UPS for Mac Pro? Apple tech suggests not

[wildmac]

If I can't find a reasonably priced pure sine wave UPS with auto outlets, I may just forget the UPS and get one of these smart power bars...

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006PUDQK...TF8&colid=3U0TODJ4J6PTB&coliid=I2LD1JGAL26NNX

And I'm looking at one of these..

http://www.amazon.com/TRIPP-AV1210S...id=1394234888&sr=1-6&keywords=surge+protector

My older APC and Belkin surge protectors are several years old, likely candidates for replacement.

 

[Average Pro]

Smart UPS

Been using a 1000XL Smart UPS (APC) since 2005. All 6 outlets are utilized, one of which splits off to 4 additional plug-ins.

Like everything else in life, you can go for the cheap-o version or spend the money for quality. To date, I have never had a power related problem with my computers or monitors. The only maintenance I've done was to get new batteries approximately 1 year ago. This thing is heavy, but makes a good footrest.

As far as software with the unit - could care less. What I really enjoyed was knowing what areas have voltage fluctuations. For example, whenever my house lights would fade, the box would chirp (letting me know there was a fluctuation). However, in different states, it would chirp regularly but the house lights would not fade. That was the only place I extracted the data from the box and was surprised to see how much the power fluctuated.

 

[wildmac]

Another side note here.. the larger UPS'es do draw quite a bit of power on their own. If you are looking to cut down your power bill, they are not going to help you.

 

[AidenShaw]

A UPS with a sinusoidal output would be preferable to one with a trapezoidal output, due to the high-frequency components of the latter, ....

For many years we sold square wave UPS units along with Dell computers, which worked fine together.

Most "non pure sine wave" consumer UPS use a "stepped sine wave", which is like a sine wave with severe jaggies.

If I can't find a reasonably priced pure sine wave UPS with auto outlets, I may just forget the UPS and get one of these smart power bars...

Get the best of both worlds - plug the smart power bar into a sine wave UPS.

(Don't plug a surge protector into a stepped sine wave UPS though - the surge protector will consider the high frequency components of the input to be "spikes" that should be shorted to ground. It won't hurt anything, but your battery runtime will be shortened.)

 

[Sun Baked]

Seems decent. No real issues in the reviews.

Side note.. a LOT of complaints in comments on the APC products about trying to get damage claims and replacements. APC can guarantee all they want, but if you have to fight with a call center in the Phillipines, that's a problem, and those claims ring hollow.

However, on another note, since APC recalled their 7 and 8 series surge protectors made for a decade ... i was surprised it only took them a few weeks to deliver a replacement.

If you have any old APC 7 or 8 series surge protectors made before 2003, you might want to check to see if it was recalled.

http://recall.apc.com/en

Don't worry only 700 of them have overheated and melted and cause a couple million in damages soo far ...

 

[Kevin808]

Anyone have any thoughts / theories on my original question as to weather or not a UPS provides extra juice when needed to high power draw setups? Perhaps with the battery (and capacitors?) it would deliver the additional power needed on startup?

I am still wondering weather or not it will help with my 27" CD's weak startup where the monitor is detected, USB works, mic works, etc. But the LCD itself will sometimes not come on.

Thanks,
K-

 

[kwarwick43]

However, on another note, since APC recalled their 7 and 8 series surge protectors made for a decade ... i was surprised it only took them a few weeks to deliver a replacement.

If you have any old APC 7 or 8 series surge protectors made before 2003, you might want to check to see if it was recalled.

http://recall.apc.com/en

Don't worry only 700 of them have overheated and melted and cause a couple million in damages soo far ...

Funny you should mention this, I discovered my APC net8 was recalled a few months ago when it failed suddenly. The design of these power bars is a little scary in that the internal rails can come out of position and short the hot and neutral lines together. This is exactly what happened to mine when I was plugging in a device and fortunately it blew out the internal fuse. When I took it apart to investigate I noticed an area on the circuit board near the "protection working" LED was a little brown, so some of the components have been running hot for some time it would seem. Glad it didn't get hot enough to cause a fire!

APC sent me a replacement totally free of charge and I disposed of the old one.

 

[hfg]

Anyone have any thoughts / theories on my original question as to weather or not a UPS provides extra juice when needed to high power draw setups? Perhaps with the battery (and capacitors?) it would deliver the additional power needed on startup?

I am still wondering weather or not it will help with my 27" CD's weak startup where the monitor is detected, USB works, mic works, etc. But the LCD itself will sometimes not come on.

Thanks,
K-

It will not supply extra power since, normally, the UPS is actually OFF and you are running on line power. In the event line power is interrupted, the UPS quickly switches on and takes over the supply of power before your computer power supply shuts down. (Yes ... there are continuous duty UPS units out there for critical systems, but those are beyond the scope of this discussion).

Some UPS units will have a voltage correction circuit which will "buck/boost" the small variations in line voltage to stabilize for optimum input conditions. This might help you if your line voltage is at the low end of nominal and that is causing startup problems, but I suspect it would more likely be due to a problem with your monitor power supply.

Your computer shouldn't be drawing more power than the power distribution in your house is capable of supplying ... so there is no instance where the UPS could add to that when in the normal run-time (OFF) state. If the power is disrupted, the UPS will only deliver what it is designed to supply ... if that isn't enough for your system, you need to look at a higher capacity UPS unit.

 

[Kevin808]

It will not supply extra power since, normally, the UPS is actually OFF and you are running on line power.

Ok, good to know, thank you for the info!

 

[AidenShaw]

It will not supply extra power since, normally, the UPS is actually OFF and you are running on line power. In the event line power is interrupted, the UPS quickly switches on and takes over the supply of power before your computer power supply shuts down. (Yes ... there are continuous duty UPS units out there for critical systems, but those are beyond the scope of this discussion).

Some UPS units will have a voltage correction circuit which will "buck/boost" the small variations in line voltage to stabilize for optimum input conditions. This might help you if your line voltage is at the low end of nominal and that is causing startup problems, but I suspect it would more likely be due to a problem with your monitor power supply.

Your computer shouldn't be drawing more power than the power distribution in your house is capable of supplying ... so there is no instance where the UPS could add to that when in the normal run-time (OFF) state. If the power is disrupted, the UPS will only deliver what it is designed to supply ... if that isn't enough for your system, you need to look at a higher capacity UPS unit.

Most decent UPS systems will in fact boost the voltage if it's low - it's not all-or-nothing. Before I ran a couple of dedicated 20 amp circuits for the computers, the UPS would briefly kick in when the vacuum cleaner started.

I agree that a computer/monitor shouldn't have inrush current problems, unless the house wiring is faulty (or a very long, small gauge extension cord is being used).

The graph shows the defaults for a Smart-UPS 1500.

 

[WildBB]

SUA1500 SmartUPS

I have been using an APC SmartUPS SUA1500 for my MacPro for years. I do have a question for those who use the APC Smart UPS.

Do you buy APC batteries when the original batteries fail or do you buy aftermarket? I need to replace mine, as my unit is yelling at me , but my last set of aftermarket batteries were expensive ($100-120) and lasted ~1-1.5 years.

 

[hfg]

I have been using an APC SmartUPS SUA1500 for my MacPro for years. I do have a question for those who use the APC Smart UPS.

Do you buy APC batteries when the original batteries fail or do you buy aftermarket? I need to replace mine, as my unit is yelling at me , but my last set of aftermarket batteries were expensive ($100-120) and lasted ~1-1.5 years.

I have tried aftermarket replacement batteries from BatteriesPlus, but they never lasted nearly as long as original APC branded batteries. I have found good prices on APC branded batteries at Amazon and ProVantage.

http://www.provantage.com/apc-rbc7~7AMPO37A.htm

 

[rei101]

I use APC UPS for everything! Loosing power is like crashing your car without having insurance. Is better to have it and not need it than not having it and need it.

 

[WildBB]

I have tried aftermarket replacement batteries from BatteriesPlus, but they never lasted nearly as long as original APC branded batteries. I have found good prices on APC branded batteries at Amazon and ProVantage.

http://www.provantage.com/apc-rbc7~7AMPO37A.htm

Wow, provantage wants nearly $40 to ship. I could not find genuine APC batteries on Amazon.

 

[hfg]

Wow, provantage wants nearly $40 to ship. I could not find genuine APC batteries on Amazon.

Well ... those batteries are REALLY heavy!

Must be your location as I purchased one last year and shipping to me was $24 on the $125 purchase price. Amazon is showing $26 shipping to me (not eligible for Prime ) on a price of $137.

Here is one on Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00004Z8GN/ref=ox_ya_os_product_refresh_T1

BTW: APC will send you a prepaid shipping label to return your old battery for recycling to keep them out of the landfill (even if you don't purchase your replacement from them). Nice!

-howard

 

[michael_aos]

I ran into kind of a weird situation recently.

I noticed my DSL Internet connection would drop when my little portable A/C unit would kick in.

Even though the DSL modem was on an APC UPS.

I eventually figured out there was a voltage drop from ~119V to ~114V when the little portable A/C unit kicked in. That was enough to cause the "wall wart" transformer for the modem to freak out.

The UPS can be configured to intervene in a brownout type situation, but only when it drops below 88 volts.

I wound up just replacing the DSL modem transformer.

 

[WildBB]

Well ... those batteries are REALLY heavy!

Must be your location as I purchased one last year and shipping to me was $24 on the $125 purchase price. Amazon is showing $26 shipping to me (not eligible for Prime ) on a price of $137.

Here is one on Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00004Z8GN/ref=ox_ya_os_product_refresh_T1

BTW: APC will send you a prepaid shipping label to return your old battery for recycling to keep them out of the landfill (even if you don't purchase your replacement from them). Nice!

-howard

Thanks Howard! Yes, I looked at that one on Amazon, but all the reviews stated that they were not APC genuine batteries. Pictures are deceiving

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The UPS can be configured to intervene in a brownout type situation, but only when it drops below 88 volts.

On one of my networked APC ups units, I can set the upper and lower voltage boundaries to direct it when to kick on. I am not sure what voltage my APC Smart UPS series kick on, 88V seems a little lower than I thought.

 

[hfg]

Thanks Howard! Yes, I looked at that one on Amazon, but all the reviews stated that they were not APC genuine batteries. Pictures are deceiving

I actually bought that one from Amazon and did, in fact, receive a genuine APC oem battery.

Since the battery is shipped by Amazon and the title, photo, description, etc. ALL say it is a genuine APC, you would have a pretty good case with Amazon if they shipped something else. I suspect the comments were from customers who bought from 3rd party vendors through the Amazon website, not from Amazon directly. Note the "alternate buying choices" column to the right ... if Amazon is out of stock, one of them will occupy the main page when you click on that link. One has to be sure that it is actually Amazon that is handling the purchase when you shop on the Amazon website.

 

[WildBB]

I actually bought that one from Amazon and did, in fact, receive a genuine APC oem battery.

Since the battery is shipped by Amazon and the title, photo, description, etc. ALL say it is a genuine APC, you would have a pretty good case with Amazon if they shipped something else. I suspect the comments were from customers who bought from 3rd party vendors through the Amazon website, not from Amazon directly. Note the "alternate buying choices" column to the right ... if Amazon is out of stock, one of them will occupy the main page when you click on that link. One has to be sure that it is actually Amazon that is handling the purchase when you shop on the Amazon website.

Thats a good point! I usually find myself jumping to the reviews (which seem to be third party), but I do realize that people are more likly to review a negative experence than a positive one.

I may purchase from amazon, but with tax and shipping it would come out to be ~$175. I am trying to determine if I should just upgrade to a new UPS unit or replace my 8+ year old SUA1500.

 

[Gav Mack]

I have been using an APC SmartUPS SUA1500 for my MacPro for years. I do have a question for those who use the APC Smart UPS.

Do you buy APC batteries when the original batteries fail or do you buy aftermarket? I need to replace mine, as my unit is yelling at me , but my last set of aftermarket batteries were expensive ($100-120) and lasted ~1-1.5 years.

The APC batteries are twin yuasa cells stuck together wrapped in black plastic with their logo on them - as long as the replacement are genuine yuasa they're exactly the same cells inside.

The Yuasa's in my pair of 1500's are both 5 plus years and still going strong.

This explains the APC RBC7 design better than I can in pictures - a pair of Yuasa wired in series.

http://www.vps-ups.co.uk/rbc7-nc-ne...r-existing-cables-and-fuse-free-delivery.html

It's freshly made cells that determine how long your batteries last with lead acids. If they've been made longer than 3 months or not charged back up regularly over that interval whilst stored they deteriorate and have a short life in a UPS. I bought mine from one of the big uk electronics distributors, Farnell or RS and they had a manufacture date of 7 weeks previous stamped on the outside.