I'd bet the premium they charge for the Mac App Store version hurts them. The regular individual subscription is $2.99/month through their site but $3.99/month on MAS, and there is nothing on MAS mentioning the difference, so it looks (and is) very overpriced. I'd rather buy through MAS because then I could use discounted iTunes credit but they charge so much more on MAS there's no point.
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Password Managers for 2017
- Thread starter maflynn
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You're aware that 1Password has been doing this since day 1, right?
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It doesn't hurt AgileBits at all. Apple takes a 30% cut, so they're essentially making the same amount (they're actually making about 20¢ less on MAS sales). So dollar-wise, there's almost no difference. But they get a lot of exposure on the MAS, and that's worth a lot time/money.
Then figure in that most of their customers are existing customers who understand the value of buying each way. You aren't losing those customers, for the most part.
Newbie consumer customers are going to buy from the MAS because it's the only way they know how. No harm to them this way, either.
But to your point, the average "Joe Consumer" is going to see a $1 difference and not realize that you're paying $1 for convenience and not much more.
Playing the Devil's advocate, but perhaps those developers are unable to earn a living with appropriately priced apps.
Also consider the race to the bottom, back in the day, it was not unheard of to pay 80 dollars for an application, now people complain about spending 15 dollars. Today's applications are much more involved, complicated and time consuming to build but people thing an appropriate price app is 2.99 thanks to Apple's app store success.
My complaint about subscriptions are you getting value, and this model turns into a death by a thousand paper cuts. all of a sudden I have a half dozen subscriptions of nice to have apps, and not so much used apps, and I'm paying 100 dollars a month or more.
If you're referring to 1Password. My apologies if not.
The pricing difference is not different at all. Having the price be different on our website vs the App Store (or Mac App Store) is against the rules. The difference is because our website allows you to use an Annual subscription, which we offer discounted pricing on. The App Store (or Mac App Store) only offer monthly pricing at the moment. We're looking at bringing both options in a future update. This would level the pricing, but we didn't know what kind of demand there would be so focused on monthly to start.
Does anyone have a suggestion for an office-wide password manager. We have 100s of accounts and need it to be shared between the staff members, permissions levels would be great too. I was thinking last pass, since I use that personally, but I am open to other suggestions.
I also bought 1Password for both my iOS and Mac two or so years ago when at sale prices. They have continually been upgraded without any additional expense. What was not part of the original post is that 1Password with its basic features is free on the iOS devices. The basic features are more than adequate for most people.
I really don't like subscription business model because i keep technology for such a long time before I feel it needs to be upgraded. I am still happily using Adobe CS 6 which meets and even exceeds most of my needs.
Agile Bits spent a lot of time on MR claiming that standalone was going to get supported as much as the subs, but look at the way they treat it in their website, and look at how the support on Windows has withered. They can say what they like, but they have decided standalone users are second class.
They used to be a good company. Not sure what happened but I wouldn't trust them as far as I could spit them now.
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Agilebits are undoubtedly pivoting towards a subscription model. That's a commercial decision.
But I definitely take umbrage about your 'spit' phrase. I don't necessarily like their direction, but at no point have I ever felt the need to question their trustworthiness. AB have been undone by their generosity by not charging for upgrades when almost all other companies would. At all times their staff here and on their own forums are professional. You name me a company that interacts with their customers in the same way?
I might have to make a decision on my password manager based on price, but at no point will it be based on a loss of trust.
Hi Steve,
Thanks a ton for the kind comments. From one perspective I can totally understand some of the complaints and concerns I've seen in this thread. On the other hand, it cuts pretty deep when people just assume we're out to get them in some way. I've had a lot of terrible jobs in the past, and worked for places that haven't cared much about their customers. AgileBits is not that at all, and I think you've nailed it pretty well that our generosity in the past sort of set a standard by which we are now being judged.
Version 3 was available for Mac was available from November of 2009 and we updated it for free for existing users until October of 2013 when we released version 4 as a paid upgrade. Even though it was a paid upgrade any users who bought in the entirety of 2013 got a free upgrade to version 4, that's 10 months of past purchases that we upgraded free of charge.
We did a similar thing with the iOS app, when we released version 4 we upgraded users who purchased in the last month for free. Since the App Store doesn't allow this really it was difficult. We did two things, first we used our allotment of promo codes, second, we reimbursed people who showed us receipts via PayPal, and third we gifted the app to others that we were able to do, I guess a fourth was we purchased gift cards as well. This was an absolute mess for us and I can only imagine cost us way way more than it should have, we caught several people trying to cash in multiple times, I can only imagine others got away with it but never got caught.
Likewise with Windows upgrades, we were very generous with users who purchased version 1 and we released version 4 (there were now version 2 or 3). I forget the exact details but i believe it was any user who purchased within the same year and anyone who wrote in to ask or bugs were fixed in version 4 but the user wasn't upgraded.
We did a similar upgrade/swap thing with 1Password 5 for Mac when we released a new version that couldn't support iCloud sync on our webstore version of the application. We re-imbursed, issued refunds (well outside of our 30 day window and up to the maximum of credit card processing limits), purchased gift cards, reimbursed via PayPal, and any other methods we could come up with until it just simply became so overwhelming that we had to stop doing it.
I'm only mentioning this because sometimes I feel like the users who are upset the most aren't aware of the hoops we've jumped through to help users in the past. Or they are aware and are expecting us to keep doing it. The bigger we've gotten the more difficult these things have gotten for us. But one thing hasn't changed, we've always tried to do what is right by our users. We may not get it correct every single time, but we certainly try our best.
So thank you for your kind comments and thank you for your trust. Hopefully we will continue to earn it.
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Hi Max,
I'd be curious to think why you think we're not a good company now? It's an honest question and I'd love an honest answer.
We still sell standalone licenses, they're available here and we also offer them within the Mac App Store application. You just have to start the app and during setup choose to use a standalone vault (under the More Options menu) and after that it'll allow you to purchase a standalone in-app purchase.
As for why we don't point users to the standalone licenses on the webpage, this is a clear decision we made to avoid confusion.
We whole heartedly believe that the 1Password.com service is the best place for new users to start. It offers a number of features and benefits that make new users introduction to 1Password significantly better. I'm happy to discuss those if you wish.
But we are the same people we were when you started using 1Password. I've been here for over 5 years and while the number of people on our team has changed the same people are steering the ship. What has changed rather significantly is the average user of our application is no longer a tech expert. I suspect many on this forum take for granted that they are what we'd consider power users or technically literate with computers. As we got more popular we also started getting a lot of users who want to be secure but are not power users. My mom has struggled with using 1Password for years and we're trying to make some real progress in making 1Password easier to use for these users and also remove complications that confuse new customers. The subscription options help in a number of ways:
1. No more having to decide which licenses are necessary to purchase. Before subscriptions our sales team had to try to determine what many users needed because users weren't always able to figure that out for themselves. Licenses are confusing to users (in general, they may not be to you), but subscriptions allow us to allow users to have access to every single one of our applications for one fee.
2. Family sharing is something becoming more and more common. Shared netflix passwords are just the beginning of it. Setting up and maintaining additional vaults to share with people has traditionally been complicated and we couldn't find easy ways to make it significantly better with 3rd party sync services, thus our subscription helps alleviate all of those complications. Create a vault, add a person, instantly that vault appears on the other person's devices. No password necessary, no configuration necessary, just instantly there.
That's just the tip of the iceberg but this is why we're pushing the subscriptions so hard, we really do believe it helps more people. For power users who want standalone licenses, they're still for sale just not right there in front. Doing so would mean another choice that has to be made and the majority of users are better off with the subscription option not the standalone license. We're trying to help more people. It's really as simple as that. There's no ill intent or anything happening here.
You can certainly disagree with our decisions, but I don't think this has made us a bad company.
I'm not Steve or Max, but I'm glad to see you following up here in the forums
Happy to chime in when I can. I'm no longer full time support at AgileBits. I'm on the iOS and Mac development teams, so I don't have the time to devote to keeping up with all of the various places I used to try to keep up with. I also don't like getting involved in some of these discussions because they're not always just about 1Password and I feel a bit scummy when I interject in threads that are clearly more general and not specifically about 1Password.
In the end I just want to help though. If anyone here has specific questions about 1Password I'm happy to answer them to the best of my ability.
1Password is still the go to tool for private and confidential information.
As long as there is a stand alone version, that does not force me to use a remote/cloud server then I'm okay. Just keep the WLAN server syncing.
Thank you as well AGKyle and Agilebits for the free upgrades over the years. They have always been appreciated and welcomed. I've even paid for upgrades when needed.
Mostly though, don't force users down a single path or force users to use a single service. Choice is good and allows 1Password to meet a lot of different people's needs.
As long as there is a stand alone version, that does not force me to use a remote/cloud server then I'm okay. Just keep the WLAN server syncing.
Thank you as well AGKyle and Agilebits for the free upgrades over the years. They have always been appreciated and welcomed. I've even paid for upgrades when needed.
Mostly though, don't force users down a single path or force users to use a single service. Choice is good and allows 1Password to meet a lot of different people's needs.
I don't make these decisions so I can only pass your feedback along.
Have you tried using our 1Password.com membership? It comes with a 30 day trial and if someone here needs more than 30 days to try it I'm happy to look into increasing that if it makes sense.
I get this feeling that some of the people here are unhappy about the subscription cost, but others are unhappy that they can't sync with <insert favorite service>, and maybe a few others are concerned about security. I'd be really curious to hear which things people are actually concerned with because it's very confusing that people lump one of those into "I hate subscriptions" when it's a bit more subtle than the blanket statement of "subscriptions."
So if anyone wants to discuss whatever the real issue I welcome it. If I'm going to pass information along to our management team I would hope I could pass along valuable information beyond "Well, the users say they hate subscriptions"
as i said i am 1password user, from the early days, i do recommend to all the people i see use weak passwords.
i am a so called power user? no i am just a regular guy who loves tech, love well made apps.
I did not notice that 1password had now a new app the "subscription" method, because the main app is always well updated, i cant tell this about all the apps i bought over the time.
do i use subscriptions
Yes i do, i have apple music (and before spotify premium for years)
i also use for work (not paid by me)
Lightroom+PS license (some 12$ a month)
and Office (10$ a month more ore less)
I use 1password for me in the best way with icloud(before dropbox)
i love it! for my apps i feel better paying once (and upgrades) than paying each month.(its a mentally more peace full)
if i would need Lightroom for me, i would go for the license.
i had a lot of apps come and go on my mac, but not 1password
i also used lastpass in a company, it was awful.
@AGKyle appreciate you answers on the forum, nice to know that the company cares about us.
count with me for the next payed upgrade.
i am a so called power user? no i am just a regular guy who loves tech, love well made apps.
I did not notice that 1password had now a new app the "subscription" method, because the main app is always well updated, i cant tell this about all the apps i bought over the time.
do i use subscriptions
Yes i do, i have apple music (and before spotify premium for years)
i also use for work (not paid by me)
Lightroom+PS license (some 12$ a month)
and Office (10$ a month more ore less)
I use 1password for me in the best way with icloud(before dropbox)
i love it! for my apps i feel better paying once (and upgrades) than paying each month.(its a mentally more peace full)
if i would need Lightroom for me, i would go for the license.
i had a lot of apps come and go on my mac, but not 1password
i also used lastpass in a company, it was awful.
@AGKyle appreciate you answers on the forum, nice to know that the company cares about us.
count with me for the next payed upgrade.
Keepass can do better than form filling - you can create your own macros around your username/password for use when you press ctrl+alt+a.
I use 1password for my personal stuff and Keepass for work, but i regularly ask myself why i haven't just converted everything to Keepass.
The iOS client for 1Password is definitely more slick, but KeePass works EVERYWHERE and is far more customizable.
I use 1password for my personal stuff and Keepass for work, but i regularly ask myself why i haven't just converted everything to Keepass.
The iOS client for 1Password is definitely more slick, but KeePass works EVERYWHERE and is far more customizable.
I don't make these decisions so I can only pass your feedback along.
Have you tried using our 1Password.com membership? It comes with a 30 day trial and if someone here needs more than 30 days to try it I'm happy to look into increasing that if it makes sense.
I get this feeling that some of the people here are unhappy about the subscription cost, but others are unhappy that they can't sync with <insert favorite service>, and maybe a few others are concerned about security. I'd be really curious to hear which things people are actually concerned with because it's very confusing that people lump one of those into "I hate subscriptions" when it's a bit more subtle than the blanket statement of "subscriptions."
So if anyone wants to discuss whatever the real issue I welcome it. If I'm going to pass information along to our management team I would hope I could pass along valuable information beyond "Well, the users say they hate subscriptions"
My 1Password data stays on the local computer and mobile devices. It does not get copied to any cloud service or remote server.
I was part of the battle so many years ago when Agile tried to force everyone to Dropbox and the outcry from that move is why a few months later we had a shim/app to sit between the user and 1Password to allow for local WiFi updating. There are circumstances where users cannot or will not use remote based servers to store their information.
Things like Notes, Contacts and Calendar can live on the cloud. They will not contain confidential or private information.
As far as subscriptions go, in software I try to avoid them. It is a personal issue for me.
I use LastPass Premium and Dashlane Premium. Additionally, I use Zoho Vault Personal for some stuff, which is free. All three are easy to use and have good support. I've been using Dashlane for a couple of years now, but I've been using LastPass since early 2009, I believe. I've never had a problem with the software and support for minor bugs or mistakes by me was simple and pain-free.
I always disable form filling. I can't comment on it as a result.
I always disable form filling. I can't comment on it as a result.
Any mSecure users not happy with their new policies especially the fact they won't support iCloud sync, only 'mSecure Cloud'
I find it all very odd.
I find it all very odd.
The older version is syncing between icloud, the new one wont. There is really nothing odd here. Keeping only a one cloud service will provide more secure and bug free system and easier to sync between devices when you change your devices. All it is needing now is msecure account.
Yes I realise its mSecure 5 but with their new encrption method and "mSecure cloud who?" how can they be trusted with our precious data. I trust iCloud and their new security.
"mSecure cloud" may not be so robust.
To me this feels like a false equivalency saying that mSecure's service will be more secure than iCloud. It really depends on the skill of the administrators, developers and the desire of management to invest in maintaining and improving the security.
This brings up why I don't use cloud based services for sensitive data. The safest place for my data is on my device. Not being stored some where I can't control. mSecure, 1Password and other dedicated sites are honey pots for committed criminals to break into. They represent challenges to them to be conquered. iCloud, to a lesser extent, is the same way but with an unknown payoff.