The iMac condensation problem is obviously quite real....

[skunk]

I agree that it could be a manufacturing issue due to where it was manufactured, but the fact that the glass cover isn't sealed on the inside strongly suggests to me that it's due to air which circulates inside, not due to air from where it was made - and it'd surprise me if these were made in highly humid environments.

Still, yes, it might be a defect - and I've seen plenty of other Apple design defects over the years - but this strikes me as more likely being user error.

Let's be honest, if the glass screen cover is not sealed to the machine - which I don't believe it is - this will produce condensation behind the glass if the conditions are right (or wrong), and this constitutes a DESIGN FLAW. It should not happen. Of course if you mollycoddle the machine, check the temperature and humidity every time you turn it on and so on, you will be able to minimise the occurrence, but that it happens at all is a DESIGN FLAW. Somebody did not think it through at the design stage. It may not be particularly serious, but I certainly would be pissed off if it happened to me. I want to be able to just switch the bloody thing on and get computing. If it happened to a laptop nobody would argue that it served the OP right for using it outside, would they?

As for "user error", you surely cannot be serious.

 

[saltyzoo]

Let's be honest, if the glass screen cover is not sealed to the machine - which I don't believe it is - this will produce condensation behind the glass if the conditions are right (or wrong), and this constitutes a DESIGN FLAW. It should not happen. Of course if you mollycoddle the machine, check the temperature and humidity every time you turn it on and so on, you will be able to minimise the occurrence, but that it happens at all is a DESIGN FLAW. Somebody did not think it through at the design stage. It may not be particularly serious, but I certainly would be pissed off if it happened to me. I want to be able to just switch the bloody thing on and get computing. If it happened to a laptop nobody would argue that it served the OP right for using it outside, would they?

As for "user error", you surely cannot be serious.

What design change would you suggest to prevent condensation from occurring?

 

[skunk]

What design change would you suggest to prevent condensation from occurring?

It ain't my job, it's Apple's, but I expect some sort of a gasket would do the trick.

 

[jsw]

Let's be honest, if the glass screen cover is not sealed to the machine - which I don't believe it is - this will produce condensation behind the glass if the conditions are right (or wrong), and this constitutes a DESIGN FLAW.

I agree that either it could have been better sealed, or else more easily removed and wiped. However, I don't consider it a design flaw, per se. We have a few at work, with no problems, and I've moved mine around my house, with various temperatures as it goes from room to room, with no issues at all.

Still, yes, I would imagine they'll fix it silently soon. But I don't see it as a major issue, simply one that affects a few customers, and, in those cases, I'm not convinced it's not because of how the iMacs are used.

 

[skunk]

Still, yes, I would imagine they'll fix it silently soon. But I don't see it as a major issue, simply one that affects a few customers, and, in those cases, I'm not convinced it's not because of how the iMacs are used.

It may not be a major issue, and it may be fixed, but I really don't think that "how the iMacs are used" should enter into it. How "should" one use a computer?

 

[Consultant]

Let's be honest, if the glass screen cover is not sealed to the machine - which I don't believe it is - this will produce condensation behind the glass if the conditions are right (or wrong), and this constitutes a DESIGN FLAW. It should not happen. Of course if you mollycoddle the machine, check the temperature and humidity every time you turn it on and so on, you will be able to minimise the occurrence, but that it happens at all is a DESIGN FLAW. Somebody did not think it through at the design stage. It may not be particularly serious, but I certainly would be pissed off if it happened to me. I want to be able to just switch the bloody thing on and get computing. If it happened to a laptop nobody would argue that it served the OP right for using it outside, would they?

As for "user error", you surely cannot be serious.

Maybe you should put a glass in your freezer, let it sit for awhile, then take it out. Does it have condensation? Are you going to return the glass? It's NOT a design flaw. It's just the laws of physics.

As others point out, if you let piece of equipment (that's been in the cold for awhile) get to room temperature first, then you would NOT have a problem.

 

[jsw]

It may not be a major issue, and it may be fixed, but I really don't think that "how the iMacs are used" should enter into it. How "should" one use a computer?

Basically, I just meant that the systems should never be turned on when they're quite cold, as one might expect if they're delivered in the winter, since that is a recipe for drawing moisture into the system - which might not show up until later.

If people have let them warm up before turning them on and still see the condensation, I'm a lot more inclined to see it as a design flaw - I just can't see the mechanism for condensation if the system is never turned on when cold.

 

[Waragainstsleep]

Thats a good point. I would also suggest that since a number of the people suffering this problem seem to have had it with more than one unit, there could well be an environmental reason for it....
I'm guessing the faulty replacements were installed in the exact same place.

 

[Consultant]

Thats a good point. I would also suggest that since a number of the people suffering this problem seem to have had it with more than one unit, there could well be an environmental reason for it....
I'm guessing the faulty replacements were installed in the exact same place.

It's not faulty replacement. It's the user environment and desire to turn on new machine as soon as possible.

Cold item + warm air with moisture = condensation

Have you people never have a cold soda or other beverages in a glass before?

 

[bluedoggiant]

I was thinking of getting a 20" iMac tomorrow but this has put me off.

Is it a very widespread issue and have Apple fixed it yet?

That shouldn't stop you from buying one. It's a very good computer.

 

[skunk]

Basically, I just meant that the systems should never be turned on when they're quite cold, as one might expect if they're delivered in the winter, since that is a recipe for drawing moisture into the system - which might not show up until later.

If people have let them warm up before turning them on and still see the condensation, I'm a lot more inclined to see it as a design flaw - I just can't see the mechanism for condensation if the system is never turned on when cold.

Thats a good point. I would also suggest that since a number of the people suffering this problem seem to have had it with more than one unit, there could well be an environmental reason for it....
I'm guessing the faulty replacements were installed in the exact same place.

It's not faulty replacement. It's the user environment and desire to turn on new machine as soon as possible.

Cold item + warm air with moisture = condensation

Have you people never have a cold soda or other beverages in a glass before?

I really can't believe that you are all seriously suggesting that if the user does not warm his or her computer up before turning it on, then it's their fault they get condensation behind the glass. This is utterly ridiculous. The thing should "just work" straight out of the box, as advertised, every time you turn it on, no ifs, no buts, no absurd excuses. Apple chose to put a piece of glass in front of the screen. Apple should make sure their design decision does not compromise their computer. End of story.

 

[heatmiser]

I really can't believe that you are all seriously suggesting that if the user does not warm his or her computer up before turning it on, then it's their fault they get condensation behind the glass. This is utterly ridiculous. The thing should "just work" straight out of the box, as advertised, every time you turn it on, no ifs, no buts, no absurd excuses. Apple chose to put a piece of glass in front of the screen. Apple should make sure their design decision does not compromise their computer. End of story.

There are so many Apple apologists here, it isn't really worth arguing with them. If you hop over to the MB/P boards, you'll still find people denying the yellow screen issue in the MBPs, the Magsafe issue, the Seagate hard drive issue (until Apple finally threw in the towel and admitted they were defective), the warping MBPs, the random shutdown Macbook club, etc. The bottom line is that no matter how many defective products Apple releases, a large percentage of their stockholders and zealots won't acknowledge the flaws in any of the products until Apple does so publically. And since Apple almost never acknowledges defective products, their sycophants have little reason to do so either. Does the iMac have numerous problems, including a condensation defect? Of course it does; anyone with the ability to read and analyze data can see so. But as Uptown Sinclair said, It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his job depends on not understanding it.

 

[Mac6272]

Please guys read my post and take my advice, dont buy an iMac and deal with the screen issues if it doesnt condensate its gonna have horrible backlight bleeding , and if you dont believe me go to your local apple store get on everynew iMac hits command + esc bring up frontrow and look how bad all the backlight bleedage is on all of them, Out of my 4 iMacs one of them didnt do it out of the box then 2 weeks later it already started.

Honestly think long and hard about buying an iMac i did i read all these screen issues and thought i would'nt be affected but the problem is VERY real and all consumers should atleast wait for Revision B.

 

[dejo]

Does the iMac have numerous problems, including a condensation defect? Of course it does; anyone with the ability to read and analyze data can see so.

What data are you referring to?

 

[Mac6272]

http://themacsucks.com/joomla/content/view/423/30/ ITS GOT TONS OF SCREEN ISSUES DONT WASTE YOUR MONEY

 

[bluedoggiant]

Please guys read my post and take my advice, dont buy an iMac and deal with the screen issues if it doesnt condensate its gonna have horrible backlight bleeding , and if you dont believe me go to your local apple store get on everynew iMac hits command + esc bring up frontrow and look how bad all the backlight bleedage is on all of them, Out of my 4 iMacs one of them didnt do it out of the box then 2 weeks later it already started.

Honestly think long and hard about buying an iMac i did i read all these screen issues and thought i would'nt be affected but the problem is VERY real and all consumers should atleast wait for Revision B.

We understand your anger (from the other thread), but the imac is a great machine, you just got unlucky. It's really sad that you're moving on to becoming a PC user, I wouldn't give up the OS because the hardware is awful, if its bad, Apple will fix it, yet again, you got unlucky.

 

[jsw]

What data are you referring to?

I'm also waiting, as I sit here looking at my non-condensing, non-backlight-bleeding iMac.

I've had issues with Macs, my last MBP in particular, and I certainly accept that there are design/manufacturing issues, acknowledged or not by Apple. I'm just not yet seeing the condensation issue as Apple's fault. Maybe with more data.

 

[heatmiser]

What data are you referring to?

Not empirical data; reviews and complaints by people with iMacs. There's a new thread on the issue almost weekly in these boards, and there have been dozens of discussions on the matter here since it started to appear. Hop on over to the official Apple forums, and you'll find many more discussions, despite their policy of deleting complaints relating to various "open secret" defects. There are over 25,000 hits on Google for "iMac condensation" (sans quotations); how many of these could refer to anything other than the defect we're discussing right now? In the end, the complaints are readily available, yet people will persist in denying them for as long as their financial/mental welfare depends on their refusal to acknowledge these issues. The rest of us see things as they are, and aren't going to defend Apple through yet another defective product.

 

[jsw]

There are over 25,000 hits on Google for "iMac condensation" (sans quotations); how many of these could refer to anything other than the defect we're discussing right now?

Have you actually read any of the threads? I just went through several links, and every one of them ended up saying the problem resolved itself after the system had been left on for a short while.

Please post a link to one that says it remains an issue if the computer is left on, or that it's recurring.

 

[skunk]

I'm not saying that every single iMac suffers from these problems. I haven't even got one (mine's a 24" white one, which has been great), but there is quite obviously a weakness in the design which tends to produce these problems for many people. Even if the problems only manifest in 5% of iMacs, that's a hell of a lot of people with a completely justifiable complaint. Denying this does nobody any favours. Telling people who have these issues to stop whingeing and trolling is even less helpful.

 

[Mac6272]

We understand your anger (from the other thread), but the imac is a great machine, you just got unlucky. It's really sad that you're moving on to becoming a PC user, I wouldn't give up the OS because the hardware is awful, if its bad, Apple will fix it, yet again, you got unlucky.

Thank you for reading my post and understanding my issues. I'm not giving up on the OS i got a MBP that i use DVI out when im not gaming but I will never ever again buy an All in one form facotor computer again, I love leopard i just want other people to know what i went through before they buy one an become plagued like i did, don't get me wrong APPLE OSX is awesome!

But their iMac hardware on the other hand is not, i highly suggest a Mac Mini or MBP and if you really want an iMac go for a revision C white iMac or wait for atleast some reviews on the iMacs revision b screen when it comes out.
Right now just isn't the time to buy an iMac IMHO.

Also theres alot of people hating me right now but you guys gotta understand , I Didnt want to leave OSX i fricking love it i evan kept a time machine backup in case i go back to apple on my desktop. but what is one supposed to do in a situation like mine??

I really don't want to drive to an hour away to clean my screen every 2 weeks and the fact is the iMacs should be flawless and all the screen issues need to be resolved, they lost me as a customer and i would say im a good customer after buying an iPhone for 600$, then a iMac for 2400$ and then a Macbook pro for another 2400$ w/ apple care , it sucks i went from a huge apple fan to being really dissappointed with them but none the less i still think OSX is an outstanding OS and do reccommend it, i just advise staying as far away as possible from iMacs for the time being.

 

[heatmiser]

Have you actually read any of the threads? I just went through several links, and every one of them ended up saying the problem resolved itself after the system had been left on for a short while.

Please post a link to one that says it remains an issue if the computer is left on, or that it's recurring.

I'm not saying this is an issue that stays forever and ever; I'm saying that this is an issue, one which should be acknowledged (both by Apple and by her believers), and *fixed*, instead of ignored and denied (both by Apple and by her believers). This shouldn't be happening at all, but if and when it does, the least we could do as consumers is 1.) support each other instead of accusing each other of negligence and irresponsibility, and 2.) insist upon Apple's acknowledgment of the issue, and steps to resolve it. Denying the issue and denigrating its sufferers seems to be the M.O. for too many Apple users, and it only hurts the userbase, while allowing Apple to continue getting by making defective products without accountability. How long will we keep reacting this way whenever a problem arises in Apple hardware?

 

[Mac6272]

Have you actually read any of the threads? I just went through several links, and every one of them ended up saying the problem resolved itself after the system had been left on for a short while.

Please post a link to one that says it remains an issue if the computer is left on, or that it's recurring.

Dont we wish the problem were solved that easily unfortunately that definitely does not fix it, i honestly wish i took a picture of my screen before i returned the last one, they all had the same exact pattern on the same spot and they were all run every day all day, i think thats what actually caused my condensation.

 

[saltyzoo]

Doesn't anybody read those little pieces of paper they put in the packages. The ones that say stuff like "don't operate outside this temp range....."

They aren't just in mac boxes.

 

[skunk]

You cannot be serious. Are you really suggesting that everybody experiencing these problems is operating their computers outside these limits?



By the way, have you read the "little slip"? Have you even seen one? I don't think so, because there is no such thing included. Users have every right to expect their computers to work without problems in a wide range of "normal" conditions. Why can't you just accept that this is a DESIGN WEAKNESS which Apple should address?