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Poll: How should the next Mac Pro be upgradeable/expandable?

  • PC: Just make a PC and stuff MacOS on it.

    Votes: 4 5.5%
  • xMac: Use industry standard parts as much as possible while still giving it that Mac magic.

    Votes: 19 26.0%
  • 5,1ish: Solidly Apple, but a lot can be upgraded with industry standard parts.

    Votes: 42 57.5%
  • Custom: Highly custom Apple upgrade kits, specialized to be better in some way than standard parts.

    Votes: 4 5.5%
  • 6,1: Real pros don't upgrade, they buy new computers. We just need a 6,2 to upgrade to.

    Votes: 1 1.4%
  • Other, describe in comments.

    Votes: 3 4.1%

  • Total voters
    73
What the hell are you doing to your cables that warrant replacing every few months? Egads, I'm still using my original iPhone 5 cables with my iPhone 6s. LOL

I woke up wrapped in one once. I often use my iPhone while charging and I often use it in bed to watch videos and search stuff. So waking up wrapped in the cable or sleeping on the cable or bending the cable the wrong way tends to happen often. I refuse to change my user habits so replacing cables is the compromise I pay for exceeding the design limitations of the cables.

The main failure point is where the cable enters the lightning connector. I just accept I am hard on cables and I just treat them as throw away items really, its annoying when they die but I just buy another and keep going.

The heavy duty Belkin one I am using right now stands up really well as it has a rubber reinforcing at each end to reinforce where the cable attaches to the lighting/usb fittings.
 
Based on what keeps getting released at nearly every tech show, a long time yet. Every show its bigger cases with more slots, more of everything.

For example at computex right now, custom prototypes like this




Clearly it's all about "Bigger" and "More slots"...

EVGA would disagree with you.
JUiHARx9hsAgxUaytcwvQE-650-80.jpg


Considering many of the x299 boards will have two or three M2 drive slots, even on the mini ATX boards, I get the feeling size will be coming down a bit. Unless you're building a server.

That EVGA DG7 series case is about perfect for my needs. If I need two 4TB spinning storage drives I can hide them below, and use three M.2 drives for boot, cache and scratch, and the last one as an active jobs working drive.

The black Mac Pro should have had two user upgradeable M.2 flash drive slots and one user upgradeable GPU, along with the user upgradable ram. At minimum. Why do I get the feeling Apple will miss the boat on this?
 
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Small case that allows for liquid cooling and good airflow, to keep the parts cool. As low amount of parts as possible(the less is there, the less will go wrong).

That is why I love so much Mac Pro 6.1, and that is why I love so much Corsair One computer. That is also why I love so much those cases that were just announced by Phanteks:
 
What we have here is two sides, those like myself who want to mass internal expansions. And those who want small form factor.
I actually want something fresh, and new. Current state of Workstation cases is boring ;). Thats what I have hoped for for very long time.
 
Maybe I'm going against the grain here, but give me option A. Use industry standard parts. I want to be able to go out and buy a 1TB Samsung 960 EVO M.2 drive, for $450 rather than spending $650 on a proprietary Apple connect flash drive (OWC as an example) that's lagging WAY behind (almost 3x behind) in read/write speeds. Right now, if you upgrade a 2015 MacBook Pro to a 1TB Aura drive from macsales, you're losing speed by nearly 50% while also being charged a $200 premium.

CPU, Video cards, Ram.... more options means less expensive user upgrades.

I'd love Apple to offer two options - a Xeon for those who need it, or feel like they need it. And also an x299 chipset option for those who know they don't need a Xeon option.

Basically I want Apple to build me a workable Hackintosh out of the box I can upgrade on my own without having to hunt through Specialty Apple component vendors. LOL

...This is SO never going to happen.


Have you seen the size of the best EVGA nvidia cards lately?

Yes. I've seen them. I have the EVGA 1070 in all of my pcpartpicker build lists, as I plan for a "worst case scenario" from Apple. HAHAHA

Plus those EVGA video cards will fit in the EVGA DG7 series case. They're not going to design a case that won't fit their video cards. :)

...Also, those beasties beat the dual FirePro D700 into the ground.


What we have here is two sides, those like myself who want to mass internal expansions. And those who want small form factor.

I think you can have a little of both. Much like the iMac, which they have multiple sizes, and the various sizes of their laptops, they could have two sizes for the Mac Pro. A full size case with multiple PCIe slots, and a smaller case for 2 or 3 PCIe slots.

Even this Corsair Crystal 460X case has plenty of PCIe expansion for 90% of the users, three 2.5" SSD slots on the back of the mobo, with room for two more 3.5" spinning drives. Add that to the two or three M.2 drives on the mother board, that's up to 8 storage options.

On a larger case, you can have 10 3.5" spinning drives on top of the two or three M.2 drives... and even more PCIe expansion for those who need it.


Apple seems to believe there's a "one size fits all" when it comes to the "Mac Pro", but gives the general consumer more options tailored to their "needs". This is just freaking bassackwards.
 
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Maybe I'm going against the grain here, but give me option A. Use industry standard parts. I want to be able to go out and buy a 1TB Samsung 960 EVO M.2 drive, for $450 rather than spending $650 on a proprietary Apple connect flash drive (OWC as an example) that's lagging WAY behind (almost 3x behind) in read/write speeds. Right now, if you upgrade a 2015 MacBook Pro to a 1TB Aura drive from macsales, you're losing speed by nearly 50% while also being charged a $200 premium.

Video cards, Ram.... more options means less expensive user upgrades.

Basically I want Apple to build me a workable Hackintosh out of the box I can upgrade on my own without having to hunt through Specialty Apple component vendors. LOL

...This is SO never going to happen.
Erm... what are the read and write speeds of SSDs in newest Apple computers(Macbook Pro 2016)? Not in line with Samsung 960 Evo? I think they are... O_O
 
Right. If you buy a 500GB SSD in the new MacBook Pro, but want to upgrade to 1TB for added storage space, you'll chop off nearly 4 times that performance going through macsales. Or pay $900 for maybe 'half' the performance...
 
960 Evo 1 TB costs 480$ on Newegg. Similar price is on Amazon. Apple charges 600$ price tag on base model fir 1 TB upgrade, and 400$ on higher end model.

Im wondering what prices they will charge after the upcoming update...
 
You can't use the 960 EVO in the MacBook Pro or Mac Pro - unless they changed the socket with the 2016 MBP model. Apple charges more for their 500GB upgrade to 1TB than Samsung charges between their 500GB and 1TB flash drives.

Apple's 500GB flash drive in my 2015 MacBook Pro is a Samsung. Because of the socket, (like I said) if I want to upgrade to 1TB, it'll cost me nearly $900 if I use Bionz to keep the performance level relatively the same, or I'll spend $600 through macsales, and cut the performance in half of the original 2015 MacBook Pro performance. It would cost me $480 to buy Samsung's 1TB 960 EVO, and it would more than double the performance of my 2015 MacBook Pro - provided the 2015 MBP's bandwidth could handle that speed increase.
 
I actually want something fresh, and new. Current state of Workstation cases is boring ;). Thats what I have hoped for for very long time.

Who cares if cases are boring.

What is inside the case is all that matters.

I'm also a member of the massive internal expansion faction. I need at least 5 3.5" bays.
 
Just to point out since you mentioned cars, the Ford f150 is the biggest selling car in America. In Australia it's what is basically the equivalent, the Toyota Hilux. Still effectively boxes on wheels, whose primary design feature, is a blank cargo tray that can be user configured, adapted and reconfigured to have any combination of storage and tools put into it.

They're vehicles made for work, and the reason they're used for work is that individual users can configure and reconfigure them, not the car company.

we have a box truck at the shop.. literally a box on wheels and called exactly that - 'box truck'

here's the thing.. when deciding to purchase, the function needed was delivering products and purchasing materials..
those are the priority#1 functions and then the form follows..

if you're doing the same analysis with a computer, how high/low on the list is the shape of the physical shape of the computer?

for me, it ranks maybe around #500 on importance.. like, i don't even begin to imagine the shape of a computer if answering a question "what do you need the computer to do? what functions do you require?"
(speaking desktops here.. laptops or phones etc, the form comes into play much earlier as you're physically interacting with these)

the desktop box computer is, or has been, the size/shape it is for exactly one reason.. technical hurdles.. that's it..

you don't need a box for configurability.. you're not putting work items in it.. you're not hauling cargo with it. you're moving microscopic electrons around.. the idea of "i need big" or "i need box" for my computing work is a complete logical fallacy.

---
what you're doing with this box defending is, in design world, referred to a "form follows precedent".. the thought process that a product should be shaped a certain way simply based off the fact that this shape was seen prior.. it's completely uninspiring and you should realize the only reason you're saying 'box with slots' is because it's something you've seen prior.

the opposite of 'form follows precedent' is "form follows function":

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Form_follows_function

this is the modern philosophy which states a product's (etc) shape is determined by its intended function or purpose..

a designer should be asking "what is this item supposed to do?" first and foremost then allow the shape to evolve from there.. instead of "well, i've seen _____ shape before so i might as well do that again" without consideration of what actually needs to be accomplished.

the funny thing about this is at these forums in particular, the above principles have been completely butchered into "apple is all about form over function" o_O
..when their designs are actually very far from that.. j.Ive and co. are pretty damn strict on following the principle of 'form follows function'.. probably one of the best examples of this in current times.

----
idk.. it's not really important for me to change your mind.. i completely understand your viewpoint and also realize many to most think similarly.. so i'm definitely not thinking i'm going to enlighten the world regarding design principles ; )
(though it might be neat if you could at least attempt to understand the viewpoint i'm speaking from in a similar way as i understand yours.. not to come to agreement with me but simply to be able to see more than one side)

here's what i think you should understand regardless of your design theories since it's the actual topic at hand..
mMP will not be box-with-slots
if that's what you want, or especially, if that's what you 'need' -- quit looking to apple for a solution because you're not going to get it from them.. you're wasting your time.
 
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I put other. We dont know what they are doing at this moment. They could be taking a long break and go to different countries to talk about politics. They would apologize again in public and pretend they will figure something out with mmp.
 
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Ok then let's talk about design, the 6,1 went away from the box with slots idea into the trash can.

But you lost most of the upgradability and everything was proprietary and specific to that model.

A new modular Mac Pro, if made upgradable by the user will have to be designed around some form of off the shelf parts. Even if the motherboard was proprietary.

Let's look at that....

CPU flat square shape, the motherboard will have to be flat with standard PCIe and RAM slots. Also any M.2 mounts will have to be standard. The way they mount it inside the case will be upto Apple but it won't be proprietary.

Ram dimms will be nothing innovative as if upgradable it will have to be a mass produced product so no different then found in custom PC.

GPU design will be whatever the top stuff Nvidia and amd are making at the time. No radical design innovations there besides hardware.

Drives of all kinds are all some form of square or rectangle shape.

If not a big case with slots then it could very well be a cube.

So I'm sure someone will ask "where's the innovation?, Apple must innovate!" Well they really don't have to but what they can do is design their own motherboard, cooling system, maybe some kind of high powered yet incredibly efficient power supply, they can be innovative in the way they mount things within the design limitations of the off the shelf parts.

Maybe upgradable CPU sockets so that as CPUs upgrade they aren't limited by the socket.

Maybe some kind of water cooling.

Hot swappable fans that can be replaced easily yet dead quiet under normal operation.

Redundant power supply in case one fails.

Maybe it could talk to you and ask you about your day so you don't get lonely while at the office.
 
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you don't need a box for configurability.. you're not putting work items in it.. you're not hauling cargo with it. you're moving microscopic electrons around.. the idea of "i need big" or "i need box" for my computing work is a complete logical fallacy.

Sorry, but I do need a box for configurability, because I have to move electrons between parts of the hardware setup that need to change faster than the entire setup as a whole, and need to do so in the same physical location.

A 5,1-esque slotbox works for me, and for you. Addressable market: 2. A 6,1-esque does not work for me. Addressable market: 1.
 
This is what Phil Schiller said stuffed Apple up with the 6,1 anyway, what is best for one person is terrible for someone else.

I think to appease everyone there will need to be some kind of configuration option.
 
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I think to appease everyone there will need to be some kind of configuration option.

so do i..
but a user configurable computer doesn't mean a towered box.
something very user configurable could possibly be done with a base hub containing, say, cpu/ram/single ssd/single GPU within the volume of 6,1... which for many to most people, would be an awesome desktop system within itself.

mating & unified modules could then be added to that for users requiring more volume for more components.. while keeping the computer looking like one unit instead of a variety of breakout boxes /external housings.

not saying apple should or will do something like that.. just pointing out that there are numerous ways to approach the problem..

and imo, one of the worst ways to approach it would be to build a computer based around the most demanding user then the typical user will just strip parts out of it.. leaving most people (yes- pro users) with an unnecessarily large box sitting on their floor..

another way to approach it would be for apple to offer more than one sized housing in a somewhat similar way as they do with laptops.
 
so do i..
but a user configurable computer doesn't mean a towered box.
something very user configurable could possibly be done with a base hub containing, say, cpu/ram/single ssd/single GPU within the volume of 6,1... which for many to most people, would be an awesome desktop system within itself.

mating & unified modules could then be added to that for users requiring more volume for more components.. while keeping the computer looking like one unit instead of a variety of breakout boxes /external housings.

not saying apple should or will do something like that.. just pointing out that there are numerous ways to approach the problem..

and imo, one of the worst ways to approach it would be to build a computer based around the most demanding user then the typical user will just strip parts out of it.. leaving most people (yes- pro users) with an unnecessarily large box sitting on their floor.

Funny you should say that as a pc case company called cooler master has a modular case like that. While I don't like the aesthetic, the idea is good.

http://www.coolermaster.com/case/full-tower/haf935/
 
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