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Need help choosing between nMP or Dell Precision T3610
- Thread starter BigZero
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I ended up having to reinstall Win8 and then restore the Winclone image onto the clean install. It would not restore without reinstalling bootcamp and it would not even boot into Windows. Luckily I haven't lost anything, except time. I've never had issues like this in Bootcamp with Windows 7, so I have no idea what happened.
I'm also thinking on buying a workstation for intensive processing tasks (matrix multiplying and relational database as a persistence layer mainly).
Although I'm currently more familiar with OSX than Windows, I don't have simpathy for AMD stuff. They operate hotter and I know tons of stories of failures with their GPUs.
The Dell workstation is bigger, but infinitely more user-serviceable. Also, it comes with a (in my opinion) more reliable GPU. Apart from OSX, I don't know a very good reason for buying a nMP thinking on the use I'm planning for a workstation. On the other hand, maybe I'd prefer a Linux environment as Ubuntu seems to be compatible with newer Dell T-Series -- and Quadros seem to perform better on Windows.
I really don't know what to do. I don't trust AMD, but OSX is a tempting "feature" for adopting the nMP.
Although I'm currently more familiar with OSX than Windows, I don't have simpathy for AMD stuff. They operate hotter and I know tons of stories of failures with their GPUs.
The Dell workstation is bigger, but infinitely more user-serviceable. Also, it comes with a (in my opinion) more reliable GPU. Apart from OSX, I don't know a very good reason for buying a nMP thinking on the use I'm planning for a workstation. On the other hand, maybe I'd prefer a Linux environment as Ubuntu seems to be compatible with newer Dell T-Series -- and Quadros seem to perform better on Windows.
I really don't know what to do. I don't trust AMD, but OSX is a tempting "feature" for adopting the nMP.
Are you sure about this? Isn't OpenCL used to accelerate apps like FCPX and Adobe stuff? Strangely enough I have never seen anyone tested the nMP with GPU real-time rendering in 3D apps. So far I haven't decided yet but this is giving me a headache. The Mac is really tempting, but they had to go with AMD. I guess for now its only good for video editing folks and running benchmarks.
I assure you that it is not infinitely more user-servicable. That is if you go by the definition of the word.
Which word... Infinetely or servicable?
Servicable... Yes it is.
Infinitely...not sure.
To quote Enstein: "Two things are infinite. The Universe and human stupidity. I'm not sure about the universe..."
The Dell T3610 has....
... handles.
Smooth, rounded, comfortable to use handles.
So what is your opinion on this? Thank you guys for your time
... handles.
Smooth, rounded, comfortable to use handles.
I have been looking at the same issue lately. I need windows to run some intensive tasks and Paralells or Bootcamp isnt cutting it for me.
So I looked at a Lenovo Erazer X700 (if you can get past the case and LED's) and it seems to be a great machine with the X79 chipset so you can upgrade the CPU's to 6/8 core at a later time. Plus quad channel memory controller! And liquid cooling and very overclockable!
Then I also saw the DELL Precision T3610. Comparing CPU's on Dell to say a Core i7, the performance seems the same. But, the Xeon seems to lack some extensions that the i7 has. These extensions have been on the i series for a while and not sure what software takes advantage of them and what I will be missing by choosing a Xeon... And by buying the DELL am I stuck to buying parts from DELL only or can I upgrade memory and such myself?
So I looked at a Lenovo Erazer X700 (if you can get past the case and LED's) and it seems to be a great machine with the X79 chipset so you can upgrade the CPU's to 6/8 core at a later time. Plus quad channel memory controller! And liquid cooling and very overclockable!
Then I also saw the DELL Precision T3610. Comparing CPU's on Dell to say a Core i7, the performance seems the same. But, the Xeon seems to lack some extensions that the i7 has. These extensions have been on the i series for a while and not sure what software takes advantage of them and what I will be missing by choosing a Xeon... And by buying the DELL am I stuck to buying parts from DELL only or can I upgrade memory and such myself?
.............
Maybe you have a friend or acquaintance owning a nMP.
I believe that having that "thing" in front of you and doing some work with it might change your view of things.
Unless you are already inside decided for the Dell and just need some reassurance...
The T3610 has a unique motherboard and power supply. Memory/CPU/disks/PCIe cards are commodity items - buy them anywhere.
Note that if the Core i7 has quad memory channels, it's the same as Xeon as far as extensions. The Haswell is the one with AVX2 - but I don't think that any quad-channel versions exist.
Also note that the Xeons support 256 GiB of RAM, the Core i7 Extreme only 64 GiB.
Check this Intel comparison chart: http://ark.intel.com/compare/70845,77779,77656,75780
(There's an error for the E5-1650v2 - it supports MMX, SSE, SSE2, SSE3, SSSE3, SSE4.1, SSE4.2, EM64T, AES, AVX .)
The one I looked at had only 4 cores?
Plus, the memory for this computer is very expensive even if you buy it from say newegg.com etc..
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Mr.Shaw, you have made a strong case. Just ordered the DELL precision T3160 with E5-1620 v2
I need hyperthreading and a quadro video card. Have some programs that do severe number crunching that also uses the GPU for calculations. Parellel programming at its best!
Hope this machine will help.
Now I cant afford to have my iMac anymore. It was great. But, now it goes for sale!
Just a wild guess on my part...But I had similar problems while encrypting both my Win 8.1 PRO and OS X partitions on my 1tb SSD. I think what happens is any time either of your partitions resizes itself for any reason then bootcamp deletes the other partition.
When I tried to encrypt the windows partition first, bootcamp would blow away my OS X partition due to the fact that bit locker resizes the existing Windows partition slightly.
Encrypting the OS X partition first eliminated that problem since I don't believe that partition gets resized.
I don't believe a partition can be resized once it's actually encrypted.
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Good news for Dell.
Mr. Shaw was never a friend of the new Mac Pro and I often asked myself if he participates regularly in this sub forum just to convince people how bad it is, while in a Forum for PCs he would have little to add to the opinions of others.
I am not entirely sure your decision is as good news for you as it is for Dell though, but time will tell...
I still believe the Apple Mac Pro is the best mass produced stationary computer presently available and am happy to have one.
There are many brands and models available for sale but the new Mac Pro is a class by itself IMHO and Apple is committed to quality AFAIK.
But either you appreciate the nMP or you don't and the same applies to OSX in comparison to Windows or Linux.
Obviously you don't.
Good luck with your Dell.
First of all let me be clear that I am not getting into the MacPro vs DELL debate. I just got here by searching for DELL Precision workstation.I am not in the market for MacPro. I need a dedicated Windows machine that works without the thousand quirks that bootcamp has.
Plus the price point at which I bought a enterprise class workstation(DELL) I could probably not buy a maxed out Mac Mini and even if I did, Boot camp is.. as Steve jobs said about Blu-ray a "Bag of hurt".
And I didn't make the decision based on comments on this thread. I had already made my decision in the Bootcamp thread in the forum due to overheating issues.
Look I love Mac's. I have bought plenty of MacBook Airs and I still own a rMBP Pro. Sometimes some of us have to work on Windows and wanted a smooth and powerful experience. And for that nothing beats a dedicated Windows machine. I am just playing with Windows 8 which I had been putting off for so long and I actually love it. It's like an acquired taste. The more you use it you will like it.
This whole Bootcamp thing was literally a "Bait and Switch" program from Apple. Apple crippled windows in Bootcamp by not supplying the necessary drives etc..
Why you ask? First of all, I have to download a gazillion fan programs so the fans rpm keeps up with the rising temperature of your Mac's innards.
Next, it won't go to sleep if you any thunderbolt devices connected to it because Apple did a half baked job for it in Bootcamp etc... So I have had it and it has go to go. If a company is not interested in supporting something they advertise? Then I have no reason to keep that product.
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I'm a fan of the new Mac Pro, but I really curiously as to why you think it's in a class by itself. I use HP and Boxx workstations pretty regularly and they're both solid. If it's an operating system argument, then I that might make more sense. But if you're talking about hardware alone, why do you think it's so much better?
I am no tech great expert.
However many people who know much more than I will ever learn say that
1) building a similar powerful computer with those specs would need a huge ugly enclosure.
2) similar components would cost much more if bought separately
I might be wrong but love and admire my nMP more than any of the different computers I previously had.
You are free not to agree.
P.S. I believe that the idea of gathering all the unavoidable heath generated by the different components into one single hollow room, allowing in this way to suck the warm air by a single, large, and therefore quiet moving fan (the only moving part in the whole computer) seems such an obvious solution for the heath disposal problem in any computer, that it should had been adopted long ago.
Instead, manufacturers just added whenever needed a further fan to those already present.
(This includes the previous generations of Mac Pro as well, the 2010-2012 had 8 fans!)
Even my weakest netbook makes therefore much more (fan) noise than a nMP.
So much so that at the end I became used to the noise of any computer or notebook and did not realize it could be different. Fan noise became thus "normal". Human beings are known to get used to permanent working sensorial phenomena to the point they finally are no longer aware of them.
Once I heard that our ears ignore from early childhood molecular generated noise which otherwise would make us mad. (I don't know if it is true, am no expert in that field either).
However to "hear" once my nMP I had to stress it with a Benchmark.
Otherwise only the small lamp tells me if it is on or off.
That is in my opinion reasonable computer design and for the moment I am not aware of any other manufacturer disposing of heath in such a straightforward, simple and ingenious way.
And heath is the factor limiting CPU and GPU speed and performance AFAIK and not a minor inconvenience.
Well, that's my opinion for what it might be worth...or not.
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I am no tech great expert.
However many people who know much more than I will ever learn say that
1) building a similar powerful computer with those specs would need a huge ugly enclosure.
2) similar components would cost much more if bought separately
I might be wrong but love and admire my nMP more than any of the different computers I previously had.
You are free not to agree.
1) It's a workstation, not a work of art... For most task, people just don't care about the look, they need performances first and foremost.
2) False... Read up on the "Apple tax". Just compare the price of ram for exemple.
Thanks, but unfortunately I am not using encryption, so I am still in the dark. I am not having much luck with Windows recently. I managed to fix it and then week I created a third partition to play around with Yosemite and Xcode 6. Now my bootcamp partition won't boot.
Not really. Spec a comparable workstation and Apple's prices are well in line. The cost savings really only come into play when you talk about building your own, and that would be true comparing to any retailer.
Ram is a non-issue since you can easily upgrade through another seller.
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I feel for you. I couldn't believe an app would have permission to wipe a partition with notification. That's a big one. Very sloppy programing if you ask me.
No problems to report so far once I got both partitions encrypted. I'm also doing the same thing on a late 2013 MBP. I'll post back if something happens to mine as well. But so far so good on both. Both computers very responsive so far with either operating system. I do backup everything to play it safe.
Thanks, but unfortunately I am not using encryption, so I am still in the dark. I am not having much luck with Windows recently. I managed to fix it and then week I created a third partition to play around with Yosemite and Xcode 6. Now my bootcamp partition won't boot.
I feel for you. I couldn't believe an app would have permission to wipe a partition with notification. That's a big one. Very sloppy programing if you ask me.
No problems to report so far once I got both partitions encrypted. I'm also doing the same thing on a late 2013 MBP. I'll post back if something happens to mine as well. But so far so good on both. Both computers very responsive so far with either operating system. I do backup everything to play it safe.
RAM is the only part in which you can save money by ordering just the bare minimum of 3x4 GB from Apple and increasing it by yourself.
When the new MacPro was introduced half a year ago there were several blogs in which tech people for sheer technical curiosity added the price of components bought separately trying to find parts as similar as possible. The total amount they reached was higher than the price of the nMP. You can easily google for those comparisons.
I agree that a computer is a machine and function is the main criteria but the old saying "form follows function" has a lot of truth in it.
A car or a watch are also just devices supposed to perform simple tasks.
Still designers invest a lot of work in any device in order to make it successful.
We are not only rational beings but aesthetics plays a great role in our life.
If some device or machine does not work, I agree that no cosmetic make up will replace the malfunction.
But if it works well and besides that brings pleasure to see it in front of you, then beauty is an additional value.