Eyeing one of the higher variants myself, I do hope that the price increase across the portfolio will be at least linear.
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The new Mac mini is almost certainly coming
- Thread starter GabrieleR
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Have a great new year y’all!
Whatever new mini they eventually release — the next one after it won’t be released shortly thereafter. It’ll be a looong time like it always is for the mini.
Bearing in mind that we can't exactly call the Mac mini a headless MacBook Pro 13" (previous Intel generation, no touch bar), let's not forget that the starting price there was $1299 for pitiful amounts of SSD whereas a high spec mini (with 8Gb RAM/512Gb SSD, similar to the Intel MBP) is currently $1099. The CPUs are not the same and Apple accept a smaller profit margin on the Mini anyway. Removing all the listed components for a $1000 price drop considering where they priced the M1 is a bit optimistic.
My expected pricing for M1 Pro Mini has been published elsewhere, but I felt it was a significant boost over the price of the remaining Intel Mini partly based on the price increase of the 14" MacBook Pro over the previous 13" Touch Bar Intel model.
To add value to the M1 Pro/Max/Duo headless machine I would see it being delayed until the Mac Pro is launched - and serving as a base model on that machine - rather than seeing it as a Mac mini top SKU. Especially if the thinner chassis rumours are being followed through on for the M2 CPU.
I took a stab earlier in the year at how a M1 pro/max mini would be priced here you may be interested in. It’s my assumption the M1 Pro mini will take the product slot the current i5 model has just how the M1 mini took over the i3 slot.
My assumption is the baseline M1 Pro mini will start at $1,299 as it will start with 16GB of ram. You can check out my table I made here:
I hope you’re right. I think my concern is it took almost a year from M1 to M1 Pro/Mac and computationally, the Mac Pro is hugely more complex to cater for. The lithography for manufacturing processors is likely to be big complication at each jump.
Given the financial side, I could see the M2 releases taking priority over the iMac Pro/Mac pro end. However the tech for the larger iMac and powerful Mac mini replacement are already available so I’m keeping everything crossed.
Also, Happy 2022 everyone! 2021 was a complete disaster for me personally so I’m hoping for a calmer year at least, hopefully with a new Mac mini
Man I hope we'll hear some rumours this January...
It felt so exciting a few months ago, when there were quite a few rumours on the high end mac mini.
The Mini is literally the only mystery in the Apple 2022 lineup; we pretty much know when the other macs will come in 2022, but the mini could come at any time...
It felt so exciting a few months ago, when there were quite a few rumours on the high end mac mini.
The Mini is literally the only mystery in the Apple 2022 lineup; we pretty much know when the other macs will come in 2022, but the mini could come at any time...
Rumors suggested the delay was due to supply constraints - like miniLED. One of the forum members here got word that the M1 Pro/Max chips were done ~January of 21’ which would corroborate with the rumors these chips were originally going to be announced at WWDC. Seeing as the chips rumored for the Mac Pro are just multiple M1 Max chips, it’s not unreasonable to think they have figured out a solution a year after the Max chips were done.
To bring this back to the Mac mini (as this is a Mac mini thread), I believe supply constraints (not chip shortages but lack of actual common parts, and restricted global shipping) are a factor in why we didn’t see a Mac mini update this fall. Apple rightfully was worried about the impending issues within the industry and likely choose to focus on the notebooks going into the holidays (which account for ~70% of Mac sales based on figures from a few years ago). My guess is announcing a mini in March is the most likely - as Apple in the last decade as never held an event earlier than March, and this would give them 3 months of lead time to make sure their supply chains are where they should be and recover after the holiday season.
I don’t think we really know when any macs will come - both the iMac and Mac Pro are also uncertain as well. I think the iMac probably has the most footing in the rumor mill right now due to the display rumors (and it being a more flashier product). But it’s good to remember there were zero rumors of a mini before the M1 mini event so lack of rumors doesn’t mean much.
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Ah that’s interesting, I’d not been paying that much attention to rumours prior to the MacBook Pro event.
Although I’m not sure about the multiple M1 Max chips part, my processor manufacturing knowledge isn’t great, but I didn’t think they were doing chiplets on the existing M1 max and they were monoliths. It would be interesting to see how far they can push the chip fabric and memory bandwidths while maintaining IO and synchronisation. I believe AMD use an IO die to push their chip fabric further.
Apologies if this is too off topic.
That seems likely now. I imagine it’ll be some kind of “pro” event with big boy iMac, Mac mini “pro” and maybe iPad Pro and airpod pro.
I’ll be interested to see how they split the mini specs on the website when the M2 comes out as it will look a little strange having the new processor family being the budget model as it’s been the other way around with intel and AMD where the beefy chips tend to arrive first.
I'd be surprised to see the iPads and Mac mini and iMac in the same event.
M1 Pro and M1 Max are much, much beefier than M2 will be.
For marketing simplicity Apple will want to get all M1 models out of the way before starting afresh with the M2 in October 2022.
It's my assumption that the CPUs are ready, it's the manufacturing/design side that's been delayed.
As per all the news roundups it makes sense to complete the ARM transition by WWDC 2022 (June) by dropping the Mac Pro in as the headline hardware announcement. This would mark 2 years since the M1 Mini was announced and would complete the transition nicely.
This Mac Pro might end up replacing the upper SKU Mac mini too in my opinion leaving the way clear for the current M1 Mac mini to be replaced by a super-thin M2 model in October.
The 27" iMac (Pro) might also get aired at WWDC as well - we've already potentially seen the design and it makes sense from a benchmarking basis for the rest of the desktops to arrive at the same time as potentially that's when the M1 Max Duo/Quad CPUs would drop.
We would then see an Intel refresh for the Mac Pro to keep the professionals who don't want to worry about compatibility issues for a bit happy (probably as a press release).
It then leaves any March event clear for iOS devices such as the iPad Air to get the A15 CPU, New 2022 iPhone SE (with A15), is it high time for a new iPod touch?
This is an interesting idea that I would actually love to see. The Mac Pro cube replacing the high-end mini. Though I have a hard time seeing Apple charge $1,299 for a Mac Pro cube (if this is to replace the current i5 mini SKU) and I don’t think an M1 Pro/Max chip warrants that enclosure. Either way, as long as it has an M1 Max chip that can run at full loads without thermal throttling, my wallet will be ready.
Here’s my prediction:
Spring Event:
• 27” iMac
• 24” & 27” Consumer displays
• High-end Mac mini (maybe)
WWDC Event:
• Mac Pro
• iMac Pro
• ProDisplay XDR
They also can do two events in the Spring if they have enough products. I just think it would be smart for Apple to release the iMac and displays sooner than June, and I really hope a new Mac mini as well.
The ASi Mac Pro (Cube) should be dual or quad SoCs, not diluted down with single SoCs; and a chassis designed for dual and quad M1 Max SoCs is total overkill for a single M1 Max, not to mention the extra cost...
I could see the Mac mini becoming a two chassis lineup; a smaller variant for the Mn-series SoCs, and the current variant (or maybe a taller variant...?) for the Mn Pro/Max-series SoCs...
I've been saying that a refreshed 2019 Mac Pro would be a press release for awhile, I would expect right before WWDC 2022...
Yup, an ASi Mac Pro (Cube) chassis is overkill for a Mac mini, and it wouldn't really be a mini anymore either...!
M1 Max Mac mini in Spring 2022 please...!
I think people should remember that the Cube was never designed to be a fully upgradable machine. It was upgradable because it had modular parts, and it even had a fan bracket if you wanted to add a fan, but the main point of the machine was to be a self-contained machine with external peripherals for expansion...
...just like the Mac mini. To put it another way, the Cube was upgradable just like the Mac mini has been upgradable but neither is intended to be truly upgradable like the Mac Pro.
Furthermore, even M1 Max doesn't actually need a Cube design for thermals, and increasing the size of the machine would cost Apple more, and would also cost us more. In that context, I don't expect to see a Mac Pro light. I expect to see a re-designed Mac mini, but it will be a design shared with the M2 Mac mini, the latter appearing much later. I would guess the main differences between the M1 Pro/Max and M2 minis would be the colour, CTO upgrade options, and the port selection.
...just like the Mac mini. To put it another way, the Cube was upgradable just like the Mac mini has been upgradable but neither is intended to be truly upgradable like the Mac Pro.
Furthermore, even M1 Max doesn't actually need a Cube design for thermals, and increasing the size of the machine would cost Apple more, and would also cost us more. In that context, I don't expect to see a Mac Pro light. I expect to see a re-designed Mac mini, but it will be a design shared with the M2 Mac mini, the latter appearing much later. I would guess the main differences between the M1 Pro/Max and M2 minis would be the colour, CTO upgrade options, and the port selection.
None of the ASi Macs (laptops or desktops) are upgradable anymore; which is a fact that should make the Mac mini much much more appealing to Mac users, because once you need to upgrade the SoC in your Mac (aka buy a new machine), you are shelving your expensive display if you have bought an iMac or laptop...
Hopefully the iMacs will gain Target Display Mode again...?
Rumors have a smaller chassis for the new M2 Mac mini, which I would think is insufficient for the M1 Pro/Max SoCs...
As I said above, the Mac mini lineup may go to a two chassis position...
Oh yeah, I have no delusions that m2 will be incremental like any generational shift between intel skus… just without the endless delays and spiralling TDP. It’s the “explain it to grandpa” issue where they see a bigger number and don’t understand why it’s less performant, for the layman it’s not that clear. For example an 8th gen i7 may be more performant than a 12th gen i3 but it’s not easy to distinguish for non-techies.
I think this would solve the issue above, but I don’t see it scaling for production. The chassis would have to be tiny for it to be an issue, these are in laptops already. The height gives the engineers a lot more to play with for thermals compared to a laptop, and if the psu goes external then they could achieve a lot in something between the current design and Apple TV size, say 5x5”. (Apple TV is 3.9, Mac mini is 7.7”). The current M1 mini is almost embarrassingly empty. The M1 Max is only a 40w component, which is crazily efficient, the current high end intel option (8700b) is 68w.
Looking at the ifixit images for the internals of the MacBook Pro, the cooling is taking up a huge part of the volume. The board itself isn’t very big at all from the looks of it. From the layout of the other components, I think it’s safe to assume nothing is underneath them either.
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Maybe I missed it but I don't recall seeing a respected leaker indicate how much smaller the chassis would actually be. I had thought most of this was just from general consensus, because we already know the M1 Mac mini is mostly just empty space internally. I could be wrong though.
So, even if it does get smaller, it's a matter of degree. I don't see it going to Apple TV size, and the truth of the matter is that the Mac mini isn't actually that small, once you compare the actual dimensions to existing Apple Silicon products. The thing is 19.7 x 19.7 x 3.6 cm or about 1.4 L. Even if you shave some of that off because of the corners and part of the base, that ends up being about 1.3 L.
The 14" MacBook Pro is 31.26 x 22.12 x 1.55 cm = 1.07 L. To put it another way, the M1 Mac mini with max 16 GB RAM and 2 TB storage is already about 20-25% larger than the 14" M1 Max MacBook Pro with max 64 GB RAM and 8 TB storage, and the Mac mini doesn't even have a screen, keyboard, trackpad, or battery.
IOW, a new Mac mini could easily lose one-third of the internal volume compared to the current M1 model and still house the M1 Max no problem.
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You know, this is one reason why I’m so excited for this year.
With the notebooks, and even the iMac to a degree - we already sort of knew what we were getting. It’s only minor changes (bezels, thickness, notch) but at the end of the day there’s only so many things you can do with a laptop form factor. With the Mac mini and the Mac Pro - they really could do so many things here. The form factor is less set in stone.
Is it a cube? Is it a pancake? Is it taller? Thinner? Narrower? Square? Round? Will it have holes? Different chassis sizes or variants?
There are the Prosser renders, which look to be the same footprint, but a shorter height...
They also do not have a real proper airflow thought out, so more "pretty render" than functional design...
If you look at the 2018 Mac mini teardown, then the M1 Mac mini teardown, and then the M1 Pro / Max MacBook Pro teardowns...
The Intel mini is pretty full, the M1 mini is not; but the M1 Pro/Max in the MBPs is larger, so the room within the current mini chassis would seem appropriate for the higher powered SoCs...
Over on a Small Form Factor forum I frequent, we have an ongoing no-prize competition, Performance Per Liter...
Chassis volume is determined by a bounding box, no "shrinkwrapping", so the rounded corners & spaces around the "bottom circle / access hatch" would not be subtracted from the overall volume calculation...
I really don't think so, again, look at the assorted teardown videos...
Which is why I think there might be two Mac mini chassis designs going forward; the smaller / thinner model for the Mn-series SoCs, and the current model for the Mn Pro/Max-series SoCs...
I don't take stock in much Prosser says. Anyhow, those renders (which aren't really his actually) don't even make sense, as you said.
OK. We'll just have to agree to disagree. I've looked at the teardowns already and what's the most obvious is that the M1 Mac mini is basically mostly just empty space. In fact, IMO the M1 non-Pro could easily take up less than half the current volume of the Mac mini, no problem.
I'd be quite surprised to see two different chassis designs. I personally think there will be just one, designed to the specs of the higher end SoC, meaning that if you get an M2, it's gonna stay completely silent for the vast majority of the usage, but the M1 Pro/Max may not be completely silent under heavy load... sort of like how the high end MacBook Pros behave.
The problem with that line of thought is that the entire point with the M1Pro/Max are those heavy loads - otherwise you’d buy the cheaper and in other cases equally performant M1.
So if you buy a higher performance Mini, of course you want it to be silent when you use it for what you bought it for.
That’s difficult to achieve in a laptop, but trivial for a stationary computer at those power draws.
Doesn't matter. Apple doesn't have a strong incentive to make a Mac mini a "better" machine than a MacBook Pro.
The Mac Mini is Apple’s red headed stepchild. The MacBook Pros and the larger screen iMacs sit at the head of Apple’s table.
The MacBook Pro is in a seperate league from any other Mac . But at the end of the day the iPhone and iPad are the golden goose.
Apple doesn't have a strong incentive to make the mac mini "worse" than the MacBook Pro either. If the M1 Max mac mini was marginally better in full sustained loads, it's not like a bunch of MacBook Pro users are suddenly going to buy a mini. You likely got the notebook or a desktop because of the form factor.
Also as a side note and something related to the mac mini discussion, I think Apples new rumored consumer displays are going to be a perfect companion to a mac mini. Some people here and on reddit were saying Apple is never going to make a rumored 24" display at $999 because "Then people would just buy a mini and not the iMac" but when you actually sit down and do the math:
8-core M1 iMac - $1,499
Total: $1,499
- Or -
8-core M1 mini - $699
24" Apple Display - $999
Magic Keyboard - $149
Magic Mouse - $79
Total: $1,926
Apple makes an extra $427 if the consumer goes with a Mac mini + 24" display option, and even more if they go with the 27" option. Then it gives consumers options. Buy the cheaper all-in-one or buy the more expensive mini + display.