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mentaluproar

macrumors 68000
Original poster
May 25, 2010
1,774
224
Ohio, USA
My iPhone 5s is as loud as the surface, and the iPad 4 was louder than both. Still, the surface is an impressive device.

Penny Arcade did mention the start thing and that made me want to try this device. I liked that Microsoft was paying close attention. I feel more confident the device will get continued support like apple products do.
 

spinedoc77

macrumors G4
Jun 11, 2009
11,488
5,413
My iPhone 5s is as loud as the surface, and the iPad 4 was louder than both. Still, the surface is an impressive device.

Penny Arcade did mention the start thing and that made me want to try this device. I liked that Microsoft was paying close attention. I feel more confident the device will get continued support like apple products do.

I'm wondering if you got a defective SP3 as I'm not finding that to be the case. The SP3 has some very nice reviews mentioning the sound.

Keep in mind I'm a caveman when it comes to music fidelity. I find no difference in analog versus digital and see little difference in changing bitrates, etc, it all sounds the same to me so maybe I just have crappy ears.
 

mrex

macrumors 68040
Jul 16, 2014
3,458
1,527
europe
After reading reviews im considering to skip sp3 until it has broadwell architecture inside. Not sure can they do anything to the thermal issue in current models.
 

xraydoc

Contributor
Oct 9, 2005
11,031
5,492
192.168.1.1
I keep hitting the Microsoft button by mistake, kicking me out of tasks. Handwriting recognition in portrait mode is worthless because of this.

My iPad had better sound too. Louder and fuller.

When I'm doing a lot of writing, I'll turn the screen upside down and put the Windows logo at the top. Works like a charm.


No trouble with sound here - better and fuller than my iPad Air was.
 

monty77

macrumors 6502a
Mar 4, 2005
594
173
UK, South Coast
:eek:
I can get iCloud to sync with outlook, but not from there to the windows calendar. It's maddening that such a useful tile doesn't tie in with anything I already have.

This!! Tried a SP2 a few months back and this was a deal breaker for me unfortunately - crazy this doesn't work.
 

mentaluproar

macrumors 68000
Original poster
May 25, 2010
1,774
224
Ohio, USA
After reading reviews im considering to skip sp3 until it has broadwell architecture inside. Not sure can they do anything to the thermal issue in current models.


Broadwell should do amazing things for the Microsoft Surface. It's perfectly usable now, but it will likely get thinner and quieter with Broadwell.
 

m98custom1212

macrumors 6502
Jul 20, 2013
287
1
Toledo, Ohio
any NAS setup recommendations you're willing to share? I've been wanting to set one up for a while but it's a bit intimidating to be honest. I can't quite find the best system out there. I'd want to be able to access everything on the system from anywhere in the world preferably on my iPhone as well.

Depends on Budget you can build your own but you have plenty of other options from Buffalo, Qnap and Synology

That can be done and has do you want to build your own? Prebuilt if so go the sites I mentioned and so what fits the build and Ios and Android are popular so you will no problem on either.
 

irnchriz

macrumors 65816
May 2, 2005
1,034
2
Scotland
Anyone got OSX running on one yet? If they can get OSX on it and stable I might have to take a trip to the shops :)
 

spinedoc77

macrumors G4
Jun 11, 2009
11,488
5,413
Anyone got OSX running on one yet? If they can get OSX on it and stable I might have to take a trip to the shops :)

The Pro 1 and 2 had OSx running on them. I'm sure the SP3 has also, I just haven't really searched around if that was the case. I have a Hackintosh on my desktop and I've thought about getting it running on my SP3 as well, but I don't really have the time and I really don't like OSx so it would be primarily to see if I could do it.
 

mentaluproar

macrumors 68000
Original poster
May 25, 2010
1,774
224
Ohio, USA
any NAS setup recommendations you're willing to share? I've been wanting to set one up for a while but it's a bit intimidating to be honest. I can't quite find the best system out there. I'd want to be able to access everything on the system from anywhere in the world preferably on my iPhone as well.


You may not need an NAS. For something that basic, my ASUS router's built in sharing features do the job faster than my NAS. My Synology NAS is much more featureful than the router-as-NAS solution, and is able to safely shut down when the UPS battery gets low.
 

tennisproha

macrumors 68000
Jun 24, 2011
1,724
1,238
Texas
Depends on Budget you can build your own but you have plenty of other options from Buffalo, Qnap and Synology

That can be done and has do you want to build your own? Prebuilt if so go the sites I mentioned and so what fits the build and Ios and Android are popular so you will no problem on either.

either/or really. for the pre-built option it seems that they are accompanied by crappy apps or systems. ie: the synology app for iOS looks very amateur and chaotic. they have like 5 apps that do the same thing.

for self build I want to be able to access from any device and my iPhone mainly. this is going to be my backup solution so potentially Mac and PC compatibility is core. I don't see the links you're talking about. can you point me in the right direction?

----------

You may not need an NAS. For something that basic, my ASUS router's built in sharing features do the job faster than my NAS. My Synology NAS is much more featureful than the router-as-NAS solution, and is able to safely shut down when the UPS battery gets low.

true but this will be my backup solution as well so I'd rather have a centric server-esque solution.
 

mentaluproar

macrumors 68000
Original poster
May 25, 2010
1,774
224
Ohio, USA
Either works. The asus runs scheduled disk checks and supports time machine. Better budget option if you want a new router. Otherwise, my synology works slow but very stable.
 

burgman

macrumors 68030
Sep 24, 2013
2,798
2,385
Broadwell should do amazing things for the Microsoft Surface. It's perfectly usable now, but it will likely get thinner and quieter with Broadwell.
Some opinions are the current Surface was designed for broadwell. The current chipset was a last minute switch when Intel couldn't deliver Broadwell. Not sure there will be any design changes.
 

MozMan68

macrumors 603
Jun 29, 2010
6,152
5,261
South Cackalacky
Some opinions are the current Surface was designed for broadwell. The current chipset was a last minute switch when Intel couldn't deliver Broadwell. Not sure there will be any design changes.

Well... the slots for ventilation could technically be diminished or removed all together.

But making it much thinner will not be possible due to the requirements to support USB and the mini display port.
 

m98custom1212

macrumors 6502
Jul 20, 2013
287
1
Toledo, Ohio
either/or really. for the pre-built option it seems that they are accompanied by crappy apps or systems. ie: the synology app for iOS looks very amateur and chaotic. they have like 5 apps that do the same thing.

for self build I want to be able to access from any device and my iPhone mainly. this is going to be my backup solution so potentially Mac and PC compatibility is core. I don't see the links you're talking about. can you point me in the right direction?

----------



true but this will be my backup solution as well so I'd rather have a centric server-esque solution.


I just use windows 8 as my nas/htpc operating system you find plenty of appilctions to fit whatever you're to do. I guess I have a desktop that serves and main file hub.

check out filezilla ftp?

Backup software so many choices in that department. I just a file sync program that backup certain folders. Programs and operating systems I don't care about. I care about my designs, onenote notebooks, my e books and all the custom toolbars and settings I did to my engineering programs. Photos get synced to dropbox from my phone.

Qnap looks pretty impressive as does readynas
 

mentaluproar

macrumors 68000
Original poster
May 25, 2010
1,774
224
Ohio, USA
Well... the slots for ventilation could technically be diminished or removed all together.

But making it much thinner will not be possible due to the requirements to support USB and the mini display port.

I agree with this. This tablet struggles to cool itself at times. Clearly meant for broadwell.

Intel is pissing a lot of people off with the broadwell delays.
 

honam1021

macrumors regular
Nov 4, 2012
240
105
Originally I wanted to buy a rMBP, but after taking a look at Yosemite, I am now on the same boat with op.

If they improve the look on non-retina displays (I often hook up my laptops to other monitors at home) and may change my mind.
 

mentaluproar

macrumors 68000
Original poster
May 25, 2010
1,774
224
Ohio, USA
Seriously considering a Surface Pro 3

I returned the surface last night. I felt bad. It really was a good piece of kit but it was not meant for me.

There was a lot of overlap between my rMBP and the Surface Pro 3. While there were things I could do on the surface I could never do on the Mac, where there was overlap, the Mac crushed it. It wasn't even fair. My rMBP is faster, gets better battery life, has a fantastic keyboard, amazing audio (although the left speaker does distort now. maybe I should take it in for service before the warrantee runs out.) and handles multiple operating systems better. Gaming good on this machine whereas the surface was just passable. Portal 2 played fine, but that was the extent of it. Still impressive.

The surface didn't hold up well in tablet mode. First, I always took the damn keyboard off, as it added bulk and it didn't always deactivate. Modern IE would randomly eat processor time and kick on the fan, even without a site being displayed. I had to kill it in task manager to stop it. Otherwise, it would just do it again once I went back to IE.

The pen was slippery and note taking was a pain. The pen just flew around the glass. I have terrible handwriting, but some resistance would have helped here.

Ergonomically, tablet mode is horrid. If I was at a classroom desk, moving between pen and on screen keyboard, this would be a win. Onenote in modern mode is convenient. The pen feels "right" in my hand and the on screen keyboard is probably the best out there. With shortcuts for numbers on the top row and left and right arrow keys at the bottom to make up for touchscreen inaccuracies, it was really well done. I'm going to miss that. But in my hands, terrible. First, it's too heavy as a tablet. It will hurt your wrists. The split keyboard is locked to the bottom of the screen, making holding the surface in portrait mode ridiculous. I was constantly correcting typos in an acting class because we have notes to take, scripts to work with, annotations for our sides etc, but no desks. This is a usage case that many won't encounter, but a tablet should be usable without a desk. The surface failed there.

Tech support was dismissive except for one woman. She reminded me of when I had to call Apple because someone else's Mac kept showing up in find my iPhone. She really did WANT the help me. It wasn't about a paycheck. She actually wanted to help, and seemed displeased by the rationalizations other employees made. For her, top notch support. I wish could remember her name and call a supervisor to praise her.

I wish she was the norm but from my multiple calls for support, I found she was the exception. Multiple times I was told that there were no problems with overheating and the wireless networking issues were fixed with updates. I had reinstalled windows 3 times among two surfaces. The engineers behind the surface were clearly passionate about their baby, but the support side was oblivious at best, and smug at worst.

Network logins on windows 8 were stupidly limited. OS X allows multiple logins from the same machine with different users, but windows doesn't. When you like to screw with a NAS, that matters.

Windows 8 only makes sense on a tablet. As a laptop, even the surface was behind. Gestures on a Mac were much better than using the touchscreen on the surface.

IE doesn't handle websites with layered objects well. Look at the apple website or onlycoin. Certain elements are intended to move as layers. Modern IE treats everything as a single static layer. You cannot drag a background element either.

The battery life is acceptable for a PC laptop, but as a tablet it's abysmal. At least the charge time was Apple-level fast.

The display was absolutely gorgeous and exactly what I want at this price point. When I needed to push to the TV, miracast was built-in and ready for the task. However, it was laggy. Not only was the content on the TV side behind, which I would expect, but it slowed down the tablet itself too. AirPlay never had that problem.

The sound was decent but let's be honest here. My iPad 4 was louder and the rMBP killed it all around.

The keyboard was an embarrassing gimmick. It was clearly a transitional thing for those who can't handle touchscreen typing yet.

No true touchscreen version of Microsoft Office on Microsoft Windows. Inexcusable.

Waking from sleep was very laptop like. With a tablet, I want to open the cover, unlock, and go. The Surface had to boot up and even that required me to use the power button, which was ignored half the time on both tablets anyway.

I really did want to like this tablet, but I'm going to get a Samsung note 10.1 or 12.2 once the refund hits. The prices are the same for both so now it's just a matter of which size I like more.

If you have a good laptop already, you do not need or want the surface pro 3. If you are looking for a laptop and want a tablet, this is a great buy, but consider the i3 first. The surface really is a good piece of kit, and the wireless issues were fixed the day before I returned it with yet another firmware update. If you only need a note-taking tablet, get a tablet and not this hybrid.

If I had to do it over again and I didn't have the rMBP, I would have kept the Surface. My past experiences with iPad notetaking prove this to be a far better classroom device. However, onenote on a smaller device with a stylus and my current laptop are better for me. I would have killed for a surface when I started back in college again, but it's just not there yet and at that price point, it needs to be.
 
Last edited:

Technarchy

macrumors 604
May 21, 2012
6,753
4,927
I am looking forward to Yosemite, but I think the Surface 3 is sexy kit.

Where I work it's crept in and replaced quite a few Retina MBP's.

I'd love to own one but my MBA just works too well, and changing for the sake of changing just doesn't make sense.
 

mentaluproar

macrumors 68000
Original poster
May 25, 2010
1,774
224
Ohio, USA
Seriously considering a Surface Pro 3

It really was hard to take that thing back. Once surface gets broadwell, it will be impossible to ignore.
 

rowspaxe

macrumors 68020
Jan 29, 2010
2,214
1,009
Broadwell should do amazing things for the Microsoft Surface. It's perfectly usable now, but it will likely get thinner and quieter with Broadwell.

Dont get your hopes up. The initial implementation of Broadwell will be the core M--a low voltage atom type processor.You may not see Broadwell i7's for a while
 

mentaluproar

macrumors 68000
Original poster
May 25, 2010
1,774
224
Ohio, USA
Dont get your hopes up. The initial implementation of Broadwell will be the core M--a low voltage atom type processor.You may not see Broadwell i7's for a while

I'm okay with i3 performance, if they can get it there. I don't need an i7 in this form factor. I want it thinner, fanless, lighter, and with a split screen keyboard I can lift to a more natural position. Maybe they could let the stand rotate 90 degrees for upright tasks and give it a built in holder for the pen like the Samsung Note series tablets have.

I worry that we may not see a Surface 4 or 5. Microsoft needs to keep the project going. It is a great concept, very close to perfect hardware-wise, and in as little as a year could be the best piece of tech out there. I am no fan of Microsoft but the Surface really has convinced me they can do great things. Lets just hope Windows 9 doesn't ruin this.

Wouldn't it be interesting if AMD jumped in on the Surface project? If MS could make their OS push more of the work to the GPU side with legacy apps, it could lower the cost of the Surface and still give decent performance.
 

MozMan68

macrumors 603
Jun 29, 2010
6,152
5,261
South Cackalacky
Lets just hope Windows 9 doesn't ruin this.

I think the hope is that Windows 9 will SAVE it.

You are so right about the hardware....at least for a form factor combining a tablet and laptop...it is currently the best available right now. But the software isn't there yet...I'm hopeful for Windows 9 taking a huge step in the right direction.

It better, as you can bet Apple is working on their own "Surface" and will have an instant hit assuming the link between Macs, iPhones and now Watch improve beyond where they are even at today.
 

rowspaxe

macrumors 68020
Jan 29, 2010
2,214
1,009
I'm okay with i3 performance, if they can get it there. I don't need an i7 in this form factor. I want it thinner, fanless, lighter, and with a split screen keyboard I can lift to a more natural position. Maybe they could let the stand rotate 90 degrees for upright tasks and give it a built in holder for the pen like the Samsung Note series tablets have.

I worry that we may not see a Surface 4 or 5. Microsoft needs to keep the project going. It is a great concept, very close to perfect hardware-wise, and in as little as a year could be the best piece of tech out there. I am no fan of Microsoft but the Surface really has convinced me they can do great things. Lets just hope Windows 9 doesn't ruin this.

Since you have written insightfully on this--I have to ask: Isn't s full size pen
without a silo better than a "mini" pen with a silo? At least we can agree the stylus ribbon on the sp3 key cover is awful? It lacks only a bow.
 

spinedoc77

macrumors G4
Jun 11, 2009
11,488
5,413
Since you have written insightfully on this--I have to ask: Isn't s full size pen
without a silo better than a "mini" pen with a silo? At least we can agree the stylus ribbon on the sp3 key cover is awful? It lacks only a bow.

I don't think so. A mini pen in a silo is always with you, AND you can always buy a larger pen as a companion to throw into your bag. As a SP3 owner I'm quite disappointed in the fact that I almost never have my SP3 pen with me, and that I cannot use the pen from my Note 3 with it either. Both of these scenarios would really help out.

Yeah the stylus ribbon is a complete joke, for all the insanely good quality of the SP3 that ribbon is just an utter embarrassment.
 
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