OS X Steam - I don't get it

[Intelligent]

Steam is so bad. I hate when developers make a game steam only so you have to go through that horrible program.

I like freedom. Therefore i buy games from App Store/Other websites and even CDs before i would use this bad program.

 

[richwoodrocket]

I download all my games from steam and use it religiously.
I simply turn off the cloud sync because I would never use it.
It's nice having all your games in the cloud in one place and you don't have to go to a million places to reform load them if need be.
The steam overlay is great within games.

 

[Washac]

Good luck getting 99% of all current games in boxed form without DRM.I love boxed copies, I tend to always get them. They all have DRM, even Feral Games have a set amount of activation on their boxed games.

Even buying of off the MAS, Origin, UPlay, GOG, they're all DRM.
If you have a row with GOG and you never use their service, good luck downloading them again.

It's the same everywhere. Since CD-Keys there has been DRM, especially those with limited activation.

By the same right, none of my software is my own, or yours. TOS, EULAs, DRM, it's everywhere. It's a fact of life now.

GoG has no DRM, download once, apart from any updates store the game files away safely, back them up and you never ever have to download from them again.

 

[N19h7m4r3]

GoG has no DRM, download once, apart from updates store the game files away safely, back them up and you never ever have to download from them again.

Yes, that's it. What if you lose your backups, or system dies, but as you stated had a row and refuse to use, or lost access to the account. Then what? Still out of the game.

DRM is everywhere, whether you like it or not. Steam and all download platforms just the way things are going. The days of DRM and cd-key keys on disks are going away, and very very few games are available boxed and DRM free.

 

[Washac]

What if you lose your backups, or system dies, but as you stated had a row and refuse to use, or lost access to the account. Then what? Still out of the game.

Come on, you know what I am saying, I could walk out of my front door and get run over, that argument just does not work. Even in the old days of boxed games they COULD or MIGHT get damaged in some way, or even lost.

The other thing is I will never convince you that steam is not a good delivery system in the way it works, and I will never convince you there are other ways, so I think we best agree to disagree, shake hands and go play some games

 

[VI™]

Well you can download games from the Apple App Store. And you can also go to the Mac Game Store. Or one can buy the game on DVD.

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Yes, I just boot it up, play the game, and then usually quit it. Maybe I will try leaving it run in the background more often. I have 12GB of memory, so I've got plenty to spare.

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Thanks. Seems about the same level of experience I'm getting.

Gameagent (store and broker of best available prices)
Macgamestore
Mac App Store
Amazon
GOG

It was a joke based on the fact that there aren't many options out there and that Steam is one of the biggest.

 

[TallManNY]

It was a joke based on the fact that there aren't many options out there and that Steam is one of the biggest.

No problem. I also wonder if I download from some of these other sources if the game isn't just going to point me to steam anyway for DRM purposes. I don't recall if that has happened to me. But from these other sources I've generally bought indie titles. AAA titles seem too expensive in the App Store.

 

[Washac]

No problem. I also wonder if I download from some of these other sources if the game isn't just going to point me to steam anyway for DRM purposes. I don't recall if that has happened to me. But from these other sources I've generally bought indie titles. AAA titles seem too expensive in the App Store.

GoG is totaly DRM free and will never point you towards steam or any other client.

 

[Dirtyharry50]

Now I see you cannot access the forum of a game unless you buy it, so that now stops you seeing what people are are saying about the game.

I used to sell software for a living, going back to the days of Lotus 1-2-3, Wordperfect, dBase, etc. and while you owned the disks and manuals you purchased, even going back that far you never owned the software. License agreements have always specified that you were purchasing a license to use the software but you did not own it. This practice has been the norm all along and still is.

I understand where the confusion can come in because with DRM-free software, you can have possession and control over the bits stored on something and once you have that it is yours to keep. However, it still doesn't change the license you implicitly agree to with any software purchase and use that the makers of the product own it and are only licensing you to use it.

So really, it isn't about ownership. That's always established in the EULA for any software. It's about control. With DRM, somebody else does have control to varying extents depending on the form of DRM. It is true that some risk is assumed in allowing somebody else to have control and I can't blame anyone who doesn't like this but it is pretty commonplace now with little chance of it going away.

Personally, I accept this on Steam and conduct myself in such a way that I am unlikely to ever have them wish to suspend my account. But I know there is risk of inconvenience and I accept it in return for the benefits and selection of games offered at prices I like. That's just my differing view.

By the way, I am not sure which site or client you were referring to but it made me wonder so I checked Steam and I can go view forums for games I do not own there.

By the way, don't get me wrong. I am not picking on you at all here. I can understand and respect your point of view. DRM does suck. In a perfect world we wouldn't have it. I admittedly give in and accept it like so many others because otherwise my selection is more limited than I want it to be. It's just that simple. I might use and like Steam overall but it doesn't mean I like DRM or the control they have over my purchases. It's just a tradeoff I make and so far so good.

 

[Washac]

I used to sell software for a living, going back to the days of Lotus 1-2-3, Wordperfect, dBase, etc. and while you owned the disks and manuals you purchased, even going back that far you never owned the software. License agreements have always specified that you were purchasing a license to use the software but you did not own it. This practice has been the norm all along and still is.

I understand where the confusion can come in because with DRM-free software, you can have possession and control over the bits stored on something and once you have that it is yours to keep. However, it still doesn't change the license you implicitly agree to with any software purchase and use that the makers of the product own it and are only licensing you to use it.

So really, it isn't about ownership. That's always established in the EULA for any software. It's about control. With DRM, somebody else does have control to varying extents depending on the form of DRM. It is true that some risk is assumed in allowing somebody else to have control and I can't blame anyone who doesn't like this but it is pretty commonplace now with little chance of it going away.

Personally, I accept this on Steam and conduct myself in such a way that I am unlikely to ever have them wish to suspend my account. But I know there is risk of inconvenience and I accept it in return for the benefits and selection of games offered at prices I like. That's just my differing view.

By the way, I am not sure which site or client you were referring to but it made me wonder so I checked Steam and I can go view forums for games I do not own there.

By the way, don't get me wrong. I am not picking on you at all here. I can understand and respect your point of view. DRM does suck. In a perfect world we wouldn't have it. I admittedly give in and accept it like so many others because otherwise my selection is more limited than I want it to be. It's just that simple. I might use and like Steam overall but it doesn't mean I like DRM or the control they have over my purchases. It's just a tradeoff I make and so far so good.

That is a truly great post and I thank you for that

I am sure that [ View Discussions ] option was not there the other day, I would have seen it

 

[roadbloc]

The other thing is I will never convince you that steam is not a good delivery system in the way it works, and I will never convince you there are other ways, so I think we best agree to disagree, shake hands and go play some games

I'm confused. The way Steam works is that you select something in the store (preferably something on the awesome sales), add it to the cart and then buy it at the checkout when you're ready. Then the game is ready to install. Its super simple. I don't understand what isn't good about that, or at least, what makes it bad. It isn't exactly a confusing process. It is as simple as any other App Store.

If it wasn't for Steam, I probably wouldn't game on a PC. It is the savior of PC gaming and the recent big picture mode is a blessing for the gaming PC I have plugged into my TV.

 

[Washac]

I'm confused. The way Steam works is that you select something in the store (preferably something on the awesome sales), add it to the cart and then buy it at the checkout when you're ready. Then the game is ready to install. Its super simple. I don't understand what isn't good about that, or at least, what makes it bad. It isn't exactly a confusing process. It is as simple as any other App Store.

If it wasn't for Steam, I probably wouldn't game on a PC. It is the savior of PC gaming and the recent big picture mode is a blessing for the gaming PC I have plugged into my TV.

OK, I will put it in a more basic way.

I feel, me, myself, do not like steam as a way of providing software, DRM.

DRM being part of said delivery system, therefore I do not like the delivery system.

Ever dealt with steam support ?

Totaly and utterly useless, support also being part of said delivery system.

I quite agree it is easy select your games, and pay for them and they do have great sales, no it is not confusing in anyway, behind that lies the bad, I hope you do not have to deal with their support, or if you do I hope you get a better experience than me.

 

[roadbloc]

Ever dealt with steam support ?

Nope. Never had to. Not once since I opened my account in 2006.

I understand Steam isn't perfect and sometimes horribly buggy. But I've always appreciated its freedom, letting users choose the level of use they want. An Offline mode that actually works, a compact view if you don't wish to use the social stuff, big picture mode if you're using your PC as a console, the ability to create shortcuts if you don't want to see the interface at all and skins if you don't like the god awful default look (which was horrible until the most recent update). You can backup games and transfer them from machine to machine with ease. You can stream games from one PC to another. You can share your library to friends/family when you're not playing. You can buy a game on one platform and receive all the other platforms it supports free. It may be DRM, but its damn flexible and undoubtedly feature complete without being intrusive.

I remember the early days with the horrible green interface. Now Steam was horrible back then and looking back it makes what they're doing today seem far far superior and not bad at all.

Ever dealt with Apple support? It's horrible. Ever dealt with Amazon support? Or Microsoft support? All horrible. EA support? Downright insulting. I'm lucky I haven't had to send Valve a support ticket but I wouldn't ever expect it to be a smooth process. Most companies support sucks. I don't see how it makes Steam a bad thing.

 

[Washac]

Nope. Never had to. Not once since I opened my account in 2006.

I understand Steam isn't perfect and sometimes horribly buggy. But I've always appreciated its freedom, letting users choose the level of use they want. An Offline mode that actually works, a compact view if you don't wish to use the social stuff, big picture mode if you're using your PC as a console, the ability to create shortcuts if you don't want to see the interface at all and skins if you don't like the god awful default look (which was horrible until the most recent update). You can backup games and transfer them from machine to machine with ease. You can stream games from one PC to another. You can share your library to friends/family when you're not playing. You can buy a game on one platform and receive all the other platforms it supports free.

I remember the early days with the horrible green interface. Now Steam was horrible back then and looking back it makes what they're doing today seem far far superior and not bad at all.

Ever dealt with Apple support? It's horrible. Ever dealt with Amazon support? Or Microsoft support? All horrible. EA support? Downright insulting. I'm lucky I haven't had to send Valve a support ticket but I wouldn't ever expect it to be a smooth process. Most companies support sucks. I don't see how it makes Steam a bad thing.

I have actually dealt with Apple support, dealt with my problems at the time quite well I have to say.

Amazon Several times over time, even down to this week, all problems always resolved no problems

Microsoft never had to deal with.

EA and Origin both totaly useless.

I think I am missing the good that people seem to find in steam, but I still will not like DRM nor my experiences with their support.

 

[Dirtyharry50]

Ever dealt with Apple support? It's horrible. Ever dealt with Amazon support?

I have found Apple support to be first class and above and beyond any other I have ever needed to use. I could go on at length about my own experiences but I'll just leave it at this. I have nothing but praise for them. They are a class outfit.

I've only needed Amazon support once for a botched order but they were quick to rectify the problem for me so I have no criticism for them either. I am a very satisfied long time customer of theirs going back to when they were just a bookstore.

I can't comment on the others. I haven't needed support from them although I am their customer as well. Actually, come to think of it I did have a positive experience with Origin support when I asked them to register some EA games on Origin that I owned elsewhere and they did that for me which was nice.

As for Valve, their automated support system at the first level does leave a lot to be desired. Too often after some delay one gets a form letter back that often contains basics one has already tried or worse yet irrelevant info. You are generally better off going to user forums or searching Google for Steam issues other than transaction based ones because their support does suck.

On the other hand, I think Steam support is often inundated with tickets about various games I would not expect them to support any more than I would expect a brick and mortar retailer to support them. Users need to contact the game makers, not Steam when some game isn't working well. There again, most of the time I've found the answers via Google without having to bother contacting a company, such as when Google leads to the company's forums or faqs or whatnot or else other user shared information.

 

[saturnotaku]

I think I am missing the good that people seem to find in steam, but I still will not like DRM nor my experiences with their support.

Then it looks like you're going to be stuck buying games on GOG because you will otherwise never get away from DRM.

That's your prerogative. Personally, I prefer keeping my options open. I've never had any major problems with either Steam or Origin. Uplay is beyond terrible, however, and I refuse to play recent Ubisoft games as a result.

 

[Washac]

Then it looks like you're going to be stuck buying games on GOG because you will otherwise never get away from DRM.

That's your prerogative. Personally, I prefer keeping my options open. I've never had any major problems with either Steam or Origin. Uplay is beyond terrible, however, and I refuse to play recent Ubisoft games as a result.

Believe it or not I do keep my options open, with GoG and steam If I actually know a game I really want will never be on GoG then I have to swallow hard and go to steam.

The other two Uplay & Origin I nave no time for at all.

 

[pedromcm.pm]

Never had an issue with steam. Runs well, plays my games.

Only one I've had issue with is UPlay. Even Origin does all right.

If you have a Mac you do in fact have a problem with steam:

Just let the app open in the background. In the next few minutes/hours watch it eat GB upon GB of Ram with a rogue distnoted process.

 

[Washac]

If you have a Mac you do in fact have a problem with steam:

Just let the app open in the background. In the next few minutes/hours watch it eat GB upon GB of Ram with a rogue distnoted process.

I have steam open and I see no memory loss, well not the Activity Monitor anyway ?

 

[N19h7m4r3]

If you have a Mac you do in fact have a problem with steam:

Just let the app open in the background. In the next few minutes/hours watch it eat GB upon GB of Ram with a rogue distnoted process.

Can't say I've ever noticed that, and I always have background apps and it open.

Steam has now been open for over 10 hours on my computer.
Only 118MB used all day, with games, games testing, and game videos recorded.

The app using the most RAM at the moment is Chrome with it's tabs.

 

[Alrescha]

Just let the app open in the background. In the next few minutes/hours watch it eat GB upon GB of Ram with a rogue distnoted process.

I started up Steam and let it sit in the background for a while. Nothing interesting happened. I was going to post my "doesn't happen to me" post, but while I was waiting Steam popped up with an update. I let Steam update and restart, and within five minutes distnoted memory use has doubled...

I can see the counter click up as I watch in Activity Monitor (about 1MB/min - shows no sign of stopping).

A.

 

[Washac]

I started up Steam and let it sit in the background for a while. Nothing interesting happened. I was going to post my "doesn't happen to me" post, but while I was waiting Steam popped up with an update. I let Steam update and restart - and within five minutes distnoted memory use has doubled, and I can see the counter click up as I watch in Activity Monitor.

Now, how to best restore to the previous version...

A.

I see no distnoted memory issues with steam running.

 

[N19h7m4r3]

I see no memory issues, where does this distnoted memory show ?

Disnoted is the process name.

I have no issues, the largest disnoted men usage is 11.1MB for me.

 

[Washac]

Disnoted is the process name.

I have no issues, the largest disnoted men usage is 11.1MB for me.

Yes, mine shows about the same.

 

[Alrescha]

In my case it is increasing at a rate of about 50 MB/hour. It is not a crisis by any means, but it does appear to be broken.

A.