My iMac with 4850 was under $1900 with overnight shipping. Not everyone wants two computers. One for gaming and one for work. The new iMac is a solid desktop and decent at gaming. Also your $500 PC won't have a $700 IPS panel like the iMac.
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New iMac: Nvidia GeoForce GT 130 -or- ATi Radeon HD 4850?
- Thread starter BG-Mac
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My iMac with 4850 was under $1900 with overnight shipping. Not everyone wants two computers. One for gaming and one for work. The new iMac is a solid desktop and decent at gaming. Also your $500 PC won't have a $700 IPS panel like the iMac.
@jmpage2
hope you read the previous post before actually posting, I'm just saying the difference of 4850 and a gt130, will probably be on games, and you would never want to equate mac with games. With all the guys whining about how their iMac freezes every 20 minutes, its not worth the wait and the anguish of having a sucky computer, where you have to wait for a fix.
hope you read the previous post before actually posting, I'm just saying the difference of 4850 and a gt130, will probably be on games, and you would never want to equate mac with games. With all the guys whining about how their iMac freezes every 20 minutes, its not worth the wait and the anguish of having a sucky computer, where you have to wait for a fix.
iMac uses TN panels NOT IPS.. Check out the iMac disassembly the panels are just tn panels form other brands.
Think you'll find that the 24" imac uses IPS, and the 20" imac uses TN.
M
mäkmäk
Guest
130 gt or ati 4850
I got the faulty ati mac 2days ago and I had 3 freezes until now which is really annoying. apart from that I am really happy with my choice.. can not say anything about the speed of the geforce but the ati runs xplane 9 smooth on verz high details and does not even get very hot. but I will have to test a game like crysis to really proof that the ati was a good choice.
another question I have is if it would be better to wait for a fix regarding the ati 4850 freezes or just get apple to replace the whole machine or repair it....??
PS. no freezes yet when wifi is turned off
I got the faulty ati mac 2days ago and I had 3 freezes until now which is really annoying. apart from that I am really happy with my choice.. can not say anything about the speed of the geforce but the ati runs xplane 9 smooth on verz high details and does not even get very hot. but I will have to test a game like crysis to really proof that the ati was a good choice.
another question I have is if it would be better to wait for a fix regarding the ati 4850 freezes or just get apple to replace the whole machine or repair it....??
PS. no freezes yet when wifi is turned off
My advice would be to wait for a fix. You have one year to send your machine back if no fix is released (which I strongly doubt).
Original aluminium iMacs had the same problem and it was fixed by a firmware update. I can't remember how long it took, though. I would say a few weeks at most.
If the iMac "wasn't for gaming" then Apple wouldn't even offer a high end mobile chipset in it like the 4850. What else is it good for? It isn't going to help with work tasks.
The iMac is comparable in price to other all-in-one computers, some of which do decent at gaming.
Is an iMac going to perform like a giant budget PC tower? No, of course not. You are comparing apples to oranges though when you try to compare a $500 budget PC tower with crummy $200 TN panel monitor to the iMac.
Maybe it just burns your back side that the iMac with 4850 card is turning in some respectable gaming benchmarks.
@jmpage2
are you suggesting that apple wants people to run windows on their imac to play games? LOL. anyway, just read what Jack Flash said
You know I don't want to argue about macs in general, I mean, why would I even be here if I hate macs.
I'm just saying that the better buy is the one with the gt130, since you're getting a perfect machine with no hassle, I mean that's why most switchers like about macs right?
The reason you're pointing out is that 4850 gives more fps than gt130, tell you what, there's is no significant difference! you can still play the same games you play in 4850 than that of gt130,
you said it yourself:
That's what I'm saying, the advantages of 4850, (if there is any) isn't worth it . Bottom line is if you want a significant increase of 3d gaming performance than its either you buy a mac pro of build a PC.
are you suggesting that apple wants people to run windows on their imac to play games? LOL. anyway, just read what Jack Flash said
You know I don't want to argue about macs in general, I mean, why would I even be here if I hate macs.
I'm just saying that the better buy is the one with the gt130, since you're getting a perfect machine with no hassle, I mean that's why most switchers like about macs right?
The reason you're pointing out is that 4850 gives more fps than gt130, tell you what, there's is no significant difference! you can still play the same games you play in 4850 than that of gt130,
you said it yourself:
That's what I'm saying, the advantages of 4850, (if there is any) isn't worth it . Bottom line is if you want a significant increase of 3d gaming performance than its either you buy a mac pro of build a PC.
You don't think that a 40-60% improvement in gaming performance is worth $50?
Wow.
The only way it isn't worth it if is Apple is unable to fix the problems.
As to Frankemac guy above, seeing as the lowest price 24" IPS panels tend to run about $500 I would say he's full of it if he says he got a 24" IPS panel as well as that tower for $900.
Not to mention that some of us are willing to pay a bit more for the aesthetics of not having a big black or beige box sitting under a desk with 10 cables plugged into it.
To each their own. You arguing that the GT130 is better "because you shouldn't play games on a Mac anyway" is laughable. Does MS expect people to run games under Windows on their Macs? Yes, they do, or they never would have released Boot Camp.
Duh.
Hey If it was so bad who would buy a Mac Pro? I'm an iMac switcher but Dell's 2209WA is a 22" IPS panel which can be had for $212 or less.
That's not comparable to the 24" IPS panel in the 24" iMac. If a 22" does it for you, then great, but it's a completely different price point device running a different resolution.
The Mac Pro is a great box, but completely over kill for 99% of users. You shouldn't have to get a $3000 box just to get decent gpu performance.
The bottom line is that the 4850 is the most capable GPU that Apple has ever offered in an iMac and is probably going to best performance possible with Mac Pro + 8800GT from just a few months ago.
Pretty good option for those who don't want to run two computers at their desk or for those who don't want to go the frankenmac route.
Ok, had to respond, because wow.
First off, the 50% poll thing is anything but accurate or scientific. A lot of people that would find this website, that thread, etc, would have been searching for resolutions to their problem of a freezing iMac, which is how I found this thread (I don't have a freezing iMac, but I was doing searches on the iMac for possible problems because I just ordered one).
Second, I have read from other threads that just running a fan control program of freezing iMac's that makes the fans kick in sooner has resolved, from what I saw of those complaining and their responses, 100% of the problem. It also seems to be that people not using the WiFi/Bluetooth chipsets dont have the issue. That doesn't make this problem ok, but if I just have to run an App that turns up my fans in order to make the much faster 4850 work just fine until Apple actually fixes it, thats hardly worth giving up a superior video card for.
Finally, To the guy that uses "lol" over and over in his posts and talks about just building a gaming machine and blah blah blah, man, just stop. I am typing this on a Q6600, 4GB, 22" Dell monitor, etc etc computer I built in April last year. Even with shopping around, NewEgg, rebates, all that, it still came out to be $1200, and that doesn't even include the OS or my mouse because I already had a mouse.
Build a computer that matches the iMac, that means a Wireless N network card, speakers, 24" IPS, not 22, and even then, of equal color, brightness, etc. Then add an Operating System, and at least $100 to the cost for a year warranty and phone support. Then add the keyboard, mouse, everything that is comparable that comes with the iMac.
Make it work for a significant amount less than the iMac. Oh and it has to look good too, because with the iMac you are talking an all in one, and not as someone else pointed out a large, loud, box sitting next to you.
No download windows from Torrent sites like a tool, none of that, actual retail stuff here. Yes, you can get the components and build it for less usually, and it might even be faster, but once you add the value of the form factor, the warranty, the OS and other software, there is no way and hell its worth the headache of building it yourself and dealing with DOA equipment, sending crap back if its bad, whatever, and this is coming from a long time computer builder that loves this stuff. There is a difference between doing the hobby because you love it, and being realistic.
And as far as the ATI goes, just get it, there is already a workaround (which we shouldn't have to do, but at least it exists) and even if its not as big a deal now, in two years when you don't already have to trade in your computer it will seem like the damn right choice.
First off, the 50% poll thing is anything but accurate or scientific. A lot of people that would find this website, that thread, etc, would have been searching for resolutions to their problem of a freezing iMac, which is how I found this thread (I don't have a freezing iMac, but I was doing searches on the iMac for possible problems because I just ordered one).
Second, I have read from other threads that just running a fan control program of freezing iMac's that makes the fans kick in sooner has resolved, from what I saw of those complaining and their responses, 100% of the problem. It also seems to be that people not using the WiFi/Bluetooth chipsets dont have the issue. That doesn't make this problem ok, but if I just have to run an App that turns up my fans in order to make the much faster 4850 work just fine until Apple actually fixes it, thats hardly worth giving up a superior video card for.
Finally, To the guy that uses "lol" over and over in his posts and talks about just building a gaming machine and blah blah blah, man, just stop. I am typing this on a Q6600, 4GB, 22" Dell monitor, etc etc computer I built in April last year. Even with shopping around, NewEgg, rebates, all that, it still came out to be $1200, and that doesn't even include the OS or my mouse because I already had a mouse.
Build a computer that matches the iMac, that means a Wireless N network card, speakers, 24" IPS, not 22, and even then, of equal color, brightness, etc. Then add an Operating System, and at least $100 to the cost for a year warranty and phone support. Then add the keyboard, mouse, everything that is comparable that comes with the iMac.
Make it work for a significant amount less than the iMac. Oh and it has to look good too, because with the iMac you are talking an all in one, and not as someone else pointed out a large, loud, box sitting next to you.
No download windows from Torrent sites like a tool, none of that, actual retail stuff here. Yes, you can get the components and build it for less usually, and it might even be faster, but once you add the value of the form factor, the warranty, the OS and other software, there is no way and hell its worth the headache of building it yourself and dealing with DOA equipment, sending crap back if its bad, whatever, and this is coming from a long time computer builder that loves this stuff. There is a difference between doing the hobby because you love it, and being realistic.
And as far as the ATI goes, just get it, there is already a workaround (which we shouldn't have to do, but at least it exists) and even if its not as big a deal now, in two years when you don't already have to trade in your computer it will seem like the damn right choice.
Duh, MS didn't make bootcamp
@VulnoX
Well I'm not a real fan of MS either, but if you're into games, a PC is always better. If you play games in and iMac in windows, that's the same sh%t OS you're throwing in your machine. You'll be getting the same problems as far as the OS is concerned? You get my point?
I'm just saying I'm not buying an iMac for its gaming capabilities. like jmpage2 said which i quote
Nothing I said had anything to do with playing games in Windows or anything even remotely like that.
First off, a PC is not ALWAYS better. For example, World of Warcraft. You get built in functions like video capture and encoding, and iTunes controls that would require extra work on a PC. It also runs damn well, and under the current patch from what I see, people don't see a real performance difference between the OS', and OSX probably stomps Vista in WoW performance.
The only reason OSX would be worse than Windows is if the game didn't run with OSX, but fewer and fewer games are Windows Exclusive, and even beyond that, Windows (from reports) runs faster under Boot Camp than it does on comparable Dell/HP machines made to run Windows, so to say it would be as good or worse to run Windows on a Mac is just false.
I don't have a problem with MS or Windows, I don't get people that do, I have yet to see them do anything so horrible as to make them an enemy. Vista sucked/sucks, but find me a company that has never made mistakes... yeah they don't exist. For that to happen people would have to be perfect and they aren't. I am typing this on a Windows 7 machine, and I friggin' LOVE Windows 7.
My post was to get people to be realistic, which seems harder and harder to find. I have had to respond to people complaining about the Mac Mini saying they could build a PC for $600 that's faster.
THAT'S NOT THE POINT, build one that's the same form factor, and software, power usage, as quiet, etc etc, for the same price. Not happening.
Thats what I saw in this thread too, people saying the iMac should be compared to some home built computer they claim cost $900 with no proof to back it up. Lying to make your point, or even stretching the truth or conveniently leaving things out, isn't going to get anyone anywhere, someone is always checking your work.
oh ok at VulnoX, sorry, I was thinking of jmpage2, you see in our previous discussion,
I'm not a fan of windows either, but I'm just saying, that I don't buy macs just to play games, I buy them for work. So for me its better to get the gt130 option, alleviating myself with the problem. Whatever happens to "it just works" motto.
Anyway guys, if you guys are willing to wait for the 4850 before, this is a better treat!
onlive
Now you can play crysis in absolute MAX settings, even using the slowest of the mac line, or even a macbook air!
Now if you're argument is getting the 4850 because of its 3d gaming performance then this destroys it, you can play any games all at max system even on the slowest mac line
I'm not a fan of windows either, but I'm just saying, that I don't buy macs just to play games, I buy them for work. So for me its better to get the gt130 option, alleviating myself with the problem. Whatever happens to "it just works" motto.
Anyway guys, if you guys are willing to wait for the 4850 before, this is a better treat!
onlive
Now you can play crysis in absolute MAX settings, even using the slowest of the mac line, or even a macbook air!
Now if you're argument is getting the 4850 because of its 3d gaming performance then this destroys it
, you can play any games all at max system even on the slowest mac line
Typo, duh!
And as to OnLive, it's going into BETA this summer, which means we won't see it until the fall or winter at the earliest. Also, we don't know what the performance is going to be like when 1M people start hammering on it.
When you game on your own machine at least you have a general expectation of what the performance will be like.
Anyway back on point I still say get the GT 130. The ati card is turning out to be nothing more than a Harley Davidson. You think you want it - need it - and by all means it's big and fast and shiny - but turns out it's always in the shop for repairs. 7 months or so there will be better bigger faster quad core iMacs with far superior gpu's (or 2) that don't freeze up.
7 months or so there will be better bigger faster quad core iMacs with far superior gpu's (or 2) that don't freeze up. 
I expect you're referring to me even though I didn't once say 'lol' That's unimportant, save for that it discloses that you're someone predisposed to fabricating information favorable to your defense. Since you're interested, I will tell you how much each part cost.
Dell 2209WA - $228.96. Purchased @Dell. (8% sales tax, free shipping)
Antec Three Hundred - $48.59. Purchased @MicroCenter. (8% sales tax, no shipping)
Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P motherboard - 80.00. Purchased @eBay. (No sales tax, free shipping, not used)
Intel Q9400 - $194.39. Purchased @MicroCenter. (8% sales tax, no shipping)
8GB RAM - $43.19 Purchased @MicroCenter. (8% sales tax, no shipping, $40.00 rebate)
22x Samsung Lightscribe DVD drive - $21.99. Purchased @NewEgg. (No sales tax, free shipping)
Samsung Spinpoint F1 1TB - $79.99. Purchased @NewEgg. (No sales tax, free shipping)
Lepoard Retail DVD - $60.00. - Purchased @eBay. (No sales tax, free shipping, not used)
XFX GTX 260 Core 216 - $129.99 Purchased @NewEgg. (No sales tax, free shipping, sold two included games for $20 a piece)
Antec NeoPower 500 - 40.00. Purchased @eBay. (No sales tax, free shipping, not used)
Total: $927.10. Did I have to shop around? Yes, I did. Did I already own an Apple Aluminum Keyboard and MX Revolution mouse? Yes, I did. But don't you accuse me of lying to this forum or stealing my software. I'm not a 'hobbyist' and I didn't run into any headaches building this machine. I built it because my iMac was losing value rapidly at each product release while Apple simultaneously was barely upgrading the new models.
You will complain that it isn't a 1:1 match for the iMac. 802.11n? Add $25. 24" IPS monitor? Add $250. Bluetooth? Add $2. (Yes, $2.00) I will protest, however, saying that I have three year or greater warranties on any individual part. You have to add AppleCare to the Mac's cost to match the coverage. It's difficult to get a genius bar appointment these days (I had a Mighty Mouse with my iMac and getting it replaced required waiting until midnight to pounce at reservation slots) so I don't believe Apple has a distinct advantage there.
Having switched from an iMac and I understand the aesthetics. I suppose the fair comparison would be to a Mac Pro but all the same, I decided that vanity wasn't worth the opportunity cost of this machine. I haven't looked back. I used to run my iMac with smcFanControl to keep it cooler than stock. (Simply too hot to be running 24/7) This new box is quieter than that iMac ever was.
I'm sorry you had difficulty building your computers and I'm sorry you didn't get the best prices you could but your experience certainly doesn't speak for me.
EDIT: I realize I misspoke about the cost of my computer earlier. I had said it cost under $900. This was true at my original purchase before upgrading my video card from a $95 ATI 4850 to the GTX 260. Wanted to add that clarification.
*fans the flames*
These are Mac forums, frequented by Mac enthusiasts. Does anyone else find it really irritating when users flaunt their cheap Hackintosh computers?
Even more so when they act like theyre smarter than the rest of us as if none of us had ever thought of it or we aren't 'able' to build a desktop PC's.
Not only is it a legally dubious point, but frankly its totally out of place.
I only brought up my computer when someone said:
"While you pined and whined for your atImac the last almost 2 months I've been enjoying the best iMac Apple ever made"
I am a Mac enthusiast. I love their software but I got tired of the Apple tax and I don't regret doing it myself. As far as being legally dubious I have to agree. Are EULA's a valid contract? When that's decided in court let me know. I did pay for my copy of Leopard so I don't feel too bad.
You are still comparing Apples and Oranges (nyuck nyuck) here. A noisy, 40lb desktop tower with separate monitor and an all-in-one PC are completely differently priced and we both know that the iMac is an all in one which by itself commands a price premium.
The implication that people here don't have the skill to do their own builds is laughable, and it's long been the running joke in the PC world that Apple peeps are 'idiots' and such statements just try to reinforce that claim.
The reality is that some of us have done plenty of home builds but are looking for more out of these computers. Having something sitting in front of you that's dead quiet, uses very little energy and works correctly out of the box without spending hours updating BIOS, drivers, etc, is well worth it for quite a lot of folks.
It's also important to note that one man's "bargain" is another man's "waste of time".
My time is far too valuable to screw around with a Hackentosh. I have plenty of my own projects that actually generate $$$ to screw around with a DIY Apple rig.