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What standard of design should The New Old Web, or Web 1.1, ideally adhere to?

  • < HTML4, CSS2, no JS, no embedded media (Closer to 90's Web)

    Votes: 14 16.5%
  • =< HTML4, CSS2, frugal JS, frugally embedded media (Closer to Early 2000's Web)

    Votes: 67 78.8%
  • Something else (Post an alternative)

    Votes: 4 4.7%

  • Total voters
    85

Certificate of Excellence

macrumors 6502a
Feb 9, 2021
952
1,463
No, the blame is entirely on me for missing your point. Oops! :oops:


These were only used for the consumer versions prior to W2K’s release. Applying them to NT was (presumably) done to suggest W2K was “NT for everyone” but didn’t quite work out as most PCs continued shipping with 98SE (and later, ME)…

Anyway, let’s get back on topic :)
No blame and yessir (or ma'am - dont know) agreed. 110% back on topic.

@z970

Thanks for the link. Very much appreciated!
 

lepidotós

macrumors 6502a
Aug 29, 2021
677
750
Marinette, Arizona
Win2k was my favorite iteration of windows - still is.
2000 SP4 feels like coming home to me, though Vista feels like a second home as well. Hard to break childhood nostalgia, I suppose, though I never really let 2000 fade into nostalgia -- it was my main OS into 2018 and even then I have a Dell laptop I've had it on and off installed on since.​
IIRC I have seen you speak to this in the past as something that was possibly in the works.
AquaTrimcelerator.
what (in your opinion) should be my priority for creating accessible web pages in the new 1.1?
Personally, my target is 1024x768, Netscape Navigator 4. It depends on the point of your site and who your target audience is, for me, I want to be a combo fansite and quick reference for homebrew, so I'm definitely targetting older browsers since the toolchain is usually used with Windows XP, but can be installed and used on as low as 95/NT 3.51 or IRIX 5.3.​
 
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DisqueteMandela

macrumors newbie
May 15, 2022
5
1
Spain
My main target is latest Netscape Navigator/RetroZilla/IE6/7/8, and, as screen readers, Jaws9/10, NVDA 0.5 and later, software of the late 2000s decade. However, since I won't use JS, it will probably work on older browsers.
 
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DisqueteMandela

macrumors newbie
May 15, 2022
5
1
Spain
This could be a stupid question, but, here it is. Forms need real time validation, and it is important to throw an alert when an input is incorrect. The thing is, that is possible to do with some clientside languages. I even could write an alerter in vanilla Javascript which works in the browsers that I tarjet, such as latest Netscape. Another option would be using an html5 form, so I would need to enforce people to use an updated device with XP or newer and control the input this way, but in that case I wouldn-t include JavaScript. However, since I want to allow old devices, I think Javascript validation and making alerts with Javascript is the best solution, but I-m not an expert on old pages! At least I could see rests of form validations with JavaScript in the page which I use as a template. So, how would you validate the forms? Js, serverside languages, something different? Important thing! I just use Js in just one form! All the other stuff is with html, css and php!
 

Kitsune86

macrumors newbie
Feb 15, 2022
5
8
To validate forms you’ll just want to do string checks / number / data type checks on the server end and then return them to form if they messed up with a system message telling them to change their data.

In the months since I made my personal Web 1.1 site I’ve actually got an iBook G3!

Last weekend a friend and I stripped down a second G3 and took some parts from it and put an SSD in the working one.

Also could I get my site http://www.WeMakeSmall.Games/ listed under personal? Thank you!
 

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lepidotós

macrumors 6502a
Aug 29, 2021
677
750
Marinette, Arizona
After... a year in mothballs, it's alive for a test run! I want to transition over to my own server, Aleister Crowley, but for now while I get it repaired it'll be hosted on NameSilo's servers.
This won't be how it looks in a year or two from now, it's just to prove to myself that I can run a website at all.

Also, if it looks weird, it's not my fault. For some reason the hosted version is put in a corner, when that's not how I wrote the page and it doesn't show that way on the Neocities version or original html file.
Edit, figured it out: it was a bunch of garbage text.
Edit 2: Works in IE5, but not Netscape Navigator 4.77... I know it'll work with 6+, but still. I'll need to work that out, I admit the html is messy. I wrote it in Classilla and then edited it in NameSilo's HTML editor, which probably doesn't help.​
 
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Kitsune86

macrumors newbie
Feb 15, 2022
5
8
Twitter has kind of imploded and I've been wanting to make a Web 1.1 "Social Media" like site (not exactly social media). But my background in the early 2000s was running forums using customized solutions.

Forums are nowhere as popular as they once where. Especially with Reddit, Quora and niche forums, facebook and instagram.

But with twitter imploding upon itself I decided to pull this project from my brain and actually get it running.

It should load on OS9 just fine, seems like it even worked on old versions of Safari too.

* PHPBB3 (still customizing it)
* Punny domain name
* Hoping to build a neat community.

http://www.cereally.online/
 

matO_opp_ITA

macrumors member
Oct 3, 2021
77
16
Calabria, Italy
Twitter has kind of imploded and I've been wanting to make a Web 1.1 "Social Media" like site (not exactly social media). But my background in the early 2000s was running forums using customized solutions.

Forums are nowhere as popular as they once where. Especially with Reddit, Quora and niche forums, facebook and instagram.

But with twitter imploding upon itself I decided to pull this project from my brain and actually get it running.

It should load on OS9 just fine, seems like it even worked on old versions of Safari too.

* PHPBB3 (still customizing it)
* Punny domain name
* Hoping to build a neat community.

http://www.cereally.online/
C1A968F5-E961-4391-8CB5-BD7242BF8681.jpeg

Can confirm it works! (Yes, I just woke up)
 
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DisqueteMandela

macrumors newbie
May 15, 2022
5
1
Spain
Twitter has kind of imploded and I've been wanting to make a Web 1.1 "Social Media" like site (not exactly social media). But my background in the early 2000s was running forums using customized solutions.

Forums are nowhere as popular as they once where. Especially with Reddit, Quora and niche forums, facebook and instagram.

But with twitter imploding upon itself I decided to pull this project from my brain and actually get it running.

It should load on OS9 just fine, seems like it even worked on old versions of Safari too.

* PHPBB3 (still customizing it)
* Punny domain name
* Hoping to build a neat community.

http://www.cereally.online/
Hi! I'm interested in joining cereally but I'm visually impaired so I can't pass the captcha. My question is, for the admin of the service, can you create me an account if I will be able to post/discuss stuff there without struggling with captchas?
Another thing, do you think that it's time to create a web 1.1 proxy for modern web using node.js? I know that there are now other proxies, such as browservice and WebOne. WebOne is pretty good, however it can't remove js or such things, and browservice is not very easy to setup and it converts the site to a image so a Screen Reader can't read it.
I suggest to switch to node.js cause it would bring a modern js engine to old browsers, making possible to run Mastodon and similar js sites on outdated browsers!
But, someone might think, why node.js instead of Python/php and other languages? The answer is simple, node.js has a powerful library for web scrapping called puppeteer which uses chrome engine/headless chrome. Puppeteer can get the html of a page which rely only in Javascript, and convert it to plain html! So, it only would be necesary to create an express server or similar node.js http server that would get an url, the puppeteer would scrap the URL and return html code to the browser. It surely could accept something like http://nodeserver:port/customurl where nodeserver is the server address, port is the port of the server, and customurl is the page passed as paramether which will be returned as a rendered plain html by puppeteer. What do you think about this?
 

PPC_505

macrumors newbie
Feb 8, 2024
3
1
Does anyone have a pulse on how this project is going? I'll be adding my group's site to the ranks in the coming weeks.
 

Dronecatcher

macrumors 603
Jun 17, 2014
5,247
7,884
Lincolnshire, UK
Does anyone have a pulse on how this project is going? I'll be adding my group's site to the ranks in the coming weeks.
I don't think it was ever a project as such, more of an umbrella term for wilfully retrogressive (at least in features) websites.

I think there's still plenty of involvement but protocols like Gemini shot themselves in the foot by having modern security demands and my personal feeling is that there's a bit of snobbery afoot that means 'normies' aren't welcome.

I'd personally recommend Blue Dwarf as a good example of low-end Web 1.1 that is community driven and has an author/developer who is on a personal mission to deliver an oasis of oldskool web serenity.
 
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