The Car Thread ... !

[MacBH928]

My Charger R/T arguably had enough power before I had the supercharger installed. It was a lot of fun to drive before, but it is way more fun to drive now.

May I ask why did you choose Supercharger over Turbo? My understanding is that a SC install is dangerous and need some expertise to get it right, and will harm the car. At least, this is my archaic impression of it. I am more easy about the turbo since all it does is increase airflow. I could be 100% wrong.

 

[fridayxiii]

I’ve never driven a Mini before, my main question would be, is the reliability as bad as they say? (I use the word ‘they‘ loosely) Or is that for specific models/years? Are they manual only? I’m sure manual would be the way to go for the added experience. We have a Mini dealership about 10 miles from my house, even though that specific car isn’t for me, I sure would like to drive one.

Anyways, I lived in East Tennessee, just outside Knoxville for two years. Not also is is it beautiful with the Smokies, but is very Curvy, especially when you start approaching Dandridge/towards the North Carolina border. I miss the south on many levels.

Eastern TN is beautiful country with many great roads. Friends & I took a mini driving tour of the south in our MINIs a few years ago and spent many hours enjoying the backroads in the Volunteer state.

For MINIs, reliability largely depends on the year. 2005 - 06 were the most reliable years of the first gen cars. They had a bulletproof Getrag manual transmission, and as long as standard maintenance was done, they were great cars. Many have delivered. 100K, 200K miles, and more. That said, MINI changed from supercharged to turbo boosted motors for the S variant, starting in 2007. From 2007 - '10, the N14 motor was notorious for carbon buildup, which required regular/repeated walnut blasting to remedy. Those motors were also known for developing a "death chain rattle". But MINI changed to the N18 motor in 2011 or so, and those have again been solid cars.

The third gen of the "new" MINI is known as the F56, which was born in 2015. By & large, the F56 cars have been very reliable, especially the latter years (2017 & up). They've been so reliable that the service departments at many MINI dealers have turned lower profits than in years past because of lack of problems with the F cars. (Not just hearsay, but coming from a corporate rep I know who handles all MINI dealers in the southeast.)

MINIs come with both manual and automatic gearboxes. The latest GP is an exception: it only comes in paddle-shifted sport auto gearbox because of the higher HP output. My first MINI was a six-speed but my current is a sport-auto with paddles. It's a surprisingly good car: easy to drive in rush hour stop & go, yet still as much fun in the corners or doing spirited driving. I've driven the Tail of the Dragon, Cherohala, and many other kickass roads in my new car, and don't really miss the manual that much. The sport auto shifts faster than I could even with the short-shift kit I had in my '06. You get the ease of auto in the city but the fun of a stick on the backroads. Best of both worlds to me.

 

[D.T.]

I don't believe much in modifying cars, lighter stuff is ok but I believe the PhD physicist who built it made it in this form to work to its best...of course that does not mean you can't have fun with it but I rather save my $20-40K investment.

Production cars have to deal with mass manufacturing, cost, a wide set of consumer expectations, maintenance, available gas, so there's often times a notable amount of performance left on the table, handling, braking, straight line can almost always be improved.

It's not an "investment", it's for fun

To me a powerful engine is a reliable enginge...a one that will last a long time under many conditions without needing more than regular maintenance. A loud engine that makes you pulls G's and 5 miutes you see the piston of one of the cylinders piercing the hood of the car and flying into the air is not a powerful enginge...I am exaggerating of course.

Powerful == Reliable? Two different attributes, however, increasing the output of an engine far beyond the original spec could make it less reliable. There's a difference as well if you're talking factory vs. aftermarket, there are incredibly powerful, very reliable engines, and unbelievably unreliable, very low power engines.

Why does your car look green in one shot and absolutely blue in the other?

Assuming you didn't actually read the post ...

(Also it's more than just the color, look at the grill, wheels, stripes ...)

May I ask why did you choose Supercharger over Turbo? My understanding is that a SC install is dangerous and need some expertise to get it right, and will harm the car. At least, this is my archaic impression of it. I am more easy about the turbo since all it does is increase airflow.

I could be 100% wrong.

You would be.

Both are forced induction methods to increase the amount of air in an engine (past the atmospheric pressure, i.e., forced induction vs. naturally aspirated). They do exactly the same thing through different methods. One isn't particularly more reliable than the other (and certainly not "dangerous").

A supercharger runs the compressor off a belt that's driven by the engine itself. A turbocharger runs the compressor by blowing exhaust gas over a turbine that's spins the compressor. They're both "blowers", i.e., compressors that increase the air volume, in fact, turbo stands for Turbine Blower. There's a good number of differences in the power delivery, where the power is available in the RPM, how much is available on the top end, etc.

Then within the tech, there's various implementation differences, for example, a supercharger can be centrifugal or positive displacement (how the compressor is designed). They all have different driving characteristics, pros, cons, etc.

There's manufacturers that use turbos, like a Nissan GT-R and some that use superchargers like a Chevy Corvette ZR-1.

In terms of the aftermarket, packaging plays a huge part, i.e., the available space, plus heat management, installation, fabrication costs of the kit/components.

 

[fridayxiii]

Why does your car look green in one shot and absolutely blue in the other?
I heard these were terrible with reliability.

They're two different cars. The top photo is of my 2006 MINI Cooper S: British Racing Green with a white roof. The bottom photo is my 2019 MINI Cooper John Cooper Works (JCW), Starlight Blue.

Reliability is largely dependent upon what year. I gave a few details in msg #12523 here.

 

[fridayxiii]

@D.T. nailed it regarding mods and reliability: car manufacturers leave so much untapped potential on the table, that it can be fairly safe (reliability-wise) and pretty inexpensive to maximize what a car can do. They (manufacturers) also have to account for the lowest common denominator when figuring the performance limits or capabilities for a car.

Mods don't have to be complicated. A lighter set of rims and good tires like Michelin Pilot Super Sports can make a big difference. One of the first changes recommended to those new MINI owners who're serous about driving is to ditch the factory runflat tires and get on some sticky rubber, pronto.

 

[bunnspecial]

By the time cars make it to production, they're a compromise of a lot of different things.

The engineers design the car with a goal in mind-maybe it's a simple commuter or family car, maybe it's an all out performance machine, maybe it's a nimble and good handling car, or maybe it's none of the above or a combination of some of the above(look at say the Civic si for a stereotypical "hot" family hauler, just as an example, although it's far from the only one nor was it the first-with Minis for example look at the original Cooper S).

After the engineers design it, a bunch of other people get their hands on it before it makes it to production. Another group may say "This kills our CAFE(corporate average fuel economy)-figure out a way to make it use less gas." The lawyers say "No matter how many warnings you put on it, you still can't do it that way because people are stupid." Marketing says "This car has this, this, and this wrong with it and it won't appeal to who we want to buy the car, and remember we have to sell these things."

At the end of the day, you get a car that's sometimes slightly different, sometimes very different, from what the engineers wanted.

Even putting that aside, there are compromises even the engineers make at the design stage. In the old days, you didn't have a lot of ways to really dramatically alter the performance of a car with a few mouse clicks. You can take one basic engine-say a small block Chevy 302-and with a 2 barrel carb, a mild cam, and a few other changes is a sedate car that's easy to drive, has a nice wide torque band, and is relatively economical. Put a more aggressive cam in it, stick a bigger carb on it, and maybe up the compression ratio and you have a fire-breathing monster(at least for the time) that has very different attributes from the first design. Even in the same body, those two engines appeal to different buyers.

In current production, I think of the Dodge Challenger range. I'd venture to say most of them sold are more powerful than a lot of cars on the road, but still a step down from their full potential. The Hellcat is the no-holds-barred tire smoker that's just plain fun. A few steps down you have trims like the R/T and Scat Pack that still have a good bit of power on-tap(more than a lot of other cars on the road) but are somewhat more sedate than the Hellcat.

Some modifications just take advantage of what was the engineers "true" intent in the car before other departments messed with it. Some mods get the potential out of a car that was always there, but for whatever reason the factory didn't build. Others still take advantage of interim developments, or of aftermarket parts that the manufacturer for whatever reason couldn't easily use. Sometimes aftermarket parts fix a known deficiency in the original design. I've seen many engine builds, for example(including Relentless Power's Cobra) that essential pick and choose the best parts from a range of years that for whatever reason the factory never put together on their own, but combined make an even better package than anything the factory offered. In the MG engine build I'm currently having done, I started with a 1970 engine block(good quality cast iron) but use a few parts from earlier engines that are somewhat more durable, and parts from later engines that were redesigned to be lighter or have other favorable attributes. The camshaft I'm using is very similar to a grind the factory offered through their special tuning department but never actually installed in a production car.

To a lot of the folks in this thread, a car is more than a way to get around. I HAVE a car that's basically as it came from the factory that I use to get around. I've had other "toy" cars that I both drive and modify for fun, even though they often are nice day run-around-town cars.

 

[Matz]

May I ask why did you choose Supercharger over Turbo? My understanding is that a SC install is dangerous and need some expertise to get it right, and will harm the car. At least, this is my archaic impression of it. I am more easy about the turbo since all it does is increase airflow. I could be 100% wrong.

What @D.T. said.

Specifically, I chose the SC over the Turbo because of the torque/power curves. With a positive displacement SC, when stepping on the gas, torque starts pretty much right now; whereas with a turbo, things tend to happen in the mid to upper rpm range.

Also, I had a speed shop install my SC. I suppose that I could have done it myself, except for the tuning portion, but it would have taken me a lot longer than it took the shop, and I don’t have the time. Plus, that’s what they do for a living.

 

[44267547]

Eastern TN is beautiful country with many great roads. Friends & I took a mini driving tour of the south in our MINIs a few years ago and spent many hours enjoying the backroads in the Volunteer state.

For MINIs, reliability largely depends on the year. 2005 - 06 were the most reliable years of the first gen cars. They had a bulletproof Getrag manual transmission, and as long as standard maintenance was done, they were great cars. Many have delivered. 100K, 200K miles, and more. That said, MINI changed from supercharged to turbo boosted motors for the S variant, starting in 2007. From 2007 - '10, the N14 motor was notorious for carbon buildup, which required regular/repeated walnut blasting to remedy. Those motors were also known for developing a "death chain rattle". But MINI changed to the N18 motor in 2011 or so, and those have again been solid cars.

The third gen of the "new" MINI is known as the F56, which was born in 2015. By & large, the F56 cars have been very reliable, especially the latter years (2017 & up). They've been so reliable that the service departments at many MINI dealers have turned lower profits than in years past because of lack of problems with the F cars. (Not just hearsay, but coming from a corporate rep I know who handles all MINI dealers in the southeast.)

MINIs come with both manual and automatic gearboxes. The latest GP is an exception: it only comes in paddle-shifted sport auto gearbox because of the higher HP output. My first MINI was a six-speed but my current is a sport-auto with paddles. It's a surprisingly good car: easy to drive in rush hour stop & go, yet still as much fun in the corners or doing spirited driving. I've driven the Tail of the Dragon, Cherohala, and many other kickass roads in my new car, and don't really miss the manual that much. The sport auto shifts faster than I could even with the short-shift kit I had in my '06. You get the ease of auto in the city but the fun of a stick on the backroads. Best of both worlds to me.

You need to hang around this thread more often! We don’t have any Mini Aficionados in here.

So is your 2019 a ‘daily’ or just like your fun car for the weekend?

There was a movie with Mark Wahlberg, called ‘The Italian Job’ back in 2003, where they’re using Minis while filming. Wahlberg mentioned post production of the movie, that was some of the most fun he’s ever had on set with Learning the different driving dynamics and I think they even had some type of driving school they attended for the more elaborate maneuvers.

 

[Apple fanboy]

You need to hang around this thread more often! We don’t have any Mini Aficionados in here.

So is your 2019 a ‘daily’ or just like your fun car for the weekend?

There was a movie with Mark Wahlberg, called ‘The Italian Job’ back in 2003, where they’re using Minis while filming. Wahlberg mentioned post production of the movie, that was some of the most fun he’s ever had on set with Learning the different driving dynamics and I think they even had some type of driving school they attended for the more elaborate maneuvers.

Sorry, but there is only one Italian job. There is only one mini.

My car day started badly. Mrs AFB Kia decided it wouldn’t start. I was already at work. Looks like a battery change this weekend.

 

[bunnspecial]

On the whole SC/Turbo discussion-

One thing to remember is that poorly done(or getting too aggressive with boost), both a supercharger and a turbocharger can wreck an engine in short order. Even running too low of an octane of gas can get you into trouble with more modest performance improvements. Both can be implemented safely, though, and have been around for a really long time.

I prefer superchargers for what is essentially instantaneous boost delivery-they start spinning directly in relation to the engine.

Turbochargers do inherently have some lag while you wait for the exhaust to start spinning them up. On things like big truck diesels I've driven, the lag can be rather disconcerting if you're not use to it. In rail locomotives, those from ALCo were know to belch clouds of black smoke from turbo lag when increasing engine speed.

With that said, there are ways around it. On a very basic level, the smaller a turbo is, the more responsive it is. Engine designers can use this to their advantage and you'll see applications where multiple ones are used-sometimes on a V engine, for example, you might have a separate one for each bank. By and large, the lag issue has gotten better. Plus, things like intercoolers allow them to be more efficient for a given size.

I'm still prefer a supercharger given the choice, but both can work equally well.

In terms of being "hard" on an engine-superchargers do pull power right off the crank. Turbos are a(functional) restriction in the exhaust. Both will "rob" power from the engine, albeit in different ways, but the(not insignificant) power used to drive them is used in such a way that there's a huge net benefit to the performance. I've seen folks say that turbos are scavenging "wasted" power and don't rob engine power like superchargers do-that's incorrect. There's no free lunch, and the engine still has to overcome what's needed to spin the turbo.

There again, either can blow a hole in your pistons or cause other damage whether you're dealing with a factory install where you've increased the boost or doing a complete aftermarket and don't know what you're doing, or there again don't respect what octane ratings actually mean.

 

[fridayxiii]

You need to hang around this thread more often! We don’t have any Mini Aficionados in here.

So is your 2019 a ‘daily’ or just like your fun car for the weekend?

There was a movie with Mark Wahlberg, called ‘The Italian Job’ back in 2003, where they’re using Minis while filming. Wahlberg mentioned post production of the movie, that was some of the most fun he’s ever had on set with Learning the different driving dynamics and I think they even had some type of driving school they attended for the more elaborate maneuvers.

Thanks! I love talking & reading about cars, so I'll surely be here for a while and contribute if I can.

My car is my daily driver, fun road trip car, hobby, and social catalyst. MINIs have an active owner/enthusiast community through which I've met many of my current friends, hence the social component. I take great joy and find peace in things like washing & waxing my car, so it's a form of relaxation too. I spec ordered this MINI, so it came from the factory in pretty good knick. I've added a few upgrades that don't affect the daily drivability but make it even more capable of handling hairpins, sweepers, and switchbacks. As @bunnspecial said, it's kind of a sleeper, a wolf in sheep's clothing ?

I LOVE The Italian Job (both versions) but especially enjoy the Walhberg version for the MINIs. I woulda loved to get in on the driving classes they took to prep for the movie! These little cars are capable of some pretty amazing things on the road, and will surprise the unsuspecting. Taking HPDE is on my bucket list.

 

[fridayxiii]

Sorry, but there is only one Italian job. There is only one mini.
View attachment 949962

Them's fightin' words, mister ??

There is some heated contention in the Mini/MINI community about whether the 2002 + cars are truly worthy of the name, and if you should call the original cars "Minis" and the new, BMW-owned cars "MINIs". I mean, the forums get red-hot over simple things like this. I love the classic Minis and have a couple of friends who own them. The size doesn't really hit you until you see them in the sheet metal, but they still surprise you in other ways. One of said friends is 6'3" and a well-built 220lbs but still fits in his Classic quite well. I thought my 2006 was small until I saw a Classic!

 

[Apple fanboy]

Them's fightin' words, mister ??

There is some heated contention in the Mini/MINI community about whether the 2002 + cars are truly worthy of the name, and if you should call the original cars "Minis" and the new, BMW-owned cars "MINIs". I mean, the forums get red-hot over simple things like this. I love the classic Minis and have a couple of friends who own them. The size doesn't really hit you until you see them in the sheet metal, but they still surprise you in other ways. One of said friends is 6'3" and a well-built 220lbs but still fits in his Classic quite well. I thought my 2006 was small until I saw a Classic!

I never owned an original mini. I came close a few times. Those things are worth a fortune these days.

 

[bunnspecial]

If I may, since it's been brought up, offer a bit of history on the Mini/MINI difference. Feel free to correct anything that's wrong, but I think this is mostly accurate.

Back in the 1950s, BMC(British Motor Corporation) came out with what could be called essentially a revolutionary product. The goal was a family car that was spacious inside but still had a minimal footprint(to fit well in crowded streets).

What they developed was just that. It was powered by a transverse-mounted 4 cylinder A-series engine(same as used in the MG Midget and a handful of other cars) that shared a sump with a 4 speed transaxle. The result was exactly what was intended-the engine and gearbox packaging kept the drivetrain footprint compact, and left essentially all the other room in the car for people/cargo. It also was a gas sipper at reliably 40+ MPG.

The car was a roaring success. Not only did it accomplish its design goal, but the light weight and small footprint made it a nimble and just plain fun car to drive. It's often been called a street legal go-kart, an appropriate designation.

It's worth noting that BMC(and later British Leyland) recognized this and exploited it. There were several high output variations, with the top one being the Cooper S. It used a 1275cc high compression version of the A series engine. Of small note, the Cooper S engine was built with 11 head studs, while a standard A series engine has 9 head studs. Urban legend has it that BMC/BL never would put the Cooper S engine in the MG Midget because it would have made it faster than the flagship MGB.

By 1967, the Mini could no longer meet US safety standards, and since the American market generally preferred larger vehicles for family cars, there was no motivation to change it to make it still possible to import. A fair few have trickled in over the years(using the 25 year rule) but most are pre-67.

Despite the loss of US sales, though, the Mini soldiered on in the home market for a REALLY long time. It had several updates over the years, including a switch in powerplants, but fundamentally the sheet metal didn't change until it was discontinued in 2000(?).

Around that time, BMW bought the rights to the name, and did a clean-sheet design in the same vein as the original. It gained some weight and some "bloat" to be inline with modern safety standards/expectations, but kept a lot of the character, including the sharp, direct handling.

The new one has been a roaring success also. They've continued the tradition of high output versions(that are miles ahead of the original in terms of power), but also made more normal daily drivers that are still gas friendly and comfortable. BTW, they're one of the few cars around that can be had with a manual, but a lot in the US do have automatics.

Whether you love the new one or consider it an abomination, there's still a lot about them that makes them great. I've considered one more than once.

 

[44267547]

Thanks! I love talking & reading about cars, so I'll surely be here for a while and contribute if I can.

My car is my daily driver, fun road trip car, hobby, and social catalyst. MINIs have an active owner/enthusiast community through which I've met many of my current friends, hence the social component. I take great joy and find peace in things like washing & waxing my car, so it's a form of relaxation too. I spec ordered this MINI, so it came from the factory in pretty good knick. I've added a few upgrades that don't affect the daily drivability but make it even more capable of handling hairpins, sweepers, and switchbacks.

It’s amazing we like what we’re surrounded by or grew up with from those around us. I’d say you’re the first person that I’ve come across as a mini enthusiast that I personally don’t know anyone owns one. My whole life, I’ve been surrounded by V8’s, and that was what I was introduced to at 18, (I’m 34), I don’t know anything else outside that realm. (You name it, I’ve owned/driven it).

Just a quick research sitting in the Home office right now, I didn’t even know that there was a ‘mini Cooper club‘ north of my region in about 30 minutes that has over 850 local members With models from every era. They even have a ‘touring run’ that ventures over 350 miles from start to finish From Peak valley to Norwash trail.

Oh, you mentioned about you take pride in detailing. I know you didn’t read back far enough into this thread, but I am an extremist when it comes to detailing. I only use the best products (Carguys/Chemical Guys), I have specific lighting in my garage that actually enhances the paint From all angles. I have specific patterns of how I detail, high-quality count microfiber cloths, etc. If You ever need any recommendations on products or in general discussion, that’s one of my top side hobbies.

Actually, I was just discussing with a business partner about a month ago, that if I ever started a business on the side, it would be detailing for specific cars, like exotics, muscles, classics, etc for seasonal prep or car show comps.

I could go on and on about that, but you get my point.😁

 

[fridayxiii]

Outstanding post @bunnspecial. You nailed the history part of it. MINI also has some racing heritage, having won the Monte Carlo Rallye three times.

I saw my first MINI in the early 2000s and was instantly smitten, obsessing over them until I bought my first in 2010. When she started showing her age in 2018 it was a no-brainer: the only dealer I visited was MINI. It's hard to have more fun on four wheels than a MINI Cooper, especially for the money.

 

[bunnspecial]

Outstanding post @bunnspecial. You nailed the history part of it. MINI also has some racing heritage, having won the Monte Carlo Rallye three times.

I saw my first MINI in the early 2000s and was instantly smitten, obsessing over them until I bought my first in 2010. When she started showing her age in 2018 it was a no-brainer: the only dealer I visited was MINI. It's hard to have more fun on four wheels than a MINI Cooper, especially for the money.

Thanks!

I'm an MG guy, but I love LBCs in all forms and fashions and have a ton of respect for both what the original Mini represents as well just how great it is all around.

One of my bucket list cars is a Morris Minor. They're definitely a different beast, and of course the Mini was meant as a replacement for them but the Minor still stuck around a really long time after. The last Minor I drove had a 1275 Midget transplant from its original 998, and it was a blast as least compared to how they normally are. I have to admit, though, that I felt a bit weird looking at a Craigslist ad that had "Minor" and "Midget" next to each other in the title . I kind of wish I'd bought that one, but at the same time primer gray isn't my look(and is expensive to change), the hood hinges were broken from it flying loose at speed, and most disconcerting was that it popped out of 3rd and 4th. It wasn't fun to be driving up a hill, forget about it doing that, and suddenly be back in neutral. The guy selling it just said "Yeah, just rest your knee on the stick and it's fine"...

 

[Apple fanboy]

Thanks!

I'm an MG guy, but I love LBCs in all forms and fashions and have a ton of respect for both what the original Mini represents as well just how great it is all around.

One of my bucket list cars is a Morris Minor. They're definitely a different beast, and of course the Mini was meant as a replacement for them but the Minor still stuck around a really long time after. The last Minor I drove had a 1275 Midget transplant from its original 998, and it was a blast as least compared to how they normally are. I have to admit, though, that I felt a bit weird looking at a Craigslist ad that had "Minor" and "Midget" next to each other in the title . I kind of wish I'd bought that one, but at the same time primer gray isn't my look(and is expensive to change), the hood hinges were broken from it flying loose at speed, and most disconcerting was that it popped out of 3rd and 4th. It wasn't fun to be driving up a hill, forget about it doing that, and suddenly be back in neutral. The guy selling it just said "Yeah, just rest your knee on the stick and it's fine"...

Funny I love the original mini, and MG, but have no love for the Morris Minor.

 

[MacBH928]

Production cars have to deal with mass manufacturing, cost, a wide set of consumer expectations, maintenance, available gas, so there's often times a notable amount of performance left on the table, handling, braking, straight line can almost always be improved.

It's not an "investment", it's for fun




Powerful == Reliable? Two different attributes, however, increasing the output of an engine far beyond the original spec could make it less reliable. There's a difference as well if you're talking factory vs. aftermarket, there are incredibly powerful, very reliable engines, and unbelievably unreliable, very low power engines.




Assuming you didn't actually read the post ...

(Also it's more than just the color, look at the grill, wheels, stripes ...)



You would be.

Both are forced induction methods to increase the amount of air in an engine (past the atmospheric pressure, i.e., forced induction vs. naturally aspirated). They do exactly the same thing through different methods. One isn't particularly more reliable than the other (and certainly not "dangerous").

A supercharger runs the compressor off a belt that's driven by the engine itself. A turbocharger runs the compressor by blowing exhaust gas over a turbine that's spins the compressor. They're both "blowers", i.e., compressors that increase the air volume, in fact, turbo stands for Turbine Blower. There's a good number of differences in the power delivery, where the power is available in the RPM, how much is available on the top end, etc.

Then within the tech, there's various implementation differences, for example, a supercharger can be centrifugal or positive displacement (how the compressor is designed). They all have different driving characteristics, pros, cons, etc.

There's manufacturers that use turbos, like a Nissan GT-R and some that use superchargers like a Chevy Corvette ZR-1.

In terms of the aftermarket, packaging plays a huge part, i.e., the available space, plus heat management, installation, fabrication costs of the kit/components.

I skimmed through the post, must have missed it, the two shots seemed to imply its from the same photo shoot. I know some colors look different from different angles but never so much so I was wondering.

Excuse my ignorance, I thought a supercharger adds more "spinning" to "something"(crankshaft?Axel?) to make it run faster. I never know it adds more air like a turbo, I would still feel that air going back into the engine(turbo) is a safer install than adding another thing that spins with belts.

This bring me to an idea, can you modify an electric car?

 

[Apple fanboy]

I skimmed through the post, must have missed it, the two shots seemed to imply its from the same photo shoot. I know some colors look different from different angles but never so much so I was wondering.

Excuse my ignorance, I thought a supercharger adds more "spinning" to "something"(crankshaft?Axel?) to make it run faster. I never know it adds more air like a turbo, I would still feel that air going back into the engine(turbo) is a safer install than adding another thing that spins with belts.

This bring me to an idea, can you modify an electric car?

Rewind the motor maybe? Extra battery?

But I’d have thought hacking the CPU is the way to go!

 

[Matz]

I skimmed through the post, must have missed it, the two shots seemed to imply its from the same photo shoot. I know some colors look different from different angles but never so much so I was wondering.

Excuse my ignorance, I thought a supercharger adds more "spinning" to "something"(crankshaft?Axel?) to make it run faster. I never know it adds more air like a turbo, I would still feel that air going back into the engine(turbo) is a safer install than adding another thing that spins with belts.

This bring me to an idea, can you modify an electric car?

This isn’t a bad presentation on superchargers. It might help.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

I don’t have much experience with superchargers but I do know that I really like it on my Range Rover compared to Turbo cars. It just seems to be much more “ready” to go. Even compared to multiple turbos. Saying that I’m booking mine in to have a 10% reduction pulley and a remap for a little bit more power; should take it from just 510Hp to about 650 ?

 

[D.T.]

You name it, I’ve owned/driven it.

Domestic V8s?

'67 L88 Corvette

*drops mic*

Excuse my ignorance, I thought a supercharger adds more "spinning" to "something"(crankshaft?Axel?) to make it run faster. I never know it adds more air like a turbo, I would still feel that air going back into the engine(turbo) is a safer install than adding another thing that spins with belts.

Right, so no forced induction bypasses the combustion process, they increase the power (i.e., torque) that's generated, by forcing more air into the engine during that same process.

To clarify, a turbo does not recirculate the same "air" that it uses to spin the turbine/compressor wheel, that's super hot exhaust gas. Basically as the engine releases the exhaust gas, it flows over the turbine, then out the actual exhaust system.


Both superchargers and turbos work like this:


Fresh/outside air >> air intake >> compressor >> engine/cylinders


A turbo spins that compressor like this:


engine >> exhaust manifold >> turbine >> cats/resonators/exhaust


A supercharger spins it like this:

engine crankshaft >> pulley >> turbine

(the exhaust process is no different that if the engine was NA (naturally aspirated).


Then systems have all sorts of flow control, wastegates, etc., to handle boost control and whatnot, which of course is tied into air volume monitoring, fuel delivery management, etc.

Additionally all that factors into things like __gearing__ for the final effective performance (gearing is so important, and so often not discussed, especially in the context of RPM ...)

I don’t have much experience with superchargers but I do know that I really like it on my Range Rover compared to Turbo cars. It just seems to be much more “ready” to go. Even compared to multiple turbos. Saying that I’m booking mine in to have a 10% reduction pulley and a remap for a little bit more power; should take it from just 510Hp to about 650 ?

I think all modern OEM superchargers are a PD style, that's where you have the compressor sitting right on top of the engine, it sort of combines an intake manifold - that's the same implementation as all the supercharged domestics (GT500, ZL1, Z06/ZR1, various Hellcat flavors). It uses two long tightly coupled impellers and outputs directly to the engine (vs. through an intake pipe), so there's always tons of positive pressure (vs. having to build it up), meaning a near instant increase in torque.

Of course, that also means in a RWD car, it can get squirrely really quickly.

Most modern turbo cars went to two smaller (vs. one larger) turbos, create the same boost but with quicker response, all sorts of different tricks, twin scroll, etc., it's gotten really good in terms of immediacy of power delivery, but won't ever match a PD supercharger.


Turbos are, depending how you define it, "more efficient" in that they use what is in essence "waste gas", the supercharger actually costs HP, I think I've seen estimates of up to 100-125HP used to actually spin the supercharger, but that depends in the design, displacement, etc.


It occured to me that Ford offers cars with both turbos and superchargers, and in fact, it's in the same _model_ line: Mustang Ecoboost (2.3L I4 turbo), GT/GT350 (5.0L/5,2L V8 nat aspirated), GT500 (5.2L V8 supercharged).

That upgrade sounds fantastic, and that's of course, the amazing thing with factory FI, you're just a pulley, tune, maybe exhaust away from another 75-100 HP

 

[MacBH928]

I just read what everyone said about modding cars, I just assumed they are released as is in best condition and not meant to be tempered with. At least thats how most products are. I know some are released with the idea to modify them like the Toyota Supra.

I noticed manufacturers tend to prefer to pre-install their cars with turbos more than SC, is there a reason?

As for Minis, I once had an idea to get a Mini as a fun mini car but after reading online that they are more on the expensive side of things and reliability is meh...I never looked back at it again. I checked online and they seem to start at $22K which is very reasonable I wonder if they brought new models in. I don't see much of them on the road I think I heard once they are being canceled. As for history, I think those were BMW minis kind of like VW Beetle. Not a brand on its own.

 

[MacBH928]

Production cars have to deal with mass manufacturing, cost, a wide set of consumer expectations, maintenance, available gas, so there's often times a notable amount of performance left on the table, handling, braking, straight line can almost always be improved.

It's not an "investment", it's for fun




Powerful == Reliable? Two different attributes, however, increasing the output of an engine far beyond the original spec could make it less reliable. There's a difference as well if you're talking factory vs. aftermarket, there are incredibly powerful, very reliable engines, and unbelievably unreliable, very low power engines.




Assuming you didn't actually read the post ...

(Also it's more than just the color, look at the grill, wheels, stripes ...)



You would be.

Both are forced induction methods to increase the amount of air in an engine (past the atmospheric pressure, i.e., forced induction vs. naturally aspirated). They do exactly the same thing through different methods. One isn't particularly more reliable than the other (and certainly not "dangerous").

A supercharger runs the compressor off a belt that's driven by the engine itself. A turbocharger runs the compressor by blowing exhaust gas over a turbine that's spins the compressor. They're both "blowers", i.e., compressors that increase the air volume, in fact, turbo stands for Turbine Blower. There's a good number of differences in the power delivery, where the power is available in the RPM, how much is available on the top end, etc.

Then within the tech, there's various implementation differences, for example, a supercharger can be centrifugal or positive displacement (how the compressor is designed). They all have different driving characteristics, pros, cons, etc.

There's manufacturers that use turbos, like a Nissan GT-R and some that use superchargers like a Chevy Corvette ZR-1.

In terms of the aftermarket, packaging plays a huge part, i.e., the available space, plus heat management, installation, fabrication costs of the kit/components.

I skimmed through the post, must have missed it, the two shots seemed to imply its from the same photo shoot. I know some colors look different from different angles but never so much so I was wondering.

Excuse my ignorance, I thought a supercharger adds more "spinning" to "something"(crankshaft?Axel?) to make it run faster. I never know it adds more air like a turbo, I would still feel that air going back into the engine(turbo) is a safer install than adding another thing that spins with belts.

@D.T. A lighter set of rims and good tires like Michelin Pilot Super Sports can make a big difference. One of the first changes recommended to those new MINI owners who're serous about driving is to ditch the factory runflat tires and get on some sticky rubber, pronto.

rims and tires is a mod? I thought rims were mainly aesthetics and all good quality tires are made to be the same more or less. I know different types are better for different terrains and some(for reasons are unknown to me) are probably racing tires....but for a road car, I didn't think it mattered. Honestly I also thought factory chosen tires are best.