The problem is that iTunes now has many movies in 4K that are not available on UHD disc, and at the clip they are adding 4K versions I don't see that changing anytime soon. In those cases the iTunes version is arguably the best version available (in my experience iTunes 4K streams are overall better than standard Blu-rays in terms of image quality).
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Oppo Digital to cease production
- Thread starter Macalicious2011
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
I think you're jumping the gun a bit. While the physical disc market is obviously in decline, it's still significant. Oppo's problem wasn't so much that they made a UHD player, but that they made a $500+ UHD player. This is just a very small niche market. But other UHD players have been on sale for less than $100 recently.
Personally I'm sorry to see Oppo go. I don't have their UHD player, but I do have an older Blu-ray player (BDP-93) which is still going strong and doesn't just play 2D and 3D movies, but also DVD Audio and SACD. The build quality is excellent and their service is second to none.
I doubt that TV sets are going away anytime soon. As a data point, Netflix recently disclosed that 70% of Netflix's streams are consumed on TVs.
I would never watch a movie on a phone. Actually, even TVs are too small; a projector with a 120+ inch screen is where it's at.
I too have the BDP-93 and think it's fantastic. It was expensive but has been worth it. I hope it lasts a long time, now. Sorry to see OPPO go.
[doublepost=1522867295][/doublepost]While I understand that video streaming is the preferred mode for watching TV and movies generally, there are still a lot of us who purchase discs for their portability, e.g. DVD players for the kids in the car or portable dvd players to be used on vacation or when visiting relatives who don't have a streaming service. I've been taking discs to someone in a nursing home who has a dvd player but no internet.
Internet service is also still unreliable in many areas of the US and downloading a video can take 30 minutes or more, not to mention frequent buffering, not to mention Netflix or Internet providers throttling high quality video after certain data limits are reached.
Some movies and TV shows are only available on a rotational basis or for a few months at a time through Netflix or every few years, e.g., Disney
In short, I think that there will always be a place for people who find discs more reliable,always available, and less expensive than multiple rentals or even purchasing from premium priced iTunes.
For goodness sake man, it's only a damn disc or film. It's not life changing - it's not having healthy food taken from you or airplanes grounded for life. It's a damn film in a home which, let's be truly honest, hardly, hardly adds real value or quality to most people's lives. Let's be truly honest here! It's a method of true, basic, bland entertainment. Period! It doesn't really add value to ones life!
But what does?
Is high-fidelity music any different from film?
PS I think this can get very pesonal-individual
What adds value to ones life is entirely up to the person. Movies can take you to places you can't go, show you things about the world you can't see, experience things you may not otherwise be able to. Movies can be transformative.
Or it can simply be a hobby. Everybody is in to something different for their own reasons.
Most people cannot travel as you do. We have families. Our kids are in school. They have activities. We own our homes and thus we spend our weekends often times maintaining the house and yard. Having a large, quality tv and watching movies and TV is something we enjoy. There are other things we enjoy as well. We get together regularly with friends. We camp as we are able which is about 6-7 times a year. Once every few years, if money allows, we get on a plane and go somewhere. Usually vegas as it's the cheapest vacation we can generally afford. This is just what life is when you have a family and own your home.
I'm going to make an assumption here. And correct me if i'm wrong. You're young, probably mid 20's, you don't own your own home, not married and no kids? For one who travels you have a very single minded view of the world.
Last edited:
It is sad as it clearly represents the begining of the end for high quality physical media players. However, I don't think it's as clear cut as an end to physical media.
In the UK, it seems like UHD is badly failing as there are so few titles available (WhatHifi stated "over 200" in March) compared to the US and the prices are stupidly high. But I would consider Blu Ray to be a failure in the UK too - not many people I know have a player and it's still very rare to find Blu Rays in charity shops (and I've looked in quite a few non-London regions).
In the US it was reported last year that UHD Blu Ray had got off to a much better start than Blu Ray which had surprised the studios and is likely why we're seeing a surge in catalogue 4K releases. I was living in the US when 4K discs launched and there were special areas in Best Buy and Walmart for 4K discs (even in rural Indiana) so I think it was getting a push.
However, I think the main reason higher quality discs have failed to go fully mainstream is that DVDs are 'good enough'. I know so many people who have large HD tvs and still watch DVDs or Freeview SD - people just want bigger, not better! I'm sure profits and DVD sales are down a lot, but that's because if someone wants a DVD they can get it for under £3 from a charity shop or Amazon Marketplace second hand (which, of course won't be recorded as a sale). When you think about whey DVD was such a success it was simpy because if offered so many benefits over VHS: smaller physically, no rewinding, no degradation, instant playback/chapter skips, special features, whole seasons of shows in one set. Improved picture and sound were likely far down the list of benefits for most people. Now look at Blu Ray and 4K - what do they offer over DVD? A better picture and sound - not really enough for the average man on the street to get excited about. What about streaming? That offers not having to buy a film in advance, no physical size at all, no chance of loosing or scratching a disc and again, better quality picture/sound (if they plump for HD/4K) is probably down the list of benefits most people consider. The down side of streaming is internet speed, but as Netflix will work with only 2 mbps for SD this likely won't be such an issue by the end of the decade.
Where does UHD go from here? Hard to say - I think the disc market for new high-profile releases and famous catalogue titles (e.g. BTTF, Star Wars, Aliens, Indiana Jones etc) will remain strong for collectors, but indie films (e.g. Lady Bird) and catalogue films that have faded from memory (e.g. Copycat to pick a random example) likely will remain limited to streaming. Players will be provided by the regular CE companies - but I don't think prices will come below the magic £100 mark for a good while.
In the UK, it seems like UHD is badly failing as there are so few titles available (WhatHifi stated "over 200" in March) compared to the US and the prices are stupidly high. But I would consider Blu Ray to be a failure in the UK too - not many people I know have a player and it's still very rare to find Blu Rays in charity shops (and I've looked in quite a few non-London regions).
In the US it was reported last year that UHD Blu Ray had got off to a much better start than Blu Ray which had surprised the studios and is likely why we're seeing a surge in catalogue 4K releases. I was living in the US when 4K discs launched and there were special areas in Best Buy and Walmart for 4K discs (even in rural Indiana) so I think it was getting a push.
However, I think the main reason higher quality discs have failed to go fully mainstream is that DVDs are 'good enough'. I know so many people who have large HD tvs and still watch DVDs or Freeview SD - people just want bigger, not better! I'm sure profits and DVD sales are down a lot, but that's because if someone wants a DVD they can get it for under £3 from a charity shop or Amazon Marketplace second hand (which, of course won't be recorded as a sale). When you think about whey DVD was such a success it was simpy because if offered so many benefits over VHS: smaller physically, no rewinding, no degradation, instant playback/chapter skips, special features, whole seasons of shows in one set. Improved picture and sound were likely far down the list of benefits for most people. Now look at Blu Ray and 4K - what do they offer over DVD? A better picture and sound - not really enough for the average man on the street to get excited about. What about streaming? That offers not having to buy a film in advance, no physical size at all, no chance of loosing or scratching a disc and again, better quality picture/sound (if they plump for HD/4K) is probably down the list of benefits most people consider. The down side of streaming is internet speed, but as Netflix will work with only 2 mbps for SD this likely won't be such an issue by the end of the decade.
Where does UHD go from here? Hard to say - I think the disc market for new high-profile releases and famous catalogue titles (e.g. BTTF, Star Wars, Aliens, Indiana Jones etc) will remain strong for collectors, but indie films (e.g. Lady Bird) and catalogue films that have faded from memory (e.g. Copycat to pick a random example) likely will remain limited to streaming. Players will be provided by the regular CE companies - but I don't think prices will come below the magic £100 mark for a good while.
The xbox one S/X has killed stand alone BD players. I own the samsung UBD-K8500. I got it before the one S was out. If I had to do it over again, I would have gotten the one S. It is hard to compete with a great all-in-one solution. I doubt I will ever buy a stand alone BD player again.
A comment on DVD from kiranmk2, I also wonder how many actually watch 1080p disks and indeed the SD TV channels linger for some ungodly reason (in the UK). Overheard conversations in the usual shops flogging TV's seem to indicate shiny new is in rather than understanding what the shiny does and is capable of.
Buy TV, take some then watch soaps in SD. High end and capable TV's must be screaming out in frustration across the globe for the material they are being fed.
Problem for hardware is when IP was first mooted this dying of hardware was always on the cards, just a matter of when, I think that in the UK we have a better deal with download speeds, smaller country, easier to cable up. Pushing 1's and 0's around on networks will win in the end.
When Oppo 4k player came out, personally, I could not see much in the reviews that would lead me to their door apart from brand buying and cheaper options were around. My player sits behind a smoked screen (cannot see any displays) and if a cheaper 4k will do the same job visually, well, I get the cheaper option in this case. I expect disks to linger for a while though wonder what will happen when 8k comes along.
For that total shift to IP to happen wholesale though needs the bandwidth and cheap at that to reach a lot of people. I expect a mix of both for a good few years. It would be nice to get a better streaming option for those that can.
Buy TV, take some then watch soaps in SD. High end and capable TV's must be screaming out in frustration across the globe for the material they are being fed.
Problem for hardware is when IP was first mooted this dying of hardware was always on the cards, just a matter of when, I think that in the UK we have a better deal with download speeds, smaller country, easier to cable up. Pushing 1's and 0's around on networks will win in the end.
When Oppo 4k player came out, personally, I could not see much in the reviews that would lead me to their door apart from brand buying and cheaper options were around. My player sits behind a smoked screen (cannot see any displays) and if a cheaper 4k will do the same job visually, well, I get the cheaper option in this case. I expect disks to linger for a while though wonder what will happen when 8k comes along.
For that total shift to IP to happen wholesale though needs the bandwidth and cheap at that to reach a lot of people. I expect a mix of both for a good few years. It would be nice to get a better streaming option for those that can.
Wow, what a load of bluster and nonsense.
Nobody is consuming media on a wrist watch. Nobody. People watch YouTube and the odd thing on their phones, when they're on the bus/train, but that's it. 4K TV sales are doing just fine, better than fine, because ultimately quality genuinely does matter.
4K discs will never be as big as blu-ray which in turn will never be as popular as DVD, but they serve a useful purpose and will be around for a good while. Plenty of people still love film and nothing in the home can rival the quality of a 4K disc on a high end OLED screen with an Atmos sound set-up. You may be happy to see quality go down the toilet but many of us aren't, which is why it won't.
Last edited by a moderator:
Too bad. I bought the OPPO 4K player last fall and love it. I stream most of what I watch but there are plenty of discs, particularly European operas, that will never stream. And I get 4K discs for particularly important movies since the quality is noticelably better with the disc.
________
They priced themselves out of business...more expensive than the Best Betamax when $1200 was real money.
I've owned an Oppo UDP-203 for well over a year and it has been one of the finest pieces of audiophile equipment I've encountered. They did frequent firmware updates and the picture quality and sound from 4K UHD disks is not comparable to streaming from an Apple TV 4K, Roku Ultra or other streaming device.
Picture quality is getting close with streamers but they can't handle the amount of bandwidth that a dedicated player can. As far as sound quality when I want to be immersed I pick a disk that has Atmos and enjoy the theater-like atmosphere as I watch the movie.
Streaming is what killed Oppo and consumer choices for something similar are very limited, especially if you want Dolby Vision and 4K HDR.
Picture quality is getting close with streamers but they can't handle the amount of bandwidth that a dedicated player can. As far as sound quality when I want to be immersed I pick a disk that has Atmos and enjoy the theater-like atmosphere as I watch the movie.
Streaming is what killed Oppo and consumer choices for something similar are very limited, especially if you want Dolby Vision and 4K HDR.
You do realise that a DVD does not even play at the correct speed here in the UK and Europe as a PAL standard?
You simply cannot talk about quality when a film does not even sound correct! If you try, right now, a piece of music set at +4% in pitch you'll hear for yourself and you'll b horrified!
4K Dolby Vision iTunes films to me certainly are not of toilet quality. My old BluRays often are as were DVD and VHS/Betamax/Video2000/Video 8 in comparison. I happen to find iTunes 4K films are rather lovely
If quality does matter, then why are there so many cheaply made TV 4K sets around by LG, Samsung, Hisense etc etc.
But then again, I don't know anyone with a Atmos home cinema or OLED TV - just not our thing
But then again, I don't know anyone with a Atmos home cinema or OLED TV - just not our thing
Then stop bashing those who do enjoy maximum quality video and audio because it is "their thing"
Oppo Digital (no relation to the Oppo phone), the gold standard for Blu-Ray & UHD players, announced they are shutting down operations:
https://www.soundandvision.com/content/oppo-shocks-av-world-plans-exit-ce-business
Over the years I have had multiple generations of the OPPO players. They are built like tanks (the 205 is 22 pounds!). They can have a high resale value. I sold my ~3 year old BDP-95 for 77% of the price I paid for it new!
Video quality and audio quality is stellar. You can split HDMI audio and video, sending the HDMI video output directly to the TV and the HDMI audio output to your sound bar or receiver.
Running Plex via the native DNLA client on the Oppo (no gui, alas) it decodes every audio and video codec that I throw at it. Plex doesn't have to do any transcoding! Running a Blu-Ray rip with DTS-MA this way is identical to viewing the original disk. Only forwarding/reversing shows the limitations of streaming.
Although the new UHD UDP-203 is still available, the more expensive UHD UDP-205 is not. It includes a second HDMI in port, so you can use the Oppo as a limited HDMI switcher. It has a headphone jack, and a long list of audio and video improvements:
https://www.oppodigital.com/KnowledgeBase.aspx?KBID=131&ProdID=UDP-205
Waiting for the LG OLED Black Friday sale 2018, my plan has been to get the 205 so I don't have to also replace my non-UHD receiver/HDMI switcher. Unfortunately I just discovered the (expensive) 205 is now sold out. Oppo is considering doing one final production run if enough people show interest by signing up at:
https://oppodigital.com/blu-ray-udp-205/lastbatch.aspx
I have my fingers crossed that they do this final run.
https://www.soundandvision.com/content/oppo-shocks-av-world-plans-exit-ce-business
Over the years I have had multiple generations of the OPPO players. They are built like tanks (the 205 is 22 pounds!). They can have a high resale value. I sold my ~3 year old BDP-95 for 77% of the price I paid for it new!
Video quality and audio quality is stellar. You can split HDMI audio and video, sending the HDMI video output directly to the TV and the HDMI audio output to your sound bar or receiver.
Running Plex via the native DNLA client on the Oppo (no gui, alas) it decodes every audio and video codec that I throw at it. Plex doesn't have to do any transcoding! Running a Blu-Ray rip with DTS-MA this way is identical to viewing the original disk. Only forwarding/reversing shows the limitations of streaming.
Although the new UHD UDP-203 is still available, the more expensive UHD UDP-205 is not. It includes a second HDMI in port, so you can use the Oppo as a limited HDMI switcher. It has a headphone jack, and a long list of audio and video improvements:
https://www.oppodigital.com/KnowledgeBase.aspx?KBID=131&ProdID=UDP-205
Waiting for the LG OLED Black Friday sale 2018, my plan has been to get the 205 so I don't have to also replace my non-UHD receiver/HDMI switcher. Unfortunately I just discovered the (expensive) 205 is now sold out. Oppo is considering doing one final production run if enough people show interest by signing up at:
https://oppodigital.com/blu-ray-udp-205/lastbatch.aspx
I have my fingers crossed that they do this final run.
The dude seriously wants everyone know how much he travels, and seems to think highly of himself for it. Personally, I’d rather own my home than spend a bunch of money on traveling here, there, and everywhere. I’m perfectly satisfied with taking a vacation once every year or two if it means I own a home, a decent car, and have lots of toys to play with.
Last edited:
You do realise that a DVD does not even play at the correct speed here in the UK and Europe as a PAL standard?
You simply cannot talk about quality when a film does not even sound correct! If you try, right now, a piece of music set at +4% in pitch you'll hear for yourself and you'll b horrified!
4K Dolby Vision iTunes films to me certainly are not of toilet quality. My old BluRays often are as were DVD and VHS/Betamax/Video2000/Video 8 in comparison. I happen to find iTunes 4K films are rather lovely
If quality does matter, then why are there so many cheaply made TV 4K sets around by LG, Samsung, Hisense etc etc.
But then again, I don't know anyone with a Atmos home cinema or OLED TV - just not our thing
BDs and 4K BDs play at exactly the right speed in the UK. At 24fps. If you don't have decent equipment you'll end up with 3:2 pulldown which looks terrible, but the speed will still be correct.
Pitched audio is a side effect of forcing 24fps content into a 25fps stream, which affects broadcast but not BDs.
I think the Xbox definitely cut into stand alone player sales when it first launched, but you can regularly get stand alone players for ~$100.
I've had the opposite experience. I use an Xbox One S, and if I could do it all over again I'd get a standalone player.
- The user interface is not geared towards home theater--instead it is focused on gaming, social media, advertising, and other crap I care nothing about.
- The spinning disc is audible all of the time, except perhaps when loud scenes drown it out.
- For some reason the disc is always spinning even if I am using streaming apps.
- Doesn't support Dolby Vision.
- Using a controller is terrible compared to a remote. After many many months I am STILL not used to it. Even worse, I have to wake/sync the controller before using it, so there is a long delay.
Most of the threads I've seen concentrate on the media players. Oppo was/is more than that. They produced the highly rated PM-1 and PM-3 headphones, the HA-1 DAC, the Sonica speaker. Given that the headphone market is exploding, and DACs are becoming much more common, all this focus on streaming killing physical media doesn't explain their closing. Something else seems to be going on. I had a meeting in the same building that houses their corporate headquarters today. Should have gone in and asked.
Was reading about this on another home theater forum. They make one of, if not the best, blu-ray 4K players. Sad to see them go!
Agreed. 4K quality on Netflix and Amazon is poor, barely better than Blu-ray. The bitrate is way too low (15Mbps in the UK).