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MP 7,1 Waiting for Mac Pro 7,1 A1991 (no more)

mattspace said:
According to someone who claims to have used / worked on the eGPU display (the same source I suspect for the MR report on it, since all the details match up)
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I Cannot Give you more details, but my source also showme an Apple Promotional Photos, those photos shown a 5K iMac with an obvious smaller 21" iMac Like Display Daisychained to an external DAS, and its official name 21" Thunderbolt Retina Display. if the guy PS all this to mock up a 4K TB3RD to fool me, really did a good work.

PD Rene Ritchie's sources, also discarded for ever an eGPU display at the time are confident a Thunderbolt Retina Display is coming soon.

Maybe if Darylmple leaks something you'll began to believe.

PD. the GPU availability excuse, is not convincing (not to say fishy), the TB3 macs where programmed for Polaris dGPU since day-0, I dout Apple would ever considerd another GPU, even Fiji (the Fiji dGPU rumour was a missunderstod, the actual GPU was polaris).
 
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mattspace said:
According to someone who claims to have used / worked on the eGPU display (the same source I suspect for the MR report on it, since all the details match up), it is a finished product, and was "released to manufacturing" months ago when the Skylake Macbook Pros were originally due to ship, until component delays held them up (and iirc caused them to elect to skip to a whole new dGPU generation, which added to the delay) - right about the time they canned the Thunderbolt display.

Speculating about what different combos of connectivity could do is lovely, but the source of this specifically stated there was no 4k display coming from Apple, it's the 5k eGPU display, and only the 5k eGPU display.
Click to expand...

Yep. I don't know about the Skylake MacBook Pros, but the lack of an Apple display right now is not intentional. Timelines were thrown off.

I also concur with the no 4k display.
 
Mago said:
PD Rene Ritchie's sources, also discarded for ever an eGPU display at the time are confident a Thunderbolt Retina Display is coming soon.
Click to expand...

Richie was thrown a bone (the "official" denial of the eGPU happening at that upcoming event) because he'd been made to look like an arse in public by MR publishing the eGPU details less than a day after his huge article which missed it as a possibility, and he's one to the "good guys" who act as part of the annointed friendly media.
 
Apple needs to give buyers an option for either an nVidia GPU or AMD GPU. Both have their strengths and weaknesses.

Also they need to shy away from using server grade GPUs on the Mac Pro -- they should use consumer GPUs like the GTX1070 or GTX1080.
 
pat500000 said:
It can only be dead if you want it to be dead.
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Not the product itself. Because the new Mac Pro is not a good workstation computer at all due to compatibility, performance, and expandability. The update for Mac Pro didn't come out for almost 3 years while classic Mac Pro took 2 years max to update.
 
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mavericks7913 said:
Not the product itself. Because the new Mac Pro is not a good workstation computer at all due to compatibility, performance, and expandability. The update for Mac Pro didn't come out for almost 3 years while classic Mac Pro took 2 years max to update.
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Personally, I think nMP is great for FCPX....and few other things, such as Logic Pro.
For expandability, of course it's gonna be external....and rams could be expanded. What compatibility are you talking about? and for what? It might be for all purpose workstation...but someone previously mentioned that it's mostly softwares that would dictate compatibility. For GPU, you could select what you want from apple website.
What about performance? Are you talking about fast and furious?
 
pat500000 said:
Personally, I think nMP is great for FCPX....and few other things, such as Logic Pro.
For expandability, of course it's gonna be external....and rams could be expanded. What compatibility are you talking about? and for what? It might be for all purpose workstation...but someone previously mentioned that it's mostly softwares that would dictate compatibility. For GPU, you could select what you want from apple website.
What about performance? Are you talking about fast and furious?
Click to expand...

Can 2013 Mac Pro add audio card? no.
Dual CPU? no.
More GPU options especially from Nvidia? no.
More than 64gb of RAM? no.
Cooling system? suck.
6 thunderbolts ports? still rare to use it and thunderbolt 3 is now here.
More HDD and SSD internally? no.
Optional PCIE slots? no.
Can it be upgraded? DEF no except for ram.


You see, Apple throw out the most important features from classic mac pro. It blocked all possible compatibility and expandability for performance, longer uses, and more.
 
mavericks7913 said:
Can 2013 Mac Pro add audio card? no.
Dual CPU? no.
More GPU options especially from Nvidia? no.
More than 64gb of RAM? no.
Cooling system? suck.
6 thunderbolts ports? still rare to use it and thunderbolt 3 is now here.
More HDD and SSD internally? no.
Optional PCIE slots? no.
Can it be upgraded? DEF no except for ram.


You see, Apple throw out the most important features from classic mac pro. It blocked all possible compatibility and expandability for performance, longer uses, and more.
Click to expand...
Do you actually need those?
External upgrade is upgradable.
In all honesty, none of that "fast and furious" computer is gonna matter if you just need to do some simple thing.
Dual cpu? Maybe pc or hackintosh might fit for you.
NMP is for certain group of people who could use their products.
But regardless of what you are asking for: Apple might not cater to your needs. 1) it will be standstill with your current Mac or 2) move on or 3) if they release a new Mac....then you will get that...and its possible it won't meet your need.
Once Apple states that 5,1 from 2010 is no longer supported....well..you can go retro.
 
mavericks7913 said:
Can 2013 Mac Pro add audio card? no.
Dual CPU? no.
More GPU options especially from Nvidia? no.
More than 64gb of RAM? no.
Cooling system? suck.
6 thunderbolts ports? still rare to use it and thunderbolt 3 is now here.
More HDD and SSD internally? no.
Optional PCIE slots? no.
Can it be upgraded? DEF no except for ram.


You see, Apple throw out the most important features from classic mac pro. It blocked all possible compatibility and expandability for performance, longer uses, and more.
Click to expand...

pat500000 said:
Do you actually need those?
External upgrade is upgradable.
In all honesty, none of that "fast and furious" computer is gonna matter if you just need to do some simple thing.
Dual cpu? Maybe pc or hackintosh might fit for you.
NMP is for certain group of people who could use their products.
But regardless of what you are asking for: Apple might not cater to your needs. 1) it will be standstill with your current Mac or 2) move on or 3) if they release a new Mac....then you will get that...and its possible it won't meet your need.
Once Apple states that 5,1 from 2010 is no longer supported....well..you can go retro.
Click to expand...

To be fair, you can add any external audio card to nMP (or to any Mac for that matter). I don't think that - regarding audio cards - the lack of internal upgrades is a real issue. On the other hand, though, I don't see what makes nMP so great for Logic Pro. Well, Logic Pro does run only on Mac, of course, but nMP has no h/w that favors specifically this application any more than any other modern Mac out there. FCPX sure, I hear that the dual GPUs come in handy. But for Logic Pro, I don't really see the true benefit. As a matter of fact, the enforced dual-only gpu (and the relative cost it brings) renders the nMP a non-ideal machine for a musician.

All the arguments regarding the old version of some h/w parts are valid, of course (like tb2 etc). But, let's be honest, the lack of h/w options and upgradeability is an entire Mac product line drawback rather than nMP's.
 
antonis said:
FCPX sure, I hear that the dual GPUs come in handy. But for Logic Pro, I don't really see the true benefit. As a matter of fact, the dual-only gpu option (and the relative cost it brings) renders the nMP a non-ideal machine for a musician.
Click to expand...
http://gpuopen.com/importance-audio-vr/

There is quite a lot of technology behind this API that can be added to Metal, and use compute capabilities of the GPUs to process sound.

This is only technical speculation/analysis. It has nothing to do with reality, just example it can be done.
 
koyoot said:
http://gpuopen.com/importance-audio-vr/

There is quite a lot of technology behind this API that can be added to Metal, and use compute capabilities of the GPUs to process sound.

This is only technical speculation/analysis. It has nothing to do with reality, just example it can be done.
Click to expand...
Yes, the name Metal seems to refers to an old AMD low-level-api name: close-to-metal (that became later openCL). Basically Metal means, that developers are given access to hardware. Most likely Metals goal is to provide access to GPGPU, GL and DSP & ISP functions in future. Current Metal is still just half there.

With macOS 10.13 there should be full access to GL features... but what about openCL / GPGPU? If it is not embedded to Metal directly, it will at least co-operate deeply, maybe through HSA layer? DSP / ISP are important for VR and AR and need to be low latency along with GL.

This is why Apple would need x86-based SoC in order to remove the high-latency and the need to copy a lot of data trough chipsets & PCIe lines.

So, there wouldn't be much benefit to go to AMD Zen SoC before the software is ready. MacOs Sierra seems to be still just a second step and not there yet...

Anyway, openGL will stay at 4.1 and openCL at 1.2 until Metal is finished, because they need to be re-written anyway to work with HSA & Metal. So they're on hold.
 
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Zarniwoop said:
Anyway, openGL will stay at 4.1 and openCL at 1.2 until Metal is finished, because they need to be re-written anyway to work with HSA & Metal. So they're on hold.
Click to expand...
Not exactly. The only one GPUs that can really use OpenCL 2.0 in macOS currently is R9 M295X, M395 and M395X, or Broadwell Intel integrated GPUs(or higher). Thats how Apple computers are outdated in terms of hardware :).
 
mavericks7913 said:
Can 2013 Mac Pro add audio card? no.
Dual CPU? no.
More GPU options especially from Nvidia? no.
More than 64gb of RAM? no.
Cooling system? suck.
6 thunderbolts ports? still rare to use it and thunderbolt 3 is now here.
More HDD and SSD internally? no.
Optional PCIE slots? no.
Can it be upgraded? DEF no except for ram.


You see, Apple throw out the most important features from classic mac pro. It blocked all possible compatibility and expandability for performance, longer uses, and more.
Click to expand...

are you the guy in the cowboy hat or the one with glasses?


;)
 
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koyoot said:
Not exactly. The only one GPUs that can really use OpenCL 2.0 in macOS currently is R9 M295X, M395 and M395X, or Broadwell Intel integrated GPUs(or higher). Thats how Apple computers are outdated in terms of hardware :).
Click to expand...
True what comes to Intel.

For AMD, things have changed. Check out this page:
http://support.amd.com/en-us/kb-articles/Pages/OpenCL2-Driver.aspx

"AMD Product Compatibility

The AMD OpenCL 2.0 driver is compatible with AMD graphics products based on GCN first generation products or higher."

Same can be found here:
http://developer.amd.com/tools-and-...sdk/system-requirements-driver-compatibility/
 
Driver is compatible, but they will not have specific features from OpenCL 2.0 feature set.

And many of the features are important for HSA 2.0 and for Mantle/Metal features.
 
https://www.khronos.org/conformance/adopters/conformant-products#opencl

Windows 8.1 64-bit with AMD Catalyst 15.8 driver running on:
AMD Radeon (TM) R9 Fury Series
AMD Radeon (TM) R7 M360
AMD Radeon (TM) R7 M340
AMD Radeon R7 M260
AMD Radeon R5 M255
AMD Radeon (TM) R5 M315
AMD RADEON R9 M395X
AMD RADEON R9 M390X
AMD Radeon R9 M295X
AMD FirePro S7150
AMD FirePro W7100
AMD Radeon R9 200 Series
AMD Radeon (TM) R9 380 Series
AMD FX-7600P APU with AMD Radeon R7 Graphics, 3700 MHz, 4 Core(s), 4 Logical Processor(s)
Click to expand...
We are talking about full support for OpenCL 2.0 feature set which is this:
  • Shared virtual memory
  • Nested parallelism
  • Generic address space
  • Images
  • C11 atomics
  • Pipes
  • Android installable client driver extension
Click to expand...
FirePro D300, D500, D700 in MP for example are not compliant with this, because they are GCN 1.0 GPUs. You need 1.1 at least to get OCL 2.0. And the GCN1.1 are Cape Verde and Hawaii GPUs.
 
koyoot said:
https://www.khronos.org/conformance/adopters/conformant-products#opencl


We are talking about full support for OpenCL 2.0 feature set which is this:
Click to expand...
Yes, that's a list from last year. AMD added support for GCN 1 quite recently.

And virtual shared memory doesn't work if CPU doesn't support it. So as of today, any Intel processor with AMD GPU will not be fully openCL 2.0 compatible. Only few AMD APU's make it possible. Zen will be te market changer (I hope, just to make low latency architecture reality).
 
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pat500000 said:
Do you actually need those?
External upgrade is upgradable.
In all honesty, none of that "fast and furious" computer is gonna matter if you just need to do some simple thing.
Dual cpu? Maybe pc or hackintosh might fit for you.
NMP is for certain group of people who could use their products.
But regardless of what you are asking for: Apple might not cater to your needs. 1) it will be standstill with your current Mac or 2) move on or 3) if they release a new Mac....then you will get that...and its possible it won't meet your need.
Once Apple states that 5,1 from 2010 is no longer supported....well..you can go retro.
Click to expand...

Actually need? classic Mac Pro can do those features already while the newest one does not. Also lack of internal expansion is really insane. Look a lot of pro users complain about it. Believe it or not, Apple already addressed that the new Mac Pro is a dead product which is somewhat failed in WWDC 2016 because of those issues. Accept the truth.
 
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Guys, many things can be done in order to take advantage of a dual-gpu system, in theory. My point is that a musician has nothing to look forward to from the current dual-gpu Mac Pro. An iMac can run equally (or even better if it's the latest model) the Logic Pro. Or, in other words, the nMP was not made with Logic Pro in mind, not even close compared to FCPX.
 
Zarniwoop said:
Yes, that's a list from last year. AMD added support for GCN 1 just a few moments ago.

And virtual shared memory doesn't work if CPU doesn't support it. So as of today, any Intel processor with AMD GPU will not be fully openCL 2.0 compatible. Only few AMD APU's make it possible. Zen will be te market changer (I hope, just to make low latency architecture reality).
Click to expand...
Hmmm, I must have missed that, thanks Zarni. It appears that AMD might have made progress on this despite having initial problems with the OCL2.0 drivers for GCN1.0. Very interesting, after all.
 
mavericks7913 said:
A Believe it or not, Apple already addressed that the new Mac Pro is a dead product (...) Accept the truth.
Click to expand...
They even said that current Mac Pro is a dead product.
Click to expand...

you keep saying this.. care to share where you heard apple saying this? I think people other than yourself would of heard this from Apple too but apparently, we've missed it.
??
 
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