New Mac Pro; Supercomputer on the cheap?

[ssls6]

Are you implying that Apple will use an ultra-deep discount to deliver the new Mac Pro at an ultra-competitive price? I guess they could. But I could also see them using a nearly-at cost discount to make the systems ultra-profitable and just expensive as ever. I mean, it's Apple we're talking about.

Not implying that at all. What I am implying is this "you cannot add the price of a low volume high end card to the mac pro to come up with an estimated price…doesn't work that way".

Apple will price their machines as they see fit. I hope high end BTO's are still affordable but who knows.

 

[FluJunkie]

xGrid was not competitive with the numerous other solutions out there. xGrid is largely proprietary. The other ones aren't. That's one of the major reasons it "lost" over the long term.

You can still create a grid of these Mac Pro. The only thing that is lacking is a Jonny Ive orchestrated GUI sitting sitting on top of the system. That has exceedingly little impact on computational performance.

The main competitive advantages xGrid had at the end was that it was "free" (bundled ... i.e., costs deferred onto whole mac user base) , had a nice GUI, and hooked to some of the OS X Authenticate relatively easily.
None of those have to do with performance.

Yeah - while I miss xGrid, that's just because I miss built-in, Super Easy Mode grid setup. It's still very doable, and there's other solutions that are way more flexible (like say if you also want to join your Friendly Local Linux Cluster) into things.

People are also acting like xGrid was magic. Adding something like automatically writing highly parallel GPU code isn't just a nice feature, it would be utterly game changing in a sector Apple isn't particularly interested in, and where there is lots of active research.

I think that's asking a little much of the folks from Cupertino.

 

[Cubemmal]

I agree with a lot of things here, e.g. the move to GPUs, and as you've said Apple is ahead of the curve.... but a LOT of software isn't with them yet!

Yeah, but Apple has shown no compunctions about going there first with hardware and hoping/forcing others to follow suit.

They will either adjust to align to Apple's strategy (which could be a HUGE and expensive re-think for a lot of vendors), or perhaps they could choose for themselves what processing technology works best for their purpose - which may mean sticking with CPU.

Correct. Regardless they don't have a choice, if Intel has hit a wall there's nothing Apple can do to extend performance gains with CPU's.

When you said single proc is not much faster than last gen, are you talking in terms of GHz??

No, from benchmarks. The just posted benchmark for the new Mac Pro shows an incremental improvement for CPU performance.

 

[pcd109]

I think you have less understanding of marketing than I do. I'll spell it out, they can price these at $4k-$8k and sell none, or they can price them at $2k-$6k (probably for the high end I think) and sell a lot. In which scenario do they make more money?"

There is a thread post started by Tesselator about the macpro(something with facts only). I know i am not the only one, just one of the first who sees this exactly as you. This IS the xMac. I am stumbled how people don't yet realize this! Is just not the EXACT xMac we all wait since the '90, just the..... Apple version of it(xMac without 1-2 open slots). It's going to have a 4-6 core version of it for under 2k. I bet anything on this; the machine is build like this, to be made from cheap(think of dual 'firepro' v4900 at the low end) to ultra high end(dual w9000 'firepros).

 

[Cubemmal]

Probably not true. Consolidating more stuff into the CPU package is going cut down on other latencies. ...

All good points. However I'm a software developer who has lived with all these issues for 20 years. What I'm seeing both for myself and in the industry is that the GPU will be the immediate future.

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There is a thread post started by Tesselator about the macpro(something with facts only). I know i am not the only one, just one of the first who sees this exactly as you. This IS the xMac. I am stumbled how people don't yet realize this! Is just not the EXACT xMac we all wait since the '90, just the..... Apple version of it(xMac without 1-2 open slots).

Exactly. They waited until ThunderBolt came along. Probably because, due to repairs and such, Apple doesn't like customers mucking around inside. Just sell closed boxes. But this one isn't very closed.

They give us all the external expansion we could want, all the GPU we could want to order, upgradable RAM and internal disk (the fastest possible as it is). All in a small and probably highly quiet package. xMac.

 

[Erasmus]

You can probably fit 6 nMP in the space of a "standard" desktop PC.
(It is 1/8th the volume of the oMP but you have other considerations)

Indeed you could. But you could also build your own case, stick 6 small motherboards in it, 6 Hex-core CPUs, and 12 HD7970's, and still be around the same size as an old Mac Pro. The new Mac Pro is totally awesome in my opinion, but it is almost certainly nowhere near competitive in a straight performance/cost basis. It is also not really designed to be cluster-ified, because of the shape. And unlike a standard PC, only comes in one shape-size, which cannot be modified. Let's face it, if noise was no longer an issue, the Mac Pro could probably be shrunk an extra 30% by shrinking that thermal core, putting the components parallel to each other, and ramping up the airflow.

Shame Apple got rid of xGrid.
Should have made it "transparent" with OpenCL IE no extra code to add machines to any application.

I don't think it should be completely transparent, but I think optimally it would be nice if it could detect other devices on the network (both TB and Cat.5) and then give you the choice of using just the local resources, or all detected resources.

 

[brand]

And unlike a standard PC, only comes in one shape-size, and cannot be modified.

You must know an insider at Apple because the new Mac Pro has not even been released yet and you know for a fact that it cannot be modified.

 

[Erasmus]

You must know an insider at Apple because the new Mac Pro has not even been released yet and you know for a fact that it cannot be modified.

Find me a single Apple computer that you can pull apart, and assemble in a completely different geometry.

Do you want to take bets that the new Mac Pro will be able to be disassembled, and reconfigured into a flat rack-mountable PC, and still be covered under warranty?

Above post edited to be more clear that I meant the shape will not be modifiable, not the internal components.