Awesome -- Do you have a sister? Is she single?
LOL. Yes, two, and yes they are...but they didn't get the techno-geek gene, sorry.
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The MacBook Air of DSLR cameras?
- Thread starter Phrasikleia
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LOL. Yes, two, and yes they are...but they didn't get the techno-geek gene, sorry.
Sweet Pancake arrived!!
Whooopppeee... My Olympus E-420 WITH Zuiko Pancake Lens arrived this morning.
Just charged the battery, inserted in the lens, CS card and attached the neck-strap. Cannot comment on the IQ at the moment (will probably go out this afternoon for a photoshoot -- the sun is casting a warm haze over Japan) but just holding it in my hands feels great. I can even hold the camera steady with my right hand without having to hold the lens with my left hand at all because the lens is so light -- maybe new ways to take quick snap-shots are on the horizon.
What I dont like is the lens cap for the Pancake. It is quite thin and to screw it on and off requires delicate fingers. Im considering getting a protector (or UV) for it instead of having to do this, but I am not sure if lens protectors affects image quality.
Anyway, once I have loaded the Olympus software and can convert the RAW files to jpegs, I will probably show some images on the Olympus DSLR forum in Dpreview (I have just joined).
Whooopppeee... My Olympus E-420 WITH Zuiko Pancake Lens arrived this morning.
Just charged the battery, inserted in the lens, CS card and attached the neck-strap. Cannot comment on the IQ at the moment (will probably go out this afternoon for a photoshoot -- the sun is casting a warm haze over Japan) but just holding it in my hands feels great. I can even hold the camera steady with my right hand without having to hold the lens with my left hand at all because the lens is so light -- maybe new ways to take quick snap-shots are on the horizon.
What I dont like is the lens cap for the Pancake. It is quite thin and to screw it on and off requires delicate fingers. Im considering getting a protector (or UV) for it instead of having to do this, but I am not sure if lens protectors affects image quality.
Anyway, once I have loaded the Olympus software and can convert the RAW files to jpegs, I will probably show some images on the Olympus DSLR forum in Dpreview (I have just joined).
Filters take away detail, I'm trying to recall, but I'm not sure if the 30 lines/mm figure that pops into my head is it or not. I'd get a plain glass filter before I got a UV/Skylight for digital. B+W makes some multicoated plain glass filters that'd be on the top of my list.
Its very late here is Japan, so here is just a teaser pic...
Hi all,
I did a full days photo shoot with my E420/Pancake of where I live, of my daughter who just woke up from her sleep and my journey to Tokyo. Got quite a variety of images to show, but it is time for my bedtime so I will just show my favourite one of all. Will do a more extensive comment tomorrow with more pics, but all I can say at the moment is that I had so much fun today and am pretty impressed with the E420 so far.
My fave pic is (naturally) of my baby daughter.
Hi all,
I did a full days photo shoot with my E420/Pancake of where I live, of my daughter who just woke up from her sleep and my journey to Tokyo. Got quite a variety of images to show, but it is time for my bedtime so I will just show my favourite one of all. Will do a more extensive comment tomorrow with more pics, but all I can say at the moment is that I had so much fun today and am pretty impressed with the E420 so far.
My fave pic is (naturally) of my baby daughter.
Attachments
Hi all,
I did a full days photo shoot with my E420/Pancake of where I live, of my daughter who just woke up from her sleep and my journey to Tokyo. Got quite a variety of images to show, but it is time for my bedtime so I will just show my favourite one of all. Will do a more extensive comment tomorrow with more pics, but all I can say at the moment is that I had so much fun today and am pretty impressed with the E420 so far.
My fave pic is (naturally) of my baby daughter.
Thanks for the update and the pic. I look forward to seeing more. Any chance you take requests? I'd love to know how that camera and lens perform handheld in relatively low light and with low ISO.
Some low-light photos (I think...)
Can you please specify more clearly what you mean by ‘low light’ conditions?
I, myself, tend to avoid using in-camera flash whenever possible as it tends to produce artificial looking photos. Plus, I also tend to avoid high ISO range (800-1600) as from my general experience of using digital cameras it produces excessive noise. Therefore, in ‘low light’ conditions like indoors, I like to avoid using flash but take the risk of having less sharp but more natural looking images.
With the following images (from my first day’s shooting) I stuck with Aperture Mode with settings at f2.8 (while the camera automatically selected the ISO speed) with no-flash. Condtions ranged from indoor (disused dim factory area at 4pm with no incandescent lighting and Starbucks with lots of incandescent lighting around 6pm) to walking home at night (but with object lighting from within). The camera automatically chose an ISO rating between 100 to 400 max, so that falls within your ‘low ISO’ request. All images have had their ‘Levels’ adjusted where necessary.
It is very difficult for me to conclude whether the E420 with Pancake is a great performer in ‘low light’ and in ‘low ISO’. I do not have a wealth of experience to be able to compare it with other DSLRs and make a worthwhile comment. I suggest you wait until the technical reviews come out to come to a conclusion. There is also the benefit of Image Stabilisation that comes with the E510 (or soon E520) so that model may benefit you more if you are taking more low-light photography, but, of course, you lose some weight benefits of the E420.
To conclude, I think the Pancake was designed to be for general use ‘on-the-go’ and I think it succeeds in that role. There are of course more specialist Zuiko lenses that will no doubt take sharper and better images (esp. in low-light), but none of them are as light and compact as this lens. I read somewhere that said this Pancake’s IQ is similar standard to a kit lens, and I would agree with that. But the feeling is fantastic to have a full-capability DSLR in my hands but with such a small/light lens attached. And once I get to understand the camera more and the best settings, I can see myself improving upon the images that I take from this lens.
Can you please specify more clearly what you mean by ‘low light’ conditions?
I, myself, tend to avoid using in-camera flash whenever possible as it tends to produce artificial looking photos. Plus, I also tend to avoid high ISO range (800-1600) as from my general experience of using digital cameras it produces excessive noise. Therefore, in ‘low light’ conditions like indoors, I like to avoid using flash but take the risk of having less sharp but more natural looking images.
With the following images (from my first day’s shooting) I stuck with Aperture Mode with settings at f2.8 (while the camera automatically selected the ISO speed) with no-flash. Condtions ranged from indoor (disused dim factory area at 4pm with no incandescent lighting and Starbucks with lots of incandescent lighting around 6pm) to walking home at night (but with object lighting from within). The camera automatically chose an ISO rating between 100 to 400 max, so that falls within your ‘low ISO’ request. All images have had their ‘Levels’ adjusted where necessary.
It is very difficult for me to conclude whether the E420 with Pancake is a great performer in ‘low light’ and in ‘low ISO’. I do not have a wealth of experience to be able to compare it with other DSLRs and make a worthwhile comment. I suggest you wait until the technical reviews come out to come to a conclusion. There is also the benefit of Image Stabilisation that comes with the E510 (or soon E520) so that model may benefit you more if you are taking more low-light photography, but, of course, you lose some weight benefits of the E420.
To conclude, I think the Pancake was designed to be for general use ‘on-the-go’ and I think it succeeds in that role. There are of course more specialist Zuiko lenses that will no doubt take sharper and better images (esp. in low-light), but none of them are as light and compact as this lens. I read somewhere that said this Pancake’s IQ is similar standard to a kit lens, and I would agree with that. But the feeling is fantastic to have a full-capability DSLR in my hands but with such a small/light lens attached. And once I get to understand the camera more and the best settings, I can see myself improving upon the images that I take from this lens.
Attachments
I shoot a lot of sculpture in museums, so by "low light" I mean dimly lit interiors. I think the photos you included here are sufficient evidence that the e-420 is a good performer. They also show that you have a great eye for photography.
It's interesting that you should mention the e-510 because I held one for the first time today. I went back and forth between that one, the Canon XT, and the e-410. I really fell for the e-510. It's so beautifully balanced with the generous grip that contains most of the camera's weight. It was the clear winner in ergonomics. I realize that the e-420 has an improved grip, so I really need to get my hands on one, but I can say the e-410 felt horribly uncomfortable in my average-sized female hands.
As for the rumored e-520, well, even if it gets announced sometime soon, it probably won't be released before I go abroad for the summer (late May), and even if it did it would surely exceed my budget.
Here are some more photos from the Olympus E420/Pancake... enjoy.
By the way, your shots show really terrific bokeh. I want that lens!
Some more E420/Pancake photos (non low-light)
Haha... thanks for the complement. I am only a beginner when it comes to DSLR photography, but my graphic design compositional skills does come in handy! Even though I have had only just one photo-session, I am very happy with my choice so far.
You know, the E420 has a small textured ridge for your finger to clasp. Yesterday, I realised it was very comfortable to hold with the pancake combo. I didn’t feel I needed a full-hand grip to hold the camera firm as it felt so light already I could balance it with just my middle finger on that ridge and palm. The weight of the lens has a great influence, so it is better to try out the body with a variety of lenses.
Haha... sold already?! Well, I wanted to test out the ‘bokeh’ with the pancake lens by using only f2.8 aperture throughout yesterday. Of course, the bokeh is not as good as some shots I have seen from other Zuiko lenses (I have the Zuiko 50mm f2.0 in mind here). If you look carefully, some photos has a kind of double-blur bokeh effect rather than really ‘creamy smooth’ depending on the distance between object and background. But still, considering the pancake is only a standard-rated lens, it can produce good images with the major benefit of being the lightest and compact of all Zuiko lenses. Because of this, I think that this lens will be very popular indeed and useful for many situations.
Also, what impressed me about the Olympus camera is how natural the colours of the photos are.
Here are a few non low-light photos (I included a sky shot where the details of the subtle clouds were picked up).
I think the photos you included here are sufficient evidence that the e-420 is a good performer. They also show that you have a great eye for photography.
Haha... thanks for the complement. I am only a beginner when it comes to DSLR photography, but my graphic design compositional skills does come in handy! Even though I have had only just one photo-session, I am very happy with my choice so far.
You know, the E420 has a small textured ridge for your finger to clasp. Yesterday, I realised it was very comfortable to hold with the pancake combo. I didn’t feel I needed a full-hand grip to hold the camera firm as it felt so light already I could balance it with just my middle finger on that ridge and palm. The weight of the lens has a great influence, so it is better to try out the body with a variety of lenses.
Haha... sold already?! Well, I wanted to test out the ‘bokeh’ with the pancake lens by using only f2.8 aperture throughout yesterday. Of course, the bokeh is not as good as some shots I have seen from other Zuiko lenses (I have the Zuiko 50mm f2.0 in mind here). If you look carefully, some photos has a kind of double-blur bokeh effect rather than really ‘creamy smooth’ depending on the distance between object and background. But still, considering the pancake is only a standard-rated lens, it can produce good images with the major benefit of being the lightest and compact of all Zuiko lenses. Because of this, I think that this lens will be very popular indeed and useful for many situations.
Also, what impressed me about the Olympus camera is how natural the colours of the photos are.
Here are a few non low-light photos (I included a sky shot where the details of the subtle clouds were picked up).
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manual control
tony-in-japan
Nice pics and I agree with the comments - nice eye.
Could I ask you to comment on the controls of the E420? I like to shoot manually, and I'd be grateful to you for more information on how the E420 is set up for this.
Do you have to delve into menus to change ISO, aperture and shutter speed? Or are these controls straight to hand via buttons/dial?
Thanks.
tony-in-japan
Nice pics and I agree with the comments - nice eye.
Could I ask you to comment on the controls of the E420? I like to shoot manually, and I'd be grateful to you for more information on how the E420 is set up for this.
Do you have to delve into menus to change ISO, aperture and shutter speed? Or are these controls straight to hand via buttons/dial?
Thanks.
It does not have buttons/dials to control ISO, aperture or shutter speed.
What you have is all the details displayed on the LCD (2.7" so it is quite big) and you access this screen via arrow buttons. Once you are highlighted on what you want to change, you use a click-dial to scroll through your options (i.e. left for lower ISO or click-dial to the right to up the ISO).
I really like this system as you can see all your current settings at once and it is quite intuitive to quickly change settings once you get used to it.
With digital sensors, you lose about a stop's worth of noise with 4/3rds compared to APS-C, which is about a stop off 35mm[1]. In real-world terms, the delta is probably closer to 1.5 stops total difference. Each stop is half or twice as much light, depending on the direction. Depending on the type and pattern of noise, you may be able to gain about half a stop of that back with noise reduction software, so APS-C should give you the same noise levels as 4/3rds in half as much light. Depending on how often you shoot in low light, and how you intend to use the results, that could be significant- especially if you don't have enough access to be able to use a tripod to offset the lack of light.
[1] Assuming the same number of megapixels for each format and the same generation of sensor. Larger photosites (less MP) mean less noise, and the limits are of the physics involved.
I'd add to that that CCD's of the same generation and format will generally be lower noise than comparable CMOS sensors. Don't know if Olympus uses both but in theory, CCD has traditionally held a significant advantage in heat dissipation efficiency, as well as a slight advantage in dynamic range. But CCD's are also a lot slower than CMOS sensors, which is why most manufacturers are transitioning to CMOS. Nikon's D200 was pushing the limits of CCD frame rate at 5 frames per second. In the faster D300 they had to go to CMOS to get additional performance in that category, luckily for them, technology has improved to the point that todays CMOS sensors are able to deliver very clean high ISO images too.
SLC
Just created a Flickr account with Pancake Lens photos
Just for those who wanted to see more photos of the Olympus E-420 and Pancake Lens combo, I created a Flickr account and uploaded selected photos from my two photoshoots.
Enjoy!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/26154011@N07
Just for those who wanted to see more photos of the Olympus E-420 and Pancake Lens combo, I created a Flickr account and uploaded selected photos from my two photoshoots.
Enjoy!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/26154011@N07
I figured I should report back on what I ultimately decided to do, for what it's worth to anyone in the same boat.
Ergonomics caused me to rule out Pentax right away: as much as there is to like about Pentax, I have tried to wield one of their hefty camera bodies (my husband's K100D) and simply find it to be too much of a strain on my wrist and neck.
Ergonomics likewise caused me to rule out the Oly e-420, once I got my hands on one; that tiny grip just would not be comfortable for me if I had to use it for hours on end. I posted here earlier that I really liked the feel of the Oly e-510 in my hand. It's a very well balanced camera with a generous grip. However, I couldn't justify investing in the 4/3 system merely because of one well designed camera body. The 4/3 system's particular weaknesses lie exactly in the areas where I need strengths (good selection of wide/normal prime lenses, low light performance, high dynamic range, minimal highlight clipping).
I had to rule Nikon out because their entry-level cameras cannot autofocus the wide/normal prime lenses I want to use.
So the only cameras left that had the lens offerings, image quality strengths, and favorable ergonomics were the entry-level Canons--hence the new XSi now sitting beside me as I write this post. Canon just ticked all the right boxes for my particular needs. In the end I made a decision similar to the one I made with my laptop (see first post), and my own answer to my initial question--the subject of this thread--turned out to be "yes".
Ergonomics caused me to rule out Pentax right away: as much as there is to like about Pentax, I have tried to wield one of their hefty camera bodies (my husband's K100D) and simply find it to be too much of a strain on my wrist and neck.
Ergonomics likewise caused me to rule out the Oly e-420, once I got my hands on one; that tiny grip just would not be comfortable for me if I had to use it for hours on end. I posted here earlier that I really liked the feel of the Oly e-510 in my hand. It's a very well balanced camera with a generous grip. However, I couldn't justify investing in the 4/3 system merely because of one well designed camera body. The 4/3 system's particular weaknesses lie exactly in the areas where I need strengths (good selection of wide/normal prime lenses, low light performance, high dynamic range, minimal highlight clipping).
I had to rule Nikon out because their entry-level cameras cannot autofocus the wide/normal prime lenses I want to use.
So the only cameras left that had the lens offerings, image quality strengths, and favorable ergonomics were the entry-level Canons--hence the new XSi now sitting beside me as I write this post. Canon just ticked all the right boxes for my particular needs. In the end I made a decision similar to the one I made with my laptop (see first post), and my own answer to my initial question--the subject of this thread--turned out to be "yes".
You won't like this answer but I have to say my opinion on this one anyway...
The MacBook Air of DSLR cameras in the Canon G9.
Wait a second thats a compact - correct
The Canon G9 can do almost everything the DSLRs such as the Canon 40D or Nikon D80 can do, yes it can't change lenses but it is small and compact and the most fully featured compact digital ever made.
The MacBook Air can do almost everything the Portable Computer such as the MacBook Pro can do, yes it doesn't have a superdrive in-built or a replaceable battery but it is small and comact and the most fully featured compact Mac ever made.
Point made.
The MacBook Air of DSLR cameras in the Canon G9.
Wait a second thats a compact - correct
The Canon G9 can do almost everything the DSLRs such as the Canon 40D or Nikon D80 can do, yes it can't change lenses but it is small and compact and the most fully featured compact digital ever made.
The MacBook Air can do almost everything the Portable Computer such as the MacBook Pro can do, yes it doesn't have a superdrive in-built or a replaceable battery but it is small and comact and the most fully featured compact Mac ever made.
Point made.
So the only cameras left that had the lens offerings, image quality strengths, and favorable ergonomics were the entry-level Canons--hence the new XSi now sitting beside me as I write this post. Canon just ticked all the right boxes for my particular needs. In the end I made a decision similar to the one I made with my laptop (see first post), and my own answer to my initial question--the subject of this thread--turned out to be "yes".
Sounds like a rational choice, please let us know how the images turn out.
Kinda disagree...
If you are discounting the ability to change lens but with IQ on par with DSLRs, I think The Macbook Air of DSLR cameras is probably the recently released Sigma DP1. For all its flaws (slow handling/AF) it has a DSLR sized sensor that produces amazing images and is even more compact than the G9. If it wasnt for the slow user experience (just like Macbook Airs slower CPU power) I would have got one. The Sigma DP2 would be tempting but I already have my E-420 now which I love.
On a note about the G9, I heard a rumour that Canon will be releasing a G10 this year but with a DSLR sized sensor? Just a rumour or a realistic possibility?
If you are discounting the ability to change lens but with IQ on par with DSLRs, I think The Macbook Air of DSLR cameras is probably the recently released Sigma DP1. For all its flaws (slow handling/AF) it has a DSLR sized sensor that produces amazing images and is even more compact than the G9. If it wasnt for the slow user experience (just like Macbook Airs slower CPU power) I would have got one. The Sigma DP2 would be tempting but I already have my E-420 now which I love.
On a note about the G9, I heard a rumour that Canon will be releasing a G10 this year but with a DSLR sized sensor? Just a rumour or a realistic possibility?
One can only hope this will happen as I found the G9 to be very unsatisfactory during use.
I ahve a Pentax K10 camera, and I really love it, is way better constructed than the Canon Xti or the cheap nikons (d40-50, even de d80). Is a heavy camera, but is water sealed, alloy body, no plastic. You should definetly go for the pentax (maybe the K20d, what a great super machine). Ok the camera is heavy but I have shot continously for hours, and I dont have a big hand or arm.
Considering you have lenses already, go for it, you will not regret it. Look the net, the pentax dslr have Superb reviews.
Considering you have lenses already, go for it, you will not regret it. Look the net, the pentax dslr have Superb reviews.