The Car Thread ... !

[D.T.]

Yeah, I have this fantasy about a light weight, moderately priced, next gen S2K, that's sticks close to its original roots, but it's not so much about engineering as it is about marketing and sales.

I just don't know if there's significant interest, the last model left the market due to sales (also the Solstice/Sky which were solid vehicles), and maybe that was just conditions at the time, or maybe there's only room for one vehicle in that segment and it's totally dominated by the Miata. If it gets pricey and bloated, then that gets tricky, i.e., the audience for a limited use, 2-seater Honda, with a price that's targeting an older demographic who is probably more inclined to go more upmarket (Boxster), or more basic (Miata), or even domestic (Mustang/Corvette).

On that last point, I'd also suggest that domestics have gotten pretty darn good, and they have a special character that's all their own, that's very attractive to many folks. There's a contingent of former S2K owners (myself included) on one of the more popular Mustang boards, and they were huge fans of the car, but most seem even more impressed with what Ford has done, especially factoring in the price.

 

[AustinIllini]

I can't imagine for a second there's only room for a Miata. The original S2K was so much better than the Miata. I still think the problem is keeping the price down.

 

[bunnspecial]

I can't imagine for a second there's only room for a Miata. The original S2K was so much better than the Miata. I still think the problem is keeping the price down.

To me the issue is not so much price but weight. Mazda has done a really impressive job with the Miata in keeping it at 2300lbs or so without using exotic materials.

Some of the numbers I've seen tossed around for a potentially new S2K put it in the 2800lb ballpark.

Throw as much power as you want at a car and use as many suspension tricks as you can, but at the end of the day lighter cars feel so much livelier and connected to the road. That's a lot of the reason why a piece of crap MG Midget with 50 some odd horsepower and suspension straight out of the 1960s is so much fun-the cat only weighs 1700lbs or so.

 

[determined09]

It's has a pin strip on it which I was told was pretty rare along a rear spoiler and the tinted windows which I'm glad it does have because it keeps the car cooler on the inside.

 

[D.T.]

I can't imagine for a second there's only room for a Miata. The original S2K was so much better than the Miata. I still think the problem is keeping the price down.

I would think so too, but the S2K wasn't able to sustain in the small, 2-seat, roadster market. Maybe it was price (especially towards the end of the lifecycle when the economy was in the crapper), the S was around $36K with really no price variation, and the '99 2nd gen Miata (NB) was $24K, that's a BIG difference in that market segment, for a car that's not very practical. Pushing $40K, you're running into mid-ranged options, that had more features, and getting out of the price where people can afford an extra "weekend only" car.

It was also only available in a manual, and while I don't know the % of Miatas sold with an auto, that had to have some impact.

It was always a bit of a limited market car, but when the 2nd Gen (AP2) was introduced in 2004, there wasn't much of a spike, then just a continued trickle down of sales.

1999 3,400
2000 6,797
2001 9,682
2002 9,684
2003 7,888
2004 7,320
2005 7,780
2006 6,271
2007 4,302
2008 2,538
2009 795

In 2000, the Miata was crushing the sales (wikipedia):

In 2000, the Guinness Book of World Records declared the MX-5 the best-selling two-seat sports car in history, with total production of 531,890 units.

I mean, another reason I was way more interested in the S was because it was reasonably rare.

 

[bunnspecial]

Just finished up Sunday's Top Gear. Really want that retro MG. I feel that if Honda were to make a premium sports car, it would cost quite a bit of money. The S2000 was a brilliant car, problem is just about every child racer bought one and ruined it. That and Honda really need to drop the Japanese mantra of bulbous design. These days I can't tell if certain cars are sedans or slimline crossovers.

But back to that MG. Wow! Brilliant looks, fast, and it would be a wonderful car to die in if it came to that.

Granted we're talking hypotheticals since, IMO, the car is overpriced for what it is and likely won't ever be available new in the US market.

Still, though, it's a fascinating concept-basically drop a Miata drivetrain into a BMH body. I hate to be a downer on it, but for the $100K+ that they're asking for it I could buy a new BMH body, a wrecked Miata, a pile of rust MGB for the VIN plate, and come up with something similar for a lot less money.

All of that said, I'm still counting down to 2019 when I can legally import an RV8

 

[0388631]

I'm sure there's a lot more to it than what was let on in the show.

View attachment 639311 It's has a pin strip on it which I was told was pretty rare along a rear spoiler and the tinted windows which I'm glad it does have because it keeps the car cooler on the inside.

Pin striping. I haven't seen people do that in decades to a new car.

 

[determined09]

I'm sure there's a lot more to it than what was let on in the show.


Pin striping. I haven't seen people do that in decades to a new car.

Yes you're right they are not very common now. But I have I seen it on an ES350 from 2015 or 2014 in the area that I live in.

 

[bunnspecial]

I'm sure there's a lot more to it than what was let on in the show.

I haven't watched the Top Gear episode, but there has been a decent amount of discussion about it in MG circles.

I REALLY WANT to like the car. In fact, I think it's a great car since it's effectively combining the classic charm of an MGB with a modern and reliable drive train.

It's still hard to get around the price, though, considering what it is. British Motor Heritage is supplying the body work-they have all of the original MGB stampings(with the exception of the pre-68 narrow transmission tunnel). Any Tom, Dick, or Harry can call them up and order a complete tub for £10K or so. The engine, transmission, and rear axle are straight out of a Miata.

It wouldn't be CHEAP to do it yourself, but like I said all the parts are already out there and all you'd need to legally do it yourself is find an MGB rust bucket with a title and rob the VIN plates from it($500 or less).

I admire them for taking on the project, and I know it would take me a couple of years to do my own. In fact, conceptually it's something that a lot of MG guys have dreamed of years. I just do see it for the price.

 

[2298754]

Heck, I'd settle for a SH-AWD Acura TLX Type S with 330ish HP.

Budget 340xi/S4 competitor seems like the logical next-step for Acura (with a manual). I know we've both been saying this for months, but they really squandered away SH-AWD. Every model should've had it.

While the last-gen TL was positively hideous, the V6 SH-AWD 6MT model is definitely a diamond in the rough.
[doublepost=1467951343][/doublepost]

I don't know why Honda doesn't just partner up with another manufacturer to come up with S2000 successor or another sports car/roadster similar to the BMW/Toyota partnership.

Honda and Mazda would've been the perfect pair. Let Honda do the powertrain (engine + gearbox) and let Mazda do the chassis engineering. I don't understand the Fiat-Mazda partnership at all.
[doublepost=1467951441][/doublepost]

Throw as much power as you want at a car and use as many suspension tricks as you can, but at the end of the day lighter cars feel so much livelier and connected to the road. That's a lot of the reason why a piece of crap MG Midget with 50 some odd horsepower and suspension straight out of the 1960s is so much fun-the cat only weighs 1700lbs or so.

You need to go drive a Boxster/Cayman
[doublepost=1467951593][/doublepost]

Yeah, I have this fantasy about a light weight, moderately priced, next gen S2K, that's sticks close to its original roots, but it's not so much about engineering as it is about marketing and sales.

I'm all for a S2k revival, as long as it doesn't turn into the BRZ/FRS all over again. What a train wreck that car ended up to be. Even after all these years, they STILL haven't fixed its major problem... the lack of power.

Subaru even teased that BRZ STi concept a few years ago and then told everyone they have no plans to make it. Wtf

On that last point, I'd also suggest that domestics have gotten pretty darn good, and they have a special character that's all their own, that's very attractive to many folks.

Apparently, the Alpha-based Camaro drives fantastic. American Muscle cars have definitely made huge strides over the last decade.
[doublepost=1467951691][/doublepost]

Yes you're right they are not very common now. But I have I seen it on an ES350 from 2015 or 2014 in the area that I live in.

Did you have to pay extra for the pin-stripes?

 

[0388631]

Apart from the Mazda stuff, I'm sure a lot of work went into engineering the thing for modern power and performance. It's simple to slap a lot of quality parts together but that doesn't always work out. If going the professional, like factory route, you're probably going to pay about the same if not more in the end.

Honda and Mazda would've been the perfect pair. Let Honda do the powertrain (engine + gearbox) and let Mazda do the chassis engineering. I don't understand the Fiat-Mazda partnership at all.

And who will fix the rust issues down the road?

 

[determined09]

View attachment 639457 View attachment 639457

Budget 340xi/S4 competitor seems like the logical next-step for Acura (with a manual). I know we've both been saying this for months, but they really squandered away SH-AWD. Every model should've had it.

While the last-gen TL was positively hideous, the V6 SH-AWD 6MT model is definitely a diamond in the rough.
[doublepost=1467951343][/doublepost]

Honda and Mazda would've been the perfect pair. Let Honda do the powertrain (engine + gearbox) and let Mazda do the chassis engineering. I don't understand the Fiat-Mazda partnership at all.
[doublepost=1467951441][/doublepost]

You need to go drive a Boxster/Cayman
[doublepost=1467951593][/doublepost]

I'm all for a S2k revival, as long as it doesn't turn into the BRZ/FRS all over again. What a train wreck that car ended up to be. Even after all these years, they STILL haven't fixed its major problem... the lack of power.

Subaru even teased that BRZ STi concept a few years ago and then told everyone they have no plans to make it. Wtf


Apparently, the Alpha-based Camaro drives fantastic. American Muscle cars have definitely made huge strides over the last decade.
[doublepost=1467951691][/doublepost]
Did you have to pay extra for the pin-stripes?

No I didn't. Here's a 2016 es 350 with a pin-strip.

 

[D.T.]

I'm all for a S2k revival, as long as it doesn't turn into the BRZ/FRS all over again. What a train wreck that car ended up to be. Even after all these years, they STILL haven't fixed its major problem... the lack of power.

Subaru even teased that BRZ STi concept a few years ago and then told everyone they have no plans to make it. Wtf

Yeah, you know, I hate to be too obsessed with power, but in 2016 with the strides the auto industry has made in dynamic intakes/cams, DI, FI, etc., there's really no reason to skimp, and history has shown shown us (with very few exceptions), it's a deal breaker with buyers, particularly in the sports/sporty segment.

 

[SactoGuy18]

My only gripe with the current Fit is that the steering is a bit too sensitive. If they would just tune the power steering to be a tad more like the feel of the previous generation Fit, it would make it a much more fun car to drive.

 

[bunnspecial]

Finally got the MG back with the new top installed

Also seriously considering taking on this MGA as a project

 

[Suture]

Looks great! BRG always looks great on a roadster.

 

[A.Goldberg]

Finally got the MG back with the new top installed

View attachment 639695

Also seriously considering taking on this MGA as a project

View attachment 639696

View attachment 639697

Beautiful Ben.

As for the MGA... We know you have a hoarding tendency. British Classics are the heroin of cars. Just be careful.

In all seriousness though my Dad often states his regret selling his MGA. They're beautiful cars.

 

[0388631]

That would look great in red with a beige top, black leather. The body looks great considering the dent in the back and light rust.

 

[bunnspecial]

That would look great in red with a beige top, black leather. The body looks great considering the dent in the back and light rust.

The selling point of this car is the frame-it's as near perfect as I've ever seen on an MGA.

 

[lowendlinux]

The selling point of this car is the frame-it's as near perfect as I've ever seen on an MGA.

It looks nice and I understand why you're pondering it, it's not like they're getting anymore common but that car is at least five years from drivable either by time or money.

I think you should do it if you've got the space.

 

[2298754]

Finally got the MG back with the new top installed

I'm disappointed in you Ben.

Where are the purple switchback LEDs? Faux-carbon fibré shiftknob/pedals? High performance tyres? LED DRLs?

 

[bunnspecial]

I'm disappointed in you Ben.

Where are the purple switchback LEDs? Faux-carbon fibré shiftknob/pedals? High performance tyres? LED DRLs?

Crap, I'll have to get started on those!
[doublepost=1468168675][/doublepost]

It looks nice and I understand why you're pondering it, it's not like they're getting anymore common but that car is at least five years from drivable either by time or money.

I think you should do it if you've got the space.

The(clear Kentucky) title is actually currently held by a local shop-the same one that did my top. If I go ahead with this, I know I'm in it for the long haul in terms of both time and money.

I know there are MGAs out there, but for a car I intend to keep for a long time, starting with one like this gives me a couple of big advantages.

The first is that I get to see EXACTLY what I'm getting. Few car buyers(or owners) ever get to see their cars in this kind of state. Superficially, it looks rough, but under the surface rust and old paint is a rock-solid frame with an overall straight body that has minimal filler. This car has some racing history, and there are cosmetic parts that were removed early in the cars life but are there and PERFECT. Some of these simply aren't available.

The second is that I end up with exactly what I want in the car. I'm likely going to go with the original color, but the interior and everything else are what I want them to be.

 

[AustinIllini]

I'm disappointed in you Ben.

Where are the purple switchback LEDs? Faux-carbon fibré shiftknob/pedals? High performance tyres? LED DRLs?

Not enough flower pattern on the seats, I'm sure.

 

[D.T.]

 

[AustinIllini]