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the more and more this goes on... the more I think there won't be a release this month. With that article on light peak yesterday and reports of apple devices potentially shipping in the second half of the year with lightpeak, i don't think we will see it until WWDC or later, which i'm ok with. I would rather have a mac pro with lightpeak anyway if i'm shelling out that much money.
SO BRING IT ON APPLE WITH LIGHTPEAK IN THE MAC PRO AT WWDC 2010!!!!!!
 
the more and more this goes on... the more I think there won't be a release this month. With that article on light peak yesterday and reports of apple devices potentially shipping in the second half of the year with lightpeak, i don't think we will see it until WWDC or later, which i'm ok with. I would rather have a mac pro with lightpeak anyway if i'm shelling out that much money.
SO BRING IT ON APPLE WITH LIGHTPEAK IN THE MAC PRO AT WWDC 2010!!!!!!

Realistically, lightpeak has absolutely no chance going on Mac pros this year and I doubt we will even see USB 3 on mac till 2011 as well. Intel will need to incorporate these inside the chipset before Apple jumps.
 
Realistically, lightpeak has absolutely no chance going on Mac pros this year and I doubt we will even see USB 3 on mac till 2011 as well. Intel will need to incorporate these inside the chipset before Apple jumps.

not necessarily... intel chipsets don't have firewire like many people have said.. Apple adds it onto an existing chip. They could possibly do that with light peak. And just think what an embarassment it will be not to have the "pro" machine have lightpeak first and instead put it onto an imac or something.
 
not necessarily... intel chipsets don't have firewire like many people have said.. Apple adds it onto an existing chip. They could possibly do that with light peak. And just think what an embarassment it will be not to have the "pro" machine have lightpeak first and instead put it onto an imac or something.

yes, but usb 3 and lightpeak will be on the chipset, so they are likely to wait for it to go mainstream. Apple is not Asus. Sometimes I wish they were.
 
yes, but usb 3 and lightpeak will be on the chipset, so they are likely to wait for it to go mainstream. Apple is not Asus. Sometimes I wish they were.

I get what your saying. But many are saying apple may just skip usb 3 all together and we don't know yet the full tech specs of lightpeak. If the rumors that intel are saying are true, -that devices will be shipping with lightpeak in the second half of the year- then its possible they may just be able to add lightpeak to their existing boards and not make a new chipset yet, otherwise they would have said 2011 which is when usb 3 chip will be tacked onto the new intel chipsets. its possible that lightpeak was designed be just be tacked on. But of course i'm just guessing as there really aren't any hard facts these days.
 
Well, this is likely what is happening, and I'm not happy about it. Although end of 2nd quarter isn't as bad as September. Reported by the French site Hardmac today:

"Intel informed its distribution networks that the 6 core Xeon will only be available in limited quantity until at the end of the second quarter.
If this is what prevents Apple from renewing its Mac Pro range, it could announce the new machines at the time of WWDC, history has shown that they do not forget that the Mac is, after all, still essential to develop software for the iPhone and iPad."

Well, that seals the deal. Not only will Apple not announce new MP's until WWDC, they won't be SHIPPING 6/12 cores until July at the earliest. If Intel says "limited quantity" that means nobody gets them in size. HP is gonna get their fair share, too.

So, announcement at WWDC, new 4 core at 2.8 GHZ for $2400 around June 15, an 8 core at 2.4 or 2.5 GHz for $3300 same time, and 6 cores/12 cores not until early July AT BEST and with a price tag so high our noses will bleed!! 12 cores will be north of $5000, 6 cores MAYBE $3999?

Which means, I won't be getting a new MP, at least not a 6/12 core. I'm stuck down in 4/8 core land. Hmm.... options?
 
Well, this is likely what is happening, and I'm not happy about it. Although end of 2nd quarter isn't as bad as September. Reported by the French site Hardmac today:

"Intel informed its distribution networks that the 6 core Xeon will only be available in limited quantity until at the end of the second quarter.
If this is what prevents Apple from renewing its Mac Pro range, it could announce the new machines at the time of WWDC, history has shown that they do not forget that the Mac is, after all, still essential to develop software for the iPhone and iPad."
Please understand the difference between direct and distributor channels.

Direct is where Intel sells directly to the vendor. They do this as massive quantities are purchased, and shipped over time (result of JIT Scheduling). The pricing, quantities, and delivery dates are negotiated in a contract.

It's good for Intel, as they recoup expenses faster, and therefore turn a profit faster. It's good for the vendor (Apple, Dell,...), as it gets around price volatility (pricing = fixed), and makes sure they've a steady supply of parts to keep the assembly lines running efficiently.

Then there's Distributor channels. Those are what smaller vendors that can't buy nearly as much quantity have to deal with. Intel sells and ships to the distributor (i.e. Arrow for example), and smaller vendors buy from them. The difference is, the availability and pricing is volatile (more expensive, and unpredictable).

Now since the Direct customers are so valued and it's in Intel's financial interest, they get parts first. Anything available beyond those contractual obligations will be sent out as both Retail packaged parts (boxed) and balance of OEM packaged (trays) to the Distributors.

The difference in Direct vs. Distributors is why Dell is already shipping 56xx parts in the T5500. Apple should already have parts in the assembly facility.

The only way Apple would be using Distributor channels, is if their purchase quantities have dropped low enough they can no longer negotiate for direct delivery from Intel (i.e. MP and XServe sales have dropped significantly with the '09 systems compared to previous years).

So it still is more likely that the development start time was delayed due to the iPad (people rotate from project to project). Start late, and you're going to be behind. It really may be that simple an explanation (very possible anyway, and far more probably than lack of CPU's).
 
Well, that seals the deal. Not only will Apple not announce new MP's until WWDC, they won't be SHIPPING 6/12 cores until July at the earliest. If Intel says "limited quantity" that means nobody gets them in size. HP is gonna get their fair share, too.

So, announcement at WWDC, new 4 core at 2.8 GHZ for $2400 around June 15, an 8 core at 2.4 or 2.5 GHz for $3300 same time, and 6 cores/12 cores not until early July AT BEST and with a price tag so high our noses will bleed!! 12 cores will be north of $5000, 6 cores MAYBE $3999?

Which means, I won't be getting a new MP, at least not a 6/12 core. I'm stuck down in 4/8 core land. Hmm.... options?

Hm... if this is going to be the specs: How would a '09 4x2.93 compare to a '10 4x2.8? Don't think I can wait till June.
 
Hm... if this is going to be the specs: How would a '09 4x2.93 compare to a '10 4x2.8? Don't think I can wait till June.

I'd be interested to know just how much performance these new Mac Pro's are likely to bring as I really can't wait till the end of July either.

I'm going to have to push the button in the next two weeks.

If it's less than 20% then I'm not bothered but if it's a 50% to 100% increase then that's a real problem and makes my purchase dilemma a real stupid situation ( my problem though of course)
 
Hm... if this is going to be the specs: How would a '09 4x2.93 compare to a '10 4x2.8? Don't think I can wait till June.
The architecture and core count are the same, so the only difference is the clock. So faster is better in this comparison (applies to both single and multi-threaded applications).
 
Please understand the difference between direct and distributor channels.

Direct is where Intel sells directly to the vendor. They do this as massive quantities are purchased, and shipped over time (result of JIT Scheduling). The pricing, quantities, and delivery dates are negotiated in a contract.

It's good for Intel, as they recoup expenses faster, and therefore turn a profit faster. It's good for the vendor (Apple, Dell,...), as it gets around price volatility (pricing = fixed), and makes sure they've a steady supply of parts to keep the assembly lines running efficiently.

Then there's Distributor channels. Those are what smaller vendors that can't buy nearly as much quantity have to deal with. Intel sells and ships to the distributor (i.e. Arrow for example), and smaller vendors buy from them. The difference is, the availability and pricing is volatile (more expensive, and unpredictable).

Now since the Direct customers are so valued and it's in Intel's financial interest, they get parts first. Anything available beyond those contractual obligations will be sent out as both Retail packaged parts (boxed) and balance of OEM packaged (trays) to the Distributors.

The difference in Direct vs. Distributors is why Dell is already shipping 56xx parts in the T5500. Apple should already have parts in the assembly facility.

The only way Apple would be using Distributor channels, is if their purchase quantities have dropped low enough they can no longer negotiate for direct delivery from Intel (i.e. MP and XServe sales have dropped significantly with the '09 systems compared to previous years).

So it still is more likely that the development start time was delayed due to the iPad (people rotate from project to project). Start late, and you're going to be behind. It really may be that simple an explanation (very possible anyway, and far more probably than lack of CPU's).

This post makes the most sense out of everything I've read regarding the "distributor delay". Let's hope it's true. :)
 
The Light Peak update really has me rethinking the timing of my next Mac Pro. A number ofus are ready for the next generation and ready to purchase.

That said, I certainly don't want to purchase in June / July and then be doing a face palm 7 months or so later when Light Peak rolls out in a Mac Pro.

I was a bit bummed about having to wait until June to purchase - now I'm thinking that is an update that many might avoid knowing what is arriving in the near future.
:confused:
 
The Light Peak update really has me rethinking the timing of my next Mac Pro. A number ofus are ready for the next generation and ready to purchase.

That said, I certainly don't want to purchase in June / July and then be doing a face palm 7 months or so later when Light Peak rolls out in a Mac Pro.

I was a bit bummed about having to wait until June to purchase - now I'm thinking that is an update that many might avoid knowing what is arriving in the near future.
:confused:

Ahh, I thought about this too and I'm sure others have as well. Stop giving me ideas :eek: :p

I've been on the fence too long, not sure if I can skip yet another refresh. But I've also kept in mind the option of getting a temporary iMac i7 until Light peak arrives.

Oh, which also begs the question: Will Mac Pro users without light peak be able to add this in the form of a PCIe later down the road? If so, this may put people at ease that are considering waiting until Lightpeak. I'm sure this must have been discussed somewhere but I think I missed it.

Anyway, this all comes back around to our age old discussion of Apple abandoning the Mac Pro, for a Light peak equipped iMac to replace it. When lightpeak hits, will there even be a Mac Pro? Probably, but just a thought...
 
Taken from the light peak wiki page
Intel has designed a prototype PCI Express card for desktop PCs as an add-on.[13] This would mean many people wouldn't need to buy a new motherboard for the new cable type. The card has two optical buses powering 4 ports. Note that such a card might not be able to keep up with the 40Gbit/s bandwidth of four Light Peak ports. Most desktop motherboards in 2010 have one 16x slot and a few 1x slots. A 1x slot is limited to 4Gbit/s; a 16x slot would be enough, but is usually used for a video card--although 1x video cards do exist, so that it would be possible to put the Light Peak card into the 16x slot.


So... am I correct in understanding that light peak will essentially function as a high end USB alternative? For use with external drives and whatnot? How will these read speeds compare to, say, internal drives?
 
The architecture and core count are the same, so the only difference is the clock. So faster is better in this comparison (applies to both single and multi-threaded applications).

But the '10 would use faster RAM, wouldn't it?
 
You guys are funny. Lightpeak? Intel just demo'ed the technology and they didn't even have a real cable. As long as it takes Apple do do simple refreshes, do you honestly thing that they would uncharacteristically go out on the cutting edge and use lightpeak before even Intel adopts it? Intel has stated that they won't even incorporate usb3 in their chispset till next year and plenty of usb 3 peripherals are already on the market. Lightpeak sounds great, but unless I am missing something here, I seriously would not expect to see it in any mac product until 2011 at a minimum.
 
The Light Peak update really has me rethinking the timing of my next Mac Pro. A number ofus are ready for the next generation and ready to purchase.

That said, I certainly don't want to purchase in June / July and then be doing a face palm 7 months or so later when Light Peak rolls out in a Mac Pro.

I was a bit bummed about having to wait until June to purchase - now I'm thinking that is an update that many might avoid knowing what is arriving in the near future.
:confused:

so your going to hold off buying a refresh that's been over a year in the works because of a technology you can add on at any point later with a simple PCIe card? other than giving up one slot for the light peak card what is it that your concerned about?
 
so your going to hold off buying a refresh that's been over a year in the works because of a technology you can add on at any point later with a simple PCIe card? other than giving up one slot for the light peak card what is it that your concerned about?

Short (not curt) points:

Not sure that there has been any refresh "in the works" for over a year at all.

Adding a PCIe card would enable high bandwidth right up to the point where it connects to the system's bus. The system bus can not be "upgraded". That is a key issue.

Also - while all speculation at the moment - this anticipated refresh will still give us Nehalem architecture at near current clock speeds and TDP - a die shrink to 32nm is good but not sure we will see that much practical performance boost.
 
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