The Car Thread ... !

[avro707]

Peter Falk passed away at the age of 93:

Porsche mourns the loss of Peter Falk

For more than three decades, Peter Falk shaped the company's motorsport history as an engineer and race director. He played a key role in numerous successes and developments. He passed away on January 23, 2026, at the age of 93.

newsroom.porsche.com

Obituary: Legendary Porsche engineer Peter Falk

Peter Falk (1932-2026) has died at the age of 93

www.autosport.com

I knew he was quite elderly. RIP.

He was a former racing director and a brilliant, quietly spoken engineer.

I have his book which is a great read and it gives an interesting insight into the people in the engineering and racing departments and their ways of working. Particularly interesting the anecdotes from the testing of production car prototypes in Algeria. Their "whatever it takes to get the job done" mentality is great, as was the team work. Nobody was above anyone else, that was a big no-no.

He was also very talented behind the wheel. In road cars, he was a key player in the 993 911 development, and also was heavily involved in many of the other cars like 944, 928, 911 Turbo and the 911 Carrera RS 2.7. He also drove the race cars as well, even the 917 which he reckoned was like an elephant: "big, fast, frightening".

 

[avro707]

Anyone like Cosworth 8.3L V16 engines?

One of them in action for real:

Don't be fooled by the early driving, just wait! That is scary fast.

It does have that classic V16 engine note as well, a bit like the old Auto Union 16 cylinder engines. I still prefer the old W16 quad-turbo Bugatti engines, but you've got to hand it to them, Bugatti is on a level above everyone else.

 

[avro707]

Porsche 935/78 technical overview

Norbert Singer, the former racing engineer at Porsche gives a great walk-around and technical overview of the most extreme Porsche 911 ever, the 1978 935/78 "Moby Dick". This was one of his most extreme creations.

They really pushed that to the extreme with mechanical and aerodynamic solutions and pushed the racing technical regulations right to the edge.

He also talks about the never-build 1979 ground-effect 935. I had heard of this before but didn't know any precise details, it seems to have been a more serious project than I first thought, I figured it was just some rough sketches and theory, but it got to wind-tunnel testing.

That machine would have had double the downforce but the drag coefficient would have been the same, so the car would have been way faster. How they dealt with the engine and the enormous fuel consumption was another thing altogether. Perhaps with the greater downforce they could afford to wind the engine back from 800hp (in the race, 845hp qualifying) to get more acceptable fuel economy and go further between pit stops.

I suspect that car would have been busted by the regulations, and if not, it would have been really controversial. The Moby Dick was anyway, but the 79 car would have really caused an outrage. I quite like the side profile of the 935/78 where you see the standard 911 body shape and then the extra windows stuck over the top of it (since the rules didn't specifically forbid that). That was a clever (but naughty) way to improve the aerodynamics of the car.

In any case, Moby Dick only raced at Silverstone, Le Mans and Vallelunga 6 hours. At Vallelunga they had serious setup problems (big understeer) and were way off the pace. They completely changed up the car setup "back to basics" and then absolutely obliterated everyone in qualifying. The Kremer lot were shocked. 🙂 It must be said the Kremer bothers did very good 935s themselves.

It's great hearing the history from the people who made it. Also great seeing how they just went ahead and got the job done, no endless big discussions, if something made sense and would do the job, then it got done however was possible. It's not often that happens now.

The same channel has a few other episodes on the 935 (the earlier versions) with Norbert Singer as well, he's brilliant.

There was a term coined for Singer's clever reading of racing regulations: "Interpreteering" - a play on the "scrutineering" and "interpreting". He always found clever and sometimes wild interpretations of the technical regulations.

 

[StuAff]

Porsche 935/78 technical overview

Norbert Singer, the former racing engineer at Porsche gives a great walk-around and technical overview of the most extreme Porsche 911 ever, the 1978 935/78 "Moby Dick".

They really pushed that to the extreme with mechanical and aerodynamic solutions and pushed the racing technical regulations right to the edge.

He also talks about the never-build 1979 ground-effect 935. I had heard of this before but didn't know any precise details, it seems to have been a more serious project than I first thought, I figured it was just some rough sketches and theory, but it got to wind-tunnel testing.

That machine would have had double the downforce but the drag coefficient would have been the same, so the car would have been way faster. How they dealt with the engine and the enormous fuel consumption was another thing altogether. Perhaps with the greater downforce they could afford to wind the engine back from 800hp (in the race, 845hp qualifying) to get more acceptable fuel economy and go further between pit stops.

I suspect that car would have been busted by the regulations, and if not, it would have been really controversial. The Moby Dick was anyway, but the 79 car would have really caused an outrage. I quite like the side profile of the 935/78 where you see the standard 911 body shape and then the extra windows stuck over the top of it (since the rules didn't specifically forbid that).

In any case, Moby Dick only raced at Silverstone, Le Mans and Vallelunga 6 hours. At Vallelunga they had serious setup problems (big understeer) and were way off the pace. They completely changed up the car setup "back to basics" and then absolutely obliterated everyone in qualifying. The Kremer lot were shocked. 🙂 It must be said the Kremer bothers did very good 935s themselves.

It's great hearing the history from the people who made it. Also great seeing how they just went ahead and got the job done, no endless big discussions, if something made sense and would do the job, then it got done however was possible. It's not often that happens now.

Norbert's great, and Porsche are doing a great job of covering historic cars in video and web content. Saw the Baby at the Merckx/Ickx exhibition in Brussels back in 2015, hope they do a video on that some time.

 

[avro707]

Saw the Baby

That thing was crazy! It has lead in the chassis tubes to get it up to the weight limit.

It got so hot inside when it was raced the driver pulled over, stumbled out and collapsed from heat exhaustion. They had to change the heat-shielding from the engine bay to make it safer if I remember right. That's how extreme it was. On that topic I remember another car where the footwell was so hot the drivers were getting blisters and burns on their feet. So the solution was to sew "booties" to go over the driving shoes, these "booties" were using asbestos material!! 😱

Next race I think was Hockeheimring (the old fast track) and "Baby" simply ran away from everyone. For others, "baby" was named as that because it had a very small engine (I think only 1.4L with a turbo) with about 380hp but it was super light and had fairly radical aero. It was competing with the Ford Capri (Zakspeed).

I also liked the trial they did with carbon brake material, some material from the Brabham F1 team courtesy of Dunlop Aviation. They found out who did this via Dieter Glotzbach, the Dunlop tyre guy for Porsche.

All the material was properly fixed to the brakes, out the driver goes and everyone is happy. Until the driver comes back quickly and says "no brakes"!! Impossible - they are carbon!?

Glotzbach tries to check the tyre pressures and he can't do that because everything is way too hot to touch. The brake cooling wasn't adequate and the immense heat cooked everything, also boiling the brake fluid. That little experiment didn't go very far.

They also had some extreme ideas with the 2.1 Carrera Turbo RSR (Turbo Carrera for short), Professor Ernst Fuhrmann saw that in America they put the bodies for the stock-cars in a bath of acid to make them thinner and save weight and so he pressured Singer to try to do that. Singer goes off and finds a company that can do it and is quoted an astronomical amount to do it. The company had to build a tank big enough to fit a car body, then find all the chemicals needed. The result "forget it, we can't afford that". 😀

They were trying to get the weight of the Turbo Carrera down near the Matra prototypes, which interestingly had Porsche gearboxes. They had the same, or even a bit more power than the Matra but weighed more. There was also a radical solution for the fuel tanks, moving them to the middle of the car from the front. This was for more consistent weight distribution over an entire race stint (eg, when the fuel tanks goes empty).

Norbert's great, and Porsche are doing a great job of covering historic cars in video and web content.

I agree. I wish they had gotten a bit more from Peter Falk before he sadly passed away. I know he was a lot more quietly spoken and tended to not say as much, but he was also hugely involved in all of this. He would certainly say he had a good team, but he was part of that and enabled them to do a lot of the brilliant things they did. Credit also to Timo Bernhard, he is doing a great job as a presenter on the channel.

 

[avro707]

Speaking of the 935/2.0 "Baby":

935/2.0 overview

From 1977 with Norbert Singer giving the details again. That car was actually underweight at 710kg, so they put molten lead in the chassis tubes (poured into them by a funnel). This was the way to hide it from others (BMW and Ford) who were also in the 2 litre category which was very fierce in the competition (Ford Capri and BMW 320 Turbo). And this molten lead was in the front of the car, which improved the weight balance. When you lighten a 911 to the extreme, most of the weight comes out of the front. The engine is at the back and you can't do much about it, so the weight balance usually becomes quite poor, and even worse if you have the fuel tank at the front when it gets lighter.

Even the seat adjustment was removed. Anything that wasn't necessary was removed, dashboard considerably more minimal, I think the doors weighed nearly nothing. Even the ignition key was drilled to remove weight, although the tacho needle escaped that treatment. 😉

Baby had many problems at first, too hot inside, stiffness wasn't adequate (too much weight had been chopped out of it), the tiny 1.4L single-turbo engine had terrible response. But it eventually got solved and by the second (and last race for the car) Baby simply ran away from the rivals, something like a minute faster. Then retired to the museum.

It had about 370hp at 8000rpm, but the engine only really gave power from 5000rpm so it was a tricky thing to drive. Below 5000rpm nothing happened at all. That was later the experience with the original prototype Porsche 930 Turbo with the TAG 1.5L turbo V6 engine (done in the late 80s). The ex-F1 engine was tuned to 300hp but had terrible response and so wasn't useful as a road-car engine. McLaren has this 911 in the technology centre collection. One interesting thing was the "jet cooling" for the intercooler, using the low pressure generated by the strong exhaust flow to draw fresh air through the intercoolers. Water cooling wasn't possible because that added weight.

Jacky Ickx was the driver of the 935 Baby. While it raced, it was more about research and development rather than race victories.

 

[maflynn]

This post pertains to traditional vehicles, not EV, as it relates to maintenance and repairs unique to internal combustion engines.

Has the auto industry in the US transformed to a degree that it makes more financial sense to lease instead of buying/Financing?

I'm seeing nearly every single maintenance/repair to be 1,000 to 2,000 dollars (outside of oil changes). When you lease, you're largely only paying for oil changes.

Last year I've put in about 2,000 dollars into my 2021 Chevy Colorado. This year I'm looking at potentially 4,000 dollars of repairs and maintenance in the next few months. Earlier this year I've already put in 1,200 for the 45k mile maintenance package.

Put it another way, its looking like it makes more sense to put a small portion of that 4,000 towards a lease then in a truck that will seemingly have expensive repairs moving forward.

 

[Alameda]

This post pertains to traditional vehicles, not EV, as it relates to maintenance and repairs unique to internal combustion engines.

Has the auto industry in the US transformed to a degree that it makes more financial sense to lease instead of buying/Financing?

I'm seeing nearly every single maintenance/repair to be 1,000 to 2,000 dollars (outside of oil changes). When you lease, you're largely only paying for oil changes.

Last year I've put in about 2,000 dollars into my 2021 Chevy Colorado. This year I'm looking at potentially 4,000 dollars of repairs and maintenance in the next few months. Earlier this year I've already put in 1,200 for the 45k mile maintenance package.

Put it another way, its looking like it makes more sense to put a small portion of that 4,000 towards a lease then in a truck that will seemingly have expensive repairs moving forward.

I perform all of my own maintenance. But when you compare maintenance/repair costs to the monthly loan or lease payments, it's always cheaper to keep the car as long as possible.

My car is a 2014 BMW with over 100,000 miles. Before I get into what I've done, the point I want to make about maintenance is this: Cars come with maintenance books, telling you what to do and when. Almost every time you take a car to a dealer for a maintenance job, they add ridiculous overpriced services, like "fuel system flush," (which means "pour a can of fluid into your gas tank").

Use the book that comes with the car, and follow those items, not what a dealer tells you. And second, never pay a dealership to do maintenance on your car. Find a reputable, well-known specialist shop. They will charge you about 60% of what a dealer charges. There are a lot of simple items you can do yourself, such as the cabin air filter and the engine air filter. When I had a Prius, the Toyota dealer wanted $60 to replace the cabin air filter, which takes about 30 seconds to do. You can just buy your own for $20 or less and pop it right in. YouTube has tons of DIY car maintenance videos.

With that said, in ten years of ownership, I paid $8,147 to maintain my BMW, which includes $3,079 for three sets of tires. Outside of the tires, it comes out to about $500 a year for ten years, and that is using only OEM factory parts and meticulous maintenance, well above and beyond factory recommendations.

This includes: Brake fluid flush, spark plugs, cabin filters, engine air filters, coolant hoses, transmission oil change, differential oil change, lots of engine oil changes, water pump, thermostat, serpentine belt and tensioner, valve cover, valve cover gasket, oil filter housing gasket, brake pads and rotors, oil pressure sensor, oil level sensor, charge pipe, windshield washer pump, gas cap and an oil pan gasket. Many of these items exceed BMW recommendations and most of them are things I replaced as preventatives, not because they had already failed.

I'm a huge fan of doing your own oil changes, and installing something called a Fumoto valve to make it easier. You don't save a ton of money but you get it done right. The worst thing to do is never ever ever take your car to a quick-change oil place. Never ever do that. Those people are untrained, they will not know your car and they will do everything on earth to sell you things you don't need. Do not use them.

Things you can do yourself: Air filters, windshield washer fluid, spark plugs. My independent shop wanted $633 to replace the spark plugs. I replaced them for $78. If you do your own spark plugs, you need to buy a torque wrench and a special socket, and you never ever ever buy spark plugs from Amazon or eBay. There are lots of fake spark plugs. You have to use a reputable reseller and Amazon is not safe to buy spark plugs from.

If you do your own oil changes, spark plug changes and engine/cabin air filter changes, that pretty much leaves just the brakes and the transmission oil changes to your mechanic. I've only needed one brake change on my BMW in 100,000 miles. If you don't want to get into brakes, just have a reputable independent shop do them, using quality parts, not the Autozone junk. Same thing with the brake fluid flushes.

With this approach, you can easy get to 150,000 miles and ten years or more, at very low cost.

 

[maflynn]

I perform all of my own maintenance.

but I don't, so I have to pay someone else.

Something happened with the price of maintenance. For instance prior to 2020, an oil change was in the 40 to 50 dollar range, today its over a hundred dollars. Granted an oil change is needed for new and used vehicles but its indicative of how automotive costs have sky rocketed.

hings you can do yourself: Air filters, windshield washer fluid, spark plugs.

Evidently, the location of the spark plugs for my truck means the engine has to be virtually torn apart as some of the spark plugs are not accessible. The same thing for the subaru, they need to basically pull the engine out to gain access.

These things are well beyond my skill level, and abilities.

 

[diamond.g]

Do you guys not have to do timing belt changes, fuel filter, or differential fluid changes?

 

[maflynn]

Do you guys not have to do timing belt changes, fuel filter, or differential fluid changes?

The timing belt is is scheduled for the 100,000 mile mark, the others are every 10-20k and 30k-60k respectfully.

I remember back in the day when engines used timing chains and never needed to be changed.

 

[Weaselboy]

Lots of modern cars use timing chains, but it tends to be a little more high end cars. That said, the timing belt used on many cars today hold up surprisingly well. As a former auto mechanic from the mid-1970's, it would be rare to see a timing chain last over 100,000 miles back then like the new belts do.

 

[diamond.g]

The timing belt is is scheduled for the 100,000 mile mark, the others are every 10-20k and 30k-60k respectfully.

I remember back in the day when engines used timing chains and never needed to be changed.

We have a Honda Passport in the family and I forgot about the 100k timing belt service. I remember on my old Nissan (1996) we were supposed to just visually inspect them around the same time you take off the valve cover (which now I can't remember why you'd do such a thing). Of course in that car we also had rod bearing that needed replacement.

 

[v3rlon]

This post pertains to traditional vehicles, not EV, as it relates to maintenance and repairs unique to internal combustion engines.

Has the auto industry in the US transformed to a degree that it makes more financial sense to lease instead of buying/Financing?

I'm seeing nearly every single maintenance/repair to be 1,000 to 2,000 dollars (outside of oil changes). When you lease, you're largely only paying for oil changes.

Last year I've put in about 2,000 dollars into my 2021 Chevy Colorado. This year I'm looking at potentially 4,000 dollars of repairs and maintenance in the next few months. Earlier this year I've already put in 1,200 for the 45k mile maintenance package.

Put it another way, it’s looking like it makes more sense to put a small portion of that 4,000 towards a lease then in a truck that will seemingly have expensive repairs moving forward.

I would say no (usually)
If you own a new car and under payments, you are probably under warranty. The same with CPO if th company is any good.

If you have an older car and doing your own repairs, then you are likely beating lease payments.

Cars vary in quality, even from the same maker, and that is also influenced by driving style and maintenance (and luck, if I am being fair). You could buy the most reliable car you know and still get one that keeps having issues. You could buy a terrible reputation car and never have an issue.

A CPO Porsche covers unlimited miles for 3-4 years with no deductible and no freaking hassles. A Macan isn’t much more than that Colorado, and is just an all around fun car. My first one was still quite reliable when I traded after ~110,000 miles.

 

[maflynn]

If you have an older car and doing your own repairs, then you are likely beating lease payments.

But what if you're not doing your own repairs?

I get what you're saying with new cars bought or leased, both are under warranty.

 

[maflynn]

Lots of modern cars use timing chains,

Really, I thought that went the way of the dodo in the 1980s

 

[diamond.g]

But what if you're not doing your own repairs?

I get what you're saying with new cars bought or leased, both are under warranty.

I think if you drive few miles a year and are going to trade in your vehicle every 3-4 years for a newer one, then leasing is probably a good deal.

 

[diamond.g]

Really, I thought that went the way of the dodo in the 1980s

How else would the valves be controlled?

 

[Weaselboy]

Really, I thought that went the way of the dodo in the 1980s

Nah... still around. My car (2024 3-series BMW with inline six cylinder) has a timing chain. The darn thing is mounted at the back of the engine and requires an engine pull to access it. I do three year leases, so it won't ever be my problem to deal with. 😀

 

[maflynn]

How else would the valves be controlled?

Chains were replaced by belts for many cars (thought all cars but only some)

 

[rb2112]

This post pertains to traditional vehicles, not EV, as it relates to maintenance and repairs unique to internal combustion engines.

Has the auto industry in the US transformed to a degree that it makes more financial sense to lease instead of buying/Financing?

I'm seeing nearly every single maintenance/repair to be 1,000 to 2,000 dollars (outside of oil changes). When you lease, you're largely only paying for oil changes.

Last year I've put in about 2,000 dollars into my 2021 Chevy Colorado. This year I'm looking at potentially 4,000 dollars of repairs and maintenance in the next few months. Earlier this year I've already put in 1,200 for the 45k mile maintenance package.

Put it another way, its looking like it makes more sense to put a small portion of that 4,000 towards a lease then in a truck that will seemingly have expensive repairs moving forward.

Historical sense was that leasing was the most expensive of all possible options. In 2018 when were were looking at options, leasing was so much more expensive when we ran the numbers. But you do have a good point about maintenance costs. Our anecdote: we bought a used vehicle and paid about 3,500 USD for the extended warranty....which was used for about 8,000 ! in repairs the last 2 years! All kinds of things (1 big mechanical and so many electronic) have broken. This past month we decided to spend another 4,500 for an extended warranty for the next 4 years, I expect that to pay for itself also. But even considering those costs, the 9 year comparison of (a) buy used and pay for maintenance vs (b) lease 3 similar vehicles for 3 years each. I just did an AI search on average lease price and this seems to favor (a) just like it did when we looked in 2018, with the same conclusion: "If you don't want to deal with maintenance AND have a LOT of money to spend on the vehicle, go ahead and lease." We just don't want to spend that kind of money. It's like 2-4 times as much.

 

[poorcody]

As things get more expensive, the value of quality goes up (it's cheaper never having to go to the shop in the first place). You still can't beat cars like Toyota, Subaru, Honda, etc. to reduce your total cost of ownership.

Consumer Reports covers this sort of thing really well.

 

[Apple fanboy]

One of the deciding factors of me getting rid of my Golf was the timing belt. Recommended by the dealer to change every 4-5 years. That’s crazy given the car had less than 50k on the clock.

 

[Alameda]

but I don't, so I have to pay someone else.

Something happened with the price of maintenance. For instance prior to 2020, an oil change was in the 40 to 50 dollar range, today its over a hundred dollars. Granted an oil change is needed for new and used vehicles but its indicative of how automotive costs have sky rocketed.


Evidently, the location of the spark plugs for my truck means the engine has to be virtually torn apart as some of the spark plugs are not accessible. The same thing for the subaru, they need to basically pull the engine out to gain access.

These things are well beyond my skill level, and abilities.

If you don’t mind, which model, make and year of vehicle are you talking about?

For me, I began with the simple things and progressed as my skill developed. I’m at the point where I can remove an engine, transmission or clutch and I can rebuild a car’s suspension. It takes time to get there.

 

[maflynn]

If you don’t mind, which model, make and year of vehicle are you talking about?

Not at alll

2021 Chevy Colorado Z71, I bought Oct 2020. Its been a fantastic truck, but I'm currently looking at almost 4,000 dollars in maintenance and repairs.