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Scott Forstall Reportedly Forced Out of Apple

inertiat said:
Thank goodness. I was wondering if it was just me or had Apple's own iOS apps taken a complete nosedive over the last year. The awful podcasts apps which was just completely broken and is still terrible slow and buggy (unbelievable), new broken Books app, Maps of course and the horrible, horrible skeuomorphic UI design in so many apps (game centre - what on earth?!?!).
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There's really nothing wrong with the idea of a skeumorphic UI design for Game Center, but in that case it should allude to contemporary gaming, arcade games or something. Not green effing felt. On my way to some futuristic sci-fi cyberworld I really don't need a dose of old geezer associations, pool tables, roulette, craps, tuxedos and shaken-not-stirred dry martinis.
 
Jeans89 said:
Hopefully we will get a new homescreen. The icons jungle is really so 2009.
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It goes in cycles. In the mid 90's we had a bevel and drop shadow boom, followed by a trend toward a flat 2D print style, then the bevels and shadows returned in the early 00's only this time with the glossy effect that made everything look like shiny plastic... Aqua was big on that and the look was imitated by everything from websites to Vista. Now the flat style is making a big comeback and iOS is about a year away from a "sooooo 2005" verdict.
 
Manderby said:
This announcement comes a little surprising. Aside from my personal opinion about taste and functionality, Mr. Forstall nonetheless guided iOS in a direction. And I completely understood why he was chosen. On the other hand, I never understood why he was on stage so often. In my personal opinion, Mr. Forstall tried to act like Mr. Jobs on stage. To me, this felt unauthenthic and untrustworthy which probably is why I personally never built excitement for anything he presented.

Personal taste aside, I doubt that something like not signing an apology-letter has something to do with it. Maybe it was just the last drop.

If on the other hand what is rumored about apple being divided into camps is true, his leaving (or being pushed) is totally comprehensible. Everyone can be kicked (pushed, mobbed) out, even the big ones. That is sad and I'm sure, all these posts here only scratch the surface of what is the true reason behind it all.

This announcement sounds to me that there were very personal (not so pretty) things going on which lead to this decision. I wish him strength for the future.
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I agree with everything you said. I always felt he was the weakest speaker at Apple keynotes. There was always something untruthful about him. Your comment about him trying to be like Steve Jobs on stage really makes sense. It also makes sense that he was trying to be a Steve Jobs in the workplace. Which is impossible to do unless you're Steve Jobs... So it makes sense that not many people liked him. I think it'll be a good thing for Apple that he leaves. Put Sir Jonathan Ive in charge of as much of the design process as possible.
 
Jeans89 said:
Hopefully we will get a new homescreen. The icons jungle is really so last decade.
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So long they keep it user friendly. I love what Microsoft have done with their tiles, as far as being visually nice, but I dont really care much for its user friendliness.

Also, I hope they keep using skeuomorphism, but with Ive im not so sure.
 
This is good for Apple and consumers. The more Ivy is pulled away from hardware design the better. On the other hand, why didn't they just fire Ivy?
 
Macist said:
Ive is the best presenter in videos. But it doesn't seem he likes marching round a stage in front of hundreds of people.
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He can't do his trademark head-cocking thing on stage, the spotlights up there blind him.
 
gmanist1000 said:
Who thinks Google hires him?
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Yep everyone's thinking that. I'd be surprised if not. Only factor would be that he still makes a lot of money not to go to google (I'm sure) and that over the years he probably grew to dislike android. No passion for it plus doesn't need the money.

Anyway, anyone else notice the one guy carrying on Steve Jobs' vision for the software is now being fired for doing so??? He kept realistic software design and pushed Google out with Siri & Maps. All things Jobs wanted.
 
If they bring Forstall back tomorrow most of you celebrating his departure will be fans again somehow. As long as Apple is doing it most will find a way say they like it. It's what happens when you become a lifestyle accessory brand.
 
BurchBoy said:
"Who thinks Google hires him?"

Yep everyone's thinking that. I'd be surprised if not. Only factor would be that he still makes a lot of money not to go to google (I'm sure) and that over the years he probably grew to dislike android. No passion for it plus doesn't need the money.
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Seriously?

I personally think there is no reason whatsoever for Google to hire him. They already have really good developers (if not the best), software and interface creators, why would they employ someone who apparently did not do that well at Apple?
 
sphoenix said:
Steve Jobs would have fired him sooner ;)
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I suspect jobs had wanted him to be his successor for a very long time but jobs finally had to let go of the idea because the company would have imploded. It is pretty clear he had strained relationships with many of the other top people. While jobs protected him and tried to fix him he could never do it.
 
BurchBoy said:
...anyone else notice the one guy carrying on Steve Jobs' vision for the software is now being fired for doing so??? He kept realistic software design and pushed Google out with Siri & Maps. All things Jobs wanted.
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I'd love to know what's behind all this. Would make an awesome, nerdy soap-opera! :D

Makes me wonder if Cook would've ousted Jobs years ago - if he'd had the power to do so.
 
Of course he was forced out! A title of "advisor" to the (CEO, military commander, etc.) is merely a codeword for removal of a person from his/her job quickly (typically for cause) and putting the person in a paid holding pattern until a decision is made about what to do with the employee without the embarrassment of an outright firing.

Guaranteed, these people don't do any productive "advising." In fact, they are never even seen around the organization again.

Only in a very, very rare case are they held in this holding pattern awaiting someone else's departure so they can move into a job of increased responsibility within the same organization. I don't see that being the case with Forstall; rather, I'm betting there's some reason contractually why he can't be cut loose immediately. Thus the "Advisor to the CEO" title in name only. Forstall will never be heard from again around the Apple campus despite remaining on the payroll for a few more months in this nebulous "advisor" status.
 
koban4max said:
Whhaaatt?:eek: you can't be serious. What makes you think Ive can do make a better ios? Did he have any background in that area?
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Because the interface is key and Ivey is one of the greatest human interaction designers in existence and now he has a new and potentially more substantial canvas to work on.

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DaveLG526 said:
If the not willing to sign the letter item is true, Forestall made the right decision to not sign it.

If he signs it then Cook has all he needs to fire him. In fact, if Cook actually asked him to sign such a letter, red flags must have went up in front of Forstall's eyes. He knew he was doomed.

This way he doesn't have the letter follow him around.

Cook will still have to explain this to the Board but its unlikely they will make any changes.
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You must get fired a lot. Not accepting responsibility for the failure of things you are responsible for is a guaranteed way to get fired.
 
Finally! So "Skeuomorphism" is the word I've been looking for all these years? I always wondered if there was a word for a disjointed and unrefined interface, now I know there is.. and it was actually an objective! This was a big mistake that Forstall made and I said it from the very beginning.

The interface design should be uniform and there should be a consistent visual design throughout. Having hideous leather in some places, and minimalist elsewhere makes the OS look like it was designed by a child. Don't even get me started on the wood panels in the iTunes App! Absolutely VILE!

Hopefully, we will now see a more traditional Apple design, and a move away from the disjointed mess we have come to see.
 
Vitruviux said:
I agree. Forstall leaving could be very bad for iOS. And it's iOS that is selling all the iPhones and iPads.

And for the Skeumorphism haters, there was an article or a thread on The Verge recently that showed OS X applications without skeumorphism, they looked extremely bland.
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In ideal world, Forstall should have never lead Maps project. Apple should have hired an Application Development Chief.

But if releasing non-prime Maps was Forstall's idea and Tim Cook agreed to go with that decision Forstall departure is the right outcome.

iOS is just an O/S, it is not going to change much. You could only add so many pinches going forward. It is the App Development Apple should concentrate on.
 
AFDoc said:
As they should be in the entire country IF an employee is fired. If they go on their own then I have no issue with a non compete. It's ridiculous to expect someone to not get another job in their field of work after being fired.
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Why not when someone leaves voluntarily? Non-compete clause could make you a slave of your current company.
 
So, they get rid of a guy who is at the origin of iOS (and not only from a design perspective), whose knowledge dates back from NEXT and was at the head of the best mobile OS development...

...to replace him with a guy who, for visual design's sake, just recently gave us thinner desktops (who cares? It goes on a desk) with crappy GPU and mostly laptop components?

I don't think that "ruling by killing the opposition" is the best way.
 
Bezetos said:
And how did that work out for iOS? Not so well.
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I'm not sure... But I think iOS is the most profitable mobile project in history. Good job Rubenstien and Forstall. Now it's Ives turn. Lets see how this goes. It'll take 1.5 years to see a difference in iOS
 
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