[Merged] No Flash?

[bpd115]

Flash sucks. That's been covered. According to Apple's crash reporter data, it's a major cause of Safari crashes.

Flash, until the web mercifully migrates away from it, is a necessary evil for a lot of websites unfortunately.

The answer is to allow the plugin, but disable it (IE Buy ClickToFlash now). The user then taps the content they want to play and as soon as it's done, the plugin gets shut down.

Apple, however, is stubborn. We shall see.

 

[BaldiMac]

Most major companies have not redesigned their pages to eliminate Flash. In fact, we know this device will not play Flash because Steve Jobs went to the New York Times in his demonstration and it showed the little icon most iPhone users have come to know and hate. Steve Jobs in his keynote presentation couldn't stay away from a Flash webpage from a major company.

While there are 75 million iPhones, web developers will look at stats from places like Google that track the browsers that frequent pages. This gives a true measure of usage. If your mobile Safari does not allow navigation on a page, you're not going to access that page. It will make the stats show low viewership from those devices. Web developers will have no need to change. Most people will simply wait until they can get to their laptop or desktop. Fine for the iPhone. But not for the iPad.

Actually it's still only 0.64% browser share - a small market by most people's definition. Even Linux manages 2.14%. Mobile Safari is undoubtedly important in the mobile space, but still a drop in the ocean overall.

How many companies have iPhone specific websites? How many have their own iPhone apps? My only point is that Mobile Safari is not such a small market that it is being ignored by web developers.

 

[atacinus]

Let me clarify at first that I'm already going to buy an iPad - and I'm sure I'm going to love it. There are SO many times when I want to browse the internet but don't want to sit at my desk and use my iMac. So I'm sold.

That being said, the no-flash really makes me mad. I was someone who rolled my eyes when people complained about it on the iPhone - I was like "who needs that - it's a mobile phone!" --- but if I want to use the iPad as my primary internet device why can't I access Hulu? Why can't I stream live events from CNN? I watch MSNBC clips all day long on my iMac - no can do on the iPad. Luckily HTML5 is coming for youtube and vimeo...but those are just two sites out of many.

So yeah, throw my hat into the "this sucks" camp. In a few years I could see Apple being able to release a product without flash since hopefully the web will upgrade by then...but it's only 2010 and well, flash is still around - ugh.

 

[MacBH928]

Javascript, scalable vector graphics, and HTML 5 markup as currently implemented in Safari and Firefox can replace most flash animations.

Okay, if that is true, I don't mind , I want to see a website that uses javascript, scalable vector graphics, and html5 markup that would put out animation like flash.

any how, this might be from the 90's , but I recall java applets were what made browsers heavy,slow, and then crash.

 

[calderone]

Okay, if that is true, I don't mind , I want to see a website that uses javascript, scalable vector graphics, and html5 markup that would put out animation like flash.

any how, this might be from the 90's , but I recall java applets were what made browsers heavy,slow, and then crash.

It is clear that you are outside your area of expertise.

Java ≠ Javascript. Get it right.

http://tinyurl.com/yctsm9c

 

[marksman]

Very Funny

I must admit this was very funny to me when my chrome flash plug in crashed while browsing the iPad discussion forum:

 

[FCDP]

The answer is to allow the plugin, but disable it (IE Buy ClickToFlash now). The user then taps the content they want to play and as soon as it's done, the plugin gets shut down.

Apple, however, is stubborn. We shall see.

I can't help but find it humorous that people are so against Flash support on the iPhone OS, when it's as simple as adding a Setting. But I guess everyone is use to Apple making decisions for us, rather than giving us the choice of enabling or disabling it ourselves. In the off chance it does reduce battery, have it set to default "off", and provide a warning below the toggle (such as the 3G toggle) about it affecting battery performance.

Nope, instead, Apple will choose what's best for it's children, as that's how we allow them to see us. Remember kids, Apple knows best .

 

[AngryApple]

I wish Apple would give the option of having Flash. If you were to go on a website with Flash content a little dialogue box could pop up and ask if you would like to view the Flash content for this one page or something.

 

[mtnDewFTW]

Alright, I've heard just about enough of this.
First of all, I'm more than sure that within a month of release, someone will already figure out a way to make Flash work on this device, maybe by jailbreaking, or maybe not.

And if they don't, the App Store has over 140,000 apps in it, right now. Most major sites that you would bother going onto, already have their app in there, which means you can watch their videos.

More than 50% of the videos that we all watch daily, are on YouTube, and they have a app for that, that can playback HD video. Which to me, is very impressive.

Apple don't want Flash on the iPad or any other device because A. It would slow things down, because some sites are completely Flash based, and people would obviously get sick of the browser crashing, and it looks like Apple doesn't wanna take that chance.
Also, they want more sites using Quicktime instead of Flash, so then they would own more of the market in the streaming media. Right now, barely anyone uses Quicktime to stream video content online. And they want more people to start using their own product, rather than Adobe's.

So, I know that it may seem like a huge thing to some people, but I just don't care. It can playback YouTube and that's all that I really care about. As far as the rest of the web goes, right now, every single site that I visit has it's own app in the App Store. Well, except for this one, I think.

But honestly, I really don't care that much for Flash.

 

[Nostromo]

More than 50% of the videos that we all watch daily, are on YouTube, and they have a app for that, that can playback HD video. Which to me, is very impressive.

What's impressive about that? That you only miss 50% of what the web has to offer in videos? (By the way: how did you arrive at the 50% number? Sounds like you pulled it out of a hat)

What about those who use other video sites?

Vimeo, for example, has good content, and many use it. It's playback quality is very good.

Vimeo uses flash.

http://www.vimeo.com/help/flash

And so do many other sites.

It doesn't make sense to defend everything Apple does because Apple does it. A submissive fanboy customer may be the dream of any marketing executive, but it is counterproductive for thinking individuals who want their money's worth.

 

[calderone]

Not interested in Vimeo?

Vimeo uses flash.

http://www.vimeo.com/help/flash
And so do many other sites.

It doesn't make sense to defend everything Apple does because Apple does it. A submissive fanboy customer may be the dream of any marketing executive, but it is counterproductive for thinking individuals who want their money's worth

Also uses HTML5.

http://www.vimeo.com/blog:268

Want to try again? The reason they did this: Playback was jumping on many platforms.

EDIT: I see you have edited your post. Nothing like tossing out the classic "fanboy" line when you make false claims. Thumbs up.

 

[Nostromo]

Also uses HTML5.

http://www.vimeo.com/blog:268

Want to try again? The reason they did this: Playback was jumping on many platforms.

EDIT: I see you have edited your post. Nothing like tossing out the classic "fanboy" line when you make false claims. Thumbs up.

Do you actually read what you are linking to?

The HTML player is in beta.

"It might be buggy" it says so on the site.

[snip]

Flash is a fact on the web and not going away. Many artist's portfolios are presented in flash. Take dripbook, for example. An art director could not see those sites using the iPad.

It should be to the user if he wanted to display flash content, or not.

But why use arguments?

Apple left out the use of flash. There must be a higher reason for this.

 

[FCDP]

A couple interesting tidbits about Flash 10.1 from Adobe MAX 2009 back in October.

And a Demo video of Flash 10.1 running on Smartphones and Netbooks (Note: This is a video from October on a Beta version of Flash 10.1):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pee3nT4bPw4

 

[calderone]

Do you actually read what you are linking to?

The HTML player is in beta.

"It might be buggy" it says so on the site.

Of course, fanboys never like it when they are found out they support everything a company does, no matter what.

Yes it is in Beta. GMail was in beta for how long?

Notice the keyword, might. Of course it will have bugs, it is a new feature to a website that has used Flash since its inception. Kudos to them for stating it up front. I don't recall Apple having a disclaimer on their site stating: "Snow Leopard may contain bugs."

As if Flash based videos do not have bugs. When I did consume Youtube flash, there are many times where the video just would not load. No matter what you did. If it is your contention that HTML5 is going to be buggy forever then please provide an argument. Something more than "fanboys blah blah blah."

I already do not consume Flash content and Flash is available on my Mac. Of course, it is more convenient to label everyone as a fanboy, isn't it?

Flash is a fact on the web and not going away. Many artist's portfolios are presented in flash. Take dripbook, for example. An art director could not see those sites using the iPad.

Sure. Flash exists on the web. If a site wants to use Flash for their site, they are more than welcome to. However, you better believe the second I see that it is Flash (Click2Flash blocks it) I will go leave and never come back. This is what I do already, it has nothing to do with the iPad.

It should be to the user if he wanted to display flash content, or not.

You are absolutely right. And the user has the decision as to whether or not they want to buy a device that excludes something they want. You can't buy it and hope they include it, or buy it and complain that it doesn't have it. Well you can, but you would be an idiot for doing so.

But why use arguments?

What argument have you given? All I see if "fanboy" this, "fanboy" that. And a restatement of the fact that Flash exists on the web. Anything else for me?

Apple left out the use of flash. There must be a higher reason for this.

Maybe there is. Let me know when you find out what it is.

 

[marksman]

Also when you all report your broken, non-compliant and outdated websites and ask them to provide video that you can watch, feel free to link them to this

 

[calderone]

Also when you all report your broken, non-compliant and outdated websites and ask them to provide video that you can watch, feel free to link them to this

Lovely. Thanks for that.

 

[MacBH928]

It is clear that you are outside your area of expertise.

Java ≠ Javascript. Get it right.

http://tinyurl.com/yctsm9c

Thats why I was asking

I can see a good point about abandoning flash, maybe it will make the ipad run hot and burn your fingers?
But I did try youtube HTML 5, and the videos made my 1 year old macbook run just as hot with high processor consumption equal to the flash videos or more.

As for Flash 10.1 , I am not sure which one I got not, but when i updated(os x) I got noticeable better performance.