Don't think so. I only ever saw a PC version of
FutureWave's Splash, and these sites say it
was cross-platform.
http://www.flashmagazine.com/html/413.htm
http://www.microon.net/flashStory/flash1.asp
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Microsoft to buy-out Flash from Macromedia??
- Thread starter gotohamish
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Don't think so. I only ever saw a PC version of
FutureWave's Splash, and these sites say it
was cross-platform.
http://www.flashmagazine.com/html/413.htm
http://www.microon.net/flashStory/flash1.asp
MS - sneaky little biatches. Well there goes a nice, fun to use product- destined to become some crappy product grouped next to the calculator in the accessories menu option in Win XPeePee
Apple and Adobe will get cozier...heck -how about apple buying adobe?
Apple and Adobe will get cozier...heck -how about apple buying adobe?
Never happen.
This would be a disaster for Mac web developers. Apple and it's followers wouldn't tolerate it. Plus Macromedia knows it has a large Mac following.
This would be a disaster for Mac web developers. Apple and it's followers wouldn't tolerate it. Plus Macromedia knows it has a large Mac following.
The confusion between Flash and Java exhibited by some in this forum appears to stem from the idea that Flash hasn't moved on since Applets.
When Flash first launched, it was promoted as a write once, run anywhere object oriented language that enabled developers to create mini applications that could be embedded into a Web page - Applets. These applets were executed client-side and in some respects are similar to Flash .swf movies.
Java applets, whilst still used on many sites, never took off in the way that the pundits predicted, and are not as popular as .swf movies. Since then, Java has moved on.
Java became a massive hit with the introduction of Servlets, J2EE and Enterprise Java Beans. These technologies have the support of very big players - Sun, IBM, Oracle, BAE... even Macromedia. Until recently, (with the release of .net) Microsoft did not have anything to compete with these Java technologies, which are used for the back-end development of Web sites. Part of J2EE is Java Server Page - .jsp, which is the Java equivalent of .cfm .asp or .php - it has nothing to do with Flash, or even Applets, since the Servlet is executed server-side, not client-side.
Java is extremely important to the future of the Mac platform - not least because Java tends to be deployed in a UNIX environment, whereas .net is always deployed on a Windows environment (naturally). Let's not start insulting the good name of Java with the slur that Flash, or even Coldfusion might replace it!
When Flash first launched, it was promoted as a write once, run anywhere object oriented language that enabled developers to create mini applications that could be embedded into a Web page - Applets. These applets were executed client-side and in some respects are similar to Flash .swf movies.
Java applets, whilst still used on many sites, never took off in the way that the pundits predicted, and are not as popular as .swf movies. Since then, Java has moved on.
Java became a massive hit with the introduction of Servlets, J2EE and Enterprise Java Beans. These technologies have the support of very big players - Sun, IBM, Oracle, BAE... even Macromedia. Until recently, (with the release of .net) Microsoft did not have anything to compete with these Java technologies, which are used for the back-end development of Web sites. Part of J2EE is Java Server Page - .jsp, which is the Java equivalent of .cfm .asp or .php - it has nothing to do with Flash, or even Applets, since the Servlet is executed server-side, not client-side.
Java is extremely important to the future of the Mac platform - not least because Java tends to be deployed in a UNIX environment, whereas .net is always deployed on a Windows environment (naturally). Let's not start insulting the good name of Java with the slur that Flash, or even Coldfusion might replace it!
I'm not convinced that J2EE is "at risk" from Microsoft's purchase of Coldfusion - .net seems more of a threat to me.
It may be true that J2EE is not as easy to develop in than Coldfusion or Microsoft products. In the past this has not presented a problem - it's merely resulted in small, simple sites being developed and hosted on Windows, because this is the most appropriate and cost effective platform for such applications (at the low end I buy Microsoft's total cost of ownership arguement) whereas at the highend, UNIX / JAVA still leads.
It may be true that J2EE is not as easy to develop in than Coldfusion or Microsoft products. In the past this has not presented a problem - it's merely resulted in small, simple sites being developed and hosted on Windows, because this is the most appropriate and cost effective platform for such applications (at the low end I buy Microsoft's total cost of ownership arguement) whereas at the highend, UNIX / JAVA still leads.
I'm more confused
I'm confused at the lack of intelligence most respondents to this thread are displaying. One of the problems with mac users is they don't look outside their own little world (and I AM A MAC USER, dual 867 and iBook). I also agree that the author of the register article is missing the point.
It would be impossible for microsoft to only aquire Flash, as Flash is too tightly integrated into Coldfusion, Director and the other Flash com products. If Macromedia lost Flash then that surely would be the end !!! But that will not happen unless the WHOLE company goes.
I'm not convinced that J2EE is "at risk" from Microsoft's purchase of Coldfusion - .net seems more of a threat to me.
No one is saying that it is at risk but with Macromedia's adoption of J2EE as the platform on which CFMX runs it has the potential to convert a lot developers from other platforms to J2EE. Until the MX release of CF and Flash the majority of Macromedia users were not Java developers as well, and the main reason for that was Macromedia's ease of use compared to J2EE and also the cost of ownership.
The MX products have now introduced a huge number of developers to the J2EE environment and its capabilities. Macromedia has also introduced versions of CFMX that run on top of existing J2EE environements ie IBM websphere, SUN ONE and JRUN. Another important note is that CFMX compiles it's pages into java allowing it to run on ANY java compliant platform eg OSX.
flash can't do ANYTHING by itself. Any functionality outside of tweening and other visuals is done using PHP. Flash cannot do anything java can. Java is a object oriented language. Flash scripts with javascript sudo code and can have PHP attached to it. Java is so much more robust than Flash its rediculous. Please don't even start this argument, i have to go to bed early tonight
Have you not heard of Flash communication server or Flash remoting ??? FlashMX is now tightly integrated with Coldfusion MX and the possibilities for this technology far out way anything that Microsoft has ever even envisaged !!!! Through the link between CFMX and Flash MX, Flash has the ability to access Java applets, JSP pages, Java beans and most other java technologies. Maybe this is the mysterious link people have been wondering about ????
Let's not start insulting the good name of Java with the slur that Flash, or even Coldfusion might replace it
No one is saying this, Java is now and integrated component of Macromedia's future and this is why Microsoft are so concerned, Macromedia is now introducing Java to 000,000's of developers that might never have even considered it. I don't know if people realise that Sun as a company is not in good shape at the moment and it needs all the support it can get. Macromedia is doing a fantastic job at helping the JAVA and SUN cause at the moment.
No one uses CFM these days surely, and if Microsoft wanted it so bad, why didn't they snap it up before Macromedia last year
Another ignorant comment ! Coldfusion has never been more popular or powerful since it's introducing and I can't see that changing anytime soon.
I'm no M$ lover, but I couldn't care less if they grab Flash. It's a toy, and since it hit the net there has been a backlash against superfluous falsh animations wasting bandwidth
I agree, before Flash MX, Flash was pretty much a toy but IT IS no longer a toy. It can and is being used to develop extremely sophisicated business critical applications linking J2EE, FlashMX and other technologies together. The problem is that most of the web community have yet to see any evidence of this but it is coming, believe me.
I'm confused at the lack of intelligence most respondents to this thread are displaying. One of the problems with mac users is they don't look outside their own little world (and I AM A MAC USER, dual 867 and iBook). I also agree that the author of the register article is missing the point.
It would be impossible for microsoft to only aquire Flash, as Flash is too tightly integrated into Coldfusion, Director and the other Flash com products. If Macromedia lost Flash then that surely would be the end !!! But that will not happen unless the WHOLE company goes.
I'm not convinced that J2EE is "at risk" from Microsoft's purchase of Coldfusion - .net seems more of a threat to me.
No one is saying that it is at risk but with Macromedia's adoption of J2EE as the platform on which CFMX runs it has the potential to convert a lot developers from other platforms to J2EE. Until the MX release of CF and Flash the majority of Macromedia users were not Java developers as well, and the main reason for that was Macromedia's ease of use compared to J2EE and also the cost of ownership.
The MX products have now introduced a huge number of developers to the J2EE environment and its capabilities. Macromedia has also introduced versions of CFMX that run on top of existing J2EE environements ie IBM websphere, SUN ONE and JRUN. Another important note is that CFMX compiles it's pages into java allowing it to run on ANY java compliant platform eg OSX.
flash can't do ANYTHING by itself. Any functionality outside of tweening and other visuals is done using PHP. Flash cannot do anything java can. Java is a object oriented language. Flash scripts with javascript sudo code and can have PHP attached to it. Java is so much more robust than Flash its rediculous. Please don't even start this argument, i have to go to bed early tonight
Have you not heard of Flash communication server or Flash remoting ??? FlashMX is now tightly integrated with Coldfusion MX and the possibilities for this technology far out way anything that Microsoft has ever even envisaged !!!! Through the link between CFMX and Flash MX, Flash has the ability to access Java applets, JSP pages, Java beans and most other java technologies. Maybe this is the mysterious link people have been wondering about ????
Let's not start insulting the good name of Java with the slur that Flash, or even Coldfusion might replace it
No one is saying this, Java is now and integrated component of Macromedia's future and this is why Microsoft are so concerned, Macromedia is now introducing Java to 000,000's of developers that might never have even considered it. I don't know if people realise that Sun as a company is not in good shape at the moment and it needs all the support it can get. Macromedia is doing a fantastic job at helping the JAVA and SUN cause at the moment.
No one uses CFM these days surely, and if Microsoft wanted it so bad, why didn't they snap it up before Macromedia last year
Another ignorant comment ! Coldfusion has never been more popular or powerful since it's introducing and I can't see that changing anytime soon.
I'm no M$ lover, but I couldn't care less if they grab Flash. It's a toy, and since it hit the net there has been a backlash against superfluous falsh animations wasting bandwidth
I agree, before Flash MX, Flash was pretty much a toy but IT IS no longer a toy. It can and is being used to develop extremely sophisicated business critical applications linking J2EE, FlashMX and other technologies together. The problem is that most of the web community have yet to see any evidence of this but it is coming, believe me.
Actually several people on this forum have said just that.
But you're right, I am ignorant when it comes to Coldfusion. I was not aware that you could use it with J2EE servers.
I haven't seen any evidence that Coldfusion adoption is on the increase - do you have any stats to support this?
It's great that Macromedia are supporting Java, all I'm saying is that J2EE's future is not entirely dependent upon this support.
Look, it is your problem you dont see flash beyond barbie.com. Some people pay bills with Flash. There are amazing *useful* interfaces that can be made with flash. And FYI flash animations are smaller than html.
Flash is so much easier to make then html, and good designer will make it better then html.
Some things cannot be done without flash.
you are all forgeting SVG - the xml based w3 recommended vector based web standard. go to w3.org and click on the svg link. yeah its not quite prime time yet but just wait a few years. flash was already doomed. if i was macromedia i would sell it fast. even microsoft is starting to support svg in some of its products.
Adobe LiveMotion is slowly catching up to Flash, this could be our saviour.
But lets hope Macromedia doesn't get bought.
I like Flash and Fireworks
But lets hope Macromedia doesn't get bought.
I like Flash and Fireworks
Everyone Listen, FLash and JAVA
I am a partner of Macromedia. I do "ENTEPRISE" FLASH/JAVA applications for big clients. I am talking million dollar flash jobs.
1) FLash is not a silly toy. it is not just for animations anymore.
2) Its scripting language is more powefrull that Javascript because of its ability to consume XML Webservices and lot of other things....
3) FLash is the premier application building tool for building client side UI. JAVA Swing is dead, and flesh picks up were it left off with the new component architecture.
4) IF you hate flash, you probally don't know what it can do. YOu think of it as an animation tool.
5) Flash is going to be the GUI of more complicated web applications that can not be done with just the form submit model of HTML. If you don't get how huge this is....you about to be left behind in the web world.
6) BEA Weblogic, IBM Websphere, NOVEL, Oracle, are all heavily working with flash to bring the next generation of web application that function like "DeskTop" apps.
7) Forget the silly graphics,,,,,good Flash apps will look like JAVA Swing or Apple's Interface Builder (Okay sans Aqua).
8) Try to understand what a big deal this is going to be if $M buys flash and says it things like FLASH REmoting no longer work with JAVA. There is right now a huge Flash/Java connection.
9) Flash is all grown up, and if you think it is just for animations.....you really do not know what you are talking about.
actionscript@mac.com
I am a partner of Macromedia. I do "ENTEPRISE" FLASH/JAVA applications for big clients. I am talking million dollar flash jobs.
1) FLash is not a silly toy. it is not just for animations anymore.
2) Its scripting language is more powefrull that Javascript because of its ability to consume XML Webservices and lot of other things....
3) FLash is the premier application building tool for building client side UI. JAVA Swing is dead, and flesh picks up were it left off with the new component architecture.
4) IF you hate flash, you probally don't know what it can do. YOu think of it as an animation tool.
5) Flash is going to be the GUI of more complicated web applications that can not be done with just the form submit model of HTML. If you don't get how huge this is....you about to be left behind in the web world.
6) BEA Weblogic, IBM Websphere, NOVEL, Oracle, are all heavily working with flash to bring the next generation of web application that function like "DeskTop" apps.
7) Forget the silly graphics,,,,,good Flash apps will look like JAVA Swing or Apple's Interface Builder (Okay sans Aqua).
8) Try to understand what a big deal this is going to be if $M buys flash and says it things like FLASH REmoting no longer work with JAVA. There is right now a huge Flash/Java connection.
9) Flash is all grown up, and if you think it is just for animations.....you really do not know what you are talking about.
actionscript@mac.com
I am one who actually likes to be wrong on occasion. As apps evolve, it's almost impossible to see the standard that will be in place in, say, 5 years. Some of my feelings are drawn from my own personal dislike of the technology as it stands right now, but I do realize that Flash just may evolve into something useful. Right now it's not. And it's my daughter that visits barbie.com. Crap-flash is 99% of the Flash presence on the internet. I'll wait for the technology to get past the crap.
Barbie
If you think the best flash and most usefull flash on the web is barbie, then you must never go to financial websites, or know anything about what is going on with "Enteprise" flash on intranets of the fortune 50 companies.
Flash is simply used to create a User-Centric experience that is closer to desktop applications.
Barbi.com is not an example of what flash does.
Its like saying photoshop is used to make bad filter art, and ignoring how it is really used in advertising.
If you think the best flash and most usefull flash on the web is barbie, then you must never go to financial websites, or know anything about what is going on with "Enteprise" flash on intranets of the fortune 50 companies.
Flash is simply used to create a User-Centric experience that is closer to desktop applications.
Barbi.com is not an example of what flash does.
Its like saying photoshop is used to make bad filter art, and ignoring how it is really used in advertising.
One Example
Flash can be fun but I have never seen it useful and I have seen many entertainment and biz sites!
The fact that it lets people create from scratch their own user interface is the problem as creating an interface is a major effort and flash is a major step backwards - it is like basic programing - maybe it could be done well but it never is.
Most people who really use the web do not go to flash based sites as they simply do not work well. It may have it's place but so far I have not seen it.
Flash can be fun but I have never seen it useful and I have seen many entertainment and biz sites!
The fact that it lets people create from scratch their own user interface is the problem as creating an interface is a major effort and flash is a major step backwards - it is like basic programing - maybe it could be done well but it never is.
Most people who really use the web do not go to flash based sites as they simply do not work well. It may have it's place but so far I have not seen it.
VideoWorks
(Sorry about quoting you, but your message prompted a trip down memory lane.)
Yes, Macromedia Director was originally Macromind VideoWorks. It was released, if I recall correctly, around the time of the Mac ][ and its fancy 256 color graphics. They had the most impressive booth at MacWorld for a couple years running... a large array of monitors run off a single Mac ][ with several video cards, with movies playing across all of them.
When it changed to Director, I think they basically added scripting. All in all, there is nothing really revolutionary in any release since the original VideoWorks, in my humble opinion. They got it basically right from the start then rode it over a decade.
At the time, Windows was still struggling with the concept of putting one folder inside another, and Microsoft Word and Excel were still Macintosh-first releases (if they even had a Windows version at all yet.) Ahh, those were the days. Of course, I shouldn't mention what the Amiga's capabilities were at the time.
(Sorry about quoting you, but your message prompted a trip down memory lane.)
Yes, Macromedia Director was originally Macromind VideoWorks. It was released, if I recall correctly, around the time of the Mac ][ and its fancy 256 color graphics. They had the most impressive booth at MacWorld for a couple years running... a large array of monitors run off a single Mac ][ with several video cards, with movies playing across all of them.
When it changed to Director, I think they basically added scripting. All in all, there is nothing really revolutionary in any release since the original VideoWorks, in my humble opinion. They got it basically right from the start then rode it over a decade.
At the time, Windows was still struggling with the concept of putting one folder inside another, and Microsoft Word and Excel were still Macintosh-first releases (if they even had a Windows version at all yet.) Ahh, those were the days. Of course, I shouldn't mention what the Amiga's capabilities were at the time.
first - flash MX server is in beta for unix, I'm to understand.
Second, I don't think Macro is anti-apple - hell, the MAC in Macro is for...er...MAC. Director (then videoworks) was only mac back in the day.
If anything I'm more frustrated by the lack of support for director as compared to flash within Macr (I'm a director developer by trade). If anything Flash is Director's retarded younger brother. But DirMX certainly ups the anti with the new integration into flash mx objects.
In any case, if this happens - which I pray it won't - I'll go realbasic.
But I'm hopeful that apple would step into the fray. Hell Macr is where they got Final Cut from...
The only good I can think of regarding a Microsoft buyout would be that Flash might then be compatible with the latest version of Photoshop, and not version 3.
Only reason I play with Adobe LiveMotion is due to this.
Only reason I play with Adobe LiveMotion is due to this.
Well....in what way? I use PS7 all the time with flash, save out as png and keep all the alphas......so.......er......?
Ack no!!!!!
Not Macromedia!!!
I'm still upset over Bungie
God dam u M$!!!!!!
At least Macromedia has mac in its name. UGH NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
Sorry bout the rant, I'm just so sick of M$!!!
Not Macromedia!!!
I'm still upset over Bungie
God dam u M$!!!!!!At least Macromedia has mac in its name. UGH NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
Sorry bout the rant, I'm just so sick of M$!!!
Re: Everyone Listen, FLash and JAVA
Finally an intelligent post here. Most people are greatly underestimating the potential of Flash MX -- but Microsoft clearly isn't. Because they're worried about where it's going. Flash is not just for animating logos. With the MX version there is very powerful object oriented programming and it is becoming everything that Java based web clients were supposed to be. I built a fast, robust database connected job site using Flash MX and remoting and it works beautifully on Mac and PC and is under 80k. Show me a java based client with the same UI that runs as well on all platforms -- you won't.
Some of the weenies in the web design/development world have to come to grips with the fact that HTML is primitive and weak. Miniusa.com is an example of what websites should be. The internet is going to go through some huge changes in the next 10 years and fortunately a lot of people will be left behind.
Anyway, rumors of Microsoft's interest in Flash is proof of it's potential. Microsoft may be the evil empire, but they didn't get to where they are without paying attention to what everyone else was doing and being competitive. I don't care if they acquire Macromedia as long as they continue to develop for the Mac with the quality of Office X. Love or Hate MS, but those apps are excellent.
Finally an intelligent post here. Most people are greatly underestimating the potential of Flash MX -- but Microsoft clearly isn't. Because they're worried about where it's going. Flash is not just for animating logos. With the MX version there is very powerful object oriented programming and it is becoming everything that Java based web clients were supposed to be. I built a fast, robust database connected job site using Flash MX and remoting and it works beautifully on Mac and PC and is under 80k. Show me a java based client with the same UI that runs as well on all platforms -- you won't.
Some of the weenies in the web design/development world have to come to grips with the fact that HTML is primitive and weak. Miniusa.com is an example of what websites should be. The internet is going to go through some huge changes in the next 10 years and fortunately a lot of people will be left behind.
Anyway, rumors of Microsoft's interest in Flash is proof of it's potential. Microsoft may be the evil empire, but they didn't get to where they are without paying attention to what everyone else was doing and being competitive. I don't care if they acquire Macromedia as long as they continue to develop for the Mac with the quality of Office X. Love or Hate MS, but those apps are excellent.