ssd swap - high usage of Terabytes Written

[gank41]

I tried the trial version of the DriveDx app, and it's showing 18.7 TB of data written? I do have the 16GB/2TB model, but still.. Yikes.

 

[Forti]

For how long do you have the Mac m1?

 

[alien3dx]

It's all about RAM managing as far I know. Users with 8GB ram have much higher TBW than those with 16GB.

I tried the trial version of the DriveDx app, and it's showing 18.7 TB of data written? I do have the 16GB/2TB model, but still.. Yikes.

View attachment 1731008

dam you make me scare, on pronto download trial version

 

[Forti]

dam you make me scare, on pronto download trial version

How long do you have this MacBook?
My MacBook Pro 13", which is 2 years and 3-4 months old have 47.5 TBW, which is ~~1.7-1.8 TBW / month.

from what I can see my Mac mini m1 will have 2-4 times more after 2 years.

 

[gank41]

How long do you have this MacBook?
My MacBook Pro 13", which is 2 years and 3-4 months old have 47.5 TBW, which is ~~1.7-1.8 TBW / month.

from what I can see my Mac mini m1 will have 2-4 times more after 2 years.

I've got a 2020 M1 MBP w/ 16GB/2TB. This is after almost 4 days of uptime.

 

[alien3dx]

How long do you have this MacBook?
My MacBook Pro 13", which is 2 years and 3-4 months old have 47.5 TBW, which is ~~1.7-1.8 TBW / month.

from what I can see my Mac mini m1 will have 2-4 times more after 2 years.

6 January 2021 - 1 month maybe?

 

[Forti]

Check the same on your iMac from 2017 and compare those data and enjoy your "wtf" like I did.

 

[drobiu]

Mine DriveDx shows not better results. 1.5 month "old" MBP 16/512

Normal usage, no projects at all

 

[alien3dx]

Check the same on your iMac from 2017 and compare those data and enjoy your "wtf" like I did.

this is external boot imac 2017 for 3 years period.

 

[Forti]

This is huge! I'm curious if this is sensor issue (I tried with two different tools) or it's macOS with m1 issue.

edit:
@alien3dx so basically you have 22.1 TB after 3 yers on iMac, and 1.8 TB after 1.5 month with m1. This is huge

 

[alien3dx]

This is huge! I'm curious if this is sensor issue (I tried with two different tools) or it's macOS with m1 issue.

edit:
@alien3dx so basically you have 22.1 TB after 3 yers on iMac, and 1.8 TB after 1.5 month with m1. This is huge

macbook m1 more on travel meeting customer not much doing are rarely on.

iMac more on react native , php+mysql , android studio and xcode .
** all crazy project programming

 

[svanstrom]

This is huge! I'm curious if this is sensor issue (I tried with two different tools) or it's macOS with m1 issue.

edit:
@alien3dx so basically you have 22.1 TB after 3 yers on iMac, and 1.8 TB after 1.5 month with m1. This is huge

Probably only "huge" because you are completely dismissing that first hit of system upgrades and photos syncing and being processed and installation and setups of your dev environments etc?

 

[Forti]

Probably only "huge" because you are completely dismissing that first hit of system upgrades and photos syncing and being processed and installation and setups of your dev environments etc?

I'm not syncing photos from iCloud (almost 200gb of them). And all the installation, setup dev env etc - it shouldn't write over 1TB in just 8 days

I could understand 100-200gb in some edge cases, but not 1TB.

 

[rui no onna]

High disk writes seem to be par for the course for Macs.

Smartmontool Reporting abnormally high SSD write activities?

Hi all, I have been using the lowest end Mac mini (8GB RAM, 256GB SSD) for two weeks now, and I am pretty happy with it. My workflow doesn't seem to stress the CPU that much, and memory pressure stays in the green zone 95% of the time. When I start coding and running emulators in Xcode, it...

forums.macrumors.com

According to this article a modern SSD should last between 700 TBW and 1 PetaByte, which would give you a much longer lifespan. The article is more than 3 years old, and SSDs are always improving.

I'm going to look into this more - interesting subject !

According to what I found apple is probably using the TLC NAND from Western Digital, which should have 150TBW for each 250gb ssd (512ssd = 300TBW) but once again - no one knows it.

To be honest I'm expecting one of three different solutions:
- one of the future macOS update will fix it
- like someone told before - it can be just a "sensor bug"
- in next 1-2 year we are gonna see ssd repair program

Note, those factor in controller performance. Warranty TBW values also factor in write amplification. M1 Macs use a proprietary storage controller built-in to the M1 itself.

Raw P/E cycles, you're looking at:

10,000 5x nm MLC
5,000 3x nm MLC
3,000 2x nm MLC
1,000 planar TLC
3,000 3D TLC

3D TLC is what the M1 Macs are most likely to have so going purely by P/E cycle count, in terms of NAND writes that's:

768 TBW: 256 GB
1.536 PBW: 512 GB
3.072 PBW: 1 TB
6.144 PBW: 2 TB

Those figures are at 1x write amplification and rated cycles are usually minimums that all the cells are able to meet. You'd normally risk data corruption if you exceed those figures but perhaps Apple has found a way to maximize NAND life. I mean, they did buy Anobit.

Mind, I monitored changes in the S.M.A.R.T. TBW value and compared it Disk Writes in Activity Monitor while doing an iPhone backup and found it to be fairly accurate.

 

[theSeb]

yeah .. seem okay for me, nothing weird. Maybe something else. Maybe new computer apple iCloud sync ? I think prefer to see this month vs next month. Just relax and enjoy new computer . Cheers man.

I don't think @Forti downloaded around 1 TB from his cloud account.

 

[alien3dx]

I don't think @Forti downloaded around 1 TB from his cloud account.

i know but i used ssd from 2014 and still can be used till now(sandisk ssd plus) . I rather not to think so much about it as if i want to download i will used platter drive and if real work only on main drive .

I cannot give answer as i not apple engineer or i experty on apple device.For me apple just a tool todo my job.

 

[rui no onna]

For those with DriveDx, can you please share the Drive Capacity, Life Percentage Used and Data Units Written for your SSD? I think that would help us estimate the TBW lifespan for Apple "SSDs".

If Life Percentage Used is still 0%, then at the very least, we're looking at a minimum TBW lifespan of Data Units Written * 100 for a given capacity and workload.

 

[Forti]

i know but i used ssd from 2014 and still can be used till now(sandisk ssd plus) . I rather not to think so much about it as if i want to download i will used platter drive and if real work only on main drive .

I cannot give answer as i not apple engineer or i experty on apple device.For me apple just a tool todo my job.

this is pure math, and you have an example from your MacBook and iMac. Same from my:
MacBook Pro 13" 256/16, after 27-28 months: 47.5 TBW (around ~~0.06 TBW /day)
Mac mini m1 256/16, after 8 days: 1 TBW (around ~~0.13 TBW /day)

Both machine's I'm using for the exactly same task. Nothing more, nothing less. The same programs, same tools, same stuff.

I will keep monitor it and give another post here in next 2-3 weeks just to see how much will it grow

@rui no onna -

Macbook intel:
I have it for 2 years, 3-4 months (using for daily job, 6-14 hours / day)
Drive capacity: 256 ssd
life percentage used: 6 (94% left)
Data units written: 47.5 TB (102 445 782)

Mac mini m1:
8 days, same as above, 6-14 hours / per
Drive capacity: 256 ssd
life percentage used: 0 (100% left)
Data units written: 1.0 TB (2 053 993)

 

[svanstrom]

For those with DriveDx, can you please share the Drive Capacity, Life Percentage Used and Data Units Written for your SSD? I think that would help us estimate the TBW lifespan for Apple "SSDs".

If Life Percentage Used is still 0%, then at the very least, we're looking at a minimum TBW lifespan of Data Units Written * 100 for a given capacity and workload.

Why specifically from DriveDx? ?

 

[theSeb]

i know but i used ssd from 2014 and still can be used till now(sandisk ssd plus) . I rather not to think so much about it as if i want to download i will used platter drive and if real work only on main drive .

I cannot give answer as i not apple engineer or i experty on apple device.For me apple just a tool todo my job.

Sure. I am still occasionally using a 2012 first generation 15" retina Macbook Pro. The 512 GB SSD still works fine in there.

 

[rui no onna]

Why specifically from DriveDx? ?

smartctl works fine, too. I think one of them uses binary and the other decimal, though.

This is with M1 MBA 8C/8GB/512GB. At 3,000 P/E cycles, I would expect to see 1% Life Percentage Used when it reaches 15-16TB lifetime writes. We'll see if Apple has them rated for higher.

 

[drobiu]

For those with DriveDx, can you please share the Drive Capacity, Life Percentage Used and Data Units Written for your SSD? I think that would help us estimate the TBW lifespan for Apple "SSDs".

If Life Percentage Used is still 0%, then at the very least, we're looking at a minimum TBW lifespan of Data Units Written * 100 for a given capacity and workload.

Here You go:

 

[rui no onna]

Here You go: View attachment 1731061

Thanks! Can you post a screenshot from the Health Indicators tab, please? I expect Lifetime Percentage Used is 0 but I just want to confirm. If so, that suggests at least 2.3 PBW for the 500GB SSD so Apple's "SSD" is possibly rated for higher than 3,000 cycles or has greater overprovisioning.

 

[rui no onna]

Macbook intel:
I have it for 2 years, 3-4 months (using for daily job, 6-14 hours / day)
Drive capacity: 256 ssd
life percentage used: 6 (94% left)
Data units written: 47.5 TB (102 445 782)

Mac mini m1:
8 days, same as above, 6-14 hours / per
Drive capacity: 256 ssd
life percentage used: 0 (100% left)
Data units written: 1.0 TB (2 053 993)

Thanks! That Intel seems to be pretty spot on for 3000 P/E cycles as it's tracking ~790 TBW (47.5 / 0.06).

I guess we're at wait and see for the M1.

 

[Fred Zed]

Personally, I'd be questioning the accuracy of the app or utility used to derive you those figures.
Most these app aren't accurate, similar to those apps that claim to show battery health .Use them as a guide.
I doubt there will be any SSD repair or recall programs in 2 years time.