have recently been complaining so much about their products. I hope the quality doesn't suffer too much cuz im also an apple fan and I don't want my future purchases to be a dissapointment. I would also hope apple realizes this and SJ thinks more about pleasing the customer and less about saving money. I mean, yeah i realize a company is about making money, but wasn't that one of Steve's vows when starting Apple?(yes it was)

Eh, but im not one to compain...

 

[gibbz]

Overall, there have been too many reports of software bugs and hardware issues for me to think they haven't somehow sacrificed quality for quantity.

Agreed 100%. It seems they are trying to reach the masses and expand, but are letting quality slip in order to meet demands. I would much rather have Apple come out and say "Well folks, we are a little behind. It will be out in a couple of months, we want to get it right." Instead, they have been releasing unpolished products such as MobileMe, 2.0, and the iPhone 3G hardware.

 

[macbookairman]

yeah i've totally been thinking the same thing; i heard though that they started manufacturing in China--of course for cheap labor. That's why the iPhone price fell bigtime

actually, the reason the price fell is because it is subsidized...meaning that you are paying a lower price for your phone in if you sign up for 2-year voice and data cell phone plans that cost about $75-100 per month or more (before taxes and fees), meaning $1800-2400 in ‘guaranteed’ bi-annual revenue. so they make plenty of profit from the amount of money you pay for the plan after 2 years. Therefore, they can afford to lower the phones price.

not sure if that made sense...

 

[Sun Baked]

Hardware quality: Tanked after they moved to Intel. In no way do I associate this with Intel. I associate it with the number of units they're pushing out.

Overall, there have been too many reports of software bugs and hardware issues for me to think they haven't somehow sacrificed quality for quantity.

Well, their design choices also lend themselves to noticing of minor defects in construction.

If they wanted to compromise the machine and its design a bit they could design the machines to be easier to assemble, service, and repair. And a simple switch to a textured finish would eliminate a lot of complaints.

But the visual appeal is such a big part of the "trade dress" I doubt they'll change it.

 

[SDAVE]

Assembled in China

"Assembled in China"...sounds like a documentary title doesn't it?

I don't know if this has been brought up anywhere, but is it only me that notices that Apple's quality has gone downhill ever since they started manufacturing everything in China? I think Foxconn is one of their third party manufacturers in China.

I remember when Apple was a bit smaller and manufactured their products in the U.S. The quality was great (Remember the G5? Etc?).

Now it's just, bleh.

My first Mac Pro had so many problems that Apple decided to give me a brand new one (after many repairs of course). The second one is much better.

Also I keep seeing alot of people have build problems with the iPhone 3G's, which I haven't had with my first bought iPhone.

Matter of fact, I notice that most of the things (nowadays almost EVERYTHING) that are built in China lack quality. I remember Sony used to build everything in Japan, the quality was superb and it lasted for a long time. Now most of their products are created in China.

Globalization at it's finest.

Is it going to get worse? Discuss.

 

[sushi]

I don't know if this has been brought up anywhere, but is it only me that notices that Apple's quality has gone downhill ever since they started manufacturing everything in China? I think Foxconn is one of their third party manufacturers in China.

Quality is hard to maintain as sales increase.

So on one hand, we have Apple growing their market which is good. On the other hand, quality seems to be going down.

I remember the days where Apple manufactured in US. Quality was good, and the price was expensive.

To be competitive, Apple has to reduce manufacturing and supply costs. As we have seen, their product packaging has improved greatly over the past few years.

There is rumor that Apple will make some products in the states. Who knows.

Hopefully Apple will get their hands around the issue to maintain or improve quality.

 

[0098386]

Le Shrug. Most of my electronics are just fine, the only machines to break was an Xbox 360, PSP and a couple of old Sony and Panasonic hifi bits and bobs. All my Apple electronics are perfect, barring the BT keyboard that I spilled a drink on

Maybe I'm just lucky.

 

[sushi]

Maybe I'm just lucky.

I've been lucky as well over the years as I have had very few problems with electronic devices.

One exception was my PowerBook. AppleCare was fantastic. Just a few iterations to fix the problem which ended up being the Logic Board. Also had to replace the Optical Drive once, and the HD twice. And a few other items as well. No charge due to AppleCare. Definitely worth it for me.

In general, Apple is going through growing pains which I think is good since they are growing.