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Project Creepy Farm House
- Thread starter Renzatic
- Start date
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Thank you for the helpful information, I will definitely check it out.
Also, if you're more into watching instructional videos like I am, I suggest hitting up Blender Cookie. There's tons upon tons upon tons of nice tutorials there for you to check out.
...well, it'll costs $10 a month to get at the really good stuff, but that's pretty cheap considering what you get.
As for my learning to draw initiative, I'm still stoically marching on. I might decide to post up the exercises I've done so far and show them off to everyone so I can share my shame.
One thing I've noticed is that I'm already fairly decent at learning to "see like an artist" due to my time spent modelling. Thing is, modelling tends to make you look at silhouettes more than interior details. You're making everything piecemeal rather than one big whole. Like for my creepy house above, I designed the frame first, then started filling all the details in separately. I never have to worry about perspective or size, since anything that's too big, I can just shrink it down to scale no problem.
So modelling has given me a tiny boost in helping me do the artist thing, but it hasn't addressed the one big problem I've had with drawing since I was a kid. I can't draw in perspective for crap. Like I'm doing the upside down picture exercise in the book now, and I always end up making some parts a little too big, or a little too small. I always have to have a line to judge something against. I can't just freehand draw it right to scale.
My self portrait and hand drawing really bring this out. I made my face too fat, and my hand looks like some mutant thing cuz I drew way too small fingers on a way too big palm. It's kinda freaky looking.
But hey, I think I'll get it sooner or later. That's why I'm practicing.
Already, just from the little bit I've read and done, I can see how learning to draw is going to help me in sculpting and modelling.
But hey, I think I'll get it sooner or later. That's why I'm practicing.
Already, just from the little bit I've read and done, I can see how learning to draw is going to help me in sculpting and modelling.
That is definitely true. Conversely I can see that the modeling will help you draw more volumetrically. You'll have an easier ability to "draw through".
I don't have my art books at hand and can't remember if DFTRSOTB has exercises in perspective and using guidelines. Break the rules, draw guidelines. Or also get another book about proportion. Crud, drawing a blank with the titles & authors of some really good anatomy books...
My "library" is 20 miles away.You wouldn't happen to be dyslexic would you? It can be great for those upside-down drawing exercises. Not being facetious, my husband was and he was incredibly gifted with drawing perspective, --projective geometries. He could work on a drawing or architectural rendering from any direction. I'll tell you, this was great in client meetings (so was his ability to read stuff upside-down on desks...
).Thanks for the info about the videos. I did see a couple from the site and it does look like a very helpful community. I have to let this stuff sink in a little.
I don't have my art books at hand and can't remember if DFTRSOTB has exercises in perspective and using guidelines. Break the rules, draw guidelines. Or also get another book about proportion. Crud, drawing a blank with the titles & authors of some really good anatomy books...
If you're ever back at your library and you think of a few good titles, throw them my way. So far, all I have is this book and Chrono's recommendation to fall back on. I'm always open for more suggestions.
You wouldn't happen to be dyslexic would you? It can be great for those upside-down drawing exercises. Not being facetious, my husband was and he was incredibly gifted with drawing perspective, --projective geometries. He could work on a drawing or architectural rendering from any direction. I'll tell you, this was great in client meetings (so was his ability to read stuff upside-down on desks...
Nope. As far as I know, I'm not. Though (not to brag) I can read mirrored text fairly easily, and can do pretty well reading upside down so long as the writing's clear.
But anyway, I think it's time to show off my shaky first steps into doing something I haven't done a lot of since I was...I dunno...15 or so. I'm going to show them off in the order I did the exercises in the book. No, I'm not too far yet (I have taken your advice on drawing every day, though), but I want to spend more time practicing and getting it right rather than rushing on through to get to the end.
..and please, excuse the quality. Since 99.9% of everything I do is done on a computer, I don't have need for a scanner. My only option to get my drawings online were to take shots of them using my iPhone.
Self Portrait. Wherein I drew my head too fat.
Drawing from memory. This ended up looking nothing like what I intended. I'm sure if Kristy saw this picture, she'd kill me.
Hand drawing. This is just wrong (and yeah, I do chew my fingernails).
Vaces/Faces. I kinda fudged this one a bit, since I didn't copy one side off, label the individual parts, then try to draw the right side afterwards. I'm pretty well acquainted with the "brain lock" from my early learning attempts at modelling, so I already knew what was going on here. I just drew it out and went on with the next bit.
Drawing An Upside Down Picture Attempt #1. These next three pictures are where you're going to see what I think are my biggest problem: control and scale. I can look at the line, see how it goes, but I always have to try two or three times to get it right. I have a lot of trouble replicating the size, length, and angle as it is on the page.
Same picture, second attempt.
Same picture, third attempt. So much right, so much wrong. I need to learn scale and control so bad.
Upside down horse. My first attempt at shading. I should go back and finish this one.
Childhood drawing reproduction. This was a fun exercise. You just take a page, and draw something like you did as a kid. The book was right, it's amazing how quickly I fell back into the same habits I had when I drawing stuff like this in the 3rd freaking grade.
This last one brought back some memories. It inspired me to go digging through a few old boxes in an attempt to find this old book I wrote/drew when back I was in 1st or 2nd grade. Here's a nice shot showing off my elementary school skillz.
...I was a cheesy child. It was all about the monsters and spaceships for me back then. Obviously, my tastes have matured by leaps and bounds since.
Yeah, I know. This doesn't have anything at all to do with a creepy building, but this thread is becoming more and more about showing off what you're currently teaching yourself, so I guess it fits in a roundabout way.
And please, try to be gentle with the critiques.
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If you're ever back at your library and you think of a few good titles, throw them my way. So far, all I have is this book and Chrono's recommendation to fall back on. I'm always open for more suggestions.
(...)
And please, try to be gentle with the critiques.
You're off to a good start and brave, I never had to worry about a couple thousand global strangers critting my Drawing 101 assignments.
Keep going, keep drawing & looking. Your work as it is, put through a graphics app with some texture filters and color blocking would look rather contemporary: http://csneal.tumblr.com/post/20127159959
(I like Christopher Silas Neal's clean, spare work.)
When I was in art school we had to take a ton of anatomy and life drawing courses and were tested rigorously on all the major muscles and bones. Repeatedly. We had to build plastic skulls and know all the bones and plates. (Zygomatic arch is my favorite...
) And we were encouraged to take biology courses with dissection, --poor rhesus monkeys and fetal piglets!The standard text was "Anatomy for the Artist" by Jeno Barcsay. Some other guides I can recommend are "Anatomy: A Complete Guide for Artists", and
"Realistic Figure Drawing", both by Joseph Sheppard. (We used to have a cool studio a couple doors up from his. His anatomy books are solid.)
Regarding perspective and architectural rendering, I can't get to the back wall in my husband's office yet (renovation). He taught perspective & rendering for designers and there were a couple books he required. But the most helpful for us personally, were Dover reprints of Renaissance manuscripts, and Dutch Golden Age manuscripts like "Perspective" by Vredeman de Vries, "Perspective in Architecture and Painting" by Pozzo, "Architectural & Perspective Designs" by Bibiena. There are others from when we were in school but I can't get to them yet.
My favorite drawing book isn't a how-to, but very informative none the less:
"From the Sketchbooks of the Great Artists" by Claude Marks.
I love this book because drawing is thinking and you can see the wheels turning, and see that these guys were addressing the same problems, the same challenges, all in different ways. So encouraging.
Everything seems so radically different in the past few years, there is so much helpful information online. If you haven't yet, check out Matt Kohr's blog CtrlPaint.com: http://ctrlpaint.com/blog/where-to-find-reference
He has posted useful information about perspective, light & shadow, anatomy and scale using a blend of traditional and online methods/resources. Pretty up-to-date.
Look at what other artists are doing now, and also look into art history, so much good stuff. Are you familiar with M.C. Escher's work?
Keep going, it's wonderful fun.
You're off to a good start and brave, I never had to worry about a couple thousand global strangers critting my Drawing 101 assignments.
Eh. I figure mass shaming is as good a motivator as any. I got big enough ego. I can take it.
As for the rest, I've added all your suggestions to the big list to check out later. My main goal right now is to plow through Right Brain, hit up Chrono's book (since it seems to be good for drawing basic human figures), then hit up the heavy stuff later.
And speaking of Chrono...
chrono1081 said:
If you're still interesting, but don't feel like dropping the cash to buy the book, I managed to dig up the entire video course on Youtube...
Here.
It's very...er...educational videoish. I halfway expected to see the words "From The Farm To Your Table: Where Potatoes Comes From" splash across the screen when I first fired it up.
Yeah, it's pretty hardcore cheese, but it does the same job as the book, so I recommend giving it a watch.
Oh, and Crickettgrrrl, since you're helping me out a bit, and you brought up anatomy earlier, I'll go ahead and post up my old skeleton model for you to check out.
Here.
Considering you have a good base in art, the biggest thing you have to figure out in 3D modelling is how to lay out your topology. My skeleton is a nice mixture of high poly and low poly subsurfed objects, so it'll make for a good study piece, I think.
Of course. I've always liked his stuff, and wouldn't mind learning how to cop his style a bit. I think getting into that much detail is still a little farther down the road for me, though.
Oh, it is. Even though I'm still struggling with some things, I already feel like I've improved a little bit since I started about two weeks ago.
Right now, I'm going through a little bit of downtime, since I had to order a viewfinder to continue with the book tuts. While I'm waiting for it to show up in the mail, I figured I'd doodle around to keep up with your suggestion to do at least one drawing a day. The first thing I did was redo my hand portrait...
which turned out a helluva lot better than the last one. Still not 100% perfect, but it's getting there.
...it's enough to make me wish I picked this up a long time ago.
Eh. I figure mass shaming is as good a motivator as any. I got big enough ego. I can take it.
As for the rest, I've added all your suggestions to the big list to check out later. My main goal right now is to plow through Right Brain, hit up Chrono's book (since it seems to be good for drawing basic human figures), then hit up the heavy stuff later.
And speaking of Chrono...
If you're still interesting, but don't feel like dropping the cash to buy the book, I managed to dig up the entire video course on Youtube...
Here.
It's very...er...educational videoish. I halfway expected to see the words "From The Farm To Your Table: Where Potatoes Comes From" splash across the screen when I first fired it up.
Yeah, it's pretty hardcore cheese, but it does the same job as the book, so I recommend giving it a watch.
Oh, and Crickettgrrrl, since you're helping me out a bit, and you brought up anatomy earlier, I'll go ahead and post up my old skeleton model for you to check out.
Here.
Considering you have a good base in art, the biggest thing you have to figure out in 3D modelling is how to lay out your topology. My skeleton is a nice mixture of high poly and low poly subsurfed objects, so it'll make for a good study piece, I think.
Of course. I've always liked his stuff, and wouldn't mind learning how to cop his style a bit. I think getting into that much detail is still a little farther down the road for me, though.
Oh, it is. Even though I'm still struggling with some things, I already feel like I've improved a little bit since I started about two weeks ago.
Right now, I'm going through a little bit of downtime, since I had to order a viewfinder to continue with the book tuts. While I'm waiting for it to show up in the mail, I figured I'd doodle around to keep up with your suggestion to do at least one drawing a day. The first thing I did was redo my hand portrait...
which turned out a helluva lot better than the last one. Still not 100% perfect, but it's getting there.
...it's enough to make me wish I picked this up a long time ago.
Thanks for the link! And you're definitely improving! I need to get started on trying to draw. All my life I fell for the "You need to be born with it" BS (my high school didn't even let you take art class unless you could already draw) but later I realized when I worked with a bunch of people from Europe who could all draw amazingly that it wasn't a skill they were born with, it was because they had art every single year in school.
It's funny that you posted this right when you did. I was thinking about how I was neglecting it just a little while ago.
Yeah, I pretty much got the same treatment. For the longest time I thought being able to draw was something you either had or you didn't. That line of thought actually effected me even when I started modeling. At first I thought it'd be making blocks extruded out of blocks to make fuller shapes, and it was something anyone could do. I figured out pretty quickly that was completely wrong, and even it required a very large amount of artistic skill. It was only through pure stubbornness that I kept at it, almost in contradiction of what I believed myself capable of. Even if I thought I'd never be as good at it as some people, I still had fun doing it.
...man, this is starting to sound like the pity chapter from a self help book.
ANYWAY, after watching myself improve over a couple of years, I realized it's not some God given talent, it's something you teach yourself over time. It was around the time I did that skeleton above that this really started sinking in. Even in its currently unfinished state, it's something I never would've imagined myself being capable of not even 2 years ago.
Then I had trouble making my trees for Creepy House. No matter how many pictures I looked at, I couldn't quite model one I was completely satisfied with. I could get the basics down, but when I went in to add branches, leaves, and all that stuff, they sucked. It was then I thought "screw it, I'm learning to draw". I figured it'd help me model more complicated, organic objects, and...well...it's the reason why I've gone off on this little tangent instead of finishing it up (which I intend on doing later, by the way...I ain't leaving it as is).
So here I am. Learning to draw. Haven't even touched Modo in more than 3 weeks, but I've been doodling all that time. I've already seen myself improve by a good bit. I haven't done anything spectacular yet, but I'm getting there. The only reason I haven't posted more pictures is because I took a break from the book to teach myself better line drawing control. Everything I've done has been kinda boring. Just random doodles of things around my desk and study.
But to show off how much I've learned, I drew a bottle cap about a week ago. It came out looking...well...like crap, but I figured it would, and I'd draw another again later, eventually filling up the page up with bottle caps (if I have a muse, it's a pretty dumb one). Today I drew another one, and this is what it looks like...
I was impressed with the difference. Almost shocked by it actually.
...and I've still got tons more to learn.
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Ha! I can relate. Instead of the HS instructor with all the easels and a courtyard (!) and all the cool assignments, I kept getting stuck year after year with the instructor who really wanted to teach dance. (Mebbe why I hate dancing.)
I was impressed with the difference. Almost shocked by it actually.
...and I've still got tons more to learn.
Yep, you are definitely improving!Another art school book I forgot about (until I saw it on Frenden's blog this week) is Harold Speed's "The Practice and Science of Drawing". Here's the link to Frenden's review of it and how he feels it helped him draw more sculpturally. His blog also has the link to it, a free epub download from Project Gutenberg.
http://tmblr.co/ZK1YbyighnEF
Heh, Ray Frenden is very persuasive, after reading his reviews of Monoprice & Yiynova tablets I ordered a Huion 610 for $50, 2048 levels sensitivity, 4K resolution, 200 report rate, and am languishing 'til it's delivered Friday. My Bamboo, which has been fine so far, only has 512 pressure levels.
It's downloaded and on my iPad. I'm saving it for later though, since it looks like a book that assumes you already have a foundation in drawing.
Though I've recently put Drawing on the Right Side of the brain on hold while I explore this other book I found, The Natural Way to Draw by Kimon Nicholaides. The reason I did this was because I was having trouble drawing things they way I saw them. Basically, I have no hand-eye coordination when it comes to drawing, and wanted a book that broke things down to the very bare basics. It came recommended to me, though with the caveat that I have to work my way through it sloooowww as hell to get the most out of it. As in it'll take me at least 6 months to go from beginning to end if I practice at it two hours a day. Three hundred and something odd hours is what's expected of it, so yeah...it's a commitment.
It's starting me off with blind contour drawing. Telling me how to train myself so my pencil follows my eye as I trace over an object, never once looking at what I'm drawing. I've been using my hand as the subject, and since I didn't have anything else to do on a lazy Sunday, I've spent all...freaking...day working at it. I've probably invested well over 4 hours and almost an entire sketch book on it so far.
It's making me worry about my mental well being, that's for sure. But, you know, it's been worth it. I started out yesterday producing...
Godawful tragic things like this that deserve pity.
...but today...
I'm producing pictures like this.
I just finished this up about half an hour ago. I was so surprised by the end results, I went ahead and did my version of shading on them.
The one on the top left was done with three lines, and three peeks at the page while I was working on it. The bottom right was one continuous line from beginning to end, not once looking away from my hand (save for the fingernails and knuckle wrinkles, which I added afterwards).
Not to brag, but that's a massive amount of improvement. I mean it just about looks like my hand, barring some rounding and a few exaggerated features here and there.
Also I've been doodling a bit. I had to take this with the flash off (sorry about the shadow), since the lead reflects the light back and messes up the picture.
It's finally starting to feel like I'm making a little progress.
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Totally forgot about this book! It's on my shelves too, somewhere.
Yes, Drawing 101 & 102, h o u r s in front of easels with big pads of newsprint, jammed in with lots of other people, doing gestural drawing & blind contour drawings of models. Ahhhhh. No, I don't miss that.
But it's art boot camp. Good for you.Yes, keep it up, definite progress!
***
Got my Huion 610 tablet Thursday and haven't have much luck finding time to really give it a work out. When I do use it I have to keep it on my knees, no room in the temp place I have my iMac, ---Using the pen tool mostly & I prefer the mouse tool for that. But the eye-hand/tablet-monitor thing is great with the Huion since it maps so well to the iMac screen compared to my old tiny Bamboo. Oh, --and no time for Sculptris or Blender.
PS: work on your ellipses, they shouldn't have points. (This is coming from someone who really has work on them all the time too, and whose ellipses generally suck at first.)
I'm currently working on something I think you guys will like....
I don't want to give away too much but here's a sneak peek of part of it:
The alien is just a placeholder (the ship is too but the final one will look very similar):
I don't want to give away too much but here's a sneak peek of part of it:
The alien is just a placeholder (the ship is too but the final one will look very similar):
Okay, that is pretty damn awesome. I want to see where you take this, so next time you post something, quote me so I don't miss out on it.
As for me, yeah...I'm still drawing. I haven't done anything I'd consider worthwhile to post yet, though. It's all been exercises after exercises after exercises. Mostly blind contour and gesture drawings. The former of which I find stressful for some reason, no matter how often I do it (and I've probably clocked in a good 4 hours of practice on them by now), and the latter I'm finding really fun, though the end results almost always look like something you'd see drawn by an inmate in an insane asylum.
...well, I guess I do have one thing to post. I did (yet another) drawing of my hand about a week ago. It started out as a blind contour, hence why the shape of my index finger is off a little bit. But when I finally looked down after finishing and saw what I had done, I liked it so much, I expanded upon it, shaded it in and took a picture of it.
I think I'm gonna stick to contours and gestures for another week, then I'm moving on to something else. I need to expand my skill set a bit more.
Okay, that is pretty damn awesome. I want to see where you take this, so next time you post something, quote me so I don't miss out on it.
As for me, yeah...I'm still drawing. I haven't done anything I'd consider worthwhile to post yet, though. It's all been exercises after exercises after exercises. Mostly blind contour and gesture drawings. The former of which I find stressful for some reason, no matter how often I do it (and I've probably clocked in a good 4 hours of practice on them by now), and the latter I'm finding really fun, though the end results almost always look like something you'd see drawn by an inmate in an insane asylum.
...well, I guess I do have one thing to post. I did (yet another) drawing of my hand about a week ago. It started out as a blind contour, hence why the shape of my index finger is off a little bit. But when I finally looked down after finishing and saw what I had done, I liked it so much, I expanded upon it, shaded it in and took a picture of it.
Image
I think I'm gonna stick to contours and gestures for another week, then I'm moving on to something else. I need to expand my skill set a bit more.
That looks awesome! You're improving so much! I really wish I had the time to work on drawing at the moment. I think I'll do some after I get this 3D project done.
You don't necessarily have to go whole hog with it and set everything else to the side like I am. It's something you can do in your spare time, like when you're at work and have a little downtime, or just sitting around and don't feel like plunking down in front of the computer. Like Crickettgrrl said, all you have to do is spend a tiny bit of time a day doing it, and you'll get better over time.
Like with blind contour drawing, all it takes is a pencil, something to draw on, and a willingness to look like an idiot while you stare at something intensely without blinking for 5 minutes. That's something you can do just about anywhere at just about any time.
Mini update to Project Creepy Draw House.
Besides the fact that I'm now actually quite honestly damn sick of drawing my hand over and over again, I am starting to get kinda good at it. I decided to juxtapose the first drawing I did not quite two months ago with the one I did last night to show that...well hell...I am actually improving.
Here.
Of course there are still some issues here and there, but I'm learning. I do think I need some new subject matter, though. I'm sure the last thing you all want to see is yet another picture of my hand.
So I guess would make this a good time to show off some of my gesture drawings. These are all done in 90 seconds, hence why they look so hurried and crazy, but I actually got good at doing these fairly quick. They're not art with a capital A, but you can tell what they are.
...which for me, is a pretty big deal.
Two of the better examples of my first attempts.
I don't know if they're gesture drawings exactly, because they don't convey "motion" like they're supposed to. But I'm learning some sorta skill from doing them, so I keep at it. I'm just not sure what I'm learning.
Besides the fact that I'm now actually quite honestly damn sick of drawing my hand over and over again, I am starting to get kinda good at it. I decided to juxtapose the first drawing I did not quite two months ago with the one I did last night to show that...well hell...I am actually improving.
Here.
Of course there are still some issues here and there, but I'm learning. I do think I need some new subject matter, though. I'm sure the last thing you all want to see is yet another picture of my hand.
So I guess would make this a good time to show off some of my gesture drawings. These are all done in 90 seconds, hence why they look so hurried and crazy, but I actually got good at doing these fairly quick. They're not art with a capital A, but you can tell what they are.
...which for me, is a pretty big deal.
Two of the better examples of my first attempts.
I don't know if they're gesture drawings exactly, because they don't convey "motion" like they're supposed to. But I'm learning some sorta skill from doing them, so I keep at it. I'm just not sure what I'm learning.
Mini update to Project Creepy Draw House.
Besides the fact that I'm now actually quite honestly damn sick of drawing my hand over and over again, I am starting to get kinda good at it. I decided to juxtapose the first drawing I did not quite two months ago with the one I did last night to show that...well hell...I am actually improving.
Here.
Of course there are still some issues here and there, but I'm learning. I do think I need some new subject matter, though. I'm sure the last thing you all want to see is yet another picture of my hand.
So I guess would make this a good time to show off some of my gesture drawings. These are all done in 90 seconds, hence why they look so hurried and crazy, but I actually got good at doing these fairly quick. They're not art with a capital A, but you can tell what they are.
...which for me, is a pretty big deal.
Two of the better examples of my first attempts.
I don't know if they're gesture drawings exactly, because they don't convey "motion" like they're supposed to. But I'm learning some sorta skill from doing them, so I keep at it. I'm just not sure what I'm learning.
Woa these are huge improvements! Great job!
Thumbs up for the improvement Renzatic! --and to Chrono1081 for the terrific flying saucer!
Renzatic - do you have an art school or community college nearby so you can check if anyone is doing a sort of pick-up Life drawing session a few nights a month? If so, please investigate. And yes, it's good to do a change up, when you get back to the blind contour drills (refreshed) you can usually expect a jump. Drawing from life is way better than working from photos, so set up some still-lives or friends, & some dramatic lighting to work from too. (Oh yeah, memories of those $2 hardware store metal clip-on lamps... But seriously, that light does a ton of the work for you.)
Chrono --is that background in the color version meant to evoke DC? If so, cool!
I'm currently boring myself to death with all-grey interior elevations, but at least I'm using my new Huion 610 which is wonderfully effortless. I could be working on a portrait of a dog defending the earth from meteors which would certainly be more exciting except the composition is driving me nuts. ~And I just ordered Manga Studio 5...
Okay, up to speed.
Renzatic - do you have an art school or community college nearby so you can check if anyone is doing a sort of pick-up Life drawing session a few nights a month? If so, please investigate. And yes, it's good to do a change up, when you get back to the blind contour drills (refreshed) you can usually expect a jump. Drawing from life is way better than working from photos, so set up some still-lives or friends, & some dramatic lighting to work from too. (Oh yeah, memories of those $2 hardware store metal clip-on lamps... But seriously, that light does a ton of the work for you.)
Chrono --is that background in the color version meant to evoke DC? If so, cool!
I'm currently boring myself to death with all-grey interior elevations, but at least I'm using my new Huion 610 which is wonderfully effortless. I could be working on a portrait of a dog defending the earth from meteors which would certainly be more exciting except the composition is driving me nuts. ~And I just ordered Manga Studio 5...
Okay, up to speed.
Nope its just an environment light. Basically its a way to get realistic lighting and reflections (there's a better more sophisticated way to do it than what I did but I was just doing a test and didn't go the extra mile). You take an image thats projected spherically and using Global Illumination you can use that images colors to light your 3D scene. This is a great way to get very realistic lighting with not a ton of effort. The end scene I have may or may not use this technique I'm not quite sure yet. I'll have another piece of the puzzle to post soon
I'm curious about this. Have you consulted any photo reference after drawing that? I like where you were going with some of the wrinkles. They could use a little buildup as they wouldn't be quite that hard, but it's difficult to do that without soft lead. I'm absolutely terrible with pencils, so it's better than I would have done. I'm too used to wacom tablets, and I'm not used to drawing people from scratch. Bear that in mind. Out of the images you've posted I like the rough blockouts the best. They show someone making decisions on how they want stuff to line up, which is very cool. On the hands some of the carpals are off, there are some volume issues, and your thumb grows out of your wrist on one. Have you tried consulting something like 3d.sk (nudity so may be NSFW) on that stuff? To me I see these nice wrinkles then none of the underlying phalanges as you move across the hand, and there are parts with stretched fingers and stuff like that.
If I were you I would do it in photoshop so you can adjust parts until they look right to you or block things out first as you did with the full figure drawing. I mean there are things I probably would have changed if I was doing that one, but some of the implied fabric wrinkles and things are very dynamic there. I should really post some stuff. With the faces, it seems like the 3d programs have influenced you a bit much. It's kind of like a front orthographic view of a face. I did years of photo comping work (somehow) before going back and learning basic art skills, as my degree was in something entirely different.
I'm pretty sure there are somewhere, but I've only done a few cursory searches for them. My problem is I only consistently have time at night, usually after 8 or 9, and it'd probably be hard for me to find a good class that late.
...and I'm not asking my friends, family, girlfriends past or present, passing acquaintances, or mortal enemies to pose for me. That's a recipe for nothing but trouble and injury (which is me saying I'm a little too self conscious about my skills to ask that yet
). Maybe later, but right now...it'd feel weird as hell to ask.But I can go out and draw pictures of things outside, which is what I'm thinking on doing here soon. This weekend, I plan on doing three solid hours of gesture drawings. After that, I'm moving on to something else, and it'll probably be this.
Actually, that's the clip on my little drawing board I use to hold my paper stead. But now that you've brought it up, I'm gonna go out and buy one.
thekev said:
I have looked at some "how to draw hands" tutorials since, but none of them have shown me how to do anything except basic line drawing. I haven't found anything to do with shading yet.
Shading, speaking of which, is still my biggest weakness. The way I'm doing it right now is basically just me coloring in sections with my pencil, almost using it like a lead crayon. This works well for some things, but when it comes to doing highlights and gradients, it absolutely sucks. This little fact is readily apparent from my recent hand drawings I've been doing palm up. I can get the lines down alright, along with some of the shadowing, but to get it looking real, I have to be able to shade smoothly from light to dark. To make the creases in my palms look like indentations and...yeah...creases, rather than simple black lines of varying width.
I've been doing two things to try and address this. First, and this is the weirdest, I've been practicing drawing by holding the pencil just underneath the tip with my thumb and index finger. When you're holding a pencil like you've been taught, the only thing you're able to make with it is a simple line. Holding overhanded allows you to make a larger variety of marks and shades. It's also good for making you want to draw from your elbow and shoulder, which, apparently, allows for much more smooth control without as much tension.
...let me tell you, it's a giant pain in the ass to learn how to do. But I can see the advantages in drawing this way, so I'm sticking with it.
So am I, actually. I've been using my little cheap Bamboo for about 3-4 years now.
One of the reasons why I'm getting into drawing with good ole fashioned pen and paper is because you have to learn how to coordinate your eye and your hand together better. Like if I draw something with a vector, I don't necessarily have to get it right that first time. If it ends up looking goofy, I'm just a few steps away from making it look right. You don't have that option with a pencil. If you want a good line, you have to draw a good line. And if you want a good line, you have to learn how to trace with your eye, and get your hand to follow along.
Yeah, it sounds kinda overly complicated, specially in this day and age. But if you're able to train your eye like that, it tends to train it to pick up small details elsewhere, see how it all comes together. This has always been a bit of a problem for me. Like when I'm modelling, I can block out shapes no problem. But getting details inside of it has always stumped me a good bit. I can always end up getting something kindasorta decent if I futz around with it enough, but it's never been a smooth, flowing process for me. It's been like a block, and it's what's keeping me from moving on from pretty decent intermediate to doing pro level stuff.
This is why I'm learning how to draw. My ultimate goals might be more 3D related, but I feel that drawing the old fashioned way will help fill in the areas where I'm lacking. From what I've seen so far, I'd say it's helping.
Course I wouldn't say I'm good at it yet, but I'm getting there.
Holy **** this is a long ass post. Okay, summing up from here. 3D.sk is now bookmarked. It won't work for what I'm doing right now, since you're supposed to draw them out every 30-90 seconds then switch to something else. But when I start getting into anatomy, it's gonna help out a bunch.
Yeah, 3D has probably influenced me a little too much. Even now I still tend to look at things by silhouettes with stuff inside of them rather than complete wholes. It's a bad habit I'm slowly breaking, though.
And the rest? I'll keep it in mind.
Oh, I'll also add that a lot of my problems with my hand drawings have come about because I tend to draw things from different perspectives sometimes. Like I'll have my hand on the board, staring at it while I draw one bit. Then I'll get an itch on my nose, scratch it, then move my hand back into position. Sometimes I don't get things into the same place they were before, and it messes up the whole thing. Or sometimes I'll move my head to look at something a little more closely, and I'll end up drawing it from a slightly different perspective than the rest.
Sometimes it comes out alright. Sometimes it looks freakishly weird. What I've been posting are my better attempts.
...and that should scare you.
edit: Here's a perfect example of what I'm talking about. My thumb and index finger came out just about perfect. But then I moved my hand when I went to get a swig of drink, and shifted it away from me a little more when I went to put it back. My middle, ring, and pinky fingers are actually drawn like they're slightly angled away from me rather than flat, then I moved my hand back into position to draw my palm.
End result? Mutant hand.
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...and I'm not asking my friends, family, girlfriends past or present, passing acquaintances, or mortal enemies to pose for me. That's a recipe for nothing but trouble and injury (which is me saying I'm a little too self conscious about my skills to ask that yet
That's understandable, don't sweat it yet. But you should at some point later.
Ray Frenden wrote a blog post in the past week or so about using his Note II and a stylus to do field sketching. He said that people don't notice that he's drawing them, unlike when he used a sketch book & pen or pencil. It's good you're changing it up and going outside to sketch.
When you get the $2 clip-on lamp from the hardware store, go to an AC Moore or similar and get a drawing pad of toned papers, example: Canson Mi-Teintes Pastel, assorted colors or assorted greys. (I'm looking at a 9" x 12" pad I've got, a little on the small side. Aaannnd, I've got a Strathmore drawing pad which is 12" x 18", it's Strathmore Artagain Recycled Drawing --6 assorted colors (mostly greys & tans), that was 11 bucks from MJ Design. --This size'll probably be better for you.
While you're at one of these extortionate crafts stores, get a white Prisma color pencil and or a white chalk pencil, and a couple charcoal pencils or vine charcoal, --or Conté crayons in black and possibly sepia. There are also packs with a small assortment of drawing tools which include some of these. You need softer pencils: HB 2B 4B and definitely 6B.
Set up a still-life using dramatic light and shadows --ditto for your hand --or better yet, a gnarly pair of old shoes, then concentrate on drawing the light and shadows, let the tint of the shaded paper be the middle value. You'll be amazed.
Next time you do gesturals, use a larger pad of newsprint (up to 18 x 24") so you don't stint or cramp yourself. Use a soft black conté crayon, or charcoal, or even a grease pencil, or a 6B drawing pencil. Regular pencil is barely HB and it's difficult to draw on cheap pulpy paper (newsprint pad) with it, you'll never get rich darks with it anyway.
For checking out art supplies, pretty much every place around charges out of the nose for art supplies --but you can sometimes find supplies cheaper by shopping Amazon, Cheap Joe's, and Jerry's Artarama etc., on the web.
Oh, and another exercise to do when you draw your hand again, draw through. Draw a spline for each finger, then draw elliptical sections, like banana slices, building them up from the core. When they're right and you've got the volume, you will draw a better contour.
Keep doing what you're doing, but throw in some fun drawings too.
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Understandable although you seem like you would be fine if you just established your sense of form. Other than that it's reasonably clean. I mean have you considered just a bit of digital where you can transform things at will or doing more of the scribble blockouts to establish form? It seems like that intermittent distraction is taking a toll.
...and I'm not asking my friends, family, girlfriends past or present, passing acquaintances, or mortal enemies to pose for me. That's a recipe for nothing but trouble and injury (which is me saying I'm a little too self conscious about my skills to ask that yet
I suggest against asking past girlfriends in general. I have no idea if you've ever watched flight of the conchords. I miss that show. It was so silly. If you do use someone you know, just keep it loose. If it's not detailed enough to tell who it is, how will they really blame you? I've used random people before, and I am probably perceived as much weirder than you.
I always had difficulty with that. It's an issue of so much blank space to start. It helps drawing some rough guidelines for rough perspective. Nothing ever matches entirely as ground is not flat.
Blah I hate those kinds of things as they miss the whole point. The drawing aspect when it comes to volume and shape is a separate topic from understanding the forms of the hands. Melding it in such a way means that you really only learn how to copy a case study.
You'll find people who do that digitally tend to start off with blobs of color much of the time and render it in, at least that's the most common technique. It isn't exactly the same as on paper, but it works. If you're having trouble consider photo reference. You can find a lot online. Just have it where you can glance at it while working. Having a lot helps so you aren't too influenced by a given piece.
That's a typical grip for shading as you aren't forced to use the point of a pencil. Obtaining a set of drawing pencils with soft lead might help. If they tend to put down less and build up in a clean manner, it will make things easier for you.
Fair enough.
I've mostly used 9x12 and larger. The mapping is much more comfortable although I prefer 1:1 as my hand eye coordination is too slow. I prefer to work by feel which is much easier if it maps 1:1.
This is why I'm learning how to draw. My ultimate goals might be more 3D related, but I feel that drawing the old fashioned way will help fill in the areas where I'm lacking. From what I've seen so far, I'd say it's helping. It's not a bad thing to be just a few steps away. If you can actually adjust it to be right, that's great. Even on paper it's not uncommon for people to scribble blockouts to determine form as you have done.
Course I wouldn't say I'm good at it yet, but I'm getting there.
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I wasn't talking about vectors at all. You can just use the paintbrush tool. With a bamboo I would be tempted to use mouse mode, as otherwise the mapping against a given display would be way too loose.
Yes. They have free samples, which is why I suggested it. I think there's another site with more dynamic poses. I can't remember the name.
Yeah, 3D has probably influenced me a little too much. Even now I still tend to look at things by silhouettes with stuff inside of them rather than complete wholes. It's a bad habit I'm slowly breaking, though.
And the rest? I'll keep it in mind.
Oh, I'll also add that a lot of my problems with my hand drawings have come about because I tend to draw things from different perspectives sometimes. Like I'll have my hand on the board, staring at it while I draw one bit. Then I'll get an itch on my nose, scratch it, then move my hand back into position. Sometimes I don't get things into the same place they were before, and it messes up the whole thing. Or sometimes I'll move my head to look at something a little more closely, and I'll end up drawing it from a slightly different perspective than the rest.
Sometimes it comes out alright. Sometimes it looks freakishly weird. What I've been posting are my better attempts.
...and that should scare you. Image
edit: Here's a perfect example of what I'm talking about. My thumb and index finger came out just about perfect. But then I moved my hand when I went to get a swig of drink, and shifted it away from me a little more when I went to put it back. My middle, ring, and pinky fingers are actually drawn like they're slightly angled away from me rather than flat, then I moved my hand back into position to draw my palm.
End result? Mutant hand.
I saw better results from the scribbled blockouts. I am really in favor of such a strategy. With the thumb, its structure goes quite far. It's just that you attached the phalanges too directly leaving out metacarpals. It does flow into the wrist, but it's not exactly a finger attached to a wrist. Take a look at this xray photo. See the 2 phalanges bones? You have 2 bones that rest against the metacarpal. The metacarpal connects to the carpal in the wrist where you have that sharper divot. You basically drew it like that bone didn't exist and based the articulation somewhat on the lack of that bone in the drawing. With the faces I would probably try doing something other than a straight on orthographic view. Perspective is subtle dead on, so it tends to slip into that for most people.
I don't think going that detailed will help you understand basic form. I rarely draw people, but I know the forms and most people can sense when something is off. I just think the practice needs to be more on the sense of space than detail. It's okay to look at your hand from different angles to understand the volume. Understanding volume will be crucial to a lot of drawing and modeling. What I like about drawing is that you don't get anything for free. It encourages you to add what you want as you start from nothing.
Holy crap, I've got a lot of replies to go through.
I'll look into those once I run out of my current supply of paper, which are all 9x12 sketch pads I picked up from the school supply section at the local grocery store (I slummin' it).
The clip on lamp? I'm picking one up tonight. I might even go all out and spend $10 on one.
Right now, I've two sets of graphite sticks I picked up while I grabbed my drawing board that I have no idea what to do with (for reference, one set contains three very thick 6B, 4B, and 2B pencils, and the other has two blocks simply labeled "soft"). The Conte crayons will definitely be the next thing I buy. I've watched a few portrait timelapses on Youtube and Vimeo made using them, and they seem like something I'd definitely want to learn to get a grasp on.
I've got a few pair of gnarly old shoes. Once I'm past my (seemingly obsessive) gestural and contour stage, I'll make an attempt at it.
Actually, this is something "The Natural Way to Draw" touches upon that I haven't tried yet. Right now, it seems that I'm practicing in preparation for practicing what the book wants to teach me, and I feel like I'm spinning my wheels a bit. Since thekev touches upon this a little bit, I'll go more indepth about it below.
I'll look into those once I run out of my current supply of paper, which are all 9x12 sketch pads I picked up from the school supply section at the local grocery store (I slummin' it).
The clip on lamp? I'm picking one up tonight. I might even go all out and spend $10 on one.
Right now, I've two sets of graphite sticks I picked up while I grabbed my drawing board that I have no idea what to do with (for reference, one set contains three very thick 6B, 4B, and 2B pencils, and the other has two blocks simply labeled "soft"). The Conte crayons will definitely be the next thing I buy. I've watched a few portrait timelapses on Youtube and Vimeo made using them, and they seem like something I'd definitely want to learn to get a grasp on.
I've got a few pair of gnarly old shoes. Once I'm past my (seemingly obsessive) gestural and contour stage, I'll make an attempt at it.
Actually, this is something "The Natural Way to Draw" touches upon that I haven't tried yet. Right now, it seems that I'm practicing in preparation for practicing what the book wants to teach me, and I feel like I'm spinning my wheels a bit. Since thekev touches upon this a little bit, I'll go more indepth about it below.