iPhones are cars too. That is what he was implying as well as iPads.
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All iPads The iPad will never be a Mac, and the Mac will never be an iPad
- Thread starter Kahnforever
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What the solution is in my opinion is for Apple to create one new operating system that is dynamic: that morphs based on device with specific defined design patterns. UI elements get larger and things go behind defined menu systems on touch, and things get smaller with more shown in a UI on Macs. It would all also be designed around AI from the ground up.
On what basis are making this assertion? The only hard data we have to go by is comparing iPad thermals to M3 MacBook Air thermals and extrapolating.
For me, the biggest issue with iPadOS is its file system (or lack thereof). When the Newton came out, a lot was written about the "soup," what seemed a bizarre way to store and access files. One imagines files floating around in the device's memory like cut carrots in vegetable soup. It seems to me that the iPadOS stores files in a similar way, and perhaps its filing system is even a descendent of the Newton soup. True, there is the Files app, but there is nothing like the Finder. This makes the iPad far harder to use for complex work than the Mac. Of course, the iPad is wonderful for checking email, surfing the web and similar things. If Apple would get rid of the "soup" and implement a rational file system for iPadOS, it would be a lot easier to use it to replace a Mac.
I think the other thing people here fail to grasp (and it’s a generational thing, raised on a classic PC) is that younger kids today come from a SaaS world of iPads and chromebooks. They use google documents to write their papers, not word. There is no file system or system of organizing locally. It’s all cloud based for them, tap and send a link and collaborate.
they‘re not editing in FCP, they’re using CapCut. ipads, pro or not, likely tap into how the younger generation computes. Tacking on a classic file system or multitasking interface will basically make it the system they are not using anymore.
they‘re not editing in FCP, they’re using CapCut. ipads, pro or not, likely tap into how the younger generation computes. Tacking on a classic file system or multitasking interface will basically make it the system they are not using anymore.
Very strange, I use both files and finder to access Onedrive and iCloud and both apps are working very similar. It is a strict hierarchical storage of documents for Onedrive and iCloud. I do not see any soup so please elaborate.
There is nothing to really add. It’s a fact that thermal cooling is required for processors to scale up in performance. That is why Apple has actual real fans that move and blow air in MacBook Pros and products like the Studio.
With the MacBook Air, its sustained processor output can be better than an iPad because: the internals are not sandwiched against the screen panel, providing for better passive cooling on a base that is away from the screen; the Air is thicker so things like heat plates can be larger but most importantly, heat can be better distributed.
The Air and the iPad will be a lot closer in performance given how thin they are and that they are fanless. We’ve seen, however, in benchmark tests that the new Air still throttles a lot and the iPad would be even worse if MacOS was running on it.
MacOS would run perfectly fine on iPad pro for virtually anyone using a MacBook air. You are totally exaggerating how much harder is to run MacOS compared to run iPadOS and some more high end iPad apps, just because you cannot accept that your argument could be "out the window" as you say. Apple Silicon is much more efficient than you make it out to be.
You have zero evidence to support your assertion that MacOS “would run perfectly fine on iPad Pro…”
You ignore the thermal cooling limits of a device that is thin with its internals sandwiched against the screen.
MacOS does not use many resources on its own, it's quite CPU and memory efficient. It utilizes like <15% of the CPU when idle or doing light tasks.
There's literally no physical limitation for the iPad to run macOS just fine. The passive cooling design of the MB Air is not 1000% more efficent than that of an iPad, it's more in the ballpark of 20% better. Especially the new M4 iPads.
Yeah the iPad would struggle a bit more in heavier workloads that are sustained for longer periods, but for most typical usage it'd be fine.
No, I'm saying if you keep trying to make iPadOS more MacOS-like, then just put MacOS on iPads. Having a phone IOS, a desktop OS AND an iPadOS makes no sense. Phone OS and large screen OS for laptops and iPads. Simple. Don't overcomplicate things. Plus less resources having different teams for iPadOS and MacOS.
Good for Apple to design that, but then you are asking developers to design that for their apps too. The Big boys will do it, but what about smaller app developers or hobbyists?
Yeah this here.
I think Steve was right about his post-PC vision and since then, both Gen Z and Gen Alpha have been proving the point basically spot on. And this trend will continue.
Mobile personal computing is the future, sitting behind a PC will become a more antiquated concept year by year. The area where it will remain the longest is the office space, as tech decisions are a bit more conservative there and use cases a bit more niche.
Operating systems like iOS and iPadOS should be in Apple's sights as the primary focus. MacOS last.
I don't think anyone would expect MacBook Pro 16/40 core performance from an iPad. Which is why I advocate for a third class of machine to join existing MacBooks and iPads - the "MacPad". An iPad-like device that can run MacOS. It would be more MacBook Air than MacBook Pro in performance. Business users would love it.
MacOS is in many ways limitless compared to iOS in terms of running multiple processes at once. 50 browser tabs open, FCP exporting a file, importing files from an external HD, YouTube running and much more, ALL AT ONCE. Without an operating system like iOS constantly freezing things and dumping things out of RAM and forcing mostly one application actively running at a time, it will heat up and throttle.
And you have zero evidence to support the contrary. Perfecly fine means that people would be totally fine with it, regarless of any minor difference in performance. You are greatly exagerating the thermal limitations of iPads and the requirements of MacOS, and underestimating the efficiency of Apple Silicon. There have been tons of tablets with all kind of desktop and mobile OSs running with "with internals sandwiched against the screen", including devices much less efficient that Apple Silicon. You sound like the kind of guy that would find even the slightest thermal throttling totally unacceptable (and that if it were for your all Macbooks air would have a fan).
I don't really get what you're trying to say here, if we're talking about a hypothetical scenario where macOS is slapped into the iPad, then the experience would be like 80% similar to macOS running on the MB Air.
The hardware is almost the same and you're grossly overestimating MB Air's passive cooling system compared to iPad's.
I'm well aware that iOS is knee capping the iPad, but that's precisely one of the complaints we're trying to raise here: restricting the M series chip to this extent is lazy, outdated, unnecessary and iPadOS needs to grow up. It's not that it HAS to be that way to keep its thermals in check, that's a massive stretch.
Yes there is evidence to the contrary. You can research thermal tests of MacBooks and iPad Pros using M-Class chips and see how the iPad runs sometimes 2-3 degrees C hotter.
Furthermore, if thermals were not an issue, then why does Apple put fans in its MacBook Pros and desktops…
This isn’t an argument, these are facts. But you’re just arguing for the sake of arguing.
Yep. And I’ve seen iPad Pros only last 2.5 hours on battery running pro Apps. Imagine unleashing MacOS that will just eat up all its RAM straight up with nothing running and allow the user to run multiple pro Apps at once and do a zillion things at once. It will overheat, grind to a halt, and be unusable.
While I think some executives have indicated that they want to sell both devices I also think there is a third possible reason.
Lock down.
Apple doesn’t want to open up the iPad, and in the EU they even tried to claim iPadOS was distinct enough from iOS to not include it in the DMA.
Adding macOS support to iPad (even through a VM) would mean people could load anything they want, which would undermine their control and their monetization of every dollar that flows through iPadOS.
Games are another area where the battery life can be absolutely destroyed.
Your point is totally valid, new generations will chose iPad because it’s resemblance to phone OS. PC was designed by nerds for nerds and apart from GUI and USB-C, nothing much has happened. Only smaller and faster computers but with the same old design paradigm. iPhone and iPad challenged the paradigm and the most used ‘computer’ today on the planet is an Android mobile phone.
Age? My first exposure to a computer was in the 80:th.
Are you able to say that for the new iPad Pros that have a heatsink built into them that terminates in copper on the back logo?
If iPads are so incapable of sustained performance then how does this game, a direct port from desktop, run so well? This is a no-compromises game.
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