MP 7,1 Waiting for Mac Pro 7,1 A1991 (no more)

[barmann]

Nope, the data's in the cloud too, pulled in from a few sources, and the machines there have much much faster pipes to it than my actual office does. We do have some on prem machines, but not for that kind of work; data processing is handled in the cloud.

Got it , thanks .

We are not talking about a $12/month Adobe subscription or iCloud though, the cloud services you or your company are using must cost a pretty penny, and require a fairly large effort to set up and maintain on the customer side ?

I understand your point re. pro cloud computing on that scale, and how powerful traditional workstations are less important in this instance .

I just think that in-house computing power isn't going to become obsolete anytime soon , due to general infrastructure issues re. data transfer , the budget constraints of small and mid-sized shops , and the practical requirements of many tasks .

 

[thevault]

HP Updates the Z6 & Z8 (again) with new Xeons and Optane.

*looks at watch, then calendar, then last year's calendar, then the year before's calendar* - ahh there's the promise of the "upcoming" new machine.

"Real artists ship" - you know who.

When you visit the HP site and view all the up to date options for an H6/H8 then compare it to Apple's disabled line of computers it's just sad.

 

[seek3r]

Got it , thanks .

We are not talking about a $12/month Adobe subscription or iCloud though, the cloud services you or your company are using must cost a pretty penny, and require a fairly large effort to set up and maintain on the customer side ?

I understand your point re. pro cloud computing on that scale, and how powerful traditional workstations are less important in this instance .

I just think that in-house computing power isn't going to become obsolete anytime soon , due to general infrastructure issues re. data transfer , the budget constraints of small and mid-sized shops , and the practical requirements of many tasks .

Yeah, we have a pretty big AWS footprint, this isnt an adobe subscription level cost

I don't disagree that on prem work isnt going away any time soon, especially for things like graphics design, which is where it sounds like your focus is, but you're right: my point was that the market for uber-powerful workstations becomes smaller and smaller as more and more workflows can move to being remote. And yeah, small shops with lighter demands... I think it depends on what kind of work they're doing. Sometimes cloud is more cost effective than building out local infra, but it is more variable there than in a larger shop than can afford a bigger remote deployment and pay people to manage it. Think we're pretty much agreeing though

 

[OS6-OSX]

Over to you Apple.

Thanks lantree, I'm here with Apple

As you can see Apple has taken the loss of this set very hard. Apple did not see this 100+ mph ACE by HP coming! Apple has been running around it's backhand since 2013. It's their own fault! Apple wanted to stay behind the baseline and volley the entire match. This is when HP came to the net and ended it! Playing with an over sized racket (billions of $), many were sure Apple would win. Well, it's the last set and Apple serves next. But with those specs and prices by HP, Apple might as well walk to the net and shake the winners hand!

 

[jscipione]

I've been pulling 500W out my wall for 2 days straight rendering 1080p video on my dual X5680 and I am only 1/3 the way through my task! Come on Apple don't suck it up and make me buy an HP Z-station.

 

[dazzer21-2]

I've just seen a video on Youtube that shows that the new Core i9 iMac gets somewhat perilously close to the performance of the 8-core iMac Pro at most things. Given that the 'consumer-grade' machine is giving the Pro a hard time, is there now a point to having the 8-core iMac Pro, especially given that comparable performance could be had for a lot cheaper now? Question being, if the new Mac Pro has processors that mirror those in the iMac Pro, do you think that there will be an 8-core version or would that get skipped in the name of multiprocessing prowess?

 

[beaker7]

I've been pulling 500W out my wall for 2 days straight rendering 1080p video on my dual X5680 and I am only 1/3 the way through my task! Come on Apple don't suck it up and make me buy an HP Z-station.

This just makes me sad.

 

[AidenShaw]

HP Updates the Z6 & Z8 (again) with new Xeons and Optane.

The gals and guys from Texas are there as well.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/14181/dells-new-precision-7000-workstations

 

[fuchsdh]

I've been pulling 500W out my wall for 2 days straight rendering 1080p video on my dual X5680 and I am only 1/3 the way through my task! Come on Apple don't suck it up and make me buy an HP Z-station.

What and how much are you rendering? I can't even conceive of bloated After Effects compositions that would take me days to render.

 

[Boil]

So we have now seen rumors of either (or both?) a 31.6" 6k Apple Display and/or a 31.6" 6k iMac...

There has also been older rumors about an Apple-brnaded display with a built-in eGPU enclosure...

What if the all-new Modular Mac Pro is just a 31.6" 6k iMac with a functional PCIe x16 slot for a standard 2-slot GPU...?

Trap doors for the GPU, RAM & M.2 SSDs would fulfill the "modular" aspect (just not in the way everyone wants, meaning cheese grater v2.0)...?

 

[jscipione]

What and how much are you rendering? I can't even conceive of bloated After Effects compositions that would take me days to render.

I'll confess that I'm not doing anything fancy like After Effects I'm just rendering a bunch of Blu-ray movies to h.264 two-at-a-time one after another after another.

 

[beaker7]

What if the all-new Modular Mac Pro is just a 31.6" 6k iMac with a functional PCIe x16 slot for a standard 2-slot GPU...?

Trap doors for the GPU, RAM & M.2 SSDs would fulfill the "modular" aspect (just not in the way everyone wants, meaning cheese grater v2.0)...?

Dead in the water and possibly the dumbest possible solution. Mandate which screen people use but let them change the gpu?

 

[Boil]

So we have now seen rumors of either (or both?) a 31.6" 6k Apple Display and/or a 31.6" 6k iMac...

There has also been older rumors about an Apple-brnaded display with a built-in eGPU enclosure...

What if the all-new Modular Mac Pro is just a 31.6" 6k iMac with a functional PCIe x16 slot for a standard 2-slot GPU...?

Trap doors for the GPU, RAM & M.2 SSDs would fulfill the "modular" aspect (just not in the way everyone wants, meaning cheese grater v2.0)...?

Dead in the water and possibly the dumbest possible solution. Mandate which screen people use but let them change the gpu?

Never said it was a good idea, just laying out the various rumors & how they might come together...

 

[fuchsdh]

So we have now seen rumors of either (or both?) a 31.6" 6k Apple Display and/or a 31.6" 6k iMac...

There has also been older rumors about an Apple-brnaded display with a built-in eGPU enclosure...

What if the all-new Modular Mac Pro is just a 31.6" 6k iMac with a functional PCIe x16 slot for a standard 2-slot GPU...?

Trap doors for the GPU, RAM & M.2 SSDs would fulfill the "modular" aspect (just not in the way everyone wants, meaning cheese grater v2.0)...?

That wouldn't be a Mac Pro. They've made it pretty clear it's gonna' be headless (that's basically one of the few things that's 100% certain.)

Though an iMac with a full-size GPU sticking off the back would probably make a lot of other people happy...

 

[jeanlain]

Though an iMac with a full-size GPU sticking off the back would probably make a lot of other people happy...

It would be ugly though.

 

[wallysb01]

It would be ugly though.

And imagine how they’d have to talk about how much thicker something got!

 

[MisterAndrew]

We have new evidence that the Mac Pro 7,1 will have standard PCIe slots, at least for the GPU. In the 10.14.5 update Apple added support for the new MP's GPUs and also appears to have fixed the fan issue plaguing Vega GPUs installed in an internal PCIe slot. Therefore, I think it's likely the new machine will have at least 1 standard PCIe slot.

 

[edgerider]

I totally agree,

the screen in the imac pro is like 800/1000$ alone, then ad some fancy cooling and expensive engineering like the feet mechanism or the shell itself that doesn’t need to be in a desktop box and you cut at least 1500$ of the cost of an Imac Pro.

any 8 core high clock I9 outperform any 2013/2009 macpro that is why people still do hackintosh.

to me they are going back to the motherboard /CPU tray, because this was really a cost saver for them...
with one chassis and two daughters board they can either build a 8 core I7 with a rx560 for 2990$ that would still blow most of 2013 machine with new sytem, or a dual xeon 36 core monster.

to me the motherboard should just be a big pcie switch where you make pcie lane arrive from cpu and lay down I/O such as 10gbe, usb/thunderbolt, an four double width 16x pcie slot.

what used to give our beloved 4.1/5.1 cMP an avantage over any other thing is the fact that you could actually use all the 40 pcie lane of the processor whereas any other « thunderbolt » mac was limited to pciex4.
and no matter what they say or do pcie gen2 x 16 is still faster and more standard than pcie gen 3 x4...

honestly i dont see how the machine would sale if you dont have some way to conect some gen3 pciex16 card on it either internally or via expension.

they still know by sytème instaler what hackintosh community is doing, so I highly doubt they will ignore what 99 % of the person who haven’t bought a 2013 macpro run as a replacement hardware.

any how if they give me a box with the internal of a Imac Pro and pcie x16 slot for 2990-$, l’ll be happy.

if the do a chessgrater-like mobo-daughter board case with upgradable cpu/ram/gpu/m2 storage and pcie x16 slot for less than 5000$ i will be very happy.

 

[tommy chen]

We have new evidence that the Mac Pro 7,1 will have standard PCIe slots, at least for the GPU. In the 10.14.5 update Apple added support for the new MP's GPUs and also appears to have fixed the fan issue plaguing Vega GPUs installed in an internal PCIe slot. Therefore, I think it's likely the new machine will have at least 1 standard PCIe slot.

hi MisterAndrew

can you share the AMD1000.kext from 10.14.5 DP for testing in 10.14.4 for me?

THX
Indio

 

[jeanlain]

We have new evidence that the Mac Pro 7,1 will have standard PCIe slots, at least for the GPU. In the 10.14.5 update Apple added support for the new MP's GPUs and also appears to have fixed the fan issue plaguing Vega GPUs installed in an internal PCIe slot. Therefore, I think it's likely the new machine will have at least 1 standard PCIe slot.

Interesting, but "support for the new MP's GPUs" by itself does not say much. That the next Mac Pro will have new GPUs is a given. Is there anything in the OS that refer to PCIe slots, like for instance the PCIe slot utility that was specific to the early Mac Pros?
And the fan issue fix you mention may just be a (beneficial) side effect of another bug fix.
Anyway... fingers crossed!

 

[MisterAndrew]

hi MisterAndrew

can you share the AMD1000.kext from 10.14.5 DP for testing in 10.14.4 for me?

THX
Indio

I don't think proprietary Apple files should be shared here, but you can download the 10.14.5 update from Apple. It's available as both a developer and public beta.
[doublepost=1554907080][/doublepost]

Interesting, but "support for the new MP's GPUs" by itself does not say much. That the next Mac Pro will have new GPUs is a given. Is there anything in the OS that refer to PCIe slots, like for instance the PCIe slot utility that was specific to the early Mac Pros?
And the fan issue fix you mention may just be a (beneficial) side effect of another bug fix.
Anyway... fingers crossed!

Well, I don't believe it's a coincidence that support for the Vega 20 GPUs and the fan issues were fixed at the same time. Apple wasn't interested in fixing Vega fan issues for the cMP (they closed bug reports and claimed they couldn't replicate the issues). If the new MP has internal PCIe slots and is using Vega GPUs then it would be experiencing those issues, so a fix for that would also fix those issues for the cMP. Of course, it's not very strong data, but I think it's logical.

 

[beaker7]

I don't think proprietary Apple files should be shared here, but you can download the 10.14.5 update from Apple. It's available as both a developer and public beta.
[doublepost=1554907080][/doublepost]

Well, I don't believe it's a coincidence that support for the Vega 20 GPUs and the fan issues were fixed at the same time. Apple wasn't interested in fixing Vega fan issues for the cMP (they closed bug reports and claimed they couldn't replicate the issues). If the new MP has internal PCIe slots and is using Vega GPUs then it would be experiencing those issues, so a fix for that would also fix those issues for the cMP. Of course, it's not very strong data, but I think it's logical.

It would be classic Apple to release a Mac Pro with Vega GPUs that weren't even that competitive when they were released 3 years prior to the future MP's ship date.

 

[MisterAndrew]

It would be classic Apple to release a Mac Pro with Vega GPUs that weren't even that competitive when they were released 3 years prior to the future MP's ship date.

I’m not sure I understand your post. The Vega GPUs are the top of the line offerings from AMD. Apple is working closely with AMD on the development of these GPUs and their software is optimized for them. Nothing from competitors can beat the ratio of performance and value. An Nvidia GPU that offers similar compute performance as Vega 20 is vastly more expensive. AMD is also on the forefront of technology on the 7nm process.

 

[TobiasT]

I’m not sure I understand your post. The Vega GPUs are the top of the line offerings from AMD. Apple is working closely with AMD on the development of these GPUs and their software is optimized for them. Nothing from competitors can beat the ratio of performance and value. An Nvidia GPU that offers similar compute performance as Vega 20 is vastly more expensive. AMD is also on the forefront of technology on the 7nm process.

That's the trick. Apple does not need to offer the best of the best. They just need that their customers believe that it is the best XD

 

[Nugget]

Apple does not need to offer the best of the best. They just need that their customers believe that it is the best XD

They don't even need that. They just need for their customers feel trapped in the platform and unable/unwilling to jump ship to Windows or Linux. Doesn't matter if it's the best of the best, I'm stuck buying what they offer if I want to retain my workflow and habits.