All iPads Still finding a lot of use for my old iPads, please keep yours out of the landfill.

[rin67630]

Imagine if Apple were to endlessly support them.

There is a difference between stopping updates and willingly killing an else working function.
Apple did that on the 3rd Gen iPads with maps stopping functioning with the last update and no way to get it back.
That is just disgusting.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Do you understand the GIGANTIC impact on performance and battery life that iOS updates already have?

Imagine if Apple were to endlessly support them. They just wouldn’t work at all.

Screw security, I want the device to work properly.

Have you used a fully updated 32-bit iPad? Have you used an A5 iPad on iOS 9?
Have you seen how they work?

The security argument is pointless. You assume I care more about security than functionality itself.

The 10.5-inch iPad Pro has been reported to have appalling battery life on the latest iOS version, with some people only getting two or three hours of SOT. How much more degradation do you want?

Do you understand that iOS updates necessarily worsen performance and battery life now, with current iOS support? Do you understand that Apple disallows downgrading and that there is NO way back once you update?

You may want Apple to kill your devices for “security”. I’ll keep my iOS devices on original iOS versions.

But saying that devices can’t be used if they’re not updated is utterly ludicrous and has no basis in the real world. If anything, if they won’t allow downgrading, Apple should support devices less, not more.

I haven’t updated an iOS device since 2013. I prefer functional, practical devices rather than theoretically secure garbage. Claiming that Apple should support devices more with the gigantic impact that updates already have is ludicrous and inconsistent with the motivations of 99% of iOS users. We want quality first and foremost.

That’s why you see people upgrading their devices once they’re so updated that battery life is poor.

I don’t want Apple to endlessly support them. Nor do I want Apple kill the device (which they are doing by the way). That is somewhat of a contradiction, and not anything I suggested.

I would like the ability to securely use them with an updated or security patched OS though. As people have rightly mentioned, Apple do support older OS’ with security patches. But that doesn’t go on for ever. I should be able to load a different OS on my old device to utilise it better.

You can do what you want with your device. You have a bee in your bonnet for nothing.

 

[nathansz]

Well, that’s part of being careful going outside, which what I assumed your post was trying to get at. Roads are outside. I’m careful about crossing them. I’m sorry if that was too cryptic to understand. I don’t know how to put it in a more simple way.

See that’s the thing. When one issues such a vague warning people can take it to mean whatever they want, thus making the entire statement for all intents and purposes meaningless

 

[FeliApple]

I don’t want Apple to endlessly support them. Nor do I want Apple kill the device (which they are doing by the way). That is somewhat of a contradiction, and not anything I suggested.

I would like the ability to securely use them with an updated or security patched OS though. As people have rightly mentioned, Apple do support older OS’ with security patches. But that doesn’t go on for ever. I should be able to load a different OS on my old device to utilise it better.

You can do what you want with your device. You have a bee in your bonnet for nothing.

No, you’re absolutely right here. Sadly, Apple disagrees. They don’t allow me to install security patches without updating iOS. My iPhone Xʀ runs iOS 12. I can’t install security patches on iOS 12. That’s the only way I would install them. Since the device supports iOS 13+, they require me to install the latest iOS version. That’s never going to happen, with or without security updates.

 

[FeliApple]

But for me the saddest aspect of attempting to use older iPads is compatibility. You have to start narrowing the use cases because developers love to drop support.

I try to circumvent issues the best I can, but once you are five, six, seven major versions behind (let alone nine or ten), there’s honestly not much you can do.

I would keep using my devices for years on end even after upgrading. You either find a specific use case like OP (which isn’t really using it fully), or there isn’t much you can do.

Apple should allow you to install older versions of apps even if the app hasn’t been previously purchased. They provide this functionality but only if you downloaded it previously. Before upgrading, the newest iOS version I had was iPadOS 15 on my iPad Air 5. It’s still fine, but it was only a matter of time before it would start to struggle.

Using an iPad on iOS 12 (I have my 9.7-inch iPad Pro there) is a lot tougher. That’s not on the user, I’d keep using it if I could. It’s on app developers.

Once using an older iPad becomes an endless loop of failing to circumvent compatibility issues, it’s not too pleasant.

 

[rin67630]

Apple should allow you to install older versions of apps even if the app hasn’t been previously purchased. They provide this functionality but only if you downloaded it previously.

Yes, if you have a newer device you can download the current version, which will permit you to download the older version on the older device. But you must own a newer device.
Only Apple restricts its store that way. That is clearly planning obsolescence at the worst for the sole sake of forcing you to buy new stuff.
I will never buy an iOS device again.
And I buy only used Intel devices, on which I can install a decent OS that does not infantilize me.

 

[cupcakes2000]

See that’s the thing. When one issues such a vague warning people can take it to mean whatever they want, thus making the entire statement for all intents and purposes meaningless

That’s the thing you seem to be refusing to see. It’s not vague. It’s not meaningless. It’s a warning that it’s not a good idea to connect devices to the internet when they’re no longer getting security updates. It’s not made up. It doesn’t mean whatever anyone wants. It’s means precisely that. It’s not a good idea to connect devices to the internet when they’re no longer getting security updates.

To elaborate on that to try to fit into anyone’s else’s threat model or the state of anyone else’s equipment would be pointless, as all the factors concerning what other people have, or do, or indeed their current knowledge on the matter, are unknown. I simply stated a relevant fact on a relevant thread.

If you don’t like it just please move on with your life. If it piqued your interest, look into what you have and act (or not) accordingly.

It’s pretty simple to be honest. It’s certainly not as controversial as some seem to be trying to make out.

Edit a spelling: thanks @redcarian

 

[redcarian]

“Piqued”, not “peaked”. Here endeth the English lesson for today.

Back on topic, I continue to be pleased with my 11” M1 iPad Pro. It is all the iPad I need, four years after its purchase. It is safe from landfill for the foreseeable future. This is just as well, as I do not relish the idea of replacing not just the iPad, but also the ludicrously expensive Magic Keyboard (which, to be fair, is extremely good) and, given Apple’s current track record of hopelessly confusing the product line, the Apple Pencil.

 

[FeliApple]

“Piqued”, not “peaked”. Here endeth the English lesson for today.

Back on topic, I continue to be pleased with my 11” M1 iPad Pro. It is all the iPad I need, four years after its purchase. It is safe from landfill for the foreseeable future. This is just as well, as I do not relish the idea of replacing not just the iPad, but also the ludicrously expensive Magic Keyboard (which, to be fair, is extremely good) and, given Apple’s current track record of hopelessly confusing the product line, the Apple Pencil.

The Apple Pencil stuff is ludicrous. I have a 2nd-gen Apple Pencil, which I can use with my Air 5 but not with my iPad 11th-gen.

Yes, I know, I know. The Center Stage camera makes it impossible… but still. I’m not buying another pencil.

I’ve barely used the pencil anyway, but it would’ve been nice to be able to use the same pencil for these two iPads.

The 5th-gen iPad Pro should be good for years on end, absolutely!

 

[Hamdullah Retarderson]

We bought it together in 2012 before my grandfather died. We used it in many places and kept it clean. The box, accessories and warranty certificate are still with it. Moreover, we use the cable that came in the box and there is not even a small scratch on the tablet.

 

[redcarian]

The Apple Pencil stuff is ludicrous. I have a 2nd-gen Apple Pencil, which I can use with my Air 5 but not with my iPad 11th-gen.

Yes, I know, I know. The Center Stage camera makes it impossible… but still. I’m not buying another pencil.

I’ve barely used the pencil anyway, but it would’ve been nice to be able to use the same pencil for these two iPads.

The 5th-gen iPad Pro should be good for years on end, absolutely!

I too know all the technical reasons for why things are the way they are, and I just. Don’t. Care. Apple is a $3T company, and they don’t get a pass on this nonsense. They engineered themselves (and by extension, us) into this situation. They can engineer their way out. Figure it out, Tim!

 

[cupcakes2000]

I too know all the technical reasons for why things are the way they are, and I just. Don’t. Care. Apple is a $3T company, and they don’t get a pass on this nonsense. They engineered themselves (and by extension, us) into this situation. They can engineer their way out. Figure it out, Tim!

I agree. They get so much right but make ridiculous choices for so many other things.

 

[FeliApple]

That said… for content consumption the iPad’s longevity is massive. You can use devices for years on end and they will work fine, even if they aren’t updated as far as they can go.

I don’t know where the limit is, but the hardware is extremely durable and Apple deserves praise for that.

 

[cupcakes2000]

That said… for content consumption the iPad’s longevity is massive. You can use devices for years on end and they will work fine, even if they aren’t updated as far as they can go.

I don’t know where the limit is, but the hardware is extremely durable and Apple deserves praise for that.

But that’s the problem really. They’re so good, and eventually become useless to those who care about being secure or care about wanting some modern software on them - yet there is nothing wrong with them. They’re making excellent products and killing them off at will. It’s an awful state of affairs. I agree they cannot indefinitely update them, holding back resources for newer tech, but to not ever allow others to create modern OS’ for them is just the opposite of what they’ve achieved so far. Their iPad could be so much more if you could still feasibly use them after the point they’ve become obsolete in apples eyes. It is a dream machine yet it’s so locked down they can’t even release that hold on a ‘dead’ (to them) machine. So stupid.

 

[FeliApple]

But that’s the problem really. They’re so good, and eventually become useless to those who care about being secure or care about wanting some modern software on them - yet there is nothing wrong with them. They’re making excellent products and killing them off at will. It’s an awful state of affairs. I agree they cannot indefinitely update them, holding back resources for newer tech, but to not ever allow others to create modern OS’ for them is just the opposite of what they’ve achieved so far. Their iPad could be so much more if you could still feasibly use them after the point they’ve become obsolete in apples eyes. It is a dream machine yet it’s so locked down they can’t even release that hold on a ‘dead’ (to them) machine. So stupid.

I disagree with this, but I respect your point of view.

 

[redcarian]

I agree they cannot indefinitely update them, holding back resources for newer tech, but to not ever allow others to create modern OS’ for them is just the opposite of what they’ve achieved so far. Their iPad could be so much more if you could still feasibly use them after the point they’ve become obsolete in apples eyes. It is a dream machine yet it’s so locked down they can’t even release that hold on a ‘dead’ (to them) machine. So stupid.

This I agree with. It should be enshrined in law that if you, as a company, decline to issue further software updates for your product, you cannot stand in the way of others wishing to do so - perhaps in the form of installing alternative software on it. In practical terms right now, that’s Linux or similar (e.g. FreeBSD).

I’m not suggesting iPadOS be forcibly open-sourced, or anything like that - but people who, say, wish to port Linux to the iPad should be able to trivially unlock the bootloader/jailbreak it/whatever the correct technical term is for an iPad - for devices that have fallen off Apple’s support.

At this point, the device is no longer Apple’s problem or concern. Let people install whatever weirdo OS they want on it.

 

[sparksd]

This I agree with. It should be enshrined in law that if you, as a company, decline to issue further software updates for your product, you cannot stand in the way of others wishing to do so - perhaps in the form of installing alternative software on it. In practical terms right now, that’s Linux or similar (e.g. FreeBSD).

I’m not suggesting iPadOS be forcibly open-sourced, or anything like that - but people who, say, wish to port Linux to the iPad should be able to trivially unlock the bootloader/jailbreak it/whatever the correct technical term is for an iPad - for devices that have fallen off Apple’s support.

At this point, the device is no longer Apple’s problem or concern. Let people install whatever weirdo OS they want on it.

I regularly rooted and installed custom ROMs on my Android devices; my property, let me do as I please.

 

[cupcakes2000]

This I agree with. It should be enshrined in law that if you, as a company, decline to issue further software updates for your product, you cannot stand in the way of others wishing to do so - perhaps in the form of installing alternative software on it. In practical terms right now, that’s Linux or similar (e.g. FreeBSD).

I’m not suggesting iPadOS be forcibly open-sourced, or anything like that - but people who, say, wish to port Linux to the iPad should be able to trivially unlock the bootloader/jailbreak it/whatever the correct technical term is for an iPad - for devices that have fallen off Apple’s support.

At this point, the device is no longer Apple’s problem or concern. Let people install whatever weirdo OS they want on it.

100%

I regularly rooted and installed custom ROMs on my Android devices; my property, let me do as I please.

100%

 

[cupcakes2000]

This I agree with. It should be enshrined in law that if you, as a company, decline to issue further software updates for your product, you cannot stand in the way of others wishing to do so - perhaps in the form of installing alternative software on it. In practical terms right now, that’s Linux or similar (e.g. FreeBSD).

I’m not suggesting iPadOS be forcibly open-sourced, or anything like that - but people who, say, wish to port Linux to the iPad should be able to trivially unlock the bootloader/jailbreak it/whatever the correct technical term is for an iPad - for devices that have fallen off Apple’s support.

At this point, the device is no longer Apple’s problem or concern. Let people install whatever weirdo OS they want on it.

Even if it’s only unlockable as a final goodbye, once the device becomes obsolete - via Apple. Timed like how a copyright runs out eventually. I would have issues with that too, I’m sure, but it would be better than the current situation.

 

[FeliApple]

Yes, if you have a newer device you can download the current version, which will permit you to download the older version on the older device. But you must own a newer device.
Only Apple restricts its store that way. That is clearly planning obsolescence at the worst for the sole sake of forcing you to buy new stuff.
I will never buy an iOS device again.
And I buy only used Intel devices, on which I can install a decent OS that does not infantilize me.

But sometimes developers disable their apps for older versions, even if you can install them.

It’s on both, Apple and developers. But for that to happen, the goal has to be one from the ground up: give users compatibility even if the iPad is 12 years old. In practice, this doesn’t happen. It’s a mixture of sorts: some apps work on anything, others practically always require the latest iOS version. Apple should allow you to install any compatible version without the workaround of having to install it on a compatible device first; developers should stop culling support every five minutes.

But like I said: device longevity has to be a goal from the ground up. It isn’t, for practically everyone.

I would keep using my 9.7-inch iPad Pro which is my favourite iPad ever if developers allowed me to do so. They don’t.

Apple should allow and provide standalone and indefinite Safari updates for all iOS versions. They don’t. They can build an ecosystem with the explicit goal of keeping devices relevant. But they don’t really care.

Hardware isn’t really an issue. If the iOS version helps, iPads have long-lasting hardware. Battery life remains usable even on 12-year-old iPads. Ask iPad 2, 3, 4 users! My 9.7-inch iPad Pro still gives me the same 10-11 hours it gave me when I originally updated it to iOS 12. The hardware is good. But when software collapses, there’s only so many workarounds for me.

 

[sparksd]

But sometimes developers disable their apps for older versions, even if you can install them.

It’s on both, Apple and developers. But for that to happen, the goal has to be one from the ground up: give users compatibility even if the iPad is 12 years old. In practice, this doesn’t happen. It’s a mixture of sorts: some apps work on anything, others practically always require the latest iOS version. Apple should allow you to install any compatible version without the workaround of having to install it on a compatible device first; developers should stop culling support every five minutes.

But like I said: device longevity has to be a goal from the ground up. It isn’t, for practically everyone.

I would keep using my 9.7-inch iPad Pro which is my favourite iPad ever if developers allowed me to do so. They don’t.

Apple should allow and provide standalone and indefinite Safari updates for all iOS versions. They don’t. They can build an ecosystem with the explicit goal of keeping devices relevant. But they don’t really care.

See the same on Android. Just updated my wife's Samsung phone and several apps are no longer available or incompatible with the latest version of Android. Or Windows, see the same.

 

[FeliApple]

See the same on Android. Just updated my wife's Samsung phone and several apps are no longer available or incompatible with the latest version of Android. Or Windows, see the same.

Yeah, because there isn’t an industry-wide approach to device longevity. It’s not in their interests.

This isn’t conspiratorial: they could do it, but they don’t.

That is a different issue though: one thing is apps not supporting older versions, and another one is apps breaking because they weren’t updated for the new version. That’s tougher to solve. But supported apps should pursue maximum compatibility. So should device manufacturers. That’s just my opinion…

I think that because the hardware is so good! It’s just a pointless waste to have a great iPad that can’t run even the apps it could run when it was new (so it’s not lack of power) just because a user either can’t install them, or the app itself no longer supports the iOS version the device is running. My 9.7-inch iPad Pro on iOS 12 can’t run the YouTube app. Why? No reason at all really, it just asks you to update it. That is ludicrous, sorry.

 

[*~Kim~*]

I gave my first iPad away, sold my second and my current Mini 6 will be kept as a second iPad as it has a SIM tray. I’ll be going WiFi only next upgrade (OLED.)

 

[rin67630]

Yeah, because there isn’t an industry-wide approach to device longevity. It’s not in their interests.

This isn’t conspiratorial: they could do it, but they don’t.

That is a different issue though: one thing is apps not supporting older versions, and another one is apps breaking because they weren’t updated for the new version. That’s tougher to solve. But supported apps should pursue maximum compatibility. So should device manufacturers. That’s just my opinion…

I think that because the hardware is so good! It’s just a pointless waste to have a great iPad that can’t run even the apps it could run when it was new (so it’s not lack of power) just because a user either can’t install them, or the app itself no longer supports the iOS version the device is running. My 9.7-inch iPad Pro on iOS 12 can’t run the YouTube app. Why? No reason at all really, it just asks you to update it. That is ludicrous, sorry.

It is OK not to maintain apps forever, it is also OK to stop providing older apps afer a reasonable period. But Apple is the only company that actively prevents users to download apps that they are still have on the store, just because you did not download them while they were active.
It's also the only company that did an iOs update, that actively killed all maps usage (for all apps) on all iPads of 1st and 2nd gen.

 

[IJustWannaTalk]

The Apple Pencil stuff is ludicrous. I have a 2nd-gen Apple Pencil, which I can use with my Air 5 but not with my iPad 11th-gen.

Yes, I know, I know. The Center Stage camera makes it impossible… but still. I’m not buying another pencil.

I’ve barely used the pencil anyway, but it would’ve been nice to be able to use the same pencil for these two iPads.

The 5th-gen iPad Pro should be good for years on end, absolutely!

This also infuriates me. My first-gen pencil worked on the iPad Mini 5, but the iPad Mini 6 requires the second-gen pencil? What in the hell?