POTD rules discussions [MERGED]

[mollyc]

Please, can we cool it on the cat and dog, personal pet photos for a while? This is beginning to feel like "Pet of the Day" rather than "Photo of the Day!"

There IS another area on MR for photos of this sort, where people can post all the images they want of stuff like snapshots of their cars, their food, their pets.... Check out the MacRumors Community section, where there is a specific subforum called "Picture Gallery" and there is a thread called "Post Pics of Your Pet!"

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/post-pics-of-your-pet.89406/

I agree that it's time for a revamping of the guidelines and rules for the POTD thread and the Digital Photography subforum as a whole. I suspect that some confusion comes in because there are two areas for photography, one being the Digital Photography subforum and the other being the Picture Gallery subforum in the MR Community section.

Back at the time that the POTD thread was started, there were no iPhones, and the Digital Photography subforum was inhabited by those who shot with dedicated cameras (film was still pretty much the norm but digital cameras were just coming into their own as well. I'm not sure when "The Picture Gallery" was started -- I should take a look -- but at any rate that is the more "social" area of MR in general, and it makes sense to have an area for members to post (usually iPhone or other cell phone) shots of their meals, cars, pets, family members, selfies, casual social activities, etc.

The Digital Photography forum was intended for those who were serious about photography and who wanted to share images and discuss the art and science of photography. We didn't yet have iPhones. We were all just really getting into the new world of digital imaging, which was a heady experience back in those days. Each new digital camera release brought new and exciting features and functionality. Many of us were learning from each other as we transitioned from film to digital. It was during that time frame, back in 2005, that the POTD thread was started with the idea of participants sharing their best images. Since many were traveling with their new gear, too, that was one reason for the request that the person posting an image tell where it was shot. Photographers also like to share EXIF, and at that time it wasn't possible to see that on MR itself. Now we can with MR's Media gallery section and info, so it isn't really necessary any longer to provide the EXIF info within the post with the image itself.

The POTD thread was meant for members to share their best, most interesting and varied images.... Why not try to keep it that way?

We have already been down this road. You are the only one who seems bothered by people sharing photos of pets. You are also the only one who wants to limit the types and styles of photos posted, even while offering nothing in the way of constructive guidelines.

As a group, this has been discussed multiple times in the past couple of years. In May, after there was discussion of posting diptychs, I went through the forum:

I did some research. And by research, I mean that I went back to the very original POTD thread. As noted in the opening post every month, it was started by iGary, but he hasn't been to the forum since 2013. From his first post:



And then a few pages in, someone asked if they could post 2-3 of a specific outing in one post, and this was his response:





Given his clarification that the purpose was to have people revisit the thread day after day, AND that he was okay with multiple photos even within one post on occassion, I really don't see that a diptych (or triptych, etc) would have bothered him in the least. All he ever really seemed to want was the location of the photo, which he reminded people about quite a bit in the first few pages.

I think threads like these ultimately evolve over time. Most of the people who were posting in the early days are no longer part of this forum. I think it's fine to make adjustments as the participants shift; it makes it more a living entity, flowing with the lives of the photographers, rather than something stuck in time, losing relevancy.

We ultimately went on to create a separate thread regarding revamping the POTD rules, and it was decided to leave things the way they are.

You also sent up an "idea balloon" in June 2021 that forum members disagreed with, as no one else wanted to set parameters on skill or gear required to post here.

In the first few pages of the very original POTD thread, there is a photo taken by an iMac, a photo of puppies, a cat, an ape eating sh*t, and a rather unappetizing photo of a pineapple upside down cake. The much revered iGary did not object to any of these photos, and by all accounts was welcome to seeing photos from all posters with whatever camera they chose to use.

Please, for the love of god, stop trying to police what photos people post here. Make it a resolution for 2023 to welcome all genres and skill levels.

 

[sparksd]

We have already been down this road. You are the only one who seems bothered by people sharing photos of pets. You are also the only one who wants to limit the types and styles of photos posted, even while offering nothing in the way of constructive guidelines.

As a group, this has been discussed multiple times in the past couple of years. In May, after there was discussion of posting diptychs, I went through the forum:




We ultimately went on to create a separate thread regarding revamping the POTD rules, and it was decided to leave things the way they are.

You also sent up an "idea balloon" in June 2021 that forum members disagreed with, as no one else wanted to set parameters on skill or gear required to post here.

In the first few pages of the very original POTD thread, there is a photo taken by an iMac, a photo of puppies, a cat, an ape eating sh*t, and a rather unappetizing photo of a pineapple upside down cake. The much revered iGary did not object to any of these photos, and by all accounts was welcome to seeing photos from all posters with whatever camera they chose to use.

Please, for the love of god, stop trying to police what photos people post here. Make it a resolution for 2023 to welcome all genres and skill levels.

Yeah, I find the posts here quite enjoyable. I also participate in photography-specific forums (e.g., dpreview, photography-on-the.net, etc.) to read about and discuss the technical aspects of photography - better places to do that than on an Apple product-centric site.

 

[bondr006]

OMG -

I saw the anti- posting statement of specific images (SFW of course) because there is another forum or someone got tired of seeing them.

Will there be a forum consensus on this, or will it be dictated?

Happy 2023 BTW.

Yes! I like the consensus idea. Let's do the democratic thing and let the POTD community cast their votes.

 

[Clix Pix]

I agree -- let's do a poll and see what the results are.... In the past we have been pretty successful at self-governing, so why not give it a try this time, too?

 

[mollyc]

I agree -- let's do a poll and see what the results are.... In the past we have been pretty successful at self-governing, so why not give it a try this time, too?

feel free to start the poll in a new thread

 

[sparksd]

feel free to start the poll in a new thread

Perhaps a better idea is new regular thread, something akin to "Digital photography: Techniques and technical aspects". I don't see how you specify subjective things like "best" and "most interesting".

 

[mollyc]

Perhaps a better idea is new regular thread, something akin to "Digital photography: Techniques and technical aspects". I don't see how you specify subjective things like "best" and "most interesting".

well personally i’ve already initiated the p52 project here to get people to think more creatively and deliberately.

i’m fine with the way the way the potd thread currently works.

but since clix has brought up changing the potd multiple times over the past year, i’d love to see her come up with an inclusive and actionable plan to increase the “quality” of photos shared with here.

 

[r.harris1]

Perhaps a better idea is new regular thread, something akin to "Digital photography: Techniques and technical aspects". I don't see how you specify subjective things like "best" and "most interesting".

Yes, and who’s the arbiter on “best” and “most interesting”?

 

[r.harris1]

Really, any time we start to say “no this”, “no that” it just becomes ungovernable. Changing the POTD thread at this point is quite frankly silly. If we want a thread that has “better quality” images, it should start as a new one a la what sparksd suggests.

 

[Steven-iphone]

First a poll to set up the parameters of the actual poll. Then create a poll itself with an administred protocol to distribute this poll to the widest group of people.

 

[Clix Pix]

The POTD thread was never meant to be a "social media" FB or Instagram type thread. MR already HAS a socially-oriented "Picture Gallery" for just that kind of image. Why is this so difficult for some people to grasp?

 

[r.harris1]

The POTD thread was never meant to be a "social media" FB or Instagram type thread. MR already HAS a socially-oriented "Picture Gallery" for just that kind of image. Why is this so difficult for some people to grasp?

No one has a problem grasping it. What you’re suggesting is what amounts to kicking people out who have been posting in it for quite a while. Nice people. I don’t agree with it even slightly. If you want a different thread with different images, start one and see if it takes off.

 

[mollyc]

The POTD thread was never meant to be a "social media" FB or Instagram type thread. MR already HAS a socially-oriented "Picture Gallery" for just that kind of image. Why is this so difficult for some people to grasp?

Thought it would be fun to share one of your best every day - doesn't matter what it is, just as long as it is decent (no nudes or overly graphic shots). You can add a picture everyday as long as it is different.

"Best" is subjective. iGary says explicitly "doesn't matter what it is." There is no language or indication that he ever sought to limit people by their gear or experience. My best 15 years ago is vastly different than my best today. Should we exclude newer photographers who are still learning? Exclude people who can't afford a real camera? Exclude people who only photograph their cats? The original intent was to share a photo a day. Why is that so difficult for YOU to grasp?

 

[sparksd]

The POTD thread was never meant to be a "social media" FB or Instagram type thread. MR already HAS a socially-oriented "Picture Gallery" for just that kind of image. Why is this so difficult for some people to grasp?

And who will be the judge of what is best or interesting that warrants exclusion from the thread? How will it be policed? You have moderators buying in on that?

 

[Clix Pix]

Why do people only take pictures of their cats (or dogs) when there is a whole world out there to explore with their camera or iPhone? Why not explore one's innate creativity and see what happens? This is part of what photography is all about: looking at and seeing, really seeing, the world around one and then capturing it......

 

[Steven-iphone]

There are times when I see an image that is not my flavor. However it is someone's flavor. Thank goodness for flavor.

 

[bunnspecial]

The first step to being a photographer-of any flavor-is picking up your camera(whatever form that image making device takes).

If a person's cat or dog is what catches their eye and causes them to take that first step, more power to them and it's better than them never having taken up the hobby.

I try not to post pet photos, but at the same time my dog is often a patient subject when I want to test something, and he makes a fun technical challenge as he is jet black and blends into the shadows.

I'll just say too that good pet photography isn't always easy...

 

[sparksd]

Why do people only take pictures of their cats (or dogs) when there is a whole world out there to explore with their camera or iPhone? Why not explore one's innate creativity and see what happens? This is part of what photography is all about: looking at and seeing, really seeing, the world around one and then capturing it......

Last I saw, people who have posted pet pictures here have also posted a lot of other subjects. You missed all of those? I have over 200+ images posted, maybe half a dozen are of cats and dogs, the rest are from around the world. I have almost 80K images from almost 60 years of shooting around the world. Open your eyes and get over your judgemental view of others.

 

[Steven-iphone]

I'll just say too that good pet photography isn't always easy...

I was exiting Target today and spotted a lively dog eye-balling me from a distance. I walked over and checked with the dog's two-legger for photo permission. Willow the dog was so bouncy - nearly none of the images were useable.

 

[r.harris1]

Why do people only take pictures of their cats (or dogs) when there is a whole world out there to explore with their camera or iPhone? Why not explore one's innate creativity and see what happens? This is part of what photography is all about: looking at and seeing, really seeing, the world around one and then capturing it......

Photography is a lot of things to a lot of people, including documenting things in front of us. Cats, dogs, herons, landscapes, people in bars. You name it. Sometimes we can tweak our approach and capture different aspects of our chosen subjects. Maybe we call that art, maybe we don’t.

If you want to change something, don’t just throw darts from the sidelines. Put up a poll if you feel you have the support to change what the POTD thread has evolved to since 2006 (pre iPhone). You know my vote . Or start a more exclusive thread, daily or whatever, that you are the active manager of, if you want to see different images.

 

[mollyc]

Why do people only take pictures of their cats (or dogs) when there is a whole world out there to explore with their camera or iPhone? Why not explore one's innate creativity and see what happens? This is part of what photography is all about: looking at and seeing, really seeing, the world around one and then capturing it......

Maybe people are tired of seeing photos of Alfred (you know, the wild animal you just named randomly). How would you feel if people told you to stop posting those photos? That's the equivalent to what you are asking people to do with not posting photos of their pets...animals they love and actually live with.

 

[Clix Pix]

I definitely know how challenging good pet photography can be -- cats in particular can be really difficult! Been there done that.....

My objection here is that it seems as though more and more we are seeing not just an occasional photo of someone's pet but many of them, as though one person sees another's image and thinks, "oh, right, I'll post my photo of my kitty, too!" and all of a sudden we are inundated. The POTD isn't the "post a similar image" game; we've already got that running in another thread.

We've had this situation happen before when cats seemed to be taking over when some guy who apparently is obsessed with cats kept posting and posting and posting images of his household resident felines and others joined in.... Suddnenly it seemed as though every other image in the POTD was a photo of a cat or two. At that time, objections to this rather invasive inundation were raised and eventually the guy decided to take his photos of his felines elsewhere and finally after a while we also were no longer being bombarded by photo after photo after photo of someone else's pet cat(s).

Now it seems as though we're experiencing something similar again, although this time not in quite the same way, not apparently instigated as a deliberate joke the way the other episode seemed to be. This time people just seem to be posting their photos of their pets because, well, gee, others are.....

I shoot a lot of photos. I recently shot quite a lot of Alfred the GBH when he reappeared recently. Of course Alfred is not a domestic pet, he's a wild creature who happens to live in my neighborhood. He fascinates me and I do like to shoot photos of him when I see him. However, I think everyone who looks in on the POTD would get really tired of my postings very quickly if all I did was post photo after photo after photo of Alfred day after day after day. Thing is, I could easily do that, as I've got lots of edited and yet-to-be-edited images of him which probably would take me all the way with daily posts through the entire year of 2023 and probably into the next year and maybe even beyond! (Rest assured, I am NOT going to do this! I have more sense than to inundate viewers with one subject all the time). Actually, my strategy when posting on the POTD is to offer variety so that I am not posting similar images day after day after day. I try to vary my subjects and my approaches to them. I also try to make even ordinary subjects look a little extraordinary in some way. I don't want to bore viewers.

Yes, I am a big fan of documenting what I see before me or fortuitously find before me on a given day and I do indeed shoot images of whatever that might be. However, I am reasonably discriminating and thoughtful enough not to just splash out every image I shoot for display on here or on other sites in which I also participate. Some shots I like for personal reasons but they might not be especially interesting to a general audience. Others are good, but there are some images which to my eye are better, more compelling, better composed and better edited -- and those are the ones which eventually make it to the POTD thread here or to other sites.

I am "throwing darts from the sidelines" because I really do not want to see the POTD thread disintegrate into something it was never meant to be, a bunch of snapshots and the type of personal images more suited to sharing with the parents, the grandparents or the extended family on Instagram or FaceBook..... Not to mention images which actually could quite likely be perfectly at home if placed on another subforum on MR itself, one which is specifically meant for social media kinds of images in the first place.

 

[sparksd]

I definitely know how challenging good pet photography can be -- cats in particular can be really difficult! Been there done that.....

My objection here is that it seems as though more and more we are seeing not just an occasional photo of someone's pet but many of them, as though one person sees another's image and thinks, "oh, right, I'll post my photo of my kitty, too!" and all of a sudden we are inundated. The POTD isn't the "post a similar image" game; we've already got that running in another thread.

We've had this situation happen before when cats seemed to be taking over when some guy who apparently is obsessed with cats kept posting and posting and posting images of his household resident felines and others joined in.... Suddnenly it seemed as though every other image in the POTD was a photo of a cat or two. At that time, objections to this rather invasive inundation were raised and eventually the guy decided to take his photos of his felines elsewhere and finally after a while we also were no longer being bombarded by photo after photo after photo of someone else's pet cat(s).

Now it seems as though we're experiencing something similar again, although this time not in quite the same way, not apparently instigated as a deliberate joke the way the other episode seemed to be. This time people just seem to be posting their photos of their pets because, well, gee, others are.....

I shoot a lot of photos. I recently shot quite a lot of Alfred the GBH when he reappeared recently. Of course Alfred is not a domestic pet, he's a wild creature who happens to live in my neighborhood. He fascinates me and I do like to shoot photos of him when I see him. However, I think everyone who looks in on the POTD would get really tired of my postings very quickly if all I did was post photo after photo after photo of Alfred day after day after day. Thing is, I could easily do that, as I've got lots of edited and yet-to-be-edited images of him which probably would take me all the way with daily posts through the entire year of 2023 and probably into the next year and maybe even beyond! (Rest assured, I am NOT going to do this!). Actually, my strategy when posting on the POTD is to offer variety so that I am not posting similar images day after day after day. I try to vary my subjects and my approaches to them.

Yes, I am a big fan of documenting what I see before me or fortuitously find before me on a given day and I do indeed shoot images of whatever that might be. However, I am reasonably discriminating and thoughtful enough not to just splash out every image I shoot for display on here or on other sites in which I also participate. Some shots I like for personal reasons but they might not be especially interesting to a general audience. Others are good, but there are some images which to my eye are better, more compelling, better composed and better edited -- and those are the ones which eventually make it to the POTD thread here or to other sites.

I am "throwing darts from the sidelines" because I really do not want to see the POTD thread disintegrate into something it was never meant to be, a bunch of snapshots and the type of personal images more suited to sharing with the parents, the grandparents or the extended family on Instagram or FaceBook..... Not to mention images which actually could quite likely be perfectly at home if placed on another subforum on MR itself, one which is specifically meant for social media kinds of images in the first place.

I guess many of us owe you an apology for not rising to your standards.

 

[Steven-iphone]

I will agree - cats are taking over

They take over the chair. Then lay in the middle of the floor so they need to be walked over. So how does one get back - posting images of their cute faces.

 

[r.harris1]

I definitely know how challenging good pet photography can be -- cats in particular can be really difficult! Been there done that.....

My objection here is that it seems as though more and more we are seeing not just an occasional photo of someone's pet but many of them, as though one person sees another's image and thinks, "oh, right, I'll post my photo of my kitty, too!" and all of a sudden we are inundated. The POTD isn't the "post a similar image" game; we've already got that running in another thread.

We've had this situation happen before when cats seemed to be taking over when some guy who apparently is obsessed with cats kept posting and posting and posting images of his household resident felines and others joined in.... Suddnenly it seemed as though every other image in the POTD was a photo of a cat or two. At that time, objections to this rather invasive inundation were raised and eventually the guy decided to take his photos of his felines elsewhere and finally after a while we also were no longer being bombarded by photo after photo after photo of someone else's pet cat(s).

Now it seems as though we're experiencing something similar again, although this time not in quite the same way, not apparently instigated as a deliberate joke the way the other episode seemed to be. This time people just seem to be posting their photos of their pets because, well, gee, others are.....

I shoot a lot of photos. I recently shot quite a lot of Alfred the GBH when he reappeared recently. Of course Alfred is not a domestic pet, he's a wild creature who happens to live in my neighborhood. He fascinates me and I do like to shoot photos of him when I see him. However, I think everyone who looks in on the POTD would get really tired of my postings very quickly if all I did was post photo after photo after photo of Alfred day after day after day. Thing is, I could easily do that, as I've got lots of edited and yet-to-be-edited images of him which probably would take me all the way with daily posts through the entire year of 2023 and probably into the next year and maybe even beyond! (Rest assured, I am NOT going to do this! I have more sense than to inundate viewers with one subject all the time). Actually, my strategy when posting on the POTD is to offer variety so that I am not posting similar images day after day after day. I try to vary my subjects and my approaches to them. I also try to make even ordinary subjects look a little extraordinary in some way. I don't want to bore viewers.

Yes, I am a big fan of documenting what I see before me or fortuitously find before me on a given day and I do indeed shoot images of whatever that might be. However, I am reasonably discriminating and thoughtful enough not to just splash out every image I shoot for display on here or on other sites in which I also participate. Some shots I like for personal reasons but they might not be especially interesting to a general audience. Others are good, but there are some images which to my eye are better, more compelling, better composed and better edited -- and those are the ones which eventually make it to the POTD thread here or to other sites.

I am "throwing darts from the sidelines" because I really do not want to see the POTD thread disintegrate into something it was never meant to be, a bunch of snapshots and the type of personal images more suited to sharing with the parents, the grandparents or the extended family on Instagram or FaceBook..... Not to mention images which actually could quite likely be perfectly at home if placed on another subforum on MR itself, one which is specifically meant for social media kinds of images in the first place.

The point I wished to make was that dart throwing from the sidelines solves nothing. It really truly doesn’t. If you want to change something, start acting on what you want. Start the poll, start a thread. No one else will do it for you. The fact is, POTD is what it is and I don’t see it changing back to whatever it was in its nostalgic past. We can’t start excluding subjects and people. If you don’t want to take some sort of positive action, let’s move on and go back to posting what we love in POTD and be welcoming. There are some exceptional images there, too. Lots of them.