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Ok Anthony - that's an easy bet. Over WHAT time. You seem to think it's short. I seem to think it's longer.

Tell ya what. Gloating rights for you if it's before 2011. After that - I and others get to gloat. Fair?

History has proven over and over that people can/will opt for less expensive and less features. Look at the auto industry. Look at the MP3 player industry. Apple might have dominant marketshare for mp3s - but that hasn't stopped companies like SanDisk from selling thousands of their "inferior" products.

People like choices. Without them - the choice is to buy or not to buy - not WHICH to buy.


You're good at twisting arguments but it's frankly tiresome. I never said choice wasn't good. I simply pointed out - with ample evidence - of where history shows this is all heading.

As for the timeline, too late it's already happened. The e-ink reader market is years old and still extremely tiny by any mass market consumer electronics standard. It's relative standing in the larger marketplace will only shrink from here. Sorry. Game over.


Pix posted to major sites? Which ones exactly are you referring to? Facebook? Picasa? I'm sorry but people are not relying on smartphones to snap photos when it really matters. Vacations, holidays, graduations, etc. I've never heard the following from someone: "Yeah, I sold my digital camera. I just use my smartphone now."

Pricing for every technology drops over time. I read a stat this morning where flat panel TV's have dropped significantly price-wise in the past year. Are you going to argue that less people are buying those TV's?(FYI: They aren't).

This claim that the iPad "should be good enough" is total speculation as an e-reader. Look, I don't expect it to be a horrible experience, but as I stated before reading e-ink and reading off an iPad for an ebook will be two very different experiences. We won't have an answer as to how the competition will play out (iPad vs. current and future Kindle's/Nook's) until allow it to play out. Again the fact that the iPad "does more" is only relevant if you want or need your device to do more. I'm in the market for an e-reader. I love my MBP. I'll get an iPad only if I decide it is a more enjoyable e-reader versus the the Nook or Kindle once it is time to make a purchase. I will not purchase an iPad simply because "it does more". As for it being price competitive to similar sized e-ink readers, this is currently true, but I also think devices like the Kindle DX will go down in price very soon because they can't compete with the iPad at the same price point. I also think a lot of consumers prefer the smaller sized e-readers like the Nook and Kindle. Feels more like holding a paperback in your hand vs. a hard cover book.

Current e-ink hardware will most likely find it hard to compete with the iPad (if the consumer deems the iPad e-reader experiences as sufficient compared to e-ink). But at the same time I also see future e-ink devices coming about later this year that will definitely be viable competitors to the iPad as simply an e-reader device. To quote a previous post: "Some of us want our reading to occur on a surface that behaves like paper. As a reader that's what I want. I will carry my kindle with my iPad."

You prove my point - " I'm sorry but people are not relying on smartphones to snap photos when it really matters. Vacations, holidays, graduations, etc. " EXACTLY. For the other 99.999% of the time, they use their camera phone - smart of otherwise.

As for saying the iPad will be a good enough e-reader being speculation...ummm, NO. I've read on the iPhone. My only complaint? Size. Problem solved thank you very much.


People don't realize this...so let me spell it out.

People who buy the Kindle do so to READ literature. The iPad is a toy and will NEVER replace a true eReader. It is very clear and evident people who think the iPad can replace a true eReader do not read often.

LOL. Literature? LOL. Toy? LOL. You literally make me laugh.

I read what can only be described as "a ton." About 2000 pages/week of scripts (that's 20 scripts/week for the uninitiated) and no fewer than 2-3 books at a time, usually one fiction, one bio, and one history. Since purchasing my K2 the amount I read has only accelerated.

And I will happily shed the 3/4 unnecessary pounds in my bag.

As for being a toy - that's simply preposterous. I'll be using my iPad as my primary computer. Toy? Hardly.

Ridiculous ridiculous ridiculous. If you're going to say preposterous things like that then you're beyond help.
 
People don't realize this...so let me spell it out.

People who buy the Kindle do so to READ literature. The iPad is a toy and will NEVER replace a true eReader. It is very clear and evident people who think the iPad can replace a true eReader do not read often.

The only thing that is evident is that you can't make a good argument. The iPad can most definitely replace a true eReader. How can you not read literature on the iPad? You can read literature and much more. The iPad slays Kindle in functionality.

The only things the Kindle has going for it are battery life and screen contrast. But that only gets you so far. Who reads more than 10 hours a day anyhow?. And if you are reading 10 hours a day, why? Do you not have anything else to do? I have a Kindle. I like it, but frankly I'd rather not have to use a book light to read in bed. I'm fine with LCD technology. I look at my computer all day long, and look at my iPhone all the time too. The whole "e-ink is so much better for you eyes" is marketing hype.
 
The only thing that is evident is that you can't make a good argument. The iPad can most definitely replace a true eReader. How can you not read literature on the iPad? You can read literature and much more. The iPad slays Kindle in functionality.

The only things the Kindle has going for it are battery life and screen contrast. But that only gets you so far. Who reads more than 10 hours a day anyhow?. And if you are reading 10 hours a day, why? Do you not have anything else to do? I have a Kindle. I like it, but frankly I'd rather not have to use a book light to read in bed. I'm fine with LCD technology. I look at my computer all day long, and look at my iPhone all the time too. The whole "e-ink is so much better for you eyes" is marketing hype.

Anthony - I love your enthusiasm even if it borderlines on heretic sometimes :) As we both know - these are your OPINIONS. They aren't facts. But OPINIONS. As are mine. Time will tell. As I said - there's no point in arguing/discussing this "issue". What purpose does it ultimately serve - to be self righteous? To be able to say you made the prediction. Blah - who cares. Whether the kindle lives or dies is of no consequence to me and I own one. I just don't go around waving my hands in the air ready to decry the death of fill-in-the-blank. It's a form of gloating. And prematurely, in my opinion, stomping on a grave which might not be filled in for YEARS.

As for the opinion above I quoted. It's not marketing hype. I understand it's hard for you to believe that people prefer reading on eInk vs other technologies. But they do. Why not have both in the marketplace to appeal to both kinds of people. Why must one go away in favor of another. Stupid.

There are, as discussed here more reasons than just eInk and battery life that appeal to people with Kindles. There's weight, there's price to name just two

You prefer LCD. The next guy prefers eInk. Your opinion and preference is no more important than another persons. Get over yourself and stop projecting your desires on everyone else.
 
You prove my point - " I'm sorry but people are not relying on smartphones to snap photos when it really matters. Vacations, holidays, graduations, etc. " EXACTLY. For the other 99.999% of the time, they use their camera phone - smart of otherwise.

Actually I'm not proving your point one bit. Your ORIGINAL point was that smartphones have significantly eaten into sales of other industries. One example you made was cameras. What I'm attempting to point out is that digital cameras sales have not at all been affected by smartphones. People use digital cameras when the photos really matter. Digital cameras have only grown in popularity as with smartphones. So to state that smartphones have negatively affected the sales of cameras because they also snap photos is completely wrong.


As for saying the iPad will be a good enough e-reader being speculation...ummm, NO. I've read on the iPhone. My only complaint? Size. Problem solved thank you very much.

Wow, that is so foolish to state. Just because you personally have no qualms reading on your iPhone for an extended period of time doesn't mean others will feel the same way. We are a week away from being able to compare for ourselves (reading on an iPad vs. an e-ink screen). As I stated before I look forward to trying out an ebook on an iPad screen to compare with an e-ink screen. But to proclaim that there is no way people will have issues reading books on an iPad is utter speculation at this point.
 
The only things the Kindle has going for it are battery life and screen contrast. But that only gets you so far. Who reads more than 10 hours a day anyhow?. And if you are reading 10 hours a day, why? Do you not have anything else to do? I have a Kindle. I like it, but frankly I'd rather not have to use a book light to read in bed. I'm fine with LCD technology. I look at my computer all day long, and look at my iPhone all the time too. The whole "e-ink is so much better for you eyes" is marketing hype.

I agree good marketing(AKA BS) effort on E-inks part, but note E-Ink contrast is much less than LCD. E-ink is about 20:1 contrast, vs about 1000:1 for LCD. Generally higher contrast is better.

If your reader on LCD allows custom colors, a dark gray text on light gray with your LCD if you want that low contrast look.

So the real advantage of E-ink is battery life and sunlight reading. I doubt it is a enough to stand up to the iPad and onslaught of cheap android tablets.
 
The only reason for a thread like is it that some must fear the Kindle is actually a threat to iPad sales. How many have claimed the iPad will kill Sony e-reader sales? It's ironic to me that the add that shows up most of the time for this thread is indeed for the Sony device.

So lets assume someones with no e-reader is looking for one. Do an e-reader shopping search on google. The top hit, even for variations of the search, is almost always Sony.

Now Steve mentioned the Kindle as inspiration, and as shoulders Apple stood on to build the iPad. Was it for Amazon's Kindle marketplace and the easy access to ebooks it provided? I don't doubt he was impressed how they took his idea for the iTunes store and applied it to ebooks. It doesn't surprise me either that he thinks the iPad can use the idea and he can make a few bucks too if he adds ebooks to the iTunes store.

If the debate is about hardware then it is irrelivent. The mere existence of Kindle apps for the iPhone, PC, and now the Mac says Amazon is interested in making money from ebook sales. Apple wouldn't bother with it's own ebook app if it didn't also think it could make some money now since it has a viable e-reader (the iPad). I'm curious if they would have bothered if Amazon had come out with the Mac version of the Kindle app earlier. Every macbook out there now has access to the Kindle bookstore. No macbook owner needs an iPad for ebooks. A Kindle app for every tablet device to be also makes such quibbles pointless. Unless Apple bans the Kindle app from the iPad, then makes a version of iBook available for macs and PCs and everything else, the iBook app is just another standalone Sony reader. The key thing Amazon owns is syncing your position in a book between any device you have a Kindle app on. Amazon could care less if you buy a Kindle, so long as you still sign up to buy ebooks from the Kindle store. Go ahead and buy an iBook for you iPad, but forget continuing your read on your iPhone while commuting, or at work on your break. Sure, many women will take their iPad along in their purse. Many will buy new purses just so they can. That doesn't make an ibook as everywhere as a kindle ebook can be.

So will the Kindle keep people from buying an iPad? It shouldn't. You don't need an iPad to read ebooks. Now ask if the iBook app will cut into Kindle ebooks sales? I say it won't unless Apple comes up with a parallel to whispersync.

I take all differing opinions. Feel free to pile on. ;)
 
The only reason for a thread like is it that some must fear the Kindle is actually a threat to iPad sales. How many have claimed the iPad will kill Sony e-reader sales? It's ironic to me that the add that shows up most of the time for this thread is indeed for the Sony device.

So lets assume someones with no e-reader is looking for one. Do an e-reader shopping search on google. The top hit, even for variations of the search, is almost always Sony.

Now Steve mentioned the Kindle as inspiration, and as shoulders Apple stood on to build the iPad. Was it for Amazon's Kindle marketplace and the easy access to ebooks it provided? I don't doubt he was impressed how they took his idea for the iTunes store and applied it to ebooks. It doesn't surprise me either that he thinks the iPad can use the idea and he can make a few bucks too if he adds ebooks to the iTunes store.

If the debate is about hardware then it is irrelivent. The mere existence of Kindle apps for the iPhone, PC, and now the Mac says Amazon is interested in making money from ebook sales. Apple wouldn't bother with it's own ebook app if it didn't also think it could make some money now since it has a viable e-reader (the iPad). I'm curious if they would have bothered if Amazon had come out with the Mac version of the Kindle app earlier. Every macbook out there now has access to the Kindle bookstore. No macbook owner needs an iPad for ebooks. A Kindle app for every tablet device to be also makes such quibbles pointless. Unless Apple bans the Kindle app from the iPad, then makes a version of iBook available for macs and PCs and everything else, the iBook app is just another standalone Sony reader. The key thing Amazon owns is syncing your position in a book between any device you have a Kindle app on. Amazon could care less if you buy a Kindle, so long as you still sign up to buy ebooks from the Kindle store. Go ahead and buy an iBook for you iPad, but forget continuing your read on your iPhone while commuting, or at work on your break. Sure, many women will take their iPad along in their purse. Many will buy new purses just so they can. That doesn't make an ibook as everywhere as a kindle ebook can be.

So will the Kindle keep people from buying an iPad? It shouldn't. You don't need an iPad to read ebooks. Now ask if the iBook app will cut into Kindle ebooks sales? I say it won't unless Apple comes up with a parallel to whispersync.

I take all differing opinions. Feel free to pile on. ;)

I'm actually of the opinion that the iPad might actually improve Kindle sales. I think Amazon thinks so too. Otherwise they wouldn't be producing an app for it. It's the same type of thing that Apple does.

They produce a piece of software or hardware that introduces you to the apple way. The iPod for example is a gateway drug, as is iTunes for Windows. You get a taste of what it's like and then you get to thinking, "hrm. I need a new computer, and i love my iPod. What about a mac?" and the rest is history.

"Hrm. I like this Kindle app for my iPhone and iPad, and I find myself reading a lot more I wonder if I should get an ebook reader. Hrm... how about a Kindle? It will sync with my existing software on my iPhone and iPad keeping me in sync." Sold.

I really don't think a majority of people will even use the iPad as a reading device. It's going to be internet and games. Those that want to read will probably be more inclined to get a real ebook reader.

The Kindle and Nook are only going to get better because of the iPad. And that's a good thing.

I do like the open nature in a sense of Amazon. I can use damn near any device I want to view their books now. Can't say the same for iBookstore. At least not yet.
 
Every macbook out there now has access to the Kindle bookstore. No macbook owner needs an iPad for ebooks.

Please call me out if I'm wrong here, but if your point here is to say you can just read books on your Macbook via the Kindle for Mac app, I'll disagree with you. While technically that is true, I downloaded Kindle for Mac for my MBP and was not impressed. Personally I find reading e-books on my laptop to be quite awkward and the app in itself to be rather lacking in many ways.

"The Kindle and Nook are only going to get better because of the iPad. And that's a good thing."


100% agree.
 
Well, my Kindle 2 and DX are on eBay and I already have some nice bidding going on. My wife never bought into the concept since she likes sharing the novels with her sisters, so Kindle 2 has been sitting idle since I bought it last summer. I had really high hopes for the DX and fully planned to get whatever textbooks I can get in Kindle format. Well, I really tried to stay optimistic as I once had hopes for the platform, but consider this:

1) After 2 years, Amazon still didn't manage to settle the issue of s/w shipped with some of the books/textbooks. So you're not getting the s/w that comes with the paper version of the book with your Kindle version. That's cool, I thought. I'll just call Amazon; surely they have figured something out. Nope. They didn't. No offer to download it. Going to the publisher's website yields mixed results. The s/w can sometimes be downloaded at extra cost (which pretty much negates the advantage of the lower price for Kindle book), or there is simply no download available at all.
2) The graphs and diagrams are generally of a pretty low quality. Yes, those screensaver images do look nice, but they're really not representative of what your graph/diagram is going to look like. I tried squinting and squinting, but sometimes the annotations are simply illegible.
3) No page numbers. You get a reference point for the text, but that is not very helpful when you get instructions such as "read pages 57-72." I tried to deal with this also, but it was basically too embarrassing after a while to keep everyone reminding to use a different and more complex reference schemes only to accommodate me.

Yes, the above does not make me exactly sound very optimistic, right? But that's because I'm pretty disappointed. I once had all three versions of Kindle and for leisurely reading it is still a handy thing to have. I would always prefer a Kindle version to a dead tree version. But from the usability perspective, the platform is in my opinion still immature.

Anyway, good bye Kindle. I'll be getting a 3G iPad.
 
I wouldn't bet against Amazon quite yet. The Kindle's eInk screen is much more reader-friendly than any LED screen I have seen. My friend got one for Christmas and damn it looks real. Does that mean I'm going to get one? Probably not.

However, The Kindle app for Mac has me very pleased after the iPhone app. I haven't spent a dime on Kindle hardware but yet can read my Kindle books on two different devices. I mostly use my iPhone, but can use my MacBook Pro as well. Here's my question: Is Apple going to put iBooks on Macs and iPhones or just the iPad? If it's just the iPad, then I may get one down the road. But I'll probably use the Kindle app.

Don't forget that Amazon has a few years head start on Apple. I'm glad they'll have healthy competition from each other. My main concern is how segmented the eBook market is right now. My Kindle books are only good on devices that run Kindle software. Same will go for iPad books because of DRM.

I really don't give a #@%# about ePub or whatever format. We're going down the same road as we did with digital music because publishers are so scared of piracy. Well, all music from iTunes has been sold without DRM for a year, all of Amazon's for longer. Is the music industry gone? NOOOOOO.

So I forsee a few years of screwing around with scared -- more like skeert -- publishers before they all do some DRM-free eBooks that play on any device.

The whole market has a lot of maturing to do. Nobody even owns an iPad yet people are giving it the gold medal. I assume it will do well, but I just won't be able to get one to start. I hope Apple opens iBooks to iPhones and Macs because I'd like to see what the experience is like.
 
A number of Mac-Rumors readers have reported that Apple has placed preauthorization holds on their credit card accounts for i Pad pre-orders placed earlier this month. The holds represent a check to ensure that sufficient credit is available.I want to know suggestion from others.
 
I don't know it will do ultimately, but it definitely affects Kindle sales negatively.

I mean, just in my case alone I was very interested in buying a Kindle after Christmas in January. But with all the rumors of an Apple tablet with eBook functionality I thought I'd wait it out.

What happened? I went from having the Kindle in my shopping cart and undoubtedly set to buy it, but now I have no interest in it and would rather a much more functional device like an iPad.

One sale lost. Many to come.
 
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